4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #81

[jepop]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661460528097820679

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661460531201605633

From what I read here, looks like the parents may have been called as witnesses to support an alibi? For this PA disappearance? Just a guess. Entwin says via a "source close to the case'" that it 'looks like' BK has a "solid alibi". MOO

 

[Nila Aella]

From what I read here, looks like the parents may have been called as witnesses to support an alibi? For this PA disappearance? Just a guess. Entwin says via a "source close to the case'" that it 'looks like' BK has a "solid alibi". MOO

Why take it to a grand jury if he has a solid alibi?
MOO

 

[Idaho transplant]

IMO, it has to be something pretty substantial to convene a grand jury.

I've heard many experts say that a person doesn't just kill 4 people as their first crime, that the killer must have some prior offenses leading up to that. But, isn't that what BTK committed as his first killing - 4 victims? Kohberger has been linked to BTK via the instructor at DeSalles, there does seem to be a number of coincidences.

 

[jepop]

Why take it to a grand jury if he has a solid alibi?
MOO

Don't know. Says "it looks like". Maybe they are called just for extra support of it.

 

[NyxNY]

If he has a solid alibi you'd think that it wouldn't go to grand jury. Or maybe the parents are the alibi, lol.

That's what I'm thinking.

 

[Balthazar]

"45-year-old Dana Smithers, has been missing since May 28, 2022." That was a Saturday. She was last seen leaving her best friend's house on foot at 11pm (their houses were close together so she walked.) Dana's car keys and phone were found in her home. Her best friend said she seemed nervous and wanted her to come to her house but the best friend was tired and went to bed instead. Sister hoping for new clues in disappearance of Pennsylvania woman Dana Smithers, last seen on camera 7 months ago

Her remains were found May 1, 2023. Remains found in Stroudsburg identified as missing woman Dana Smithers

 

[Cindizzi]

UPDATE: On May 1, 2023 the Stroud Area Regional Police Department in Pennsylvania announced that Dana Smithers has been found dead.

A few days earlier, on April 27, the department said in a press release that at approximately 11:22 am that day, dispatch received a call from borough employee who discovered “what was believed to be human remains” in a “wooded area next to Park Avenue/ 80 E on-ramp, in the Borough of Stroudsburg.” The remains were recovered by detectives and turned over to the coroner’s office.


The autopsy, conducted on May 1, determined the remains belonged to Dana. The cause and manner of her death are currently undetermined.

Sister hoping for new clues in disappearance of Pennsylvania woman Dana Smithers, last seen on camera 7 months ago

The 45-year-old was last seen on May 28, 2022, leaving her neighbor’s house. Her phone, purse, and other personal items were later recovered at her house.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[Megnut]

Let's hope Xana got something in fighting for her life.

Perhaps she went for his eyes! Couple of scratched corneas will make it hard to see --

jmo

 

[Odeto BJ]

I think it's in the last thread that I addressed this very question and cited rules of professional conduct and reasons that this would be unacceptable. The court can actually require the prosecution to sort it out, it's not fair play if things are hidden in the dump, and it can be cause for sanctions and IIRC appeal. I provided links there, too.

You did address the stigma of data dumping and your reference does state that for delivery to the defense counsel, combining multiple documents into a single PDF or image file is not acceptable; that the original documents must retain their form per their ordinary presentation in the course of business. So a PO needs to look like a PO and an invoice like and invoice and a bank statement like a bank statement, not like a string of comma delimited ASSEMBLER data.

Of course: pure digital data that would not have the established format or invoke an action as per a legal or commercial document, does not have a recognizable "norm" in 2-dimensions: it would nominally never be applied to paper in its continuing, conventional useage. As example: data stored by an auto's ECU and DCU; Wi-Fi contact data; ROM-BIOS data; and similar.

I was trying to indicate that the SUMMARY of data as presented by an LE technician or an expert witness or similar has never needed to abide by any consistent structuring or format. NOT FORMAT as per PDF, TIFF, HPSC....but the actual orientation and structure of the table as it appears on screen or paper. Consider the Murdaugh trial: the tight timeline for the event was constrained and defined through cell phone pings, cell phone circuitry and screen interactions, actual cellular calls and PMs, traffic camera images, Blue Tooth emulations and a host of other events as a summary eventually presented by a very nervous FBI tech. It was a table driven by source and time and the time divided to the hundredth of a second; synchronized and normalized. The defense counsel objected strenuously to the size, extensivity and intensivity, and relevance of the entirety and of specific portions because (one party particularly to...) the defense was professing continuing incomprehension. The summary had been delivered to the defense quite a bit earlier; some late data came in from On Star (GM) and the summary was reworked and a whole new round of objections and meetings in chambers resulted. As it appeared on screen during trial it was Rev. 11 IIRC. And they kept having to scroll back to find the headings associated with a specific data record because those headings were not at the top of each screen. (no wonder the tech was nervous...) That prepared presentation was a key determinant in the outcome of the trial.

Same trial: The CFO of Murdaugh's law firm showed the firms account entries and check records on paper with selected entries highlighted by hand and manuscript notations. Established format; embellished manually. Not the same thing at all.

Its the collation of this raw, unformatted, entirely digital data and its specific means of presentation to a courtroom that needs to be normalized via guidelines and established methodology. The effort of preparing the summary will nominally be on the prosecution in a criminal trial and forwarded to the defense once complete. Otherwise, delivering the raw hexadecimal in discovery is nothing less than a dump; but the extraction and presentation remains subject to challenge so the data needs to be forwarded.

This may well be established, or under consideration, or even at some level implemented but my observations of recent proceedings would indicate it never anticipated the volumes or the variety that could be assembled by LE from our current useage of electronics and digital equipment and security equipment. Every person involved in the ID crime is a prolific data generator, largely passively, as indicated by the size of the digital files already forwarded during discovery. We have another tight timeline for the event; a history of cell phone records at least 5-months long; and E-mails and SM uploads dating back much further than that.

Judge Judge will be considering motion after motion on relevance and verifiability... Its going to be a long trial.

 

[Cindizzi]

The State’s Request for Discovery Disclosure and DEMAND for
Defendant’s Notice of Defense of Alibi

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/052323%20States%20Request%20for%20Discovery%20Disclosure%20%20Alibi%20Demand.pdf

 

[x_files]

If he has a solid alibi you'd think that it wouldn't go to grand jury. Or maybe the parents are the alibi, lol.

My guess his parents were his only alibi.

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661460528097820679

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661460531201605633

That's interesting news.

 

[arielilane]

Dana K Smithers thread:

Found Deceased - PA - Dana Kristine Smithers, 45, Stroudsburg, 28 May 2022 *found in 2023

Missing Person The Stroud Area Regional Police Department is seeking the public’s assistance in locating a missing person from Stroudsburg. On 06/04/2022, Dana Smithers, of Stroudsburg Borough, Pennsylvania was reported missing to the Stroud Area Regional Police. Smithers was last seen on...

www.websleuths.com

 

[arielilane]

Kohberger's parents called to testify in front of grand jury

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661471493669224454

Kohberger’s parents called to testify in front of grand jury

The case is related to Dana Smithers – a 45-year-old woman who went missing in May of 2022 in Monroe County, Pennsylvania.

www.newsnationnow.com

Brian Entin

Updated: MAY 24, 2023

(NewsNation) — Bryan Kohberger’s parents have been called to testify before a grand jury in Pennsylvania, NewsNation has learned.

The case is related to Dana Smithers, a 45-year-old woman who went missing in May of 2022 in Monroe County. That’s the same Pennsylvania county where Kohberger lived.

A source close to the case says Kohberger has a solid alibi and is likely not connected to Smither’s disappearance — but the grand jury has not concluded their proceedings and the investigation is ongoing.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

3J was so utterly unprepared to say the names that at one point he expressed pity for himself, saying “this is hard” while mangling Xana’s name.

We don't know that he was expressing pity for himself IMO. There could be a lot of reasons he said "this is hard".

Judge Judge will be considering motion after motion on relevance and verifiability... Its going to be a long trial.

I agree. I appreciate your deep dive.

 

[jepop]

You did address the stigma of data dumping and your reference does state that for delivery to the defense counsel, combining multiple documents into a single PDF or image file is not acceptable; that the original documents must retain their form per their ordinary presentation in the course of business. So a PO needs to look like a PO and an invoice like and invoice and a bank statement like a bank statement, not like a string of comma delimited ASSEMBLER data.

Of course: pure digital data that would not have the established format or invoke an action as per a legal or commercial document, does not have a recognizable "norm" in 2-dimensions: it would nominally never be applied to paper in its continuing, conventional useage. As example: data stored by an auto's ECU and DCU; Wi-Fi contact data; ROM-BIOS data; and similar.

I was trying to indicate that the SUMMARY of data as presented by an LE technician or an expert witness or similar has never needed to abide by any consistent structuring or format. NOT FORMAT as per PDF, TIFF, HPSC....but the actual orientation and structure of the table as it appears on screen or paper. Consider the Murdaugh trial: the tight timeline for the event was constrained and defined through cell phone pings, cell phone circuitry and screen interactions, actual cellular calls and PMs, traffic camera images, Blue Tooth emulations and a host of other events as a summary eventually presented by a very nervous FBI tech. It was a table driven by source and time and the time divided to the hundredth of a second; synchronized and normalized. The defense counsel objected strenuously to the size, extensivity and intensivity, and relevance of the entirety and of specific portions because (one party particularly to...) the defense was professing continuing incomprehension. The summary had been delivered to the defense quite a bit earlier; some late data came in from On Star (GM) and the summary was reworked and a whole new round of objections and meetings in chambers resulted. As it appeared on screen during trial it was Rev. 11 IIRC. And they kept having to scroll back to find the headings associated with a specific data record because those headings were not at the top of each screen. (no wonder the tech was nervous...) That prepared presentation was a key determinant in the outcome of the trial.

Same trial: The CFO of Murdaugh's law firm showed the firms account entries and check records on paper with selected entries highlighted by hand and manuscript notations. Established format; embellished manually. Not the same thing at all.

Its the collation of this raw, unformatted, entirely digital data and its specific means of presentation to a courtroom that needs to be normalized via guidelines and established methodology. The effort of preparing the summary will nominally be on the prosecution in a criminal trial and forwarded to the defense once complete. Otherwise, delivering the raw hexadecimal in discovery is nothing less than a dump; but the extraction and presentation remains subject to challenge so the data needs to be forwarded.

This may well be established, or under consideration, or even at some level implemented but my observations of recent proceedings would indicate it never anticipated the volumes or the variety that could be assembled by LE from our current useage of electronics and digital equipment and security equipment. Every person involved in the ID crime is a prolific data generator, largely passively, as indicated by the size of the digital files already forwarded during discovery. We have another tight timeline for the event; a history of cell phone records at least 5-months long; and E-mails and SM uploads dating back much further than that.

Judge Judge will be considering motion after motion on relevance and verifiability... Its going to be a long trial.

Wow, this is such an info packed post on how digital data is collated for discovery exchange and for presentation at trial. Very clear and easy to understand for a lay person such as myself. I watched some of the Murdaugh trial and the digital evidence was extremely complex and there was a tonne of it. For this case, as you say, surely there will be even more. I really wonder how prosecution is going to have all of that digital data collated into evidentiary form by October. Obviously there have to be many professionals on the job but imagine the co-ordination required for such a massive task! I think the trial will end up getting pushed out. I hope not but realistically motions concerning relevance and verifiability are inevitable. MOO. Thanks for your work.

 

[Cindizzi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661478079133519873

 

[twall]

From last night's Banfield show-Explanation by a Idaho criminal defense attorney on the stand silent plea and motion to unseal grand jury testimony.

 

[Cindizzi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661483343823925249

 

[twall]

From last night's Banfield show-Brian Entin at Moscow house and BK's former apartment in Pullman. He says BK's associate's break in was in the building behind BK's. Dateline also mentioned the break in on last Friday's episode.