Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #7 *Arrest*

[JBowie]

Couldn't they have been cross-examined at the time of recording?

I believe that only can happen in court in front of judge and jury.

 

[boomburger]

I wonder if we will hear more about why she lied about having cancer.
It’s such a weird lie to make up, as at some point, people would realise she was lying. Unless you decide to murder the people you have told, I suppose.

Provides a serious enough reason for an immediate gathering but the bigger reason was to exclude the children from the lunch. Had they been there, the kids may have accidentally eaten part of the poisoned meals. "Can I try the gravy grandma?" etc

<modsnip>

 

[MrsAddick]

27m ago

Sketching inside court​

By Mikaela Ortolan​

Cameras aren't allowed inside court which means the only pictures of Erin Patterson that we've seen have come from Paul Tyquin.

Paul is a sketch artist who has been hired by Australian media outlets for this trial.

He's covered many other high-profile trials in the past including that of Greg Lynn, who was found guilty of a Victorian High Country murder, and Patrick Orren Stephenson who has been accused of murdering Ballarat woman Samantha Murphy.

A sketch of Erin Patterson at court on Tuesday. (Paul Tyquin)
He says he usually uses grey lead pencils and good quality drawing paper before applying colour.

"We do a photocopy of the drawing, and then I can colour using marker pens," he says.

Paul applied colour to the sketch using Photoshop. (Paul Tyquin)
Paul says the accused sometimes only appears in court for a few minutes which really puts the pressure on his work.

"Sometimes they're really rushed, you know, sometimes you might only get a couple of minutes. You have to sort of really observe carefully ... then finish it off from memory," he says.

Erin Patterson's lawyer tells jury mushroom poisoning deaths were 'a terrible accident' — as it happened

A Supreme Court jury hears opening submissions in the trial of Victorian woman Erin Patterson, who is accused of using a poisoned meal to murder three relatives. Look back at how it unfolded on our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

No tiny mushrooms doodled today. Reckon the sketch artist from last court appearance got the sack!

 

[Karin1974]

Alleged victim 'asked why Erin Patterson had a different colour plate'published at 12:09​

12:09​

Katy Watson and Simon Atkinson
reporting from court

Heather Wilkinson spoke to her son Simon Patterson after she felt ill, and told him that Erin Patterson put her food on a different plate to us, the prosecutor says.

The prosecution says Ms Wilkinson told Simon that Erin Patterson's plate had colours on it and that she wondered why that was.

Ms Wilkinson asked Simon Patterson "does Erin have a shortage of crockery? I have been wondering about it since yesterday", the prosecutor adds.

Erin Patterson: Trial begins for Australia woman accused of toxic mushroom lunch

Erin Patterson, from Victoria, is facing three counts of murder and one of attempted murder over the alleged beef wellington poisoning in July 2023.

www.bbc.com

IMO - It’s quite clear HW was a very smart woman. May all of the victims rest in peace.

 

[Bats]

True but as humans we need things to make sense for us, we need a reason as to why she poisoned her in-laws, even if its as clichéd as "because she's a psychopath", even if a motive is not needed for a verdict. I imagine her defence will later bring up "why would she poison them?".

I personally believe that when the Prosecution say that they're not relying on a motive it's not that there is a "lack" of motive, it's because it may be difficult to pin one down. That is, it could be this or it could be that....

 

[JBowie]

IMO - It’s quite clear HW was a very smart woman. May all of the victims rest in peace.

True, and from what people have said about her Patterson has also considered herself a very smart woman. As she sits through this prosecution she may have to adjust that viewpoint.

 

[JBowie]

I personally believe that when the Prosecution say that they're not relying on a motive it's not that there is a "lack" of motive, because it's because it may be difficult to pin one down. That is, it could be this or it could be that....

Yep, and as the judge told the jury there does not have to be motive, they just need to determine on the evidence if she is guilty of murder or not. In that respect, the reason is immaterial.

I know that's hard for people to accept -- because we always try to rationalize events -- but that's the rule and I'm sure the judge will remind them of that when he sends them away to consider their verdict.

 

[BreakingNews]

Provides a serious enough reason for an immediate gathering but the bigger reason was to exclude the children from the lunch. Had they been there, the kids may have accidentally eaten part of the poisoned meals. "Can I try the gravy grandma?" etc

She's guilty imo, I'm curious why she did what she did.

I'm also curious about motive, if the accused is guilty. Doesn't make sense to me.

 

[JBowie]

I'm also curious about motive, if the accused is guilty. Doesn't make sense to me.

I think the only way we'd learn of motive in such cases is if the accused breaks down under interrogation and comes clean.

I'd love to know a professional psychological diagnosis of Patterson's personality. If she's high on the psychopathic scale then she would likely never come clean.

 

[MrsAddick]

Just catching up of the day’s events and so many questions and thoughts…

1. Dying from toxic mushroom poisoning sounds like a horrendous way to go
2. Personally, I’m not convinced that the accused ‘intended’ to kill them…just make them suffer (like Simon had fallen ill previously but not fatally)
3. Curious to understand the legal burden of proof required to demonstrate murderous ‘intent’ beyond a reasonable doubt? Anyone?
4. The accused version of events seem shaky at best. The whole story is very odd (my 9 and 11 year old boys can weave a more believable tale and cover their tracks better than this)
5. The Prosecution indicated it won’t argue a specific motive. This is interesting. Whist motive may not be required to establish intent, surely presenting one would help the Jury buy-in?
6. What could Erin’s defence be? IMO, should have admitted to foraging wild mushrooms…then say death caps picked by accident.
7. Anyone know if the accused had a psych evaluation?

 

[MrJ]

The cancer thing is enraging! Allegedly lying about it is just so wrong

 

[SouthAussie]

I personally believe that when the Prosecution say that they're not relying on a motive it's not that there is a "lack" of motive, it's because it may be difficult to pin one down. That is, it could be this or it could be that....

Yes. I think that it could be this or that, also.

They couldn't rely on a motive in the Greg Lynn murder trial either. But they sure gave the jury a good idea of what they thought happened.
Greg Lynn and Russell got into a fight for some reason - could have been Lynn shooting near the camp, could have been Russell's annoying drone, for example - and Carol could have been killed because she was the only witness.

I expect some different scenarios may be introduced in this trial (perhaps by SP, the kids, or the devices) rather than everything was peachy so there was no reason.

They just may not be relying on any one specific motive.

imo

 

[Salah11]

Back in the early threads I am sure it was said she was a knowledgeable forager. I am positive the prosecution will provide evidence of this if it was true.

IMO

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Nanette Rogers SC, the prosecutor, said in her opening submissions that Patterson told police she had never owned a food dehydrator nor dehydrated food, but then said she may have owned one years ago.

She had, in fact, been sharing photos of the dehydrator and her habit of using it to dehydrate mushrooms with Facebook friends she met on a group dedicated to discussing the case of convicted baby killer Keli Lane.

CCTV footage later showed her dumping a dehydrator at a local tip. Forensic analysis later revealed it had her fingerprints on it and contained traces of death cap mushrooms.

The disposal of the dehydrator had been done to conceal her actions, Rogers said.
Rogers also said that police never recovered a phone used by Patterson at the time of the deadly mushroom lunch, and another phone seized during their investigation was subject to a “remote factory reset” while they were searching her house.

Rogers said Patterson concocted the story regarding medical issues and her cancer to ensure the children were not present for the lunch.
Simon was also invited to the lunch at Leongatha on 29 July 2023.

Patterson served individual beef wellingtons to her lunch guests, three of whom died from death cap mushroom poisoning, the court has heard.
Rogers said the prosecution also alleged that Patterson had not eaten the same lunch as her guests, but pretended she had the same type of illness to cover this up, had not fed the leftovers to her children and lied about where she had sourced the mushrooms.

The prosecution “will not be suggesting there was not a particular motive” for the alleged murders and attempted murder, Rogers said.
“You might be wondering, now, ‘why would the accused do this, what is the motive?’
“You might still be wondering this at the end of the trial.
“But motive is not something that has to be proven by the prosecution … you do not have to be satisfied what the motive was, or even if there was one.”

Rogers said in her opening submissions in the case that Patterson had invited Simon and his relatives to her house to discuss “medical issues” she had, and how to break the news to her and Simon’s two children.
She invited the group to her lunch during a service at the Korumburra baptist church, where Ian was the pastor, on 16 July 2023.

The night before the lunch, Simon texted Patterson that he “felt uncomfortable” attending, but that he would be happy to discuss her health with her another time.
Rogers said Patterson responded five minutes later saying she was disappointed, and emphasising the effort she had put into the lunch, which was a “special meal” of the kind she may not be able to have for “some time”.

The Wilkinsons had been puzzled about the lunch invite, Rogers said, as they had never visited Patterson’s home before.
When they arrived, they were shown around the property, before being taken into the dining area.
Rogers showed a photo of the dining table, which had six seats and ran parallel to a kitchen island bench, to the jury during her opening.

Patterson served individual beef wellingtons, consisting of a piece of steak covered in mushrooms and encased in pastry, with mashed potato and green beans on four large grey plates to her guests.
Her meal was served on a smaller, lighter-coloured plate, Rogers said.

They said grace and started the meal. The Wilkinsons ate their meal, with Gail finishing half of hers and Don eating all his and the rest of Gail’s, Roger's said

All the lunch guests started to fall unwell about 11 or 12 hours later, Rogers said, before being transferred to local hospitals and then to intensive care at hospitals in Melbourne.

Rogers said Patterson had an amicable relationship with her husband, despite their 2015 separation, until November 2022. Simon had maintained hope that the couple would reconcile, Rogers said.
She said at that time Patterson asked why Simon had
referred to himself as “separated” on his tax return and although he said he was willing to amend it she said she would instead be seeking child support payments.

About four weeks before the beef wellington lunch, Patterson invited Simon and his parents, Don and Gail, to lunch.
Simon texted to say he could not come, and the meal passed without incident.

After the subsequent beef wellington lunch, when all the guests became increasingly unwell, medical experts eventually came to the conclusion the symptoms were in line with death cap mushroom poisoning, Rogers said.
Patterson also went to Leongatha hospital, saying she was suffering diarrhoea.

Rogers said Patterson was asked on multiple occasions by medical professionals and others, including Don and Gail’s son Matthew, where the mushrooms for the meal had been sourced. She said half were fresh from Woolworths and the other half were dried mushrooms bought from an Asian grocer in the Melbourne suburb of Oakleigh or Glen Waverley.

She further specified in these conversations that she had bought a 500g pack of pre-sliced fresh mushrooms from Woolworths and that the dried mushrooms had been removed from their packaging and placed in a plastic container after they were bought in April 2023.

Patterson said she made a paste with these mushrooms for the meal, and that she had used all the dried mushrooms and not cooked with them previously, Rogers said.

Rogers said Patterson initially resisted treatment at Leongatha hospital and signed a “discharge against medical advice form” before leaving. The jury was shown a still from CCTV footage of Patterson leaving the hospital.
Rogers said a doctor at the hospital, Dr Christopher Webster, was so concerned she had left that he called the police, asking if they could attend her house to force her to return.

Patterson returned about 45 minutes later.
Patterson told Webster her children, aged 9 and 14, had eaten the leftovers, but that she had scraped the mushroom off. When he insisted they be taken from school and assessed, she became upset, Rogers said.
Patterson asked Webster “is this really necessary, they don’t have symptoms, they didn’t eat the mushrooms, I don’t want them to be scared or panicked”, to which Webster replied: “They can be scared and alive, or dead”.
Soon after, Rogers said, the police who had been called by Webster to check on Patterson arrived at her house.


One officer spoke to Patterson via mobile phone, and she directed him to where he could find the leftovers of the meal, in a brown Woolworths bag in an outside bin.


The trial in Morwell continues.

(Nino Bucci Justice, The Guardian)















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[JBowie]

Back in the early threads I am sure it was said she was a knowledgeable forager. I am positive the prosecution will provide evidence of this if it was true.

IMO

Here's an article:

The mushroom cook behind the toxic beef wellington that poisoned four people, leaving three of them dead, was an “experience fungi forager”, according to a source close to the family.

According to the Daily Mail Australia, Erin Patterson was known to often and expertly pick wild mushrooms around Victoria’s Gippsland region.

A friend of Patterson’s family revealed Erin was “very good at foraging” and at identifying different mushroom varieties.

“The Patterson family (including Erin and estranged husband Simon) would pick mushrooms each year when they were in season,” the friend said. [bbm]

Deadly mushroom twist: Chef an 'experienced' fungi forager, says friend

A family friend has revealed more about the woman who fatally fed her former in-laws.

www.nzherald.co.nz

 

[MrsAddick]

Back in the early threads I am sure it was said she was a knowledgeable forager. I am positive the prosecution will provide evidence of this if it was true.

IMO

I grew up in rural Victoria and loved foraging for mushrooms as a kid. Death caps look similar to common field mushrooms so we were taught at a young ago how to identify them (colour of gills, yellow tinge when scratched etc). In my area this was common knowledge.

 

[Salah11]

For a accidental poisoning she definitely went all out to avoid being poisoned.

Individual pies and a lovely individual plate that even Judi Dench could spot due to its brightness

IMO

 

[JBowie]

[The Prosecutor] said Ms Patterson had travelled to two places in Gippsland where death cap mushrooms had been identified as growing on a website. [bbm]

I have not seen (or missed) that claim before. Is it alleged by the Prosecution that EP was Googling around for death cap locations?

'Panicked' Erin Patterson lied to police but is innocent of triple murder, court hears

Defence lawyers for accused triple-murderer Erin Patterson tell a jury she lied about a cancer diagnosis and foraging mushrooms, but is innocent of murdering three relatives with a poisoned meal.

www.abc.net.au

 

[JennieM]

[The Prosecutor] said Ms Patterson had travelled to two places in Gippsland where death cap mushrooms had been identified as growing on a website. [bbm]

I have not seen (or missed) that claim before. Is it alleged by the Prosecution that EP was Googling around for death cap locations?

'Panicked' Erin Patterson lied to police but is innocent of triple murder, court hears

Defence lawyers for accused triple-murderer Erin Patterson tell a jury she lied about a cancer diagnosis and foraging mushrooms, but is innocent of murdering three relatives with a poisoned meal.

www.abc.net.au

Erin Patterson 'travelled to town where death cap mushrooms grew'
​

Tiffanie Turnbull
Live reporter

The court is being told about a website where concerned local people had been posting pictures and warnings about death cap mushrooms, geotagged to towns near Leongatha, where Ms Patterson lives.

The prosecutor says mobile phone transmission data suggested Patterson travelled to one of the nearby towns.

Erin Patterson: Trial begins for Australia woman accused of toxic mushroom lunch

Erin Patterson, from Victoria, is facing three counts of murder and one of attempted murder over the alleged beef wellington poisoning in July 2023.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[JBowie]

Erin Patterson 'travelled to town where death cap mushrooms grew'​

​

Tiffanie Turnbull
Live reporter

The court is being told about a website where concerned local people had been posting pictures and warnings about death cap mushrooms, geotagged to towns near Leongatha, where Ms Patterson lives.

The prosecutor says mobile phone transmission data suggested Patterson travelled to one of the nearby towns.

Erin Patterson: Trial begins for Australia woman accused of toxic mushroom lunch

Erin Patterson, from Victoria, is facing three counts of murder and one of attempted murder over the alleged beef wellington poisoning in July 2023.

www.bbc.co.uk

Thanks for that, but I am wondering if the Prosecution is saying that police forensics found evidence that EP had actually Googled "where are death caps growing at the moment" or something similar.

Had she done that then IMO that's dynamite.