Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#7

[Sigh Sister]

Waterbury asserts this, as does the PDF file of "Monster of Perugia" - and it was certainly said in the early newspaper pieces, yes:

http://metro.co.uk/2007/11/22/tests-reveal-sex-link-with-meredith-546313/

I don't know how I missed this. I've read 3 books on this case as well as media reports, and message boards. Somehow I never picked up on this. Thanks, SMK.

 

[geevee]

All my reading here and at the other 3 main sites makes me believe that all the evidence, inconsistencies, etc. are viewed through the lens of either guilt or innocence, respectively. And that this seems to color all: If you begin with the guilty premise, all falls into place for that; if you presume innocence, all is explained away and much vanishes.

I really wonder how the jurors (lay judges) will view all? Which side will they believe has the truth? And are these (6 women, I believe?) all familiar with the case for years, via media, etc.? Or is it new to them? I'm assuming as they are Italian, it cannot really be new for them......

I also am eager to hear how the defense wraps up - was supposed to be Dec 16-17, but now that Maresca still has to speak, it may eat into January.....and the Prosecution rebuttal. That's all that's left before jury deliberations.

Just musing......

Although having understood the gist of this case over the years, I came upon it (recently) knowing none of the details, evidence or theories presented in trial.

Now, after reading here, the links and seeing the pics, I do not know specifically what occurred in the cottage that night, but I could not convict either AK or RS on what I've seen and read. The theories and evidence just do not back up a 'no reasonable doubt' conviction, I'm afraid; I have plenty of reasonable doubt as to if AK or RS had any involvement in the murder of MK.

 

[Harmony 2]

I've never heard that RG DNA was on a tampon. Is that true?

It is in Stefanoni's power point:

pg 37

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/testimonianza2.pdf

 

[SMK]

Although having understood the gist of this case over the years, I came upon it (recently) knowing none of the details, evidence or theories presented in trial.

Now, after reading here, the links and seeing the pics, I do not know specifically what occurred in the cottage that night, but I could not convict either AK or RS on what I've seen and read. The theories and evidence just do not back up a 'no reasonable doubt' conviction, I'm afraid; I have plenty of reasonable doubt as to if AK or RS had any involvement in the murder of MK.

I know what you mean. Although I harbor some strong suspicions that the 2 were involved in some way, the evidence is sketchy and keeps you guessing - and doubting (which infers 'reasonable doubt').

 

[Amber29]

i could've linked amanda's book instead of the testimony but would it have taken as truth?

chapter 2: http://books.google.ca/books?id=YWl1n8Ru1E8C&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false

No thank you for this. I was going by Follain who is clearly wrong on this.

 

[Harmony 2]

I also located this information in the Massei report:

Page 103
She approached Meredith’s room with the chief assistant Buratti, who remained at the door as Napoleoni took one step inside the room "while the 118 doctor uncovered the corpse" (page 228, hearing [96] on February 27, 2009).
She was wearing shoe covers and sterile gloves. ‚I then saw this girl who was on the floor with her face lying towards the right of the viewer, with a terrible wound. Was semi-naked, had the t-shirt rolled up above the breast and lots of blood and spatters of blood even on the breast‛ (page 229).

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

 

[SMK]

I also locate this information in the Massei report:


http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

Thank you for this. Well, there goes "the stencil effect" (Micheli, I believe ) which supposedly had the breast bare and unmarked by blood. (supporting the theory that the body was moved and staged, the bra cut, quite some time after death ) Nothing like being misled........Mignini asserted this in court. Why? grrrrr ETA: Unless perhaps there could be a stencil effect with some speckling of blood droplets on the breast?

I cannot tell from this youtube (WARNING - GRAPHIC):

MEREDITH KERCHER - YouTube

 

[Sigh Sister]

It is in Stefanoni's power point:

pg 37

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/testimonianza2.pdf

This piece of evidence never made it to my long term memory. I'm thinking it's because there was so much evidence against him, and I just stored it as "his DNA was inside her". Thanks everyone for the links.

 

[Katody]

Hmmm wonder who is correct. I hate seeing little inconsistencies like this because it seems like an easy thing for authors to find out before asserting. How hard is it to find out who traveled to Perugia first?

Maybe the minor details don't matter to them much.

According to Filomena's courtroom testimony Nina is correct.

 

[Katody]

Yes, it is perplexing.

And I am not sure if Amanda perhaps initially rented the place, and returned to the US, and then came back in September, or just moved right in in August (I only have a limited Google preview of the book).

She returned to Germany to her family.

One other thing I was wondering about:

In the Murder Wiki, there is a section about staging not only the break in and burglary, but of someone returning to the cottage and moving Meredith's body after death, and cutting the bra and pushing up the shirt, to simulate a sexual attack.

I have been reading about staged crime scenes, and it turns out that many crime scenes have both a staged burglary and a staged sexual assault (eg a husband strangles his wife during an argument; then stages things to look as if a burglar broke in, ransacked the place, discovered the wife alone, and attempted a rape).

The question is, as Guede clearly assaulted Meredith (his DNA found on her tampon, and inside her) why would staging of a sex crime be presumed? Can anyone who believes in guilt address this; what the basic premise of a staging of sexual assault after an actual sex assault would be ? (my friend Otto or anyone else?) TIA--would be most appreciated. ETA: I know we have been over the logistics; I just want to grasp the premise better if I can.....

Good question!

 

[SMK]

She returned to Germany to her family.




Good question!

Oh, OK, I see. I guess she returned mid Sep. Thank you. (and yes, it is! )

 

[redheadedgal]

No thank you for this. I was going by Follain who is clearly wrong on this.

nadeau also got it wrong... page 12:

http://books.google.ca/books?id=DaZOATWU65gC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

[redheadedgal]

dempsey was correct too... chapter 1:

http://books.google.ca/books?id=1q3Yf_UXY-IC&printsec=frontcover&dq=candace+dempsey&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ow6hUvqVO-KWiAKP1YG4Bw&ved=0CDAQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=candace%20dempsey&f=false

 

[Harmony 2]

Other notes from the Massei report:

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

Page 107
She stated that in this bathroom there were blood traces that appeared haematic [bloody] in nature and a follicle formation; she indicated this with the letter E, located inside the washbasin.

Page 110
The inspection of the corpse was postponed, and was finally performed at around 0:30 am on November 3, 2007.

Also, her hands were bloodstained and were protected with plastic bags in order to allow sample collection, as some hairlike fibres could be seen.

From what could be observed in that setting, there were no significant injuries to the chest, abdomen or lower limbs.

Page 111
The significant elements discovered by this examination were described as follows:
a fine pattern of petechiae on the internal eyelid conjunctive;
the presence of tiny areas of contusion at the level of the nose, localised around the nostrils and at the limen nasi [threshold of the nose];
inside the mucous membranes of the lips, injuries compatible with a traumatic action localised in the inner surface of the lower lip and the inner surface of the upper lip, reaching up to the gum ridge [fornice gengivale]; also found on the lower side of the jaw were some bruising injuries, and in the posterior region of the cheek as well, in proximity to the ear; three bruising injuries were present on the level of the lower edge of the right jaw with a roughly round shape. In the region under the jaw an area with a deep abrasion was observed, localised in the lower region of the middle part at the left [parte mediana sinistra] of the jaw.

Page 112
There were no noticeable injuries to the chest or abdomen.

The presence of two relatively slight areas of bruising, with scarce colouring and barely noticeable, were detected in the region of the elbow.

On the hands were small wounds showing a very slight defensive response.
A small, very slight patch of colour was noticed on the "anterior inner surface of the left thigh" (page 16). Another bruise was noted on the anterior surface, in the middle third of the right leg" (page 17).

 

[SMK]

Other notes from the Massei report:

http://truejustice.org/ee/documents/perugia/TheMasseiReport.pdf

Thanks so much for this information. So any blood on the breasts apparently would be from the neck injury. (You know, when I was just reading above about "no injuries on the chest, abdomen, or lower limbs" , I automatically thought, "Oh, that's good, she is lucky." And then immediately realized the stupidity of this thought, because the face and neck injuries - her only real area of damage - were fatal . )

 

[Harmony 2]

Thanks so much for this information. So any blood on the breasts apparently would be from the neck injury. (You know, when I was just reading above about "no injuries on the chest, abdomen, or lower limbs" , I automatically thought, "Oh, that's good, she is lucky." And then immediately realized the stupidity of this thought, because the face and neck injuries - her only real area of damage - were fatal . )

I was looking for bruising from being restrained (like at wrists or ankles) and couldn't locate any information in the Massei report.

 

[geevee]

I was looking for bruising from being restrained (like at wrists or ankles) and couldn't locate any information in the Massei report.

That has been a lingering question in my mind, if two people were restraining her while a third raped her (or as near as he could with a feminine product inside her) it seems like there would be much more scattered bruising from all those hands, esp. in the areas where one would normally be restrained (wrists and ankles). Thanks for posting these Harmony, makes me more surprised than before that a jury ever found anyone but RG guilty.

 

[SMK]

I was looking for bruising from being restrained (like at wrists or ankles) and couldn't locate any information in the Massei report.

Well, you know, this did strike me. If 3 people were on her, restraining, is it likely that the injuries would only be the shoulder/neck/facial areas? Not the wrists (perhaps broken wrists) , ankles, legs? It did sort of come to the surface....So presumably Massei and the prosecution find this believable: That she was being restrained only from the arms, upper body (no one sitting on the legs, etc.)

 

[SMK]

That has been a lingering question in my mind, if two people were restraining her while a third raped her (or as near as he could with a feminine product inside her) it seems like there would be much more scattered bruising from all those hands, esp. in the areas where one would normally be restrained (wrists and ankles). Thanks for posting these Harmony, makes me more surprised than before that a jury ever found anyone but RG guilty.

From what I had read, the tampon had been removed (obviously by Guede, as his DNA (from fingers) was on it.) So that gave me pause, too. I guess it seemed a private act. Cannot explain it.

 

[geevee]

From what I had read, the tampon had been removed (obviously by Guede, as his DNA (from fingers) was on it. So that gave me pause, too. I guess it seemed a private act. Cannot explain it.

Maybe that's why his pants were wet in the area a pulled down sweatshirt would cover, if you catch my drift.