4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #81

[girlhasnoname]

It seems it would take a lot of courage or beta blockers to kill four people if he is NOT a psychopath.
I fear vulnerable street kids or a homeless person may have been his first.

or animals

 

[Nila Aella]

Reviewing the Financial warrants

There were two different Umpqua warrants

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 financial records for 4 victims plus 3

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/022823%20Order%20to%20Seal%20and%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 but this one is for Exterior camera footage on November 12 9pm to November 13 12pm. Umpqua on Washington Street, Moscow.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

I looked up the address on Washington Street, 1 mile from King road.
Maybe looking at the ATM outside? or?

MOO

 

[SpiderFalcon]

Reviewing the Financial warrants

There were two different Umpqua warrants

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 financial records for 4 victims plus 3

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/022823%20Order%20to%20Seal%20and%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 but this one is for Exterior camera footage on November 12 9pm to November 13 12pm. Umpqua on Washington Street, Moscow.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

I looked up the address on Washington Street, 1 mile from King road.
Maybe looking at the ATM outside? or?

MOO

Or maybe looking at the camera on it? IMO

 

[Zinn]

Regarding the timeline, we have seen video of BK receiving his diploma at DeSales University's Commencement Ceremony on May 21, 2022. Dana Smithers was last seen at 11 p.m. on Saturday, May 28, 2022, on her neighbor's Ring camera.

Dateline producers seemed to suggest that BK bought a knife on Amazon in April, IIRC. Do we have an exact date for when BK posted his "survey" online while he was at DeSales? I remember it was late in the academic year, but don't remember the date.

In any event, we don't know if there is any evidence to connect BK to the PA disappearance of Dana Smithers. Reporting in MSM is saying that BK has an alibi for the time of DS's disappearance. If BK's parents are testifying with regard to the alibi, it's posssible there was a significant event that occurred the weekend of May 28, 2022, and that is why the family remembers the date and where BK was at the time. But all this is just speculation.

Also, I don't think BK left for Pullman until early July when he drove across the country with his father. Someone had posted (way back on this forum) that BK's mother posted on Facebook that it was around the July 4th weekend and she was already missing her son as father and son had set out for the trip across the country for BK to start his doctoral program at WSU. IIRC.

Don’t know if anyone has replied about the timing of his posted surveys. I was able to see his reddit posts requesting research participation before the posts were removed. Saw them on 12/30/22 and the date stamp indicated they were posted 191-212 days prior, meaning they were posted during roughly the first three weeks of June, 2022. There were 11 posts, duplicates but posted to many different subreddits (prison, prisons, excons, prisontalk, felons) and at different times (191, 204, 210 and 212 days prior to when I saw them on 12/30/22). It’s possible there may have been additional posts that were deleted some time prior, but I did see 11 posts apparently posted during the first few weeks of June, 2022. His name and DeSales email address were included in the posts.

 

[SLouTh]

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 but this one is for Exterior camera footage on November 12 9pm to November 13 12pm. Umpqua on Washington Street, Moscow.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf
I looked up the address on Washington Street, 1 mile from King road.
Maybe looking at the ATM outside? or?

The wording certainly makes interesting reading ……

Can you be a bit more specific about your “or” ??? Maybe a hint???

Or maybe looking at the camera on it? IMO

Or what was seen on the camera footage perhaps???

 

[Nila Aella]

The wording certainly makes interesting reading ……

Can you be a bit more specific about your “or” ??? Maybe a hint???


Or what was seen on the camera footage perhaps???

No hint...I was wondering if anyone else had ideas. MOO
Just interesting that it was for a specific time, around the time of the offense, and the warrant was early (11/19). Maybe LE was aware that one of the victims went there (or there was a transaction) and wanted to see who it was or if anyone was following? IDK still thinking on it. JMO

 

[SLouTh]

Or maybe looking at the camera on it? IMO

Would “Security Video“ be the same as an ATM Camera in the US???

 

[SLouTh]

No hint...I was wondering if anyone else had ideas. MOO
Just interesting that it was for a specific time, around the time of the offense, and the warrant was early (11/19). Maybe LE was aware that one of the victims went there (or there was a transaction) and wanted to see who it was or if anyone was following? IDK still thinking on it. JMO

If BK took the route from Conestoga Drive and Palouse River Drive he could have hooked onto Highway 95, via Main Street…

That intersection (where the Bank is) Is one of the last on Highway 95 before turning onto the main road to Pullman …. On to Highway 8 …

Even though BK allegedly left the scene in the other direction, it is quite possible he went that way, to get back to the main Highway …. That security video footage is maybe the last sighting in Moscow Idaho that night of Suspect Vehicle 1 (the white Elantra) ???

Edit to add …
Possibly after doing the initial legwork and tracking down CCTV in the area, the Police we’re onto the “white Elantra“ quite early???

IMO

 

[SpiderFalcon]

If BK took the route from Conestoga Drive and Palouse River Drive he could have hooked onto Highway 95, via Main Street…

That intersection (where the Bank is) Is one of the last on Highway 95 before turning onto the main road to Pullman …. On to Highway 8 …

Even though BK allegedly left the scene in the other direction, it is quite possible he went that way, to get back to the main Highway …. That security video footage is maybe the last sighting in Moscow Idaho that night of Suspect Vehicle 1 (the white Elantra) ???

IMO

Or maybe they looked for what they "didn't see" on it.

 

[SLouTh]

Or maybe they looked for what they "didn't see" on it.

Quite possible ….

However, the wording of the documents in question, don’t support that IMO

They state the following reasons:

1. Interfere with enforcement proceedings;
2. Constitute an unwarranted invasion of personal privacy,
3. Disclose the identity of a confidential source; and
4. Disclose investigative techniques and procedures.

And the State seeks this protection for a minimum of ninety (90) days or until such time as the investigation is concluded and/or charges are filed.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

JMO on the interpretation of the document …

 

[maskedwoman]

If BK’s parents are being subpoenaed, and it’s not the missing woman’s case, then I wonder if it is about the Idaho case? That would make more sense to me. JMO

I believe Grand Juries are limited to investigating crimes committed within the jurisdiction that seats them. If they are not specifically looking into Dana Smithers due to the tip, maybe they empaneled a grand jury to look into any unsolved PA crimes that BK might have been involved in and Dana Smithers just happens to be one of them? Otherwise, I think that would reduce the options to investigating companion crimes to ID that could have taken place in PA, like obstruction, destroying evidence, etc. It seems like a Grand Jury wouldn't be the best way to look into something like that. MOOooo

 

[Justice101]

Possibly after doing the initial legwork and tracking down CCTV in the area, the Police we’re onto the “white Elantra“ quite early???

IMO

Yes, VERY early. Canvassing the close by houses for video was priority one for the investigative team that was not gathering evidence inside the house. This was for 2 reasons: 1) The perpetrator had to have gotten to the property by a vehicle or by walking and all video would be crucial for time and what they show and 2) a lot of people's videos is looping which means within only 4 days sometimes, the old videos is written over by new video.. so time was of the essence to get and copy that video from the hard drive before it was gone.

My thought was they knew it was a white compact car within a day or two...but it took another few days for the FBI expert to positively identify it as a white Elantra.

Police held that information close to the chest while they searched for potential Elantra owners for the element of surprise.

Eventually the released the info to the public to help

 

[SLouTh]

If BK took the route from Conestoga Drive and Palouse River Drive he could have hooked onto Highway 95, via Main Street…

That intersection (where the Bank is) Is one of the last on Highway 95 before turning onto the main road to Pullman …. On to Highway 8 …

Even though BK allegedly left the scene in the other direction, it is quite possible he went that way, to get back to the main Highway …. That security video footage is maybe the last sighting in Moscow Idaho that night of Suspect Vehicle 1 (the white Elantra) ???

Edit to add …
Possibly after doing the initial legwork and tracking down CCTV in the area, the Police we’re onto the “white Elantra“ quite early???

IMO

Apologies on quoting myself …

The above theory wouldn’t work if BK took Sand Road or similar back to Pullman?? And his car was first picked up at 1300 Johnson Avenue in Pullman, as per the affidavit ….….

But the above could have been the route BK took into Moscow that night from Pullman ??? (Just reversed)

IMO

 

[maskedwoman]

Attorney Shanon Gray also filed tort claim notices with @uidaho on behalf of the Goncalves and Mogen families. I just received copies of those notices.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661814179056226304

As @daniallsop noticed: these documents also put Idaho State Police on notice that the families could sue… The university, ISP & City of Moscow have 90 days to respond. The families have 2 years to sue.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1661816855085068288

I cannot imagine what liability U of I could have in this. The victims were all of legal age. They were murdered off campus, by a student of another university. U of I wouldn't have had any authority over him or the investigation.

 

[SpiderFalcon]

I cannot imagine what liability U of I could have in this. The victims were all of legal age. They were murdered off campus, by a student of another university. U of I wouldn't have had any authority over him or the investigation.

Families in pain. Grasping at any and everything for comfort IMO

 

[NyxNY]

That's how it is where I live. But not in Idaho. I don't know PA's rules.

However, if they did schedule a GJ hearing, the State has to give the case some kind of name. If there's such a thing as an investigative grand jury in PA, then I would assume that they would meet several times to go over whatever it is the State is bringing to them. GJ's do not choose their own cases. Where I live, the DA makes the decision to send matters to the GJ (and our rules are quite different to Idaho's and Pennsylvania's).

Someone has to be bringing the investigative material in front of the GJ - but in what matter, we don't know. I can envision a series of tips and complaints about BK arising from his new notoriety and I can imagine a secret GJ being asked to sort that. OTOH, does anyone know of any GJ (ever, anywhere) that met simply to discuss a bunch of tips/complaints about one person when there was no evidence collected locally by LE? (I'm trying to make sense of what we're hearing).

IMO.

See. This is why I read this forum. Yes, I find all things involved with crime investigations, the law and everything that goes on behind the scenes interesting. I am an expert of NOTHING, zero, zilch, nada. But I learn so much from people in this forum, which is what I enjoy most.

OT, I know--apologies. I just wanted to take a moment and thank all the experts (verified or not) of this forum for sharing their thoughts, opinions and knowledge.

MOO

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Yes, VERY early. Canvassing the close by houses for video was priority one for the investigative team that was not gathering evidence inside the house. This was for 2 reasons: 1) The perpetrator had to have gotten to the property by a vehicle or by walking and all video would be crucial for time and what they show and 2) a lot of people's videos is looping which means within only 4 days sometimes, the old videos is written over by new video.. so time was of the essence to get and copy that video from the hard drive before it was gone.

My thought was they knew it was a white compact car within a day or two...but it took another few days for the FBI expert to positively identify it as a white Elantra.

Police held that information close to the chest while they searched for potential Elantra owners for the element of surprise.

Eventually the released the info to the public to help

Yes, IIRC, there was a team of LE dedicated to only investigating and reviewing available video footage, although there was a mountain of it to review (at the end, 51 Terabytes was released in discovery) so it of course took a while even with a team.

But I also think very early on they honed in on a white sedan that was seen in the neighborhood around the house that night, and "stepped out" from there concentrically block by block and day by day, and checked ATM cameras during that step out for white cars and people using the ATM or walking by.

MOO

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Would “Security Video“ be the same as an ATM Camera in the US???

Yes, for the most part if I understand what's being discussed about the Umpqua warrants.

It could have been for video footage from cameras mounted inside the walk up teller machine (Automatic Teller Machine, or ATM) where customers withdraw and deposit funds, or on the bank building itself.

MOO

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Reviewing the Financial warrants

There were two different Umpqua warrants

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 financial records for 4 victims plus 3

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/022823%20Order%20to%20Seal%20and%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

Umpqua 11/19 served 11/21-22 returned to LE 11/23 but this one is for Exterior camera footage on November 12 9pm to November 13 12pm. Umpqua on Washington Street, Moscow.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/030723%20Order%20to%20Seal%20%20Redact%20-%20Umpqua%20Bank.pdf

I looked up the address on Washington Street, 1 mile from King road.
Maybe looking at the ATM outside? or?

MOO

The first warrant for Umpquah is the security video from the ATM and outside the bank. Umquah is 1/4 mile from the Corner Club, straight shot to it. The time of the warrant is from 9 pm on 11.12 (the night before they were murdered on 11.13 at 4:20ish am.) to 12 pm on 11.13. IOW the tight timeframe around the time they went to the Corner Club, then to the Grub Hub, then home to be murdered on November 13. So I'm sure that LE wanted to see who, if anyone, was at the ATM with them, and just to retrace their steps that night as well. Perfectly normal.

The second Umpquah warrant is dated 11.19 and is for the four victims and 3 others. It seems LE knew about Umpquah right away as the victims' bank. Again, perfectly normal as LE constructs their lives. The warrants only started raising questions when these happened later.

Here's a summary:

* Bank of America: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Block: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Umpquah Bank: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Paypal/Venmo: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
SO it looks like they knew about those accounts initially, and then something happened and they started adding more parties and obviously looking at more accounts. But why?
* Numerica Credit Union: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Idaho Central Credit Union: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Wells Fargo: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* American Express: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and I can't tell how many others because bullet points were redacted)
* Idaho Dept of Labor: 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Discover Bank: 11/28, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Banner Bank : 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Potlach Credit Union #1: 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Elan Financial Services: 12/22, Kaylee only (by this time they knew about BK, but it's interesting and that they did not do a warrant for this along with the other rounds - why not?)

We also cannot assume that the same 3 or 5 were the same parties across all warrants, nor can we assume that it's just the other roommates IMO.

 

[SpiderFalcon]

The first warrant for Umpquah is the security video from the ATM and outside the bank. Umquah is 1/4 mile from the Corner Club, straight shot to it. The time of the warrant is from 9 pm on 11.12 (the night before they were murdered on 11.13 at 4:20ish am.) to 12 pm on 11.13. IOW the tight timeframe around the time then went to the Corner Club, then to the Grub Hub, then home to be murdered on November 13. So I'm sure that LE wanted to see who, if anyone, was at the ATM with them.

The second Umpquah warrant is dated 11.19 and is for the four victims and 3 others. It seems LE knew about Umpquah right away as the victims' bank. The other warrants came later. Here's a summary:

* Bank of America: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Block: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Umpquah Bank: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Paypal/Venmo: 11/19, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
SO it looks like they knew about those accounts initially, and then something happened and they started adding more parties and obviously looking at more accounts. But why?
* Numerica Credit Union: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Idaho Central Credit Union: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Wells Fargo: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* American Express: 11/27, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and I can't tell how many others because bullet points were redacted)
* Idaho Dept of Labor: 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Discover Bank: 11/28, 4 victims and 5 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Banner Bank : 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Potlach Credit Union #1: 11/28, 4 victims and 3 add'l (receipt says they got info for 4 victims and 3 others)
* Elan Financial Services: 12/22, Kaylee only (by this time they knew about BK, but it's interesting and that they did not do a warrant for this along with the other rounds - why not?)

We also cannot assume that the same 3 or 5 were the same parties across all warrants, nor can we assume that it's just the other roommates IMO.

Can we assume that LE was looking at the victims in the security video?