2010.07.26 Grand Jury begins

[grandmaj]

What was the cousin's info? I missed that!

In the Parking Lot.

 

[Aedrys]

What was the cousin's info? I missed that!

It's in a thread in the Parking Lot. You'll have to click on a link to go the cousin's actual post on another forum.

 

[BeanE]

Ah, AZlawyer answered the type of question I asked here (only it was Calliope who asked in the attorney thread). Grand Juries meet for indictment purposes. So apparently a Grand Jury is not convened just to get information.

My personal opinion is that it's a GJ convened to get an indictment in a murder case where the body has not been discovered. I don't have a lot of GJ experience, but I do believe it's common to seek an indictment under those circumstances b/c it is much harder to prove murder w/o a body. Maybe RoughlyC can check in on this one.

"It's just an investigative grand jury,'' Stavely said.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

 

[Emma Peel]

My understanding is the prosecution requests review of their case by the GJ when they feel their case is ready to be tested for probable cause for criminal prosecution. The prosecutor presents the case, the evidence, etc.. That may or may not include live witnesses. For example, if they have investigative interview transcripts - they may not need live witnesses for the GJ. If the GJ wishes, they can compel live testimony. The GJ decides the soundness of the Prosecution's case & makes a recommendation for proceeding to trial.

Sounds like Dede got a GJ subpoena to testify during a GJ proceeding that was in process. IMO, if Dede refused to cooperate with the investigation until forced, the prosecutor may have introduced Dede's value as a witness and asked the GJ to compel her testimony.

IMO - Dede's testimony must have been pretty darn important
- even if it was simply timeline critical - it was critical. Perhaps everyone else's testimony was already in the prosecution's investigative records.

At any rate, the prosecutor would not convene GJ if he wasn't ready to layout his criminal prosecutory evidence and get the go ahead from the GJ to bring criminal charges against Terri. They must have enough to try to go on. IMO.

:cow:

 

[xin]

Well, didn't TH spend 8-9 hours with her lawyer on Friday? and then maybe more time over the weekend. She was either getting ready to testify at the GJ or talk to the cops with her attorney.

GJ can indict for murder, and this is a body independent of LE/DA office, so it eliminates some of the defense typical "rush to judgement" arguments.

PS for those of you who have been tuned in today--my guess on Fri was that TH would testify today at the GJ. It seems as though DeDe was in first--this is good--keeps the pressure on TH. Any guess on when TH will testify?

Arrest(s) are coming soon.

moo

 

[JSR]

From what I understand (I read it somewhere on this thread), GJ in Portland/Multnomah are continuous. They meet on an on-going basis, and take whatever case or individuals the DA brings. Because of that, I'm thinking this isn't a GJ specific to TH/Kyron, but is somewhat routine in a manner that speaks to DDS being lawyered up and not speaking unless compelled to.

Further, I think that DDS claimed 5th amendment rights, as she was in at 11:20 and out before noon. That's a very short time to do much more than say "I stand on my right against self-incrimination", unless they had only a few questions to ask her, which also may be the case.

Best-
Herding Cats

Correct. Here in CA a random group of people are selected to serve on a grand jury. Their "term" to serve is for a period of time. Say 30 days. I have a friend who served on a grand jury for a year. They hear whatever case the DA wants to bring forth. And it may take one day or several months to get all the evidence to the grand jury in a particular case.

 

[cluciano63]

I too am wondering if she either took the 5th or had nothing to contribute, in so short a period of time. It does not seem that she was in there long enough to result in an indictment.

 

[sorrell skye]

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

"It's just an investigative grand jury,'' Stavely said. "Today was a preliminary, very short session. I anticipate she'll be back in front of the jury sometime in the future.''

Spicher wasn't called in until sometime after 11:20 a.m., and was done before noon, her lawyer said.

Based on this, I would be surprised if an indictment was handed down in the near future (as in tomorrow or anytime this week - if there ever is an indictment, that is). I think what is more likely is the GJ will convene several more times to hear further testimony & evidence related to the Kyron Horman case.

 

[Calliope]

I wonder if we will know tomorrow or soon, for sure if Kyron has been murdered. Or killed in some other way.

I'm afraid so

 

[BeanE]

IMO, if Dede refused to cooperate with the investigation until forced, the prosecutor may have introduced Dede's value as a witness and asked the GJ to compel her testimony.

Stavely also disputed allegations that Kaine Horman and Desiree Young made last Thursday, contending that Spicher was impeding the investigation by not cooperating and advising others not to talk to law enforcement.

"Well, the fact of the matter is she has been cooperating,'' Spicher's lawyer said. "She met with detectives in the case for three-and-a-half hours, and has had several follow-up conversations with detectives. She's cooperated fully. And frankly, the suggestion that she has urged others not to cooperate is absolutely false.''

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

 

[Calliope]

In this video:
http://www.kgw.com/news/local/DeDe-Spicher-testifies-before-grand-jury-99252004.html#kyron

The reporter asks if she was subpoenaed as part of a criminal investigation or just to solicit information. Her attny said that to his knowledge it was just to "solicit information."

IMO, that means DeDe is not being criminally investigated per se... but that she had information that LE wanted, but could only get from her via a grand jury. In other words, she wouldn't talk unless she was forced to.

I have a real problem with that, just in general.

 

[fran]

I know we haven't heard, but it makes sense now that TH spent the better part of Friday at her lawyer's office.

Wonder if she'll show up?

JMHO
fran

 

[Chablis]

I know we haven't heard, but it makes sense now that TH spent the better part of Friday at her lawyer's office.

Wonder if she'll show up?

JMHO
fran

If its a hearing for her indictment, she does not have to show up I dont think, Casey Anthony wasn't called when a Grand Jury connived in her case.

 

[LaceSprocket]

Where are we getting that only Dede testified? I'm not reading that anywhere? Help?

In this video:
http://www.kgw.com/news/local/DeDe-Spicher-testifies-before-grand-jury-99252004.html#kyron

The reporter says that several other friends are being scrutinized (by LE), but "We do not know if anyone else was subpoenaed."

That means other friends **could have been*** subpoenaed, but maybe not. The answer is - we only know DeDe testified.

They also said DeDe testified for LESS than an hour.

Less than an hour is not very long.

 

[Emma Peel]

Stavely also disputed allegations that Kaine Horman and Desiree Young made last Thursday, contending that Spicher was impeding the investigation by not cooperating and advising others not to talk to law enforcement.

"Well, the fact of the matter is she has been cooperating,'' Spicher's lawyer said. "She met with detectives in the case for three-and-a-half hours, and has had several follow-up conversations with detectives. She's cooperated fully. And frankly, the suggestion that she has urged others not to cooperate is absolutely false.''

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

Perhaps Dede was cooperative with the investigation in many areas of their questioning. And then again, perhaps Dede was not cooperative with the investigation in other certain areas of questioning. (Since we now the greyish definition of the word cooperative.)

 

[Calliope]

Kaine Horman has filed a motion in court this morning, asking a judge to order his estranged wife, Terri Moulton Horman, to disclose the source of the reportedly $350,000 she has paid to retain criminal defense attorney Stephen Houze
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spicher appeared very briefly, but is expected to return before the grand jury for a more extensive session at a later date, Stavley said. Stavley could not accompany his client as the proceedings are closed and secret.

"It's just an investigative grand jury,'' Stavely said. "Today was a preliminary, very short session. I anticipate she'll be back in front of the jury sometime in the future.''

Spicher wasn't called in until sometime after 11:20 a.m., and was done before noon, her lawyer said.

Stavely also disputed allegations that Kaine Horman and Desiree Young made last Thursday, contending that Spicher was impeding the investigation by not cooperating and advising others not to talk to law enforcement.


http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

ot bbm... what a horribly constructed sentence /ot




"Well, the fact of the matter is she has been cooperating,'' Spicher's lawyer said. "She met with detectives in the case for three-and-a-half hours, and has had several follow-up conversations with detectives. She's cooperated fully. And frankly, the suggestion that she has urged others not to cooperate is absolutely false.''

D, K, and T may have opened themselves up a can o' worms with that letter.

 

[sorrell skye]

Stavely also disputed allegations that Kaine Horman and Desiree Young made last Thursday, contending that Spicher was impeding the investigation by not cooperating and advising others not to talk to law enforcement.

"Well, the fact of the matter is she has been cooperating,'' Spicher's lawyer said. "She met with detectives in the case for three-and-a-half hours, and has had several follow-up conversations with detectives. She's cooperated fully. And frankly, the suggestion that she has urged others not to cooperate is absolutely false.''

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

I'm glad DS's attorney addressed that issue - and with some specific information regarding how she's cooperated.

 

[Aedrys]

I too am wondering if she either took the 5th or had nothing to contribute, in so short a period of time. It does not seem that she was in there long enough to result in an indictment.

Stavely also disputed allegations that Kaine Horman and Desiree Young made last Thursday, contending that Spicher was impeding the investigation by not cooperating and advising others not to talk to law enforcement.

"Well, the fact of the matter is she has been cooperating,'' Spicher's lawyer said. "She met with detectives in the case for three-and-a-half hours, and has had several follow-up conversations with detectives. She's cooperated fully. And frankly, the suggestion that she has urged others not to cooperate is absolutely false.''

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

Sounds to me like she went in, said what she had to say, and then left. If she's cooperating with police, then I don't see her going in front of a Grand Jury just to assert her 5th amendment rights. I also don't see her as a person that tells long, convoluted stories. She seems straightforward to me, a person who cuts right to the chase. I think she said the truth, without gory and extraneous detail, and then left.

 

[nursebeeme]

"It's just an investigative grand jury,'' Stavely said.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kaine_horman_asks_court_to_hav.html

that is coming from the mouth of DDS's atty... not sure I am ready to swallow that one whole

 

[Emma Peel]

I have a real problem with that, just in general.

I guess GJ's are investigative by nature though. Keep trying until you get it right. I bet they have a lot of information to review & the GJ on this might take a long time if the prosecution needs to review with them all sorts of data that creates their circumstantial case.