AR AR - Whitehall Motel in El Dorado, WhtFem, 81UFAR, 18-21, Jul'91 - #2 - Kelly from VA

[sunnynz]

Sorry ya'll. After a little FB sleuthing, the girl whose picture i posted could not be our girl. She died in a motorcycle accident.

do you have some more details on this so I can take a look? how did you find her name?

 

[Roselvr]

Sunny where did this come from??????

I explained it all to your in my post #771. It's way too much for me to multi-quote again, easier if you click the link. It gives you the whole history of our (mine and sunny) convo. I also said I was at the photo shoot of the gal in the pic, the more I think about it the more I think the date doesn't match

 

[BayouGypsy]

sunnynz, I just clicked the links for the FB pages of the photographer's Albums and found the Black Garter Saloon album, read comments. There was another album dedicated to those passed away, I forgot what it is titled, but there was a picture of her and in the comments it was stated that she had passed.

 

[sunnynz]

sunnynz, I just clicked the links for the FB pages of the photographer's Albums and found the Black Garter Saloon album, read comments. There was another album dedicated to those passed away, I forgot what it is titled, but there was a picture of her and in the comments it was stated that she had passed.

I think we are talking about two different women - the one you're referring to has a first name starting with M right? She's a different person to the one whose picture I posted here. They do look a little alike but definitely two different people.

Regardless, it sounds as though the dates might rule this woman out from Roselvr's posts above anyway.

 

[sloane7777]

THE BLACK AND WHITE w/ the side by side that you posted let me clarify where did that come from , that's the one (I'm having a hard time keeping up, work is killing me right now)

 

[sunnynz]

THE BLACK AND WHITE w/ the side by side that you posted let me clarify where did that come from , that's the one (I'm having a hard time keeping up, work is killing me right now)

That one came from this facebook page - look in the album called Black Garter Staten Island https://www.facebook.com/PhotographyByPulsatingPaula/?fref=ts

 

[sloane7777]

so are we sure its the same girl as the deceased one ?

 

[sunnynz]

so are we sure its the same girl as the deceased one ?

No, I checked. I believe the girl bayou is referring to is definitely a different girl to the one I have screengrabbed. So in my opinion, the only thing stopping us pursuing this lead further is the timings that Roselvr mentions a few posts back - the images in this facebook album are likely from between 1988-1990, and the issue of the Outlaw mag that might coincide with when these pictures were taken is the Jan 91 issue that Roselvr posted above.

A few thoughts:
- magazines publishing deadlines are usually at least a month or two back from on sale date, so the Jan 1991 issue could feasibly use images shot in mid-late 1990 (or earlier if the photographer has had them in possession for some time but only just decided to sell them).
- According to the timelines we've seen, EDJD was on the east coast in the late 1980s, this fits with having potentially been in Staten Island. However, we know that for a lot of 90/91 she was in Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana which would have made it tricky for her to be in Staten Island.
- JM mentioned the 1989 issue of Outlaw mag, this is not so far away from early 1991 giving him the benefit of the doubt on how tricky it can be to remember dates/years when some time has passed. Maybe he was telling the truth here?

My conclusion is that it's likely not her just because the dates don't quite seem 100% right. BUT, I think it's worth double checking because right now I don't have a lot of other leads to follow. I'm going to do some further digging on this lady in the facebook album.

*Sorry this is very rambling, hope it makes sense.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Perfect and wise logic


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Roselvr]

No, I checked. I believe the girl bayou is referring to is definitely a different girl to the one I have screengrabbed. So in my opinion, the only thing stopping us pursuing this lead further is the timings that Roselvr mentions a few posts back - the images in this facebook album are likely from between 1988-1990, and the issue of the Outlaw mag that might coincide with when these pictures were taken is the Jan 91 issue that Roselvr posted above.

A few thoughts:
- magazines publishing deadlines are usually at least a month or two back from on sale date, so the Jan 1991 issue could feasibly use images shot in mid-late 1990 (or earlier if the photographer has had them in possession for some time but only just decided to sell them).
- According to the timelines we've seen, EDJD was on the east coast in the late 1980s, this fits with having potentially been in Staten Island. However, we know that for a lot of 90/91 she was in Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana which would have made it tricky for her to be in Staten Island.
- JM mentioned the 1989 issue of Outlaw mag, this is not so far away from early 1991 giving him the benefit of the doubt on how tricky it can be to remember dates/years when some time has passed. Maybe he was telling the truth here?

My conclusion is that it's likely not her just because the dates don't quite seem 100% right. BUT, I think it's worth double checking because right now I don't have a lot of other leads to follow. I'm going to do some further digging on this lady in the facebook album.

*Sorry this is very rambling, hope it makes sense.

I can't recall how long it was before the pics were published in the mag; best I can say is 1989 to 1990. My son was 3 in 1988, I wasn't hanging with the bike crew till 89. From the refresher you gave I doubt it's her. I haven't been well enough to go in the basement to get the issue.

 

[kdsmith21]

it looks like there might be a gap in Jackie's front teeth, that I dont see on EDJD...

 

[sunnynz]

Update - this is definitely not our JD. I've been in contact with someone who has shown me a pic of a tattoo that this lady had on her back which rules her out.

Back to the drawing board.

 

[DaisyChains]

Sorry if she has already been submitted, but what about Cathleen Martin?

https://missingcathleenmartin.wordpress.com/

Vital Statistics at Time of DisappearanceMissing Since: March 13, 1987From Fort Lauderdale, FloridaAge: 28 years old
Height and Weight: 5’8, 110 pounds
Distinguishing Characteristics: Caucasian female. Blonde hair, blue eyes. Martin has a coffee-colored mark on her right arm. She may use the aliases Cathleen Buttson and/or Catrina Buttson.Details of Disappearance
Martin left Cape May, New Jersey on March 13, 1987 and flew to Fort Lauderdale, Florida. After she arrived, she decided to extend her stay by one week. She never returned home and has never been heard from again. Martin left two small children behind in her sister’s care. Few details are available in her case. New Jersey police are investigating.Investigating Agency
If you have any information concerning this case, please contact:
Cape May Police Department
609-884-9500​

She looks much like the EDJD IMHO and she went missing while on vacation in FL (EDJD is theorized to have been a runaway from FL area initially). Also there were stories that EDJD was sending money home to her 2 kids. Cathleen had 2 kids she left at home with her sister.

 

[DaisyChains]

I am going to send Cathleen as a match. I'll confirm here when I do.

ETA: she has been sent in!

 

[DaisyChains]

No match as both people have DNA in national CODIS system. Would be nice if she could be listed on the rule outs anyhow. Reply from Michael with Namus:

Ms. "DaisyChains",

DNA from both individuals is in national CODIS with no associations.

Thank you,

Mike

 

[LoyalSleuth]

I wish NAMUS could submit the DNA to Ancestry to find distant relatives...

 

[ladyrider223]

Has Lisa Joy White been mentioned? I didn't see her name on the list of rule outs. I know her height is off but she was only 13 when she went missing in 1974. I know if I went missing my height would be wrong because everyone thinks I'm taller than I am. The information about Lisa states that she loved to dance and dated older boys and men. It says Lisa left a note for her mom saying she wasn't a little girl.

 

[Alleykins]

I wish NAMUS could submit the DNA to Ancestry to find distant relatives...

They may do that more in the future, but my understanding is that there are privacy concerns and profile compatibility differences between samples for ancestry sites and CODIS. I'm hardly an expert, but Roselvr has more experience with it.
One time they did that, they contacted relatives but no one knew who the Jane Doe was; she may have been adopted out without the family knowing or a distant relative they never met. So, doing this may not have the desired results, unfortunately,

 

[sloane7777]

Update - this is definitely not our JD. I've been in contact with someone who has shown me a pic of a tattoo that this lady had on her back which rules her out.

Back to the drawing board.

Are we sure it wasn't just a henna tattoo, I am blown away by the expression , IT LOOKS JUST LIKE HER SMILING!!!!!!! I'm having a hard time just dismissing this pic!

 

[sunnynz]

Are we sure it wasn't just a henna tattoo, I am blown away by the expression , IT LOOKS JUST LIKE HER SMILING!!!!!!! I'm having a hard time just dismissing this pic!

This is the pic of the tattoo. I see that someone has recently commented on one of the pics of her to say she reminds him of a girl he knew in Florida in the 80's which is kind of odd. I'm going to PM that guy to see if he recognises pics of EDJD just in case. There is also a Black Garter Saloon reunion facebook group if anyone wants to join that and ask - I personally don't wish to do so. .