ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - #10

[LambChop]

RG is missing and GG was the last one to see her. He claims she drowned and tried to put in a claim on the insurance. There is no evidence whatsoever that RG was involved in her own disappearance and speculation is just that when you have no facts. To speculate she was involved in a crime without any proof, no witnesses, is doing just that. The only information we have on GG is that he did not give LE correct information and that is what we base our discussions on. I know we all are interested in the truth and so far I have not seen any facts presented that would even suggest that she would be involved in any criminal behavior.

I mean, if we insist on facts being presented for the person who was last to see her why would we not do the same for the victim herself. It's just my personal feelings about the matter. Plus models are all ages now, not just 18 to 25 age range. Commercial agencies use all ages so if her career as a body building model was over she still could have gotten assignments for other types of modeling. Already in the business I'm sure she had connections. And most people just do not suddenly break all their ties with family and just disappear off of an island that is very hard to get off without identification. Just does not sound like something she would want to do. jmo

 

[Dushi]

RG is missing and GG was the last one to see her. He claims she drowned and tried to put in a claim on the insurance. There is no evidence whatsoever that RG was involved in her own disappearance and speculation is just that when you have no facts. To speculate she was involved in a crime without any proof, no witnesses, is doing just that. The only information we have on GG is that he did not give LE correct information and that is what we base our discussions on. I know we all are interested in the truth and so far I have not seen any facts presented that would even suggest that she would be involved in any criminal behavior.

I mean, if we insist on facts being presented for the person who was last to see her why would we not do the same for the victim herself. It's just my personal feelings about the matter. Plus models are all ages now, not just 18 to 25 age range. Commercial agencies use all ages so if her career as a body building model was over she still could have gotten assignments for other types of modeling. Already in the business I'm sure she had connections. And most people just do not suddenly break all their ties with family and just disappear off of an island that is very hard to get off without identification. Just does not sound like something she would want to do. jmo

I do understand where you are coming from
You have your mind made up and I am fine with that

I , however, am not as sure as you are so i will continue to search and listen to all opinions

many I do not agree with, but if I keep my mind open, sometimes opinions make me go... Hmmm

I did notice you didn't have as strong an opinion on trafficking.. no evidence to suggestd that either

Lets just visit all possibilities Lambchop

We all have opinions

 

[Dushi]

RG is missing and GG was the last one to see her. He claims she drowned and tried to put in a claim on the insurance. There is no evidence whatsoever that RG was involved in her own disappearance and speculation is just that when you have no facts. To speculate she was involved in a crime without any proof, no witnesses, is doing just that. The only information we have on GG is that he did not give LE correct information and that is what we base our discussions on. I know we all are interested in the truth and so far I have not seen any facts presented that would even suggest that she would be involved in any criminal behavior.

I mean, if we insist on facts being presented for the person who was last to see her why would we not do the same for the victim herself. It's just my personal feelings about the matter. Plus models are all ages now, not just 18 to 25 age range. Commercial agencies use all ages so if her career as a body building model was over she still could have gotten assignments for other types of modeling. Already in the business I'm sure she had connections. And most people just do not suddenly break all their ties with family and just disappear off of an island that is very hard to get off without identification. Just does not sound like something she would want to do. jmo

And we are basing this on the little we know, the LITTLE we know
Obviously, regardeless of what we may think, there is simply not enough evidence to charge gary Giordano either


I get that this is your personal feeling
Doesn't mean other opinions aren't valid and should be dismissed
Many things that are discussed here are not my opinon
It doesn't matter how many times you say something, repeat it, I and many others will still be free thinkers
Appreciate your thoughts but they are not always mine
And I would rather see all opinions discussed than have this thread go to the back page

Isn't this about justice? Not about our personal opinions?

 

[LambChop]

http://www.nobodycases.com/tips.pdf

This was a very interesting read. The article is about justice and what I believe we have to remember is that RG is the one missing and GG is the one who is alive and telling the story. So if someone has some information to share that would shed light on what actually happened to RG we are left with speculation and I understand that.

There is nothing, to my knowledge, in RG's background that would indicate she would be involved in any type of criminal activity, much less a highly criminal one that could have landed her in jail for years. With GG there is some significant background information of criminal activities in his past according to this article above. That is enough for us to form theories and to speculate about a motive for a crime. LE does it all the time. We do not see that with RG. Unless someone has something we have not heard about the victim we are speculating without a basis, which once again makes her a victim.

It is just something to think about and certainly if someone had some evidence that this type of behavior was consistent with something RG would do it would be interesting to explore but I just don't see it. jmo

 

[katydid23]

http://www.nobodycases.com/tips.pdf

This was a very interesting read. The article is about justice and what I believe we have to remember is that RG is the one missing and GG is the one who is alive and telling the story. So if someone has some information to share that would shed light on what actually happened to RG we are left with speculation and I understand that.

There is nothing, to my knowledge, in RG's background that would indicate she would be involved in any type of criminal activity, much less a highly criminal one that could have landed her in jail for years. With GG there is some significant background information of criminal activities in his past according to this article above. That is enough for us to form theories and to speculate about a motive for a crime. LE does it all the time. We do not see that with RG. Unless someone has something we have not heard about the victim we are speculating without a basis, which once again makes her a victim.

It is just something to think about and certainly if someone had some evidence that this type of behavior was consistent with something RG would do it would be interesting to explore but I just don't see it. jmo

I agree with this post.

Also, IF she were alive and this was a hoax, wouldn't GG have admitted to that when he was in prison as a suspected killer?

 

[Dushi]

http://www.nobodycases.com/tips.pdf

This was a very interesting read. The article is about justice and what I believe we have to remember is that RG is the one missing and GG is the one who is alive and telling the story. So if someone has some information to share that would shed light on what actually happened to RG we are left with speculation and I understand that.

There is nothing, to my knowledge, in RG's background that would indicate she would be involved in any type of criminal activity, much less a highly criminal one that could have landed her in jail for years. With GG there is some significant background information of criminal activities in his past according to this article above. That is enough for us to form theories and to speculate about a motive for a crime. LE does it all the time. We do not see that with RG. Unless someone has something we have not heard about the victim we are speculating without a basis, which once again makes her a victim.

It is just something to think about and certainly if someone had some evidence that this type of behavior was consistent with something RG would do it would be interesting to explore but I just don't see it. jmo

LOL

It seems to me that is mostly what we do here... speculate

and yes, theories are formed and we speculate based on information that we get or on others opinions
Thats all good

But the fact is, as big a jerk as GG is, there is no mention of murder in his background
He is a thief, a crook, an abuser, a liar
wierd as he**

And thats what we have

Do I think he is innocent of some kind of crime in all of this?... I don't know

Do i think its possible that he is guilty?... yes

 

[Dushi]

I agree with this post.

Also, IF she were alive and this was a hoax, wouldn't GG have admitted to that when he was in prison as a suspected killer?

Likely

But then there would be a whole other set of charges and both would face charges, insurance fraud etc

I am not saying that I believe this is what happened
I am saying that every avenue should be looked at

And I don't think anything should be disgarded because of personal beliefs

 

[Blueskies]

Of all the crazyness in this case, the one thing I really find hard to understand is the two visits to that location in two days
They go there on Monday, walk through the closed restaurant and out to the beach
The next day they go back. and basically do the same thing. Almost at the same time of day
Why?
And I understand many do not see anything strange about Robyn wearing the same outfit, but to me, something is off about that

Maybe he was showing her off the first day? Or more then likely a dry run for the real event the next day?

BTW:She never wore the same outfit two days in a row. They were similar dresses

 

[Dushi]

Maybe he was showing her off the first day? Or more then likely a dry run for the real event the next day?

BTW:She never wore the same outfit two days in a row. They were similar dresses

No

She wore the same dress
go back in the thread
Its been discussed and pics are posted

and if you have links to disprove that.. post them please

 

[LambChop]

LOL

It seems to me that is mostly what we do here... speculate

and yes, theories are formed and we speculate based on information that we get or on others opinions
Thats all good

But the fact is, as big a jerk as GG is, there is no mention of murder in his background
He is a thief, a crook, an abuser, a liar
wierd as he**

And thats what we have

Do I think he is innocent of some kind of crime in all of this?... I don't know

Do i think its possible?... yes

Well, anything is possible. One interesting point in this article I posted, which was posted in one of the threads by Kimster, is how LE views liars. And while some of us believe there is no evidence, there is some otherwise GG would not still be a suspect. One judge made the decision to let him go, another may have recommended charging him, we may never know. But what is perfectly clear is that Aruba is more comfortable charging someone with a crime when there is a body, whereas in the US they do not need the body, they only need a preponderance of proof to charge him. Had RG disappeared in the US GG more than likely may have been charged with her death. jmo

 

[Dushi]

Well, anything is possible. One interesting point in this article I posted, which was posted in one of the threads by Kimster, is how LE views liars. And while some of us believe there is no evidence, there is some otherwise GG would not still be a suspect. One judge made the decision to let him go, another may have recommended charging him, we may never know. But what is perfectly clear is that Aruba is more comfortable charging someone with a crime when there is a body, whereas in the US they do not need the body, they only need a preponderance of proof to charge him. Had RG disappeared in the US GG more than likely may have been charged with her death. jmo

True about the US
Thing is, often charges are laid but no conviction
How often have we seen that, even with a body and a crime scene

 

[LambChop]

Likely

But then there would be a whole other set of charges and both would face charges, insurance fraud etc

I am not saying that I believe this is what happened
I am saying that every avenue should be looked at

And I don't think anything should be disgarded because of personal beliefs

They can't charge him with insurance fraud until he collected and that would have been a US issue because the policy was purchased here in the US. I'm sure Aruba could have charged them with something, attempted fraud but nothing like being tried for murder. But then again he had JB (let's make a drowning looking like a murder) for an attorney. jmo

 

[LambChop]

True about the US
Thing is, often charges are laid but no conviction
How often have we seen that, even with a body and a crime scene

And that is a jury for you. You never know how they will roll. jmo

 

[Dushi]

They can't charge him with insurance fraud until he collected and that would have been a US issue because the policy was purchased here in the US. I'm sure Aruba could have charged them with something, attempted fraud but nothing like being tried for murder. But then again he had JB (let's make a drowning looking like a murder) for an attorney. jmo

And IF this was a set up, the whole idea would have been to collect, however, being arrested would have changed things

And he wanted this to look like a drowning long before JB became involved
I am not into JB, so I really don't care much about him
this all happened prior to his involvement IMO

 

[LambChop]

Maybe he was showing her off the first day? Or more then likely a dry run for the real event the next day?

BTW:She never wore the same outfit two days in a row. They were similar dresses

According to the pictures we have available, unless she had two exactly alike, she wore the same dress the following day. It was a sun dress so I could see her wearing it more than once. Some will not agree but I recently attended a Club meeting where the speaker was from a travel agency with tips on traveling. One of the things she mentioned is that many people today, for short trips much like GG and RG were on, travel light because of the baggage charges. She then demonstrated how to get the maximum amount of items into a carryon bag or backpack. One suggestion was bringing one dress for dinner since you probably would never be seeing the same people at dinner more than once. It is a way to save $50 and a lot of young people are doing it so it is possible she only brought one dress.

There was a picture posted with her sitting at a table with a different dress on very similar to the one we see in Aruba but that picture was taken in July at another activity she attended. But all the pictures show the same dress on both days or she had two with her exactly alike. jmo

 

[neesaki]

I agree with this post.

Also, IF she were alive and this was a hoax, wouldn't GG have admitted to that when he was in prison as a suspected killer?

But why would he do that if he was in on it from the beginning? He would be admitting he was a party to a fraudulent hoax resulting in a big price to pay with a lot of guaranteed prison time... whereas if he waits it out, and why not, he may get off scott free .... which it appears he's doing, unfortunately.

 

[Blueskies]

No

She wore the same dress
go back in the thread
Its been discussed and pics are posted

and if you have links to disprove that.. post them please

Do you have clear pics of the dress she wore the day before comparing it to the dress she wore the day she dissapeared? I'M not going to argue with you as it's irrelevent to her being missing and everyone studied the pictures even those close to her. Regardless of the media reports that they were the same dress,Richard said several times they were probably not the exact same dress but two similar sun dresses she owned with slightly different designs. Not sure if he meant the one lambchop mentioned in the july 4th pics or if she owned another sun dress that was very similar.

 

[Tugela]

Of all the crazyness in this case, the one thing I really find hard to understand is the two visits to that location in two days
They go there on Monday, walk through the closed restaurant and out to the beach
The next day they go back. and basically do the same thing. Almost at the same time of day
Why?
And I understand many do not see anything strange about Robyn wearing the same outfit, but to me, something is off about that

Maybe the two visits on two days doing the same thing wearing the same clothes was actually one visit on one day.

 

[Tugela]

http://www.nobodycases.com/tips.pdf

This was a very interesting read. The article is about justice and what I believe we have to remember is that RG is the one missing and GG is the one who is alive and telling the story. So if someone has some information to share that would shed light on what actually happened to RG we are left with speculation and I understand that.

There is nothing, to my knowledge, in RG's background that would indicate she would be involved in any type of criminal activity, much less a highly criminal one that could have landed her in jail for years. With GG there is some significant background information of criminal activities in his past according to this article above. That is enough for us to form theories and to speculate about a motive for a crime. LE does it all the time. We do not see that with RG. Unless someone has something we have not heard about the victim we are speculating without a basis, which once again makes her a victim.

It is just something to think about and certainly if someone had some evidence that this type of behavior was consistent with something RG would do it would be interesting to explore but I just don't see it. jmo

I don't think anyone is claiming that she was involved in criminal activity, but the possibility cannot be excluded. There is no evidence of it however.

There are only three viable and reasonable scenarios for what could have happened:
A) Something happened that resulted in an accidental or deliberate homicide by GG, and was covered up (zero evidence of that).
B) This is/was an insurance scam by GG/RG (zero evidence of that).
C) RG was swept out to sea and drowned, probably intoxicated (the most likely scenario).

C is the simplest explanation and the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. This is why GG was held and why he was released. They held him because they think he is a dubious character, and they released him because that is the extent of their evidence. They don't have anything else.

All this talk about human trafficking is nonsense.

It is not a question about the moral character of either RG or GG, all of that is not relevant to what happened in Aruba. But, if you want to go that road, keep in mind that if you think that GG has an extensive history of dubious behaviour, then RG allmost certainly does too, since people with common interests and backgrounds tend to befriend each other and flock together. She had been friends with him for quite some time. Hard core swingers do not hang out and party with the pious. He paid for the trip and she is no doe eyed bambi. Do the math, you are an adult, you can figure it out. Remember that when you are pointing fingers, you can't have it both ways. All these scenarios where he tricked an innocent for some nefarious purpose, I simply do not buy it.

If you are going to make an accusation against someone it should be based on facts, not if they are or are not a nice person according to your personal moral standards. "Nice" people do bad things all the time, and "bad" people do nice things all the time.

 

[vlpate]

Maybe the two visits on two days doing the same thing wearing the same clothes was actually one visit on one day.

Time date and stamp on the pictures and the video.