ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 9

[Dushi]

vlpate

I owe you a public apology
I was rushing through the thread last night and totally misunderstood your post
My sincere apologies

 

[vlpate]

This is what was said by TS
What is your interpretation of it?


"He was first interrogated as a witness and in that position, he was told he was free to leave," Stein said. "In evaluating his statements later on, we decided there were some things that were not correct and that changed our position towards him to seeing him as a suspect. At that point in time we decided that we wouldn't want him to leave the island," Stein said.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/woman-missi...ry?id=14271819

I interpret it literally, he was told he was free to leave, and then they changed their mind after things he said didn't add up. They may have called him to come back in, but, IMO, he thought he'd be smart and go to the Consulate for a different opinion (and without informing them he was told to stay, IMO). It doesn't make sense, otherwise, why he would consult them if he were given the all clear by ALE.

 

[vlpate]

vlpate

I owe you a public apology
I was rushing through the thread last night and totally misunderstood your post
My sincere apologies

Apology accepted, thank you

 

[vlpate]

Question, besides the mother and daughter, has it been substantiated that GG had gone to Aruba or on recent vacations with anyone else? I read he stayed at the Marriott with points, which means he must travel often.

 

[MaryAnn]

This is an interesting article on GG.

http://www.newser.com/story/125589/...n-aruba-go-snorkeling-with-gary-giordano.html

Aruba authorities also have not yet found any witnesses who saw the pair go snorkeling. Giordano, who was detained after officials found inconsistencies in his story, has been accused of domestic abuse or threats by two women in his past. Last year, a former girlfriend accused him of stalking her, threatening her, taping their sexual relations, and putting pornographic pictures of her on the Internet and in neighbors' mailboxes. Ten years ago, his then-wife accused him of throwing phones, destroying a computer, and throwing their son down. Another former girlfriend tells the Washington Post he also stalked and harassed her.

 

[LambChop]

Question, besides the mother and daughter, has it been substantiated that GG had gone to Aruba or on recent vacations with anyone else? I read he stayed at the Marriott with points, which means he must travel often.

My husband traveled for the company he worked for and he was permitted to keep his points. So I would think some of the points are from business travel???? jmo

 

[LambChop]

This is an interesting article on GG.

http://www.newser.com/story/125589/...n-aruba-go-snorkeling-with-gary-giordano.html

Aruba authorities also have not yet found any witnesses who saw the pair go snorkeling. Giordano, who was detained after officials found inconsistencies in his story, has been accused of domestic abuse or threats by two women in his past. Last year, a former girlfriend accused him of stalking her, threatening her, taping their sexual relations, and putting pornographic pictures of her on the Internet and in neighbors' mailboxes. Ten years ago, his then-wife accused him of throwing phones, destroying a computer, and throwing their son down. Another former girlfriend tells the Washington Post he also stalked and harassed her.

They should make him wear the sign: DESPICABLE ME jmo

 

[Micheline]

-snipped a bit by me-

I would say LE did not want him to leave. He had an attorney at the time and if GG is saying he discussed it with his attorney and the US Consulate they should have cleared it with LE and then told GG he was free to leave. We have not heard from the attorney nor the US Consulate that they told GG he was free to leave. What we are left with is GG's version of what he was told.

He was not a suspect so imo there would be no obligation to inform authorities of his departure, whether it is the correct thing to do is something else. At that point (allegedly) there was no suspicion a crime had taken place why would LE not want him to leave?

Could it be that he was told, by his then attorney, that they may try to detain him and he decided he'd better leave.

Giordano himself may have realised maybe even from day one that there would be suspicion, that he may become a suspect. He volunteered the insurance policy initially (per ALE) so any worry that they may get suspicious would not be ungrounded, imo.

It appears he never called the airlines to change his ticket as you would think he would do but showed up and asked for the next flight out (within the hour).

He said the ticket agent told him the airport of Charlotte was closed and offered him a flight that would take place earlier then his scheduled flight.

Btw, I still wonder if Robyn's flight was cancelled or not, or if maybe it was set to a later date which is not unusual in missing person's cases.

 

[MaryAnn]

-snipped a bit by me-


He was not a suspect so imo there would be no obligation to inform authorities of his departure, whether it is the correct thing to do is something else. At that point (allegedly) there was no suspicion a crime had taken place why would LE not want him to leave?


Giordano himself may have realised maybe even from day one that there would be suspicion, that he may become a suspect. He volunteered the insurance policy initially (per ALE) so any worry that they may get suspicious would not be ungrounded, imo.



He said the ticket agent told him the airport of Charlotte was closed and offered him a flight that would take place earlier then his scheduled flight.

Btw, I still wonder if Robyn's flight was cancelled or not, or if maybe it was set to a later date which is not unusual in missing person's cases.

If he wasn't a suspect why did they arrest him and not let him board the plane?

 

[LambChop]

-snipped a bit by me-


He was not a suspect so imo there would be no obligation to inform authorities of his departure, whether it is the correct thing to do is something else. At that point (allegedly) there was no suspicion a crime had taken place why would LE not want him to leave?



Giordano himself may have realised maybe even from day one that there would be suspicion, that he may become a suspect. He volunteered the insurance policy initially (per ALE) so any worry that they may get suspicious would not be ungrounded, imo.



He said the ticket agent told him the airport of Charlotte was closed and offered him a flight that would take place earlier then his scheduled flight.

Btw, I still wonder if Robyn's flight was cancelled or not, or if maybe it was set to a later date which is not unusual in missing person's cases.

GG was a witness and according to what he has told us had been questioned numerous times before he was arrested. Why would he think he was free to go without checking with LE to make sure they had no more questions? He checked with her mother, he claims to have checked with the Consulate and he claims to have checked with his attorney. He was the only witness to RG's disappearance then to leave without notifying LE would cause them to be suspicious. I had a break-in of my condo in Aruba and they asked me when I was planning on leaving. It's not as if they can call him to run down to the police station if they have another question. Obviously at the time he wanted to leave they had already determined they wanted to requestion him and that he was not free to leave the island or they would have never gone after him. So I think that part is pretty clear.

I thought I had read that LE was not aware initially of the insurance policy???

The storm covered the whole east coast so where would he have gone an hour earlier. Baltimore was right in the middle of that hurricane. We just have his word that he was "offered" an earlier flight and not that he requested an earlier flight to some other destination. Wonder where his flight was going???? Maybe Miami because the storm had by-passed them.

They don't book passengers on other flights that don't show up for their scheduled flight unless the airlines are notified. Not sure where that policy you are speaking of comes from. I've never heard of it. Her ticket had expired so she would have had to pay the difference to get onto another flight had she been found alive.

Weren't they scheduled to leave to go back to the US on Thursday originally? jmo

 

[Micheline]

If he wasn't a suspect why did they arrest him and not let him board the plane?

Allegedly there was no suspicion a crime had taken place since Giordano was interviewed as a witness not as a suspect.

Had he been a suspect he would have been informed of that and of his rights (such as a right to remain silent, a witness does not have a right to remain silent).

 

[LambChop]

Allegedly there was no suspicion a crime had taken place since Giordano was interviewed as a witness not as a suspect.

Had he been a suspect he would have been informed of that and of his rights (such as a right to remain silent, a witness does not have a right to remain silent).

He was in Aruba..... Miranda rights are used in US. Any witness can remain silent by just not claiming to know what happened. My guess is by the second day his story was getting squirrely and he became a suspect. When they keep calling you back in for questioning they have issues with your original statement. But no, he was in Aruba not the same rules there as here. It pays to ask when in doubt. He obviously did not ask. jmo

 

[Micheline]

GG was a witness and according to what he has told us had been questioned numerous times before he was arrested. Why would he think he was free to go without checking with LE to make sure they had no more questions?

True he was interviewed several times as a witness, and was told that he was free to leave. The moment ALE tells Giordano he is free to leave that would be an indication he had answered all their questions.
Why then would he again check with them if they had more questions for him?
If this was a case of an accidental drowing then what more could he tell then what he already told them?

He checked with her mother, he claims to have checked with the Consulate and he claims to have checked with his attorney. He was the only witness to RG's disappearance then to leave without notifying LE would cause them to be suspicious. I had a break-in of my condo in Aruba and they asked me when I was planning on leaving. It's not as if they can call him to run down to the police station if they have another question. Obviously at the time he wanted to leave they had already determined they wanted to requestion him and that he was not free to leave the island or they would have never gone after him. So I think that part is pretty clear.

There are two diferent things here, one being ALE already having plans to arrest him (which I am sure they had) and the other Giordano never being informed he was considered a suspect untill the moment he was arrested.

If this is a case of an accidental drowing, the place where this took place being indicated by Giordano, the circumstances told by Giordano, all the information he had about Robyn and his relationship with her being provided, her mother having arrived on the island, the embassy being informed, so why (if he were to be innocent) would he think they wanted to question him some more, they told him he was free to leave and never gave an indication they considered this a murder case.

I thought I had read that LE was not aware initially of the insurance policy???

I was looking up something for you yesterday and came across Stein saying Giordano mentioned the insurance initially to them.

The storm covered the whole east coast so where would he have gone an hour earlier. Baltimore was right in the middle of that hurricane. We just have his word that he was "offered" an earlier flight and not that he requested an earlier flight to some other destination. Wonder where his flight was going???? Maybe Miami because the storm had by-passed them.

Yesterday you suggested Giordano made up the whole story that the airport at Charlotte had closed due to a tropical storm that had passed north of the islands, now that it seems he was telling the truth he must himself have insisted on an earlier flight while already there (not sure why anyone would insist on a later flight).
I do not know where this plane would have taken him, he was interrupted while speaking.

They don't book passengers on other flights that don't show up for their scheduled flight unless the airlines are notified. Not sure where that policy you are speaking of comes from. I've never heard of it. Her ticket had expired so she would have had to pay the difference to get onto another flight had she been found alive.

This was not a case of not showing up, she was officially missing and they had a travel insurance.

Weren't they scheduled to leave to go back to the US on Thursday originally? jmo

I thought that too, but yesterday while going through the articles of early on in this case all the articles mention they were scheduled for Friday.

 

[LambChop]

True he was interviewed several times as a witness, and was told that he was free to leave. The moment ALE tells Giordano he is free to leave that would be an indication he had answered all their questions.
Why then would he again check with them if they had more questions for him?
If this was a case of an accidental drowing then what more could he tell then what he already told them?



There are two diferent things here, one being ALE already having plans to arrest him (which I am sure they had) and the other Giordano never being informed he was considered a suspect untill the moment he was arrested.

If this is a case of an accidental drowing, the place where this took place being indicated by Giordano, the circumstances told by Giordano, all the information he had about Robyn and his relationship with her being provided, her mother having arrived on the island, the embassy being informed, so why (if he were to be innocent) would he think they wanted to question him some more, they told him he was free to leave and never gave an indication they considered this a murder case.



I was looking up something for you yesterday and came across Stein saying Giordano mentioned the insurance initially to them.



Yesterday you suggested Giordano made up the whole story that the airport at Charlotte had closed due to a tropical storm that had passed north of the islands, now that it seems he was telling the truth he must himself have insisted on an earlier flight while already there (not sure why anyone would insist on a later flight).
I do not know where this plane would have taken him, he was interrupted while speaking.



This was not a case of not showing up, she was officially missing and they had a travel insurance.



I thought that too, but yesterday while going through the articles of early on in this case all the articles mention they were scheduled for Friday.

Fact remains he asked everyone except LE who was in charge of the investigation. Why??? Why ask people who have nothing to do with the investigation? In the end it does not matter because they stopped him right before he boarded the plane.

The airlines does not issue travel insurance. Their only concern is that she was not using that ticket on her scheduled flight which means an open seat for someone on standby. This is why they asked. By giving the wrong answer he drew extra attention to himself which, IMO, set the ball rolling as far as LE was concerned. I can see an innocent person thinking they'd be free to go if they had not heard anything back from LE and especially if they asked him when he planned to leave the island. But he claims to have asked all the wrong people who said, yes, sure, go ahead but has no confirmation the conversation ever took place.

I think I would find it odd, unless the investigator asked, to mention you had taken out a $1.5 million dollar policy. It must have been awkward. How would you put it....."Did I mention I also have a $1.5 million policy I took out on her in case of an accidential death and I'm the beneficiary?"

Thanks for the info on his scheduled departure date. jmo

 

[Micheline]

He was in Aruba..... Miranda rights are used in US.

In Aruba, by Dutch law a suspect is being informed of his rights, such as his right to remain silent, his right to an attorney etc.

Giordano was interviewed as a witness and such will be indicated above his typed witness statements (today, August 5, we interviewed as a witness person such and such).

Any witness can remain silent by just not claiming to know what happened.

Someone who does not know what happened is not considered a witness.

Other then that, a witness has no right to remain silent, a suspect has and will be informed of that.

My guess is by the second day his story was getting squirrely and he became a suspect. When they keep calling you back in for questioning they have issues with your original statement. But no, he was in Aruba not the same rules there as here. It pays to ask when in doubt. He obviously did not ask. jmo

Initially the questions may have been of another nature. The car was not searched etc.
I do not think they asked him the same questions over and over again and Giordano still having the impression he was only considered a witness, I do not think he is that ignorant. IMO

Even if he came in for questioning a couple of times that does not mean they were grilling him, also in a missing persons case (or accidental drowning which Giordano reported) there are lots of questions and things that have to be arranged and carried out, there were just two days in between Robyn going missing and Giordano being arrested (morning of August 5). So there has not been an extensive period in which they could have analysed his statements, interviewed witnesses, and so on. IMO

 

[Micheline]

-snipped a bit by me-

Fact remains he asked everyone except LE who was in charge of the investigation. Why??? Why ask people who have nothing to do with the investigation? In the end it does not matter because they stopped him right before he boarded the plane.

Regarding the investigation, if this was an accidental drowning then what investigation would Giordano take into consideration other then the search for Robyn? Her mother was there and her cousin on the way.

ALE told him he was free to leave so he did ask them.
The morning of August 5 he met with Robyn's mother and someone from the embassy and asked (apparently) if they were OK with him leaving or if maybe needed him there some more. At least he did ask them.
ALE told him he was free to go so he did not need the permission of Robyn's mother or the embassy, he could have left for the airport without meeting them or asking them, but he didn't.

I think I would find it odd, unless the investigator asked, to mention you had taken out a $1.5 million dollar policy. It must have been awkward. How would you put it....."Did I mention I also have a $1.5 million policy I took out on her in case of an accidential death and I'm the beneficiary?"

I think he mentioned the insurance in more general terms (Robyn was missing at sea allegedly, she could be found, things may needed to be arranged) but did not leave out the life insurance since that being part of the insurance he took out. IMO

 

[LambChop]

In Aruba, by Dutch law a suspect is being informed of his rights, such as his right to remain silent, his right to an attorney etc.

Giordano was interviewed as a witness and such will be indicated above his typed witness statements (today, August 5, we interviewed as a witness person such and such).



Someone who does not know what happened is not considered a witness.

Other then that, a witness has no right to remain silent, a suspect has and will be informed of that.



Initially the questions may have been of another nature. The car was not searched etc.
I do not think they asked him the same questions over and over again and Giordano still having the impression he was only considered a witness, I do not think he is that ignorant. IMO

Even if he came in for questioning a couple of times that does not mean they were grilling him, also in a missing persons case (or accidental drowning which Giordano reported) there are lots of questions and things that have to be arranged and carried out, there were just two days in between Robyn going missing and Giordano being arrested (morning of August 5). So there has not been an extensive period in which they could have analysed his statements, interviewed witnesses, and so on. IMO

He was the last person to see her so he was a witness. He was there but as we could see on GMA and the other programs he gave too much detail which was brought to out attention by JB.

I don't think GG is ignorant at all, I just know LE has a certain way they question witnesses. If the witness is being truthful they are consistent about what happened and it's possible to forget some small details when giving a statement but your statement is pretty consistent. Mr. Stein said "major inconsistencies" not small little details he forgot about but big ones that contradicted facts. An investigator is trained to know how to line up the facts with the statements by the witnesses. Apparently he was way off with his information to LE, enough so that he became a suspect. I would assume this was a top priority case for them and they were right on it interviewing enough witnesses that they felt there was a reason he needed to stay on the island. If LE called his attorney and told ML to tell GG not to leave town and GG took off to the airport then he knew LE did not want him to leave. We have no proof he did not know. The fact that he lied and when LE reached him he was covered in sweat would lead anyone to believe he had an idea he was going to be held on the island for awhile. jmo

 

[Micheline]

He was the last person to see her so he was a witness. He was there but as we could see on GMA and the other programs he gave too much detail which was brought to out attention by JB.

I don't think GG is ignorant at all, I just know LE has a certain way they question witnesses. If the witness is being truthful they are consistent about what happened and it's possible to forget some small details when giving a statement but your statement is pretty consistent. Mr. Stein said "major inconsistencies" not small little details he forgot about but big ones that contradicted facts. An investigator is trained to know how to line up the facts with the statements by the witnesses.

-bolded by me-

Stein never said major inconsistencies, there is no news article either that makes mention of major inconsistencies.

Apparently he was way off with his information to LE, enough so that he became a suspect. I would assume this was a top priority case for them and they were right on it interviewing enough witnesses that they felt there was a reason he needed to stay on the island.

If his stories were so way off, and everything they had was enough to arrest him and hold him for almost 4 months then why was he released?

If LE called his attorney and told ML to tell GG not to leave town and GG took off to the airport then he knew LE did not want him to leave.

They said (even publicly) that they told him he was free to leave.

We have no proof he did not know. The fact that he lied and when LE reached him he was covered in sweat would lead anyone to believe he had an idea he was going to be held on the island for awhile. jmo

Covered in sweat, changing toupees, blood on rock, fight in the lobby, so many stories... IMO

 

[LambChop]

On the video T. Stein claims there were big, major, large (not sure of the exact wording but meaning too many) inconsistencies in his statements. Splitting hairs won't change what T. Stein said and it does not change the facts. It's the stories that GG has been telling that don't make any sense.

He was released because they were unable to find her body. If her body washes ashore from currents that are counter to where he claims she went into the water he is busted.

In the meantime he is free to do whatever he wants to do. Everyone just knows now for sure what type of person he really is and hopefully women will stay away from him. jmo

 

[neesaki]

-snipped a bit by me-


He was not a suspect so imo there would be no obligation to inform authorities of his departure, whether it is the correct thing to do is something else. At that point (allegedly) there was no suspicion a crime had taken place why would LE not want him to leave?



Giordano himself may have realised maybe even from day one that there would be suspicion, that he may become a suspect. He volunteered the insurance policy initially (per ALE) so any worry that they may get suspicious would not be ungrounded, imo.



He said the ticket agent told him the airport of Charlotte was closed and offered him a flight that would take place earlier then his scheduled flight.

Btw, I still wonder if Robyn's flight was cancelled or not, or if maybe it was set to a later date which is not unusual in missing person's cases.

How refreshing that airlines are now offering earlier flights, versus extreme delays, when there are airport closures and delays due to weather. In fact this should possibly be marked down as a miracle in the airline industry.

I have been in many situations when the weather has caused airport delays and closures, and never have they been able to offer an early flight out. If anything, they are always delayed. By hours at least, and sometimes days. Are the Aruba airports just that slow and not busy at all? If so, I guess the tourism industry must really be suffering. Otherwise, this just doesn't sound believable at all to me.

The more I think about this, it is imo, another of GG's lies and it sounds ridiculous.

I simply would have to have someone of credibility, and I don't mean Jose Baez, to verify this claim by GG before I would even half way believe it. JMO