A family affair?

[LotteDK]

What if...? The parents thought it was the son hurting her, maybe out of jealosy (just a guess). But it was an accident, she fell and hurt her head and went in a coma. They wantet to protect their last child, so they made it look like an intruder, with the long letter etc. Not being doctors, they could have thought she was dying and ended it. Maybe the boy did sit and eat pinapple with her, after she hit her head, but the internal bleeding would make her fall down, and not move. He gets his mom, or the mother comes down seeing her lying in the kitchen, lifeless. The boy is sent to bed, and she wakes up the father, maybe telling him that the boy may have pushed her? So they try to save their son.

 

[icedtea4me]

What if...? The parents thought it was the son hurting her, maybe out of jealosy (just a guess). But it was an accident, she fell and hurt her head and went in a coma. They wantet to protect their last child, so they made it look like an intruder, with the long letter etc. Not being doctors, they could have thought she was dying and ended it. Maybe the boy did sit and eat pinapple with her, after she hit her head, but the internal bleeding would make her fall down, and not move. He gets his mom, or the mother comes down seeing her lying in the kitchen, lifeless. The boy is sent to bed, and she wakes up the father, maybe telling him that the boy may have pushed her? So they try to save their son.

Then shouldn't there be another bowl of pineapple on the table?

 

[LotteDK]

I think that sharing with your sister from your own bowl, is a possibility. Maybe she just wanted to taste it? but i am just guessing. But I think its normal to share like that, when you are children.

 

[webst1916]

The JonBenet Ramsey murder case is so convoluted and complicated. The crime scene completely botched. I did some digging not long ago into this and I found a timeline and what stood out to me was John Ramsey and his business success. At the beginning of December 1996 they had a company dinner to celebrate 1 billion in company profits, I believe. Then you look at Dec. 23rd, their Christmas party that took place in their huge three story mansion. At that time a 911 call was placed and when the police arrived, the Ramseys didn’t even answer the door. A woman named Susan Stine gave them a story and warded them off. Then you have the night where they go have Christmas dinner with their best friends, the Whites and nothing is amiss. After that everything went down, including JonBenet’s murder. From autopsy reports, it shows JonBenet suffered a skull fracture without external bleeding, so a blunt object. She was definitely sexually assaulted. Violently strangled, causing hemorrhages in both eyes, etc. Jonbenet also had another DNA sample on her underpants that were not her families, vague as the sample was. She was murdered violently. It doesn’t seem logical that her loving parents did that or her nine year old brother.

The Whites have came forward years later to tell their version because they were first called by Patsy to come over. They said that John Ramsey found the little girl after the police had arrived in their wine cellar in the basement (a place Mrs. White claims she had gotten lost in before). He doesn’t preserve the crime scene, grabs her up and shows her to police. They figure out the ransom note was written on a pad that belonged in the home.

Afterward, the Ramseys lawyer up and do not cooperate with the police. And eventually loose contact with the Whites. The Ramsey attorneys completely run the show after that. John doesn’t even take a lie detector test. The DA wants to indict, but doesn’t under insufficient evidence. What also went down shortly after was that John Ramsey sold his very profitable business and completely got out of it.

I have deduced from everything I’ve read and found that Access Graphics, the business John Ramsey started and later affiliated as a subsidiary of Linheed Martin was probably pretty shady. I think John Ramsey made his money the dirty way and in some way made some enemies from it. I also think that 911 call made two days before JonBenet was murdered wasn’t an accident. I don’t know if there was even a list to who went to that Christmas party, but if an intruder wanted to hide out — the Ramseys had plenty of space and could easily do so.

I think JonBenet was a target bc she was beautiful and winning pageants and a lot of attention drawn to her. And maybe it started off a kidnapping that went wrong or maybe the guy in question just viciously killed her and left her.

Either way, I think the Ramseys behaved the way they did because they knew who their daughter’s killer was and also knew if they came forward with the name, they would shed light on John Ramseys shady or criminal business operations. Their daughter was dead, no going back on that. So preserve the wealth and the rest.

 

[LotteDK]

thanks for your detailed apply Some questions thow. A blunt object can be anything, also something you fall in to. And that she dident bleed, may have been the reason nobody reacted in the beginning. I read that there where some brusing, but no penetration, so no evidence of sexual abuse. The touch DNA, could come from anywhere, anyone at any time, and therefore not usabel as evidence. If I lived in the U.S being innocent, my first and only word would be - lawyer, or your rights goes down the drain. That the dad refuse to give a polygraph, might even support my theory.. But its all a theory. To many mistakes and cover ups, have been done in this case to be sure about anything.

 

[UKGuy]

What if...? The parents thought it was the son hurting her, maybe out of jealosy (just a guess). But it was an accident, she fell and hurt her head and went in a coma. They wantet to protect their last child, so they made it look like an intruder, with the long letter etc. Not being doctors, they could have thought she was dying and ended it. Maybe the boy did sit and eat pinapple with her, after she hit her head, but the internal bleeding would make her fall down, and not move. He gets his mom, or the mother comes down seeing her lying in the kitchen, lifeless. The boy is sent to bed, and she wakes up the father, maybe telling him that the boy may have pushed her? So they try to save their son.

LotteDK,

The boy is sent to bed, and she wakes up the father, maybe telling him that the boy may have pushed her? So they try to save their son.

Yes, this seems a distinct possibility.

Also from the autopsy report we have:

REMAINDER OF EXTERNAL EXAMINATION: The unembalmed, well developed and well nourished caucasian female body measures 47 inches in length and weighs an estimated 45 pounds. The scalp is covered by long blonde hair which is fixed in two ponytails, one on top of the head secured by a cloth hair tie and blue elastic band, and one in the lower back of the head secured by a blue elastic band.

...

Here is what Patsy says:
1997 BPD Patsy Interview, Excerpt

ST: Did JonBenet normally sleep in addition to her jewelry with any hair ties in her hair.

PR: Usually, uh, a rubberband.

ST: Pulled back into a single ponytail.

PR: Back, ponytail, yeah.

So it looks like JonBenet made it to bed, as in her postmortem staging the parents forgot about her ponytails.

Yet we have a precedent here since there was an incident in 1994 when Burke hit JonBenét with a golf club, cutting her cheek, this has been dismissed as an accident. On this occasion Patsy rushed JonBenet to the hospital for medical advice, i.e. no waiting about!

So if JonBenet is accidentally in a coma why not dial 911 immediately to get medical assistance for JonBenet?

So maybe there is more to the case than simply an accident?

.

 

[LotteDK]

Maybe there where more than one situation, with Burke and JonBenét. I think, when one child gets most of the attention, there will be some tension. And a parent feeling guilty, and loving their son, will do absolutely everything to protect him. Siblings fight, but if one dies, wouldent you try to protect the other one? And I agree, there is much more to this case, than simply an accident. Maybe he did push her.. and then they chose to protect him?.. thanks for your reply

 

[proust20]

The autopsy revealed chronic sexual abuse. How many people would have had that sort of access to JBR?The hymen was eroded. There is also evidence of most probably digital penetration the night of the murder. The person(s) who molested her in her last moments did not treat her brutally. In fact, she was wiped down and redressed after death, and then wrapped in a blanket.

 

[UKGuy]

The autopsy revealed chronic sexual abuse. How many people would have had that sort of access to JBR?The hymen was eroded. There is also evidence of most probably digital penetration the night of the murder. The person(s) who molested her in her last moments did not treat her brutally. In fact, she was wiped down and redressed after death, and then wrapped in a blanket.

proust20,

In fact, she was wiped down and redressed after death, and then wrapped in a blanket.

Here is what the coroner thought:

December 29, 1996, BPD Search Warrant for Boulder, Colorado 15th Street, Excerpt

Det. Arndt informed Your Affiant that Dr. Meyer stated to her that he observed red stains in the crotch area of the panties that the child was wearing at the time that the child's body was subjected to the external visual examination. Dr. Meyer stated to Det. Arndt that the red stain appeared to be consistent with blood. Det. Arndt further informed the Affiant that Dr. Meyer stated to her that after examining the panties (as described above), he observed the exterior pubic area of the child's body located next to the areas of the panties containing the red stains and found no visible reddish stains in that area. Dr. Meyer stated to Det. Arndt that his opinion is that the evidence observed is consistent with the child's pubic area having been wiped by a cloth.

Was this done to make the crime-scene consistent with an abduction scenario or to make the removal of forensic evidence less obvious?

.

 

[proust20]

But, of course, there was no abduction. That scenario could not be considered reasonable for very long. The only aspect of the case which suggests a kidnapping is the RN. Whoever wrote the RN knew it was bogus. The only reason to write it was misdirection and delay. This is where IDI falls apart IMO. An intruder had no motive to delay the inevitable.
To be even-handed, I suppose that it is possible that an intruder could have written the note before the killing, and left it behind on the spiral staircase. However, for that to be valid requires much twisting of logic.

 

[UKGuy]

But, of course, there was no abduction. That scenario could not be considered reasonable for very long. The only aspect of the case which suggests a kidnapping is the RN. Whoever wrote the RN knew it was bogus. The only reason to write it was misdirection and delay. This is where IDI falls apart IMO. An intruder had no motive to delay the inevitable.
To be even-handed, I suppose that it is possible that an intruder could have written the note before the killing, and left it behind on the spiral staircase. However, for that to be valid requires much twisting of logic.

proust20,
Obviously there was no abduction and possibly no initial sexual assault?

It might all be crime-scene staging done by amateurs who wanted to do enough to claim deniability?

.

 

[proust20]

UK Guy
Amateurs who were successful in avoiding capture. In this instance, too many cooks did not spoil the broth.

 

[UKGuy]

UK Guy
Amateurs who were successful in avoiding capture. In this instance, too many cooks did not spoil the broth.

proust20,
Sure, this is how I read the case. Also with the under the age of criminal responsibility factor and the Ramsey's extreme wealth, being able to lawyer up fast, allowed them to outflank the police who usually rely on arrests and last minute deals.

If the case were PDI, I could never see Burke Ramsey, sometime in the future, telling us all that "My Mom Did It."

Yeah, the Ramsey family will want to maintain their innocence and deny reality. I'm looking forward to the day Burke Ramsey starts doing talk show circuit.

.