2012.05.17 Doc Dump Thread

[pcrum12]

On page 17 of the police information....it CLEARLY states that the headphones were found ON THE GROUND NEAR THE VICTIM.

Yea, I jumped too quick - it was reported found in pocket of victim in error then other ofc reported found on the ground. I don't know -- we could argue which ofc reported correctly but I'll concede and agree they were found on the ground unless other evidence to contrary is reported.

 

[pcrum12]

Chris Who?

Serino?

 

[pcrum12]

I saw that a 7-11 red lighter was also on TM's in pocket

page 82/ 183

IMO the fact that he had a lighter from the 7-11 and no cigs says a lot.

 

[pcrum12]

AS I mentioned upthread, Trayvon had only 1.5 to 2 nanograms in his blood. Pinsky said that if he had been smoking at the time, it would be 100. It's possible, he also said, that he smoked it 2 hours ago. But possibly days ago as well.

The most important point of that line of interview to me is the fact that, "high enough to be 'right on the line' to be considered legally imparied to operate a vehicle". Kinda says he smoked that day and could have been within 2 hours or maybe even less. I don't know anyone that smoked 2 weeks ago that would still be too high to drive. kwim? confusing.....

 

[pcrum12]

He bought a lighter at 7-11 and doesn't smoke cigarettes, so he either had some weed, or was about to score some. JMO

Thank you thank you!

 

[pcrum12]

I agree with everything you said , I also feel it is so much healthier and safer then taking pain meds which will cause aggression in some people.The point of TM possible smoking a joint that night IMO is very important because that might explain why TM might have attacked GZ because if TM was either looking for a private spot to smoke or was seen in a hidden spot to GZ it might have looked very suspicious.Also some people do get paranoid when they smoke,TM might have freaked thinking to stop GZ from calling 911 on him and getting police involved.IF GZ took out his phone to call police and said I am calling the cops TM might have punched him in the face to prevent that call not knowing they were called already.TM was on his 3rd suspension from school , most likely his parents probably told him to stay out of trouble Le would be the last people he would want called on him IMO. I wonder if the amount was small in his blood if he had been looking for a spot to smoke in when GZ first spotted him and maybe he ditched any pot he had then came back to confront GZ.

Can't find my smileys! UGH. So, YOU ROCK! I ditto what you said.

 

[mikeysmommom]

GZ is not squeaky clean either. He has to live with the fact that he killed TM, whether it was self defense or not.

Every human who makes it to at least grade school most likely are the only squeaky cleans human being IMO.After that most of us even those who try really hard are not squeaky clean because we are all human.Just saying......

 

[pcrum12]

He was given a suspension on a Sunday?

I think it was reported he was several days into the suspension. IIRC.

 

[Concerned Papa]

Wonder where this witness lives? Chasing "in the direction TOWARDS the T"?

If true, that means the initial encounter or meeting between the two began even further away from "where the sidewalks meet" than the 63 feet to where we now know the body was located. Remember, George's story has been that he was walking towards his vehicle, ON THE MAIN SIDEWALK, when attacked by TM.

If that's not true, how do you believe the rest of "Standing His Ground"?

 

[pcrum12]

GZ was an adult, TM was still a minor. I think GZ's actions were far worse than anything TM ever thought about doing. I guess it's ok to take pills, leave your home patroling with a loaded gun, get agitated for no apparent reason, call 911 to report a kid minding his own business. This is all normal behavior? If GZ had been smoking he might have stayed home sat on the couch watched TV, ate, and we wouldn't be discussing this right now.

BEM: GZ "pills" were prescribed! Legal! No evidence he abused or over medicated! Pot is ILLEGAL! It's clearly in TM's system. That's evidence.

 

[mikeysmommom]

It was probably angel dust. You are talking about the 70's, that was when everyone partied. The hippi days. I know because I graduated high school in 71 and drugs were everywhere. really bad drugs and pot laced with all kinds of carp. I seriously doubt just a joint would do that but everyone is different. That's not a normal reaction to MJ.

ETA I use to joke that I missed the sixties and most of the seventies lol. I was a long haired clean hippy for a few years lol.

I know it was not a normal reaction because at the time around 1975 I was 16 and had smoked at her house with her and we would just laugh,listen to music,talk about guys, then send pizza's to her ex boyfriend down the street and peek out the window to watch them deliver it lol.We were only 5 years apart she was my cool aunt lol.She was always mellow except that one time,it was extremely scary for both of us.Luckly she got me right before school so I was able to run to her house to keep her calm and safe.We were very close and she knew I would be there in a heartbeat for her. I miss those day but she nor I ever did what we called drugs just smoked a plant that god left here for us.IMO It should be legal for medical use and it is a shame that people who are very sick and hurting have to suffer so much.She was all alone when she smoked it and it was the first and most likely last time she smoked in the morning. I do not think it was pcp because she was not violent just so very scared and super paranoid that the cops knew and were coming for her.

 

[pcrum12]

No it isn't.

Under the federal sentencing guidelines, a "drug trafficking offense" as "an offense under federal, state, or local law that prohibits the manufacture, import, export, distribution, or dispensing of a controlled substance (or a counterfeit substance) or the possession of a controlled substance (or a counterfeit substance) with intent to manufacture, import, export, distribute, or dispense."

Source: http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/drug-trafficking/

Can someone give me a definition of import and export - Nevermind, here it is: im·port (m-pôrt, -prt, mpôrt, -prt)
v. im·port·ed, im·port·ing, im·ports
v.tr.
1. To bring or carry in from an outside source
ex·port (k-spôrt, -sprt, kspôrt, -sprt)
v. ex·port·ed, ex·port·ing, ex·ports
v.tr.
1. To send or transport

 

[LambChop]

Respectfully, we don't know that there were 3 suspensions, there has been some very bad reporting that was using leaked (unconfirmed info) in the Miami Herald. My understanding, from the parents, there was a situation with writing on a locker and because of it, they seized his backback and found the bag with marijuana residue (not a pipe from what I have heard), a screwdriver, and some jewelry. All one incident, not separate ones as some have suggested. He has been described favorably by teachers at his school, he was known as a good student. MOO.

I believe the school said one was for being tardy/late for school and they do not suspend for that. My guess it was a detention but the media reported it as a suspension. jmo

 

[pcrum12]

IMO If TM did not attack GZ he would be alive right now.If GZ did not have a gun, I am not so sure he would be.

YOU ROCK! Totally Agree.

 

[saguaro]

If you don't cooperate by taking a test that is your right but you can't say you were cooperative.

I'm going to go out on a limb in saying that I feel that GZ would HAVE agreed to any testing that the police wanted had they asked.

He didn't flee the scene and he did make the 911 calls.

 

[gator]

This prosecution is the result of another media hoax. A picture of a child, looking nothing like the way TM "styled" himself, looking nothing like the stranger GZ saw wandering in his -targeted neighborhood.


Yes, let's have a discusion about "profiling"... and "rights." Did the multi racial neighbors in that condo complex have the "right" to live in peace with the property they worked for? GZ was a volunteer, giving his time in just that effort. If the demographic of those committing the crimes FIT TM's description...then following him is common sense. The use of the word "profiling" presumes that we throw out statistics. YOU WATCH those who fit the profile of those committing the majority of crimes in a respective area...i be old blonde women, bearded Amish farmers, or young Black males. Otherwise, you throw out common sense and give into crime. If a moments annoyance on one side...and stopping crime is on the other...then stopping crime trumps annoyance.


So GZ had no right to get out of his car...no right as WATCH CAPTAIN to watch a stranger wandering in his crime plaqued neighborhood? But TM had a right to break his nose and beat his head into the pavement amd NOT be interrupted till what...GZ's death?

TM had been removed from one school, suspended three times from the new one, drugs in his system, ...far from the angelic 13year old invented by the media. Something was going on in his life and those negative events and his Facebook page and the illegal drug in his system are NOT pointing to a positive direction.

GZ should never have been charged under Fla law as it exists. This is another media driven Hoax...and now, as the truth drips out, and certain individuals have grown rich from this tragedy, the media will slink away.

I strongly disagree with this post. How would you feel if you were profiled and followed by a non-LE stranger because of the color of your skin? It is the job of law enforcement to enforce the law, not random paranoid vigilante citizens.

 

[stmarysmead]

the 7-11 tapes are interesting but are not in actual real-time speed. I see a kid who greets the clerk. They even exchange comments and then Trayvon gives him exact change. I suspect the question was "would you prefer a $20 or change?" Then Trayvon digs in his pockets for exact change. It breaks my heart that within a half an hour he would lie dead, in the rain, because some cowboy decided he was a bad guy.

There is a time stamp on one of the video views and it looks like it say 18:59:59. If that was the time then Trayvon definitely wasn't dawdling.

The facts may be...that tragically, TM is dead within an hour because he decided to use his fists to deal with a problem rather than his intelligence. The "cowboy" had no ESP to discern what TM's intentions were.

It's also a tragedy that residents of all races live in such fear that they need Watch Captains for extra protection, but that is a sorry fact. All of our children have to understand that it is those who harrass these neighborhoods that bring about a need for watchfulness or profiling. If old blonde women are causing the majority of crime in my neighborhood, then it is THEIR actions that cause me to be watched more closely. It is statistics that caused GZ to watch TM. Statistics are not racism, hatred or bias...they are just FACT not emotion. Working with fact is the only common sense way to protect your neighborhood.

IMO it is also tragic that so many good kids now wish to dress and style themselves and TALK as if they were "gangstas." Of course, they have the right...but do parents talk about the possible consequences? Or do we now feel so entitled that it is demanded that others discern the real thugs from the "pretenders?"

Imagine if TM had been taught to walk up to an adult and say "hi...I'm visiting with in Condo C. I thought you might wonder who I am...and I want to know that I'll be here for over a week." Kids used to be taught respect,humility, and how to approach a situation.....instead of rudeness, sense of entitlement, and finally, physical confrontation.

The media once again...was not content with truth or facts. TM was made five years younger and angelic. Anything negative about himwas met with emotional hysteria...as if TM's perfection was NOT to be questioned. Meantime, they scoured the gutter for anybody to say anything bad about GZ...could any of us stand against an army of paid character assassins reporting any unsubstaniated dirt? Everything was EMOTION. They did not even get GZ's race correctly reported...because the story was juicer if GZ was "white." Members of Congress referred to TM being "shot like a dog in the street."...as if there was no confrontation. TM's parents became media stars...and supposedly both quit their jobs. This became a one sided emotional Lynch Mob...demanding outcomes on falsely reported media "facts." Now the fairy tale is falling apart as FACTS come out. The media will slink away. They will report the stuff they don't like in a paragraph buried somewhere in the back where most will never see it. They have destroyed a man without a trial...to the point where our President (a lawyer) and our AG COMMENT on a case not yet gone to trial. Who is not going to convict GZ...he killed "the President's "son!!!!"

You may like this...but it is NOT justice. The whole matter is now disintegrating...fracturing into piles of little separate EXPOSED LIES. Just as Nancy grace took the night off when the Duke lacrosse Hoax was exposed...the media will slink away from the hysteria and lies they promoted. Think it's okay? Well, it could happen to you and yours.

Real subjects for scrutiny..like SYG laws will fade to the back again...just as the false duke Hoax set back REAL rape victims. In time, less and less people will give any credence to the important tangential issues because they feel duped by the fairy tale the media encapsulated those issues in.

So we all lose.

 

[mikeysmommom]

My daughter has a C J Degree she took the Police test was going to be a Police officer till a life long friend was shot in his patrol car.Thank God she is still in the field but that changed her mind.She is a terrific kid always has been never in any trouble ever.She has always had a police mindset, she was never a law breaker ever.Even though she loves her family IMO if she knew anyone who broke the law she would IMO call the police herself to report it.We had new neighbors and weird out of place things would happen small things she noticed everything at the same time driving 4 hrs 4 days a week going to school for her degree at Seton Hall, a lot of classes she made it in 3 yrs even had summer classes.She knew he was up to know good and she was right.He was running a car theft ring in north Jersey ,he told everyone he was a used car salesman lol.We all believed him but not her he wound up raided,arrested, then when on bail he stole a new caddy and when cornered by police he shoot himself and died.So I really believe some people are not really cop wanna Be's some just have it built it them as well as a very high respect for the job police do and I believe GZ is like my daughter JMO.

 

[gxm]

I strongly disagree with this post. How would you feel if you were profiled and followed by a non-LE stranger because of the color of your skin? It is the job of law enforcement to enforce the law, not random paranoid vigilante citizens.

I have been "profiled" as Middle Eastern even though I am not ME, just look like it. And as an adult I have been "profiled" as a teenager and followed through stores. Frankly, I just accept it because I understand why. I "get" why I have been stopped while driving through airports. And I "get" why I have been followed while shopping. It's just people doing their job.

GZ was a community volunteer and a tenant. He was within his rights to question what TM was up to. As I teenager I was often asked by an adult what I was up to. IMO, that's a common occurrence.

JMO, OMO, and MOO

 

[stmarysmead]

I strongly disagree with this post. How would you feel if you were profiled and followed by a non-LE stranger because of the color of your skin? It is the job of law enforcement to enforce the law, not random paranoid vigilante citizens.

If the majority of crimes in my condo area where committed by individuals of my age and general description, I would be upset with THOSE CRIMINALS...bevause it is the statistics that are causing me to be watched.

There are hard working people of all races in that complex. THEY have a right to live in peace and keep the things they worked for. If that means that those who fit the description of the majority of criminals get "looked at"....that is the fault of the criminals.

This idea that we want less crime but we cannot hurt anyone's feeliings in trying to be safe...takes sensitivity too far. The right of all those people of all races to live there in safety trumps the "feelings" of a teenager being watched for 15 minutes and not liking it. This is not about race or ethnicity..but statistics.

What's the alternative? look away and watch a 90 year old Asian woman instead of a teenager who fits the description of those harrassing neighbors of all races? Or just don't watch at all...and let the Criminals run rampant?