Accident or Intentional; Evidence and Debate

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  • #81
The more I think about the duct tape, the more I can't make it "fit" with an accident scenario. Why bother trying to stop decomp leakage/insects from specific orifices only, when you are wrapping the entire body in plastic bags and a waterproof laundry bag anyway???

And am I the only one who thinks the duct tape looks like it was chewed on from the inside?

Plus by the time the leakage would start to occur I think the jaw would have dropped. Have to get Joypath's expert opinion on this one. You make a very good point about the bags. Thanks.

If they were chew marks that would eliminate an accident for 100% certainty. JMO
 
  • #82
The more I think about the duct tape, the more I can't make it "fit" with an accident scenario. Why bother trying to stop decomp leakage/insects from specific orifices only, when you are wrapping the entire body in plastic bags and a waterproof laundry bag anyway???

And am I the only one who thinks the duct tape looks like it was chewed on from the inside?

I certainly do see what you are referencing, but considering what the duct tape went through pertaining to the time element, the weather conditions, water, and animal activity, it would be difficult for me to say for sure, although, I don't believe anything I just mentioned would really affect the "pattern" of that edge, so maybe it is teeth marks.

If anyone on the board has a roll of Henkel tape, maybe they would be kind enough to attempt biting through the tape to see if they could tear it?

Casey also had a knife in her car, and while it was only a dinner knife, it did have serrated edges that could have been used on the tape.
 
  • #83
JB was not under oath when he spoke to KB. Wonder if he would have the same answer if he was put on the stand?

Which brings up his response to the date KC first engaged him as her attorney....June 17, 2008. He was under oath. Slip or truth? JMO
 
  • #84
I certainly do see what you are referencing, but considering what the duct tape went through pertaining to the time element, the weather conditions, water, and animal activity, it would be difficult for me to say for sure, although, I don't believe anything I just mentioned would really affect the "pattern" of that edge, so maybe it is teeth marks.

If anyone on the board has a roll of Henkel tape, maybe they would be kind enough to attempt biting through the tape to see if they could tear it?

Casey also had a knife in her car, and while it was only a dinner knife, it did have serrated edges that could have been used on the tape.

I think the reference to the chew marks from the inside have to do with Caylee. I could be wrong but chew marks would indicate Caylee may have tried to bite the tape while she was still able to breathe. JMO
 
  • #85
The more I think about the duct tape, the more I can't make it "fit" with an accident scenario. Why bother trying to stop decomp leakage/insects from specific orifices only, when you are wrapping the entire body in plastic bags and a waterproof laundry bag anyway???

And am I the only one who thinks the duct tape looks like it was chewed on from the inside?

Would that not promote DNA or would the elements have taken care of that..
 
  • #86
I am sorry I must have missed where Shirley said that she believed that Casey would kill Caylee. I also hate to say it, but I dont think she was involved with Casey and Caylee enough to have an opinion on that. Not to mention IF Shirley said that, there are an awful lot of other statements from those who WERE involved closely with Casey and Caylee who say the opposite.

I also think that Mothers defend and/protect their children (it is biologically programmed into us after all). I think that Shirley would have a negative view of Casey for many reasons that have to do with HER daughter Cindy, and not necessarily her "own observations".

If I remember correctly, Shirley even said KC should be put in GP. Shirley thought GP would make KC tell what happened to Caylee.

As for other people saying what a wonderful mother KC was to Caylee are you including CA who called her daughter an unfit mother?
 
  • #87
Would that not promote DNA or would the elements have taken care of that..

Caylee's DNA was certainly on the tape at some point, but not by the time the FBI tested it. Presumably the elements destroyed it.
 
  • #88
If I remember correctly, Shirley even said KC should be put in GP. Shirley thought GP would make KC tell what happened to Caylee.

As for other people saying what a wonderful mother KC was to Caylee are you including CA who called her daughter an unfit mother?

She also said she was a wonderful mother that could never hurt her child..so she has two opinions..
 
  • #89
I certainly do see what you are referencing, but considering what the duct tape went through pertaining to the time element, the weather conditions, water, and animal activity, it would be difficult for me to say for sure, although, I don't believe anything I just mentioned would really affect the "pattern" of that edge, so maybe it is teeth marks.

If anyone on the board has a roll of Henkel tape, maybe they would be kind enough to attempt biting through the tape to see if they could tear it?

Casey also had a knife in her car, and while it was only a dinner knife, it did have serrated edges that could have been used on the tape.

I think the reference to the chew marks from the inside have to do with Caylee. I could be wrong but chew marks would indicate Caylee may have tried to bite the tape while she was still able to breathe. JMO

Thanks, LC. I didn't mean the edge--I meant the part in the middle, where the fabric backing of the duct tape isd all scrunched together but the outside of the tape is essentially undamaged.
 

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  • #90
They all talk out of both sides of their mouths bad Casey Good Casey so it becomes useless...

If you're inferring that just because the grandparents have said both, that Casey is a good mom and isn't a good mom, then it suddenly becomes awash; I absolutely disagree.

The "easy" thing to do for all parents is to brag about their offspring, right? None of us attend family BBQ's and readily spew out all of our children's shortcomings, but instead, we tend to emphasize, if not even over-exaggerate, the good. It's human nature. It's what naturally comes from a loving parent's heart.

What is not natural, is to outline our children's darkest, most unloving, lying, cheating, thieving characteristics, particular when in relation to how our child has treated their own baby.

The fact that George, Cindy, Lee, Shirley Plesea, (a great-grandmother no less), and some of Casey's friends have emphasized Casey's "dark side" in relation to her own baby, speaks volumes. It's a much more difficult task, and for most people, a very uncomfortable place to visit.

The fact that George Anthony, Casey's own flesh & blood father testified against his own daughter to a Grand Jury, is more than noteworthy.
 
  • #91
Thanks, LC. I didn't mean the edge--I meant the part in the middle, where the fabric backing of the duct tape isd all scrunched together but the outside of the tape is essentially undamaged.

Yes, I noticed that too. Almost as if someone bit down on it.
 
  • #92
I was refferring to what Kc told police and not what Lp says that TMc says
that someone else says that she said. Oh yeah, Ga was in their too.
People should stop putting words in Kc mouth, because it wont fly at trial.

From the letters it sounds like Kc does not believe Zanny is the perp. She has never said so either. She has only said that she dropped off Caylee at the steps at Sawgrass apts.

The Jury will be made up of people just like Ws I disagree somewhat.
I doubt the general public is on the same level as ws 'r doubt a Ws'r would even qualify to be on the jury. Furthermore, in the gulty not guilty thread, the not guilty made up for 11 percent. That is a hung Jury IMO
Oh yes she has! In her police interview, she specifically told LE, that ZF-G was the one that kidnapped her child!!!
 
  • #93
Well that means the Supreme Court won't buy it, but that does not mean the jury won't buy it. And what if it were true? I mean what if that really happened? What if panic set in? Not for Kc, but for anyone? Why can we not be allowed to be human and make mistakes without being charged with premedidated murder? What cant we just be charged with stupidity or bad reaction, or neglegence.
Are you forgetting about the Chloroform searches on the computer? What about Caylee's hair and the decomp in the trunk evidence? LE charged her with murder, NOT negligent homicide before Caylee's remains were ever even found!:banghead:
 
  • #94
If you're inferring that just because the grandparents have said both, that Casey is a good mom and isn't a good mom, then it suddenly becomes awash; I absolutely disagree.

The "easy" thing to do for all parents is to brag about their offspring, right? None of us attend family BBQ's and readily spew out all of our children's shortcomings, but instead, we tend to emphasize, if not even over-exaggerate, the good. It's human nature. It's what naturally comes from a loving parent's heart.

What is not natural, is to outline our children's darkest, most unloving, lying, cheating, thieving characteristics, particular when in relation to how our child has treated their own baby.

The fact that George, Cindy, Lee, Shirley Plesea, (a great-grandmother no less), and some of Casey's friends have emphasized Casey's "dark side" in relation to her own baby, speaks volumes. It's a much more difficult task, and for most people, a very uncomfortable place to visit.

The fact that George Anthony, Casey's own flesh & blood father testified against his own daughter to a Grand Jury, is more than noteworthy.

I dont believe anything they say as they lie continually. So I wont choose which statements are truthful and which are not based on my needs to make my point, I just view them as liars. As far as George's testimony I have no idea what he said or didnt I can assume that what he said made a difference but I have no knowledge of what was said.
 
  • #95
She also said she was a wonderful mother that could never hurt her child..so she has two opinions..

When have you ever heard someone say of a mother, "Yeah, I just knew she would someday kill her baby!"

Probably never.

No one ever wants to believe the fact that it does happen.

The fact that she spoke of Casey's jealousy toward Caylee and Casey's hatred for Cindy proves that it did exist.

She is also not the only one who has made reference to those facts, which further solidifies their actuality.
 
  • #96
She also said she was a wonderful mother that could never hurt her child..so she has two opinions..

I think it's important to make distinctions as to WHEN people said what about KC.

Many of the derogatory remarks about her and her behavior were made before Caylee disappeared - when nobody had an ulterior motive or agenda.

Any remarks about what kind of mother KC was or was not AFTER she was arrested bear comparing to any remarks made BEFORE, when people were likely more truthful because her future as a convicted criminal was not at issue.
 
  • #97
I am sorry I must have missed where Shirley said that she believed that Casey would kill Caylee. I also hate to say it, but I dont think she was involved with Casey and Caylee enough to have an opinion on that. Not to mention IF Shirley said that, there are an awful lot of other statements from those who WERE involved closely with Casey and Caylee who say the opposite.

I also think that Mothers defend and/protect their children (it is biologically programmed into us after all). I think that Shirley would have a negative view of Casey for many reasons that have to do with HER daughter Cindy, and not necessarily her "own observations".

Do you seriously propose that her grandmother, who has known her intimately for all of her life, knows less about her character than you do?
Or her Uncle Rick? He states quite vehemently in an email to Shirley- "She's guilty as Hell".
 
  • #98
She also said she was a wonderful mother that could never hurt her child..so she has two opinions..

Casey says, “the b!tch knows what it feels like now,” referring to her mother, Cindy.

Yes, a real sweetheart.
 
  • #99
Lee also said that KC gave him the whole "Zanny knocked me down at JB Park" story while out on bond, including physically "acting out" how Zanny pushed her.


Why am I picturing a Benny Hill skit complete with music? :waitasec:
 
  • #100
When have you ever heard someone say of a mother, "Yeah, I just knew she would someday kill her baby!"

Probably never.

No one ever wants to believe the fact that it does happen.

The fact that she spoke of Casey's jealousy toward Caylee and Casey's hatred for Cindy proves that it did exist.

She is also not the only one who has made reference to those facts, which further solidifies their actuality.

I just think they lie..
 
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