Alleged alcohol abuse Revisit w/new 2010.11.12 Dateline info

[cluciano63]

All I know is that if I was Desiree, I would be furious with Kaine for keeping from me the state of the homelife that Kyron was embedded in. I think she made it pretty clear it was news to her that her child lived with a chronic drinker with possible mental/emotional issues and that the house may have been a sort of battleground.

 

[debs]

All I know is that if I was Desiree, I would be furious with Kaine for keeping from me the state of the homelife that Kyron was embedded in. I think she made it pretty clear it was news to her that her child lived with a chronic drinker with possible mental/emotional issues and that the house may have been a sort of battleground.

I've heard the phrase "fire in her eyes" but man, Desiree was melting the inside of my television with the heat when she said that!

 

[Aedrys]

I do not want to bash Kaine.I just do not believe some of his allegations or the way he said things.
Her DUI was 5 years ago.Not today.That doesn't show me a problem.

I will say this and then I will move on.I've been in recovery for a long time and the ONLY ONE that can really call her an alcoholic is Terri herself.

1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.

I"m sorry for what you went through, but this line of thinking is WRONG. My mother picked up her father from bars for years. I think she had the right to call him an alcoholic when she was cleaning up his messes. My father drinks and shouts at the television, especially during football games - he still does it to this day and I don't like it when he's drunk. I think I have the right to call him an alcoholic. It is an insult to every person that has ever had to put up with an alcoholic in their homes to say THEY can't call someone an alcoholic! It's right in front of them and they have to deal with it because the alcoholics WON'T. Most alcoholics are NOT the ones that ever admit that they are alcoholics either.

I'm sorry. I do respect your opinion, but I do not support it. Not when I've had alcoholism run through my family. Besides, Terri will NEVER admit she's an alcoholic anyway. I believe Kaine because he was the only one there experiencing this with her. Baby K can't talk, and neither can Kyron now. Who exactly are we supposed to believe, the one person who can talk but refuses to?

 

[debs]

I"m sorry for what you went through, but this line of thinking is WRONG. My mother picked up her father from bars for years. I think she had the right to call him an alcoholic when she was cleaning up his messes. My father drinks and shouts at the television, especially during football games - he still does it to this day and I don't like it when he's drunk. I think I have the right to call him an alcoholic. It is an insult to every person that has ever had to put up with an alcoholic in their homes to say THEY can't call someone an alcoholic! It's right in front of them and they have to deal with it because the alcoholics WON'T. Most alcoholics are NOT the ones that ever admit that they are alcoholics either.

I'm sorry. I do respect your opinion, but I do not support it. Not when I've had alcoholism run through my family. Besides, Terri will NEVER admit she's an alcoholic anyway. I believe Kaine because he was the only one there experiencing this with her. Baby K can't talk, and neither can Kyron now. Who exactly are we supposed to believe, the one person who can talk but refuses to?

Which begs the question: IF this is true about Terri, why wasn't their father talking FOR them?

 

[Jo in Calif]

Which begs the question: IF this is true about Terri, why wasn't their father talking FOR them?

Possibly because he was trying to hold his family together. He sure is talking for them now, with a very loud voice.

 

[debs]

Possibly because he was trying to hold his family together. He sure is talking for them now, with a very loud voice.

According to Desiree, Kyron was a happy joyful boy, great sense of humor, coming up with all sorts of funny things to say. Kaine describes him as a great son, the best, intelligent, always asking questions, wanting to learn things. There are millions of pictures of him, his sister, his step brother all smiling and looking like they're having a grand ol time.

Kaine describes the day his son disappeared as normal, typical day. He describes a good father/son talk before he takes off from work. He describes a bucolic return home with wife and baby in attendance. Looked at the pictures the wife wanted to show, played with the baby a bit, and went off to work. He describes this day as "no different than any other day" and so my question is.....when did Terri start drinking that day?

How is any of this a "normal" day? And if it is a normal day, why would Kaine remove himself from where his daughter was, knowing that a normal day starts Terri off drinking herself blind?

I'm not trying to bash here. I have a real problem with a drunk not raising any sort of alarm in a man who should have been, as you state "trying to hold his family together"....walking on the eggshells that most drunks force everyone around them to walk on. Kaine had no alarms going off. If Terri did something to Kyron, how is it even remotely possible that this woman who can't hold herself together just watching TV maintain a facade that doesn't trigger anything in her spouse whose life had become one of intolerable drunk-watching?

It boggles.

 

[txsvicki]

If I remember correctly he was trying to show that Terri was not the sole primary caregiver of the baby, that they shared in her care.
In other words, he did not leave the house every morning and not return until the evening. 3 to 5 days a week he worked from home, didn't state the hours he was home, could have been half days or so, like on the 4th of June. He was trying to show that they shared in the baby's care.
I think that's where the statement came in that he didn't always know what Terri was doing during the day, as some or possibly most mornings he was at work. But they shared baby K's care.

I can't get the PDF to open right now to check the exact wording, but thought Kaine was saying that he was the primary provider, but may have been mistakenly basing some of my posts on that. I've been thinking that he meant Terri wasn't the primary provider because he was also saying that how he worked from home most days. I just hope he was Kyron's primary provider the 3.5-4 hours that he was awake and home, but out of his room during the week.

 

[Donjeta]

kaine writes:

Respondent's attorney (snip date) states that "It is undisputed that Respondent was K*s primary caregiver." That statement is not true. I dispute the claim that Respondent was K's primary caregiver. Further, I believe that Respondent is not fit to have contact with K, even if supervised.
During our marriage, I worked at home on average three to five days a week. I would be home and present with both children most afternoons and evenings unless travelling for business. Both Respondent and I shared responsibility for K."
http://www.kptv.com/download/2010/1026/25509272.pdf

 

[Donjeta]

After Desiree's reaction on the Today show I tend to think that there must have been alcohol problems because if he completely made this up from scratch in order to keep Terri away from the baby, Kaine or his lawyer must have realized that if it was news to Desiree she wouldn't react kindly to the information that he allowed an alcoholic take care of her precious boy and it could cause a negative reaction towards Kaine.

 

[BeanE]

Monday, November 14, 2010 - live interview with Desiree on the Today Show

Transcription


Mom: Stepmom had 'severe hatred' for Kyron
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/40192247#40192247

Q

Desiree: I personally have learned of information lately that has disappointed me in Kaine's choices and his behavior, and I just can't stand by and support the choices that he's making.


Q: court documents ... yet he never shared any of his concerns with you. Is that correct?

Desiree: That's correct. We learned of all of this information after the fact and from the media.

He had several opportunities to let Tony and I know what was going on in the house and he did not. He had several opportunities to make the right choice and either let me know or remove Kyron from the house.

I would have removed Kyron from the house had I have known what was going on.

Q

Desiree: I did not see any signs of the alc... Yeah. I did not see any evidence of the alcohhol abuse in fact I didn't know about the DUI until after Kyron went missing.

But as far as a personality disorder, I did for years, I was aware that she had some issues with pathological lying, things of that nature, but just mostly from my interactions with her, I don't... I didn't see, you know, as much as Kaine did.

Q

Desiree: Oh yes I did. Starting a year prior to his, him going missing, I tried to get custody of him.

Q

Desiree: Kaine told me it was not an option on several occasions, and it was a point of contention with us.

 

[Lucid]

According to Desiree, Kyron was a happy joyful boy, great sense of humor, coming up with all sorts of funny things to say. Kaine describes him as a great son, the best, intelligent, always asking questions, wanting to learn things. There are millions of pictures of him, his sister, his step brother all smiling and looking like they're having a grand ol time.

Kaine describes the day his son disappeared as normal, typical day. He describes a good father/son talk before he takes off from work. He describes a bucolic return home with wife and baby in attendance. Looked at the pictures the wife wanted to show, played with the baby a bit, and went off to work. He describes this day as "no different than any other day" and so my question is.....when did Terri start drinking that day?

How is any of this a "normal" day? And if it is a normal day, why would Kaine remove himself from where his daughter was, knowing that a normal day starts Terri off drinking herself blind?

I'm not trying to bash here. I have a real problem with a drunk not raising any sort of alarm in a man who should have been, as you state "trying to hold his family together"....walking on the eggshells that most drunks force everyone around them to walk on. Kaine had no alarms going off. If Terri did something to Kyron, how is it even remotely possible that this woman who can't hold herself together just watching TV maintain a facade that doesn't trigger anything in her spouse whose life had become one of intolerable drunk-watching?

It boggles.

Did it say she started her days drinking? only asking, because my first thought upon reading it was that she lived a normal day and really only drank at night, perhaps staying up late on the computer playing games.

having said that, maybe this WAS a typical normal day in the Horman household, and it just never made it far enough to the drinking stage.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

I"m sorry for what you went through, but this line of thinking is WRONG. My mother picked up her father from bars for years. I think she had the right to call him an alcoholic when she was cleaning up his messes. My father drinks and shouts at the television, especially during football games - he still does it to this day and I don't like it when he's drunk. I think I have the right to call him an alcoholic. It is an insult to every person that has ever had to put up with an alcoholic in their homes to say THEY can't call someone an alcoholic! It's right in front of them and they have to deal with it because the alcoholics WON'T. Most alcoholics are NOT the ones that ever admit that they are alcoholics either.

I'm sorry. I do respect your opinion, but I do not support it. Not when I've had alcoholism run through my family. Besides, Terri will NEVER admit she's an alcoholic anyway. I believe Kaine because he was the only one there experiencing this with her. Baby K can't talk, and neither can Kyron now. Who exactly are we supposed to believe, the one person who can talk but refuses to?

I'm sorry.I did not mean to offend anyone.All I meant was she is the only one to really say she is an alcoholic and do the first step if she is going to change get help.But I do not believe she was ever in this condition.I will move on because I see no proof she is an alcoholic.Only Kaines word.

 

[mmmagique]

Well,I'm going to have to hear this from others besides Kaine and right now,NO ONE is saying this but him.Honestly,We all do not know if she is an alcoholic or not and to put it out there she has an alcohol problem is slander.It really is.Well,again recovery is there if there is a problem with any one.

IANAL either but truth is an absolute defense against libe/slander. Even where malice is intended.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

IANAL either but truth is an absolute defense against libe/slander. Even where malice is intended.

Well,he is going to have to have the burden of proof.

 

[Chablis]

BBM~

Not only do we have the gym friend saying that TH looked a hot mess all of the time, but there is a what looks to be a good size weight gain AFTER she had baby K that would support what KH is saying as well. There are a number of photos of TH when baby K was an infant, and her face, arms and upper body look much thinner than when Kyron went missing. Looking at her face in more recent pics, she has a pretty classic 'booze bloat'. This, although circumstantial, would seem to support what KH is saying, that things seemed to go downhill for her after the birth of the baby.

As far as KH not knowing she was drinking, well, let's just say that alcoholics tend to be masterful at hiding their problem from people. My mother was an alcoholic. In our hearts, we all knew it, but she never admitted it. After she died and we had to go through her stuff and get her house ready for sale, we found a TRUCKLOAD of empty booze bottles hidden all over the house. It was beyond belief really. Not to mention, I have to also wonder if perhaps since all of this has happened, mutual friends may have come forward to confirm that which KH suspected, but didn't actually know. MOO...:twocents:

I totally agree about the differences in pictures of Terri after the babys birth, and recent ones. If she had post partum, weight gain could be from medication as well. I do believe she was probably mixing pills and booze, I do think her husband just got so sick of her that he didn't try to make the situation worse by arguing with her, and really you cant make someone get better they have to really want it as well. Plus Kaine laid it out in court papers he thought she drank too much and she promptly withdrew her plea to see her daughter. I think its hard to fight the truth.

jmo

 

[Chablis]

Which begs the question: IF this is true about Terri, why wasn't their father talking FOR them?

Whatever the reasons are, it does not warrant someone killing his child. I mean seriously, are we really going to pretend this kind of family unit is rare, and Kaine is an oddity? Terri probably had a lot of underlying mental issues and finally snapped, maybe Kaine should have spent more time caring, but maybe she was unbearable? So hes a crappy husband, MAYBE, still does not justify being the last one with a little child who is missing and taking the 5th and not answering questions about him. The child is more important than Terri, not her hurt feelings because she hated that husband who made it possible she didn't have to work and gave her a beautiful little girl, maybe he should have spent more time trying to pacify the crazy, I am sure he will regret that for the rest of his life, but him being a jerk, IF he is, does not make it ok that he is suffering the loss of his child, having your childs fate unknown is beyond punishment for not coddling his wife.

 

[mmmagique]

According to Desiree, Kyron was a happy joyful boy, great sense of humor, coming up with all sorts of funny things to say. Kaine describes him as a great son, the best, intelligent, always asking questions, wanting to learn things. There are millions of pictures of him, his sister, his step brother all smiling and looking like they're having a grand ol time.

Kaine describes the day his son disappeared as normal, typical day. He describes a good father/son talk before he takes off from work. He describes a bucolic return home with wife and baby in attendance. Looked at the pictures the wife wanted to show, played with the baby a bit, and went off to work. He describes this day as "no different than any other day" and so my question is.....when did Terri start drinking that day?

How is any of this a "normal" day? And if it is a normal day, why would Kaine remove himself from where his daughter was, knowing that a normal day starts Terri off drinking herself blind? I'm not trying to bash here. I have a real problem with a drunk not raising any sort of alarm in a man who should have been, as you state "trying to hold his family together"....walking on the eggshells that most drunks force everyone around them to walk on. Kaine had no alarms going off. If Terri did something to Kyron, how is it even remotely possible that this woman who can't hold herself together just watching TV maintain a facade that doesn't trigger anything in her spouse whose life had become one of intolerable drunk-watching?

It boggles.

I'm not positive, but I don't think it's ever been asserted or even implied Terri began her day by drinking. I thought this was a night time activity. She was trying to get a teaching position and volunteering at the school a lot, and she did go to the gym frequently, which would make drinking during the day quite difficult if not impossible.

 

[BeanE]

debs, I took what you said to mean that a normal day leads to Terri drinking at night, rather than that a normal day began with Terri drinking during the day.

Can you clarify please what you meant?

:blowkiss:

 

[mmmagique]

Well,he is going to have to have the burden of proof.

It's a civil case; the only thing that has to happen is for the judge to believe one of them just a smidge more than the other.

 

[Kimster]

Those who want to discuss and debate alcoholism on a personal level need to take it to the Jury Room. Thank you!