Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#11

[SMK]

What? A witness said Knox and Sollecito were wearing masks? Where does it say this and where were they seen wearing masks?

@Otto - was that Kokomeni who spoke of the masks? And Rudy said, "We're just on a party, man" or something to him?

 

[otto]

Yes, when one sees just how many of the surface aspects as well as the psychological motivations (reaching back even into childhood, we can see thanks to Nina Burleigh's book) come together within this scenario , and then compares it to the unflushed-toilet-as-spark -for-murderous-rage that Crini is trying to fly before the court, it is troubling to think that this will be missed by him.

As it is now press, and before the public domain, and with the court delays, what is your opinion, Otto? :waitasec:

Take note that it is also on the site's World News Page : http://www.tekjournalismuk.com/

My understanding is that in the Italian court, new evidence can be introduced during appeal ... just my understanding, though. If that's the case, I could see the prosecutor telling the court that new information has just been made available that allows all the pieces to fall into place.

 

[Amber29]

Could someone point me to where it shows that RG had blood on his pant leg, please? Since it's been brought up so much I'm sure there must be a reason for it.

I'm wondering why he would have so much blood on his pant leg. His upper body I could understand, but why his pant leg? And if his pant leg had that much blood on it than wouldn't his shoe been bloody as well to where he would have rinsed that off as well?

That has never been proven, it's speculation.

In RGs journal he said something about his pants being wet on his way home and trying to cover it with his sweater.Which leads me to believe they were wet near the top probably with blood. I mean how would your sweater cover your lower pant leg. Don't think the pants were recovered though so we will never know.

 

[otto]

@Otto - was that Kokomeni who spoke of the masks? And Rudy said, "We're just on a party, man" or something to him?

I don't remember the testimony of Kokomani and Curatilo, other than that they both came forward with information confirming that Knox and Sollecito were acting strange in the vicinity of the cottage. There was something about them pretending that they were mushrooms in middle of the road. One was wearing something like a swimming cap, but it's all a blur so many years later.

 

[SMK]

Someone should try the experiment. All I know is that in the murder case near me, the kitchen appeared spotless (no blood, no footprints etc) but with the application of luminol showed smears, smudges, wiping stains from multiple locations, everywhere blood had been, and had been washed away. The residue was not visible without the luminol.

There was a case also of a dentist who murdered his wife, and had the place steam-cleaned, and luminol still showed the clean up smears. That does give one pause: In my original theory, there was no clean up, Guede being alone in the murder room, but Knox and Sollecito involved nonetheless.

 

[quesarita]

@Otto - was that Kokomeni who spoke of the masks? And Rudy said, "We're just on a party, man" or something to him?

"Kokomani claims that he was driving in front of the cottage and that he had to stop quickly because there was a black garbage bag in the road.[39] When he stopped he realized the garbage bag was actually two people that Kokomani identified as Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito.[40] Kokomani claims to have punched Sollecito because he did not like his attitude.[41] Amanda Knox pulled a 16-inch knife from a green handbag and was holding it over her head with both hands.[42] Kokomani said Knox had the knife but was not threatening him with it only holding it above her head.[43] Raffaele Sollecito tried to assure Kokomani that there was no reason to be concerned by stating that Knox was only a girl. Kokomani went on to say that he then threw some olives and a cell phone he had in the car at Knox before driving away.[44]

According to Kokomani he then saw Rudy Guede. Kokomani asked Guede why the other two had knives and according to Kokomani Guede told him that the knife was to cut a cake for a celebration they were having at the cottage.[45] Kokomani also testified that Rudy Guede offered him money to borrow his car because they wanted to move some furniture the next day.[46] At this point Kokomani saw Sollecito approaching his car from behind so he took off. Kokomani claims he took a video knife but that he later deleted it.[47]"

Okaaaaaaayyyy :banghead:

from here:
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Raffaele_Sollecito's_Alibi

 

[aa9511]

I don't see it as a double standard if you say what you think, and I say what I think. It's a difference of opinion. It's not factual evidence from either of us - we weren't there. I am always looking for more factual evidence, and trying to avoid getting caught up in making up scenarios. i acknowledge I'm doing that with the bathroom scene which makes sense to me.

But I actually tried locking the door without leaving a footprint facing the door from outside and it's natural. It's also unnecessary to grasp the handle on the outside if you're holding onto the key and take the key with you.

Yes, perhaps, if Rudy was in the mindframe to be able to analyze his each and every step, and his each and every action, and each and every point where he placed his fingers, hands, or feet, or any part of his body.

I think it's easy for any of us to try to re-create these things within the comforts of our home, and re-create in a way which makes it possible to "fit the evidence."

Yes, perhaps it's possible for him to make those specific set of moves with his hands and feet while locking the door, at his own home, on his own time, carefully thinking about each and every move and how he does it.

That is not the mind-frame he would have after he just stabbed a young girl to death, the girl is bleeding everywhere, he needs to get out of there, he is panicked, he is stressed, he is nervous, and he just wants to get out of there.

Is he going to do some move in opening and locking the door which he does not normally do? Or is he going to fall back to the way he usually opens and closes and locks door, and moreover, do it a lot more clumsily b/c he is in a haste and panicked?

 

[otto]

Back to work ... will catch up later. Thanks for all the updates and especially the info about Knox finally admitting her pranking history. That, to me, is a huge development.

 

[quesarita]

Yes, perhaps, if Rudy was in the mindframe to be able to analyze his each and every step, and his each and every action, and each and every point where he placed his fingers, hands, or feet, or any part of his body.

I think it's easy for any of us to try to re-create these things within the comforts of our home, and re-create in a way which makes it possible to "fit the evidence."

Yes, perhaps it's possible for him to make those specific set of moves with his hands and feet while locking the door, at his own home, on his own time, carefully thinking about each and every move and how he does it.

That is not the mind-frame he would have after he just stabbed a young girl to death, the girl is bleeding everywhere, he needs to get out of there, he is panicked, he is stressed, he is nervous, and he just wants to get out of there.

Is he going to do some move in opening and locking the door which he does not normally do? Or is he going to fall back to the way he usually opens and closes and locks door, and moreover, do it a lot more clumsily b/c he is in a haste and panicked?

I get that, but what I meant was that I didn't take special care with my moves; it's just how my feet went when I walked out the doorway. It's less awkward than going into the hall, stopping to turn around and deal with the door.

 

[aa9511]

There's no way that I can catch up on even the last 10 pages of comments, but I did find the discussion about Knox's pranking ways very interesting. Although Knox's past pranks could not be verified by the prosecutors when they needed motive, it certainly looks like Knox herself has provided the most logical explanation of how things could have gone so drastically wrong between three stoned, drunk pranksters and a roommate that was lacking sleep and had work to do.

I think the court has a lot of sympathy for Sollecito, not so much for Knox since they don't know her. Unfortunately, what Sollecito's lawyer had to say seemed more like rehashing old arguments rather than shining new light on why the evidence should be viewed differently. I also think that Sollecito's lawyer made some effort to separate her client from Knox by repeating that in each and every letter where she implicated Patrick, she did not mention Sollecito.

I'm looking forward to final arguments, which I understand are now scheduled for Jan 20 and Jan 30.

Otto, I will say this, it's very illuminating for me as well.

 

[Myvice]

Just thought I'd add that the pranking scenario would answer the question of why they would bring the knife from RS's house.

ETA: Also AK had wanted to spend Halloween with MK so this would be a good little post Halloween scare. All in good fun.

 

[aa9511]

"In the case of Curatolo, the Appeal Court decided that his testimony was unreliable because he well have gotten his dates mixed up. He testified about seeing Knox and Sollecito, but also about seeing people "wearing masks" and buses going to and from the square where he was sitting. The reference to the masks and buses would seem to indicate that he was remembering the evening of October 31st (Halloween), and not November 1st."
Do you mean this witness?

Interesting, maybe they had actually planned the prank for Halloween night.

 

[aa9511]

"Amanda Knox has admitted on her personal blog for the first time that she had previously been involved in a ‘staged robbery’ during her time at the University of Washington. She admitted that the hazing prank, played on her flat-mates at the University of Washington, involved messing up the flat and hiding things to make it appear as if items had been stolen. Knox used "mutual friends" of her other housemates to help fake the burglary in her own premises. She acknowledges that it caused "distress" to her housemates and she and her accomplices had to apologise for the act. She does not disclose, however, what exactly happened or the full role of the "mutual friends". "

http://www.tekjournalismuk.com/45/post/2014/01/exclusive-amanda-knox-admits-staging-burgulary.html

Otto, I'm glad this has made you come out of your shell, or at least, take a peek out

You should have seen me last night...I could barely sleep. Fitting this new information in, and how nicely it all ties together

 

[Amber29]

Someone should try the experiment. All I know is that in the murder case near me, the kitchen appeared spotless (no blood, no footprints etc) but with the application of luminol showed smears, smudges, wiping stains from multiple locations, everywhere blood had been, and had been washed away. The residue was not visible without the luminol.

Did it test positive for blood in that case?

 

[aa9511]

Yes, when one sees just how many of the surface aspects as well as the psychological motivations (reaching back even into childhood, we can see thanks to Nina Burleigh's book) come together within this scenario , and then compares it to the unflushed-toilet-as-spark -for-murderous-rage that Crini is trying to fly before the court, it is troubling to think that this will be missed by him.

As it is now press, and before the public domain, and with the court delays, what is your opinion, Otto? :waitasec:

*Otto: Take note that it is also on the site's World News Page : http://www.tekjournalismuk.com/

Perhaps this is the reason Amanda chose now to confirm this information. She thinks it's all over. The prosecution already spoke. What has she got to lose now (and she might be right)?

She probably couldn't wait to tell everybody how she "duped" them. You know, duper's delight.

Why wait alllll this time, deny, deny, deny, and suddenly, after all the evidence is in and prosecution has spoken, now she confirms it.

What I would like to know is why these other roommates of hers stayed so quiet and did not say a word? Of course, I'm sure they believe her story that she has nothing to do with Meredith's murder, and they see the two as having no connection. Or maybe they just didnt't want to get involved. I am not going to judge them. I am just curious. Perhaps her PR team had a hand in making sure the information was kept out of mainstream.

Duper's delight, is what is going on.

 

[quesarita]

Did it test positive for blood in that case?

Yes, it did. He was convicted, but never confessed.

 

[aa9511]

Someone should try the experiment. All I know is that in the murder case near me, the kitchen appeared spotless (no blood, no footprints etc) but with the application of luminol showed smears, smudges, wiping stains from multiple locations, everywhere blood had been, and had been washed away. The residue was not visible without the luminol.

I do believe Amanda and RS's clean-up was very meticulous. I believe this murderer that you're talking about, just guessing, he probably kind of, you know, either wiped several locations with one cloth, or just wasn't too careful and nit-picky about it.

I believe Amanda and RS did some form of clean-up like I described, which I believe would be much better at completely removing the blood. And each thing they cleaned, they then threw away whatever they used to clean it, and used new one for new item.

 

[Amber29]

I get that, but what I meant was that I didn't take special care with my moves; it's just how my feet went when I walked out the doorway. It's less awkward than going into the hall, stopping to turn around and deal with the door.

I just don't know that it's possible to pull that door shut by only holding the key. It's that old fashioned style key and it's an old building/door. Being older and an add on at that, I would think it's not that simple. Like I doubt the door was still perfect and hadn't moved at all.

 

[quesarita]

I do believe Amanda and RS's clean-up was very meticulous. I believe this murderer that you're talking about, just guessing, he probably kind of, you know, either wiped several locations with one cloth, or just wasn't too careful and nit-picky about it.

I believe Amanda and RS did some form of clean-up like I described, which I believe would be much better at completely removing the blood. And each thing they cleaned, they then threw away whatever they used to clean it, and used new one for new item.

I'm not an expert. This is what the experts said in that case:
"Investigators spray the caustic, luminescent chemical on surfaces. If there
are latent traces of blood, the chemical glows in the dark as it reacts to
heme -- the substance that helps give blood its red color. Luminol can
detect blood dilutions as minute as 1 part in 5 million.

``I have run bloody clothing through the washing machine, and Luminol has
detected it,'' said Benny DelRe, director for the Santa Clara District
Attorney's Crime Laboratory, the lab that is doing the Fitzhugh tests. ``It
tells stories.''

The chemical can also react to such things as rust, vegetables, ink or even
some types of concrete. Investigators usually rule out other possibilities
using more precise chemical testing."

 

[aa9511]

Just thought I'd add that the pranking scenario would answer the question of why they would bring the knife from RS's house.

ETA: Also AK had wanted to spend Halloween with MK so this would be a good little post Halloween scare. All in good fun.

Myvice, it answers A LOT of questions.

All I can say is that I hope they get what they deserve, which is life behind bars. JMO and all that.

And that goes for Rudy, too. Hopefully he will do another petty burglary when he gets out (no one harmed of course), and then can throw him back in jail. Keeping throwing him back in, throwing him back in.

All 3 deserve to be behind bars for the rest of their lives. JMO.