Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL* #2

[Mollyandme]

to expand on my opinion a little, I find it interesting that when first asked, Guede said amanda was not involved, however after he was found guilty he got his sentence reduced by pointing the finger at her. Also, after reading the massei report in full (yes i had a lot of time on my hands after the kids went to sleep the past two nights), it's clear that Meredith did have defensive wounds, which makes me question the theory that she was somehow held down by someone else while being stabbed. i will add more in a little bit but I'm wondering what others opinions are on this. i appreciate any criticism of this line of thinking, as i said i'm still somewhat on the fence and i appreciate the dialogue and debate on this thread. I feel so bad for the Kercher family I cannot even imagine what this must be like for them. Meredith was such a bright light with so much to offer the world, reading the Massei report made me cry. I haven't had that response to a case in awhile.

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

 

[Harmony 2]

There are many long time members on this thread. Everyone is entitled to express their opinions. There may be disagreement on this case yet agreement in many other cases on the board. Please refrain from personalizing posts. Let's maintain an atmosphere of respect. Thanks!

 

[sherlockh]

to expand on my opinion a little, I find it interesting that when first asked, Guede said amanda was not involved, however after he was found guilty he got his sentence reduced by pointing the finger at her. Also, after reading the massei report in full (yes i had a lot of time on my hands after the kids went to sleep the past two nights), it's clear that Meredith did have defensive wounds, which makes me question the theory that she was somehow held down by someone else while being stabbed. i will add more in a little bit but I'm wondering what others opinions are on this. i appreciate any criticism of this line of thinking, as i said i'm still somewhat on the fence and i appreciate the dialogue and debate on this thread. I feel so bad for the Kercher family I cannot even imagine what this must be like for them. Meredith was such a bright light with so much to offer the world, reading the Massei report made me cry. I haven't had that response to a case in awhile.

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

<modsnip>
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Multiple_Attackers

The Skype call is interesting. Guede always seems to blame Sollecito as the actual killer, and Knox as the instigator. Not sure what to make of it. He is not very reliable. I don't know why you say he got his sentence reduced by pointing the finger at her. That is new to me.

 

[Mollyandme]

http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Multiple_Attackers

The Skype call is interesting. Guede always seems to blame Sollecito as the actual killer, and Knox as the instigator. Not sure what to make of it. He is not very reliable. I don't know why you say he got his sentence reduced by pointing the finger at her. That is new to me.

i read it on here, its in the tenth paragraph down:

http://blog.seattlepi.com/dempsey/2011/04/28/rudy-guede-amanda-knox-was-not-there/

also, aside from the fact that i read it on here, it also makes logical sense to me that this was part of the reason for the sentence reduction (i know there are other reasons listed as well by the court)

 

[rashomon]

A lot happened before Knox called her Mother that day. Knox found the front door to the cottage open, a broken window, signs of a burglary and blood.

But didn't Knox call her mother before the broken window was discovered?

 

[sherlockh]

i read it on here, its in the tenth paragraph down:

http://blog.seattlepi.com/dempsey/2011/04/28/rudy-guede-amanda-knox-was-not-there/

also, aside from the fact that i read it on here, it also makes logical sense to me that this was part of the reason for the sentence reduction (i know there are other reasons listed as well by the court)

Thanks. Dempsey is part of the 'Friends of Amanda' group. She made it up. This 'reason' was never listed by the court.

 

[rose222]

This case is quite interesting. In the JA case we discussed when she began her attack and which weapons were used first. Here we're arguing about the physical evidence itself. The DNA. Every single thing that one side argues the other disputes.

We have to be careful as there are many, many websites where the facts are misconstrued. Even on some Amanda is guilty sites. I rely on the actual court documents including the recent Supreme Court's rationale. Here it is in English.

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=599#p141747

 

[Footwarrior]

But didn't Knox call her mother before the broken window was discovered?

Knox called her mother after she had discovered the broken window and discussed it with Filomena on the phone.

 

[rose222]

Taken from the Supreme Court document:

"From the examination of the stab wounds and the bruises found on the victim, a picture
of massive injury in terms of number, distribution, and diversity emerged, especially with regard to the injuries inflicted on the face and neck (where the wounds were 4&#8208;8
centimetres deep), a picture which contrasted with the absence of defensive wounds; [7] a circumstance that was at odds with the fact that the young British student was equipped with a strong physique, trained in self&#8208;defence through a course in karate which she had
taken; all of which led to the conclusion that the criminal action was necessarily carried
out by several people acting together against the victim, who was placed in the position of
being unable to defend herself or shield herself with her hands to avoid the repeated
striking of vital parts such as the neck. Also considering the type of activity undertaken by
the attacker, it turned out to be very difficult to hypothesize an isolated and individual
action, because it included acts aimed at disrobing the victim (who was unquestionably
dressed when the attacker appeared), violating her private parts, and stabbing her with a
knife; the victim was certainly seized by her wrists to prevent a reaction, so that Guede&#697;s
DNA was found on the cuff of the young English woman&#8217;s sweatshirt; but the diverse
morphology of the wounds, their number, and their distribution led to the conclusion that
there was more than one attacker. In particular, it was found that many injuries were
caused by activities of grasping, others by a pointed and cutting weapon; they were
extremely different in size and degree of injury, and had reached the victim sometimes
from the right and sometimes from the left. All of which led to the conclusion that more
than one attacker, together, held the girl, limited her movements, and struck her from the right and from the left, depending on their position with respect to her, but above all they Covered her mouth in order to prevent her from repeating the scream that was heard and reported by the two witnesses mentioned above."

 

[Footwarrior]

Rose, do you believe that it's impossible for a young athletic man armed with a knife to rape and kill an unarmed woman without assistance?

That seems to be what the court is saying.

 

[otto]

to expand on my opinion a little, I find it interesting that when first asked, Guede said amanda was not involved, however after he was found guilty he got his sentence reduced by pointing the finger at her. Also, after reading the massei report in full (yes i had a lot of time on my hands after the kids went to sleep the past two nights), it's clear that Meredith did have defensive wounds, which makes me question the theory that she was somehow held down by someone else while being stabbed. i will add more in a little bit but I'm wondering what others opinions are on this. i appreciate any criticism of this line of thinking, as i said i'm still somewhat on the fence and i appreciate the dialogue and debate on this thread. I feel so bad for the Kercher family I cannot even imagine what this must be like for them. Meredith was such a bright light with so much to offer the world, reading the Massei report made me cry. I haven't had that response to a case in awhile.

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

BBM

I don't think the bold sentence above is accurate. In Italy, suspects have a choice regarding trial format. Knox and Sollecito chose the traditional "prove it" trial. Guede chose the fast-track "you got me" trial. Any suspect in Italy that opts for the fast-track trial has the sentence automatically reduced by one third at the end of the proceedings. Guede was sentenced to 24 years, and that was automatically reduced to 16 because it was the fast track format. It had nothing to do with what he did, or did not, say about Knox.

The trial summary states that one factor that influenced the conclusion that there were multiple attackers was the fact that Meredith had 43 injuries, but very little in the way of defensive wounds. Other factors contributed to the conclusion that more than one attacker was involved.

 

[otto]

i read it on here, its in the tenth paragraph down:

http://blog.seattlepi.com/dempsey/2011/04/28/rudy-guede-amanda-knox-was-not-there/

also, aside from the fact that i read it on here, it also makes logical sense to me that this was part of the reason for the sentence reduction (i know there are other reasons listed as well by the court)

There is only one reason that Guede's sentence was reduced.

"Fast-track trial[edit]

The giudizio abbreviato (fast-track trial, literally abbreviated proceeding)[24] consists, basically, of a proceeding where the trial phase is absent.

It is the Judge of the Preliminary Hearing who, according to the evidence gathered, during the preliminary investigations by the prosecutor and by the lawyer during the defensive investigations, if there were any, convicts or acquits the defendant.

Since this is a reduction of the defendant's rights (he basically gives up his right to presenting new evidence and to be tried by a Judge of the Trial), it must be he who asks that the Judge of the Preliminary Hearing hand down a judgement over him.

The defendant is rewarded with a reduction on the sentence. The law states that this reduction is one third. If the crime was punishable by life imprisonment, the defendant will be sentenced to thirty years.

Both the defendant and the prosecutor can appeal the judgement before the Court of Appeals."

Italian Code of Criminal Procedure - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Mollyandme]

Thanks. Dempsey is part of the 'Friends of Amanda' group. She made it up. This 'reason' was never listed by the court.

oh i didn't know that, thanks for filling me in, much appreciated!

 

[otto]

Knox called her mother after she had discovered the broken window and discussed it with Filomena on the phone.

I think you are correct and that I was mistaken. I checked the cell phone records for Knox and the call was made after Sollecito and Knox would have had time to discover the broken window.

 

[otto]

Rose, do you believe that it's impossible for a young athletic man armed with a knife to rape and kill an unarmed woman without assistance?

That seems to be what the court is saying.

It is instinctive for someone to use their hands, defensively, to prevent several knife attacks in the area of the neck. Apparently Meredith did not do this. The question is why she didn't do this. Any thoughts? If there was one attacker, why didn't Meredith use her hands to prevent some of the 43 injuries?

 

[otto]

"The appeal court had reduced Guede's sentence to 24 years and cut one-third off as is custom when defendants opt for a fast-track trial, said Francesco Maresca, a lawyer representing Kercher's family, who argued for the original sentence to be left unchanged."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/dec/22/rudy-guede-sentence-kercher-murder

 

[rose222]

Rose, do you believe that it's impossible for a young athletic man armed with a knife to rape and kill an unarmed woman without assistance?

That seems to be what the court is saying.

No. It happens often.

In this case though, based on the kind of injuries etc., I am convinced that there was more than one killer. The Supreme Court's report is pretty specific.

 

[rose222]

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/tjmk/C236/

<modsnip>

 

[Nova]

But she was able to change underwear- she borrowed Raf's. Would you be buying sexy little thongs for Mr. Nova though two days after your roommate had been murdered???

I imagine I would if that were the sort of underwear I were accustomed to wearing.

We've had many posters here who claim they wear thongs for comfort, not for titillation. (I wouldn't know from personal experience: the whole idea of sexy underwear and costumes makes me giggle.)

 

[Nova]

She was convicted and must pay him damages. How is it ok that she is not paying him?

AK has no idea what legal expenses may lie ahead. I don't blame her for banking her money until the legal process is finally exhausted.

But since we're asking questions about fairness: How is it ok that the Perugia police department isn't paying at least half of the damages? The idea that Lumumba was involved was the creation and insistence of PLE.