ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 9

[LolliPop]

Excuse me? Are you taking these questions "literally?" Neesaki is not asking JB to actually answer these questions--

Can we get past the literary meaning of every sentence and back to RG missing in Aruba?

Questions asked of a person are normally directed at that person.

And why ask a person questions by name if you don't want an answer ?

I am sorry, I guess it is just me not understanding.

But I totally agree with you, lets move on to RG's drowning in the sea.

 

[neesaki]

American Woman Died in Aruba
December 29, 2011

An American woman is dead after an apparent drowning at Baby Beach, a popular tourist spot on the island of Aruba. This sad case comes just a few months after the disappearance of Robyn Gardner, who is believed to have died in the same area.

Sources report that 48-year-old Jing Wei was with her husband at Baby Beach when she allegedly succumbed to the waters and drowned. She was retrieved from the water and other tourists attempted to resuscitate the American tourist. Unfortunately, by the time an ambulance transported her to the hospital she was pronounced dead. It's reported that her husband was so frantic that he went into shock.

This drowning is currently being investigated by Aruban officials, but they have acknowledged that they don't suspect foul play in this incident. It appears that sometimes the beautiful waters surrounding the island of Aruba can be treacherous.

What does this mean for Robyn Gardner?

Gardner, who vanished in Aruba, still hasn't been found; but she allegedly vanished from the same spot where Jing Wei drowned on Friday night. When Gary Giordano was arrested, he claimed that Robyn Gardner had been swept out to see while snorkeling at Baby Beach. Could he have been telling the truth all along?

Gary Giordano is free now, back in the States after spending 116 days in jail on the Aruban island. He still, to this day, maintains the claims that Robyn was swept out to sea. He swears that he didn't harm the missing woman.

Knowing that someone has drowned at Baby Beach has cast a sort of new look at Gary Giordano's story. Whether he's telling the truth or not, however, doesn't change how tragic this recent death is. Nonetheless, it could be something that may help this man in the future in case he is ever put on trial.

Chelsea Hoffman is a prolific crime writer and fiction author with several works published. Her writing has been recognized by such entities as NBC Dateline and several others. Contact her directly by visiting [link removed]. Subscribe to stay up-to-date on the latest in true crime and niche entertainment.

http://[link removed]/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474980960517

___________________________________________________________​

Snipped by me. Amazing how both The Huffington Post and Chelsea Hoffman can't get it right. This woman, JW, reportedly drowned at Baby Beach. GG claims he and Robyn were at Nanki / Rodgers beach. Different area, different conditions. Sadly this sloppy journalism seems to be becoming the norm. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Ok, just so I understand correctly.


Since this happened to Robyn on the eastern tip of Aruba where the ocean waves and currents around the island do not constantly push toward the shore and the ocean waves and currents are stronger around channel openings, and the ends of islands, etc., etc.

Every drowning victim's body will wash back to shore even when the island only has a 25 mile long shoreline to catch it ?

Am I correct in this ?

In the area where RG supposedly disappeared (it's the southern most tip of the island, not specifically on the eastern side) the sea current is being drawn in and out of the cove. The current at the opening of the cove is strong. If RG drowned right there when GG said she did the chances of them finding her body were excellent. The chances (because it was calm and no strong currents) were that her body would have come in rather than out which is what I believe LE is saying why GG story just does not add up. There is a slim chance it could have gone out to sea but her body still would have surfaced and they did do an extended search for her. Almost all people who drown are found unless they are way out at sea and their boat sinks.

This is why, when added to all the other inconsistencies, GG is still Aruba's primary suspect.

It is NOT recommened that you swim through that large opening. There is a smaller opening to the channel that runs alongside that easterly portion of Baby Beach where the snorkelers usually go because it is protected by rocks and a small reef. This is where the colorful fish are but GG was nowhere near that channel. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Snipped by me. Amazing how both The Huffington Post and Chelsea Hoffman can't get it right. This woman, JW, reportedly drowned at Baby Beach. GG claims he and Robyn were at Nanki / Rodgers beach. Different area, different conditions. Sadly this sloppy journalism seems to be becoming the norm. jmo

Well, she was not that far off. The area GG claims he went in is on the peninsula which encloses Baby Beach. I think Nanki is just the name of the area but GG was out on the peninsula but west of that opening to the cove. Had they been really close to that opening it would have pulled her in with the current. That is what I am understanding. LE fully expected to find her body if not on the shore at Rodger's Beach, then somewhere within the cove when the tide changed. Also if you google the map you can see a ridge of dark area in the water below the opening of the cove which appears to be either rocks or some type of a reef so if she went to the bottom and drifted you would think she would have gotten caught up in the rocks. jmo

 

[LolliPop]

In the area where RG supposedly disappeared (it's the southern most tip of the island, not specifically on the eastern side) the sea current is being drawn in and out of the cove. The current at the opening of the cove is strong. If RG drowned right there when GG said she did the chances of them finding her body were excellent. The chances (because it was calm and no strong currents) were that her body would have come in rather than out which is what I believe LE is saying why GG story just does not add up. There is a slim chance it could have gone out to sea but her body still would have surfaced and they did do an extended search for her. Almost all people who drown are found unless they are way out at sea and their boat sinks.

This is why, when added to all the other inconsistencies, GG is still Aruba's primary suspect.

It is NOT recommened that you swim through that large opening. There is a smaller opening to the channel that runs alongside that easterly portion of Baby Beach where the snorkelers usually go because it is protected by rocks and a small reef. This is where the colorful fish are but GG was nowhere near that channel. jmo

We are talking about the same thing ?

Tide = Current ?

And Currents flow back to the shore ?

Is this the situation on Aruba, so you are saying that the Rip Current would have definately swept the body ashore ?

And by some slight chance the rip current had to have been flowing out to sea, then without any doubt they would have located the body ?

 

[Nova]

If he doesn't read here, how will he know there is a question ?

If JB doesn't read here, then the questions are rhetorical. It's a rather common linguistic device. I have no idea why it confused you, but I'm reasonably sure you were the only one who was confused.

 

[Nova]

Thank you for agreeing.

I already said how it supports Mr Giordano.

It doesn't support him by much.

1. I think we all know drowning is possible wherever there is water.

2. I thought GG said they went snorkeling off the rocky shore, not at Baby Beach.

 

[LolliPop]

It doesn't support him by much.

1. I think we all know drowning is possible wherever there is water.

2. I thought GG said they went snorkeling off the rocky shore, not at Baby Beach.

I think the term Rocky Shore or Rocky Point is more of a description than an actual area ?

Get my point ?

 

[neesaki]

Well, she was not that far off. The area GG claims he went in is on the peninsula which encloses Baby Beach. I think Nanki is just the name of the area but GG was out on the peninsula but west of that opening to the cove. Had they been really close to that opening it would have pulled her in with the current. That is what I am understanding. LE fully expected to find her body if not on the shore at Rodger's Beach, then somewhere within the cove when the tide changed. Also if you google the map you can see a ridge of dark area in the water below the opening of the cove which appears to be either rocks or some type of a reef so if she went to the bottom and drifted you would think she would have gotten caught up in the rocks. jmo

I agree with your point that it's in the same general area, yet Baby Beach is shallow, calm and protected, versus the rocky point that GG and Robyn allegedly went in the water, which was not in the same protected cove.

The problem I have with these journalists misnaming the area, is that this has been a point of contention all along: i.e., Where did GG & RG actually allegedly go in the water, first it was reported as Baby Beach, then it was Nanki, then Rodgers, then we find out Nanki and Rodgers Beach are essentially the same thing. Then it was "Rocky Point", then we find out there is no such place.

Wherever they allegedly went in, it was not in the calm waters of Baby Beach which is what raised the red flags about GG's story in the first place.

Really, the drowning of JW has nothing to do with Robyn drowning or missing, different circumstances, different scenario, different outcome. I just think that for these journalists, it's all about making another headline and using inaccurate reporting in order to sensationalize their story.

I am a stickler for details though, guess I'm just too OCD. :seeya:JMO

 

[Nova]

I think the term Rocky Shore or Rocky Point is more of a description than an actual area ?

Get my point ?

I suppose. I used the term "rocky shore" (note the lower case) because that is the way the area appears to me in photos, we have reports of RG cutting her foot on the rocks and we are to believe that GG ruined expensive New Balance leather sneakers by wearing them into the water.

All of that is to be contrasted with what appears to be the sandy shore surrounding most of the inside of the cove known as Baby Beach.

So, yes, I was using the phrase as a description rather than as a proper place noun.

 

[LambChop]

We are talking about the same thing ?

Tide = Current ?

And Currents flow back to the shore ?

Is this the situation on Aruba, so you are saying that the Rip Current would have definately swept the body ashore ?

And by some slight chance the rip current had to have been flowing out to sea, then without any doubt they would have located the body ?

According to the Aruban authorities the water and current were very calm on that day. You can see in the pictures with GG that even the next day the water was calm. If you look at the pictures from JW's drowning the waves appear to be choppy which would mean the current is stronger. There was no riptide reported. The eastern coastline up from Baby Beach however is very choppy so if she were to go into that water there is a good chance her body could have been pulled out by rip tides but this area is not near Baby Beach.

When I said tide coming in I was referring to her settling to the bottom and when the tide came in it could have brought her back to shore and I believe that is what LE was expecting would happen.

It's been a long time since I took Oceanography, let me tell u....years. But currents are what are now bringing all the debris from Japan to our shores. Currents do travel many distances but the tides affect the currents. The claim is the currents were very calm so I believe LE expected the tide to bring her back in within a day or two. It's their country so who would know better than those who live there. jmo

 

[Nova]

I agree with your point that it's in the same general area, yet Baby Beach is shallow, calm and protected, versus the rocky point that GG and Robyn allegedly went in the water, which was not in the same protected cove.

The problem I have with these journalists misnaming the area, is that this has been a point of contention all along: i.e., Where did GG & RG actually allegedly go in the water, first it was reported as Baby Beach, then it was Nanki, then Rodgers, then we find out Nanki and Rodgers Beach are essentially the same thing. Then it was "Rocky Point", then we find out there is no such place.

Wherever they allegedly went in, it was not in the calm waters of Baby Beach which is what raised the red flags about GG's story in the first place.

Really, the drowning of JW has nothing to do with Robyn drowning or missing, different circumstances, different scenario, different outcome. I just think that for these journalists, it's all about making another headline and using inaccurate reporting in order to sensationalize their story.

I am a stickler for details though, guess I'm just too OCD. :seeya:JMO

Exactly and I don't think you are just being picky. It matters very much whether GG and RG went into the water from the sand at Baby Beach or over sharp rocks nearby.

It matters because RG doesn't appear to have had appropriate footwear to tackle the rocks.

It matters because if the pair has simply wanted a refreshing swim, then Baby Beach would have been the easier option.

It matters because the only reason to choose the rocky area is because it might provide better viewing for snorkeling, yet the time of day would seem to provide limited visibility.

All of this matter very much in terms of whether GG's stories are credible. You aren't nit-picking at all, IMHO.

 

[LambChop]

I agree with your point that it's in the same general area, yet Baby Beach is shallow, calm and protected, versus the rocky point that GG and Robyn allegedly went in the water, which was not in the same protected cove.

The problem I have with these journalists misnaming the area, is that this has been a point of contention all along: i.e., Where did GG & RG actually allegedly go in the water, first it was reported as Baby Beach, then it was Nanki, then Rodgers, then we find out Nanki and Rodgers Beach are essentially the same thing. Then it was "Rocky Point", then we find out there is no such place.

Wherever they allegedly went in, it was not in the calm waters of Baby Beach which is what raised the red flags about GG's story in the first place.

Really, the drowning of JW has nothing to do with Robyn drowning or missing, different circumstances, different scenario, different outcome. I just think that for these journalists, it's all about making another headline and using inaccurate reporting in order to sensationalize their story.

I am a stickler for details though, guess I'm just too OCD. :seeya:JMO

You're right. If the reporters had just gone into the Rum Reef and sat down, ordered a beer the bartender would have explained it so there would be no misunderstanding.

Baby Beach, the cove, lagoon, whatever you want to call it is circular. At the very bottom (south) are two openings. One is to the open sea where the water flows in and out. The other is a smaller opening that is protected from the open sea by rocks and there is a channel there where people can go snorkeling. The channel runs along the shoreline easterly. GG were on the outer portion of the circle before the opening in the south westerly direction and not physically on Baby Beach.

They will tell you to use the smaller entrance to get into the channel, not the opening to the ocean. There are warnings on websites that direct you where to enter the water and there were signs posted years ago. Plus it is pretty obvious not to go towards the opening even if you don't snorkel. It appears this poor woman was at the opening but obviously was not a victum of a rip tide because she was still there in the water and they were able to get her. If GG pointed out where he last saw RG and she was not there nor was she anywhere in the area in a calm sea what do you suppose LE would think? I think it clear when she did not surface after a day or two that maybe she did not go into the water at the exact spot GG claims she did. jmo

 

[LolliPop]

Exactly and I don't think you are just being picky. It matters very much whether GG and RG went into the water from the sand at Baby Beach or over sharp rocks nearby.

It matters because RG doesn't appear to have had appropriate footwear to tackle the rocks.

It matters because if the pair has simply wanted a refreshing swim, then Baby Beach would have been the easier option.

It matters because the only reason to choose the rocky area is because it might provide better viewing for snorkeling, yet the time of day would seem to provide limited visibility.

All of this matter very much in terms of whether GG's stories are credible. You aren't nit-picking at all, IMHO.

Are you saying that to snorkel in rocky conditions is better ?

 

[katydid23]

We are talking about the same thing ?

Tide = Current ?

And Currents flow back to the shore ?

Is this the situation on Aruba, so you are saying that the Rip Current would have definately swept the body ashore ?

And by some slight chance the rip current had to have been flowing out to sea, then without any doubt they would have located the body ?

Even IF, and I emphasize the word IF, she did drown in a rip current, and get puled away from shore, she still would have surfaced. He notified authorities soon enough for them to have found her even if she had gone in the opposite direction. The main reason they doubted his story, imo, is that they were able to see if there were any strong tides or currents at that time, and they did not see any.

 

[Nova]

Are you saying that to snorkel in rocky conditions is better ?

Yes. As people who know about snorkeling have already said in posts above, rocks and reefs provide hiding places for various animals, who in turn attract predators. So such areas are more interesting places to snorkel.

Relatively flat shallow bottoms offer little to see except sand. As at most public beaches, including, I believe, Baby Beach.

 

[Micheline]

-respectfully snipped and bolded by me-

Inconsistencies... (so far!)

GG admits she took the sleeping pill and was drinking. Even if they were both drinking moderately he should have enough sense to know she never should have been in the water. He drove her there and drove her right down to the water's edge. Who in their right mind, who claims to have cared for her, would have allowed her to get into the water. Of course witnesses (more than one) claim she never got in the water, they got in their car and left.....I believe that is a serious inconsistency.
****
GG stated that Robyn had taken a sleeping pill earlier in the day and had been drinking. Does that seem consistent with someone you would take snorkeling for their first time ever?

Last night I came across the video where this info originates.

"According to the police report, obtained by ABC News, Giordano told investigators that he and Robyn were drinking Vodka at the Marriott, and Robyn had a bottle of pills in her bag, I do not know what those pills are for".

http://video.today.msnbc.msn.com/today/44225927#44225927

 

[LambChop]

So GG told LE he did not know what the pills were but he told the server at Rum Reef that RG had taken sleeping pills and that was why she was woozie???? The server who gave LE a statement would have no way of knowing what was in GG's statement to police. So there is another inconsistency. jmo

 

[Micheline]

So GG told LE he did not know what the pills were but he told the server at Rum Reef that RG had taken sleeping pills and that was why she was woozie???? The server who gave LE a statement would have no way of knowing what was in GG's statement to police. So there is another inconsistency. jmo

Lamchop I have never read he said any such thing to the RumReef worker.

IMO, the RumReef worker told ALE that Giordano introduced himself and Robyn as Gary and Robyn from Maryland, that he had stood up to shake hands (or something like that). He also stated that Robyn told him she wanted to wait with her order till her husband came back from the car, and that they appeared in love (something like that). That according to the server Robyn seemed woozy. And then later when Giordano was interviewed by the police he told them about the vodka at the Marriott and apparently he mentioned the bottle of pills.

 

[redheadedgal]

So GG told LE he did not know what the pills were but he told the server at Rum Reef that RG had taken sleeping pills and that was why she was woozie???? The server who gave LE a statement would have no way of knowing what was in GG's statement to police. So there is another inconsistency. jmo

apparently at one point he also told police it was a sleeping pill...


http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2011/08/22/aruban-police-searching-for-body-of-missing-md-woman/