Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #7 *Arrest*

[drsleuth]

11.26am

‘Miscommunications happen’: Family confusion over Erin’s cancer diagnosis​

By​

Erin Patterson’s defence lawyer Colin Mandy, SC, is now asking Simon about a conversation he had with his father, Don, at the hospital the day after the beef Wellington lunch on July 29, 2023, where he first told Simon about Erin’s cancer diagnosis.

He is asking Simon whether his father said the cancer diagnosis was a possibility and not a certainty. At that point, Don Patterson had been in pain, awake, and distressed physically for about 12 hours.

Simon said he had come out of that conversation believing that Erin had had a diagnosis of cancer, or at least she told Don that she had a diagnosis of cancer.

“Miscommunications happen. It’s possible I’ve misunderstood everything you’ve said so far, and you’ve misunderstood me as well. But I don’t think we probably have. And so to me, that’s the flying teapot end of possibility,” Simon said, following repeated questioning from Mandy.

 

[MsMarple]

Signal messages between Simon and Erin Patterson are tendered as evidence, showing the two arguing with each other.

The argument stems around arrangements for Gail Patterson's 70th birthday party, which Erin was not invited to.

Mr Patterson says the lack of invite was not intentional and that his parents had "genuinely believed" she was invited.

In messages on October 14 and 15, the pair argue and then reconcile.

"There was a lot of tension in our relationship and a lot of tension in ... Mum and Dad's relationship with Erin as well," Mr Patterson says.

 

[MsMarple]

Woah…

Erin 'didn't actually ask' how sick in-laws were, Simon says​

By Joseph Dunstan​

During questioning about conversations with Erin in the aftermath of the lunch, Simon says his estranged wife didn't make detailed inquiries about how her in-laws were.

"It intrigued me that she didn't actually ask," Simon says.

"We didn't have that conversation, I think at any time."

 

[SouthAussie]

Just want to say .. this portion of Simon's testimony is him answering to Erin's lawyer. Not to the prosecution.

In case there is confusion about Simon's "flying teapot" remark and other responses.

It is the defence job to try to discredit any and all prosecution witnesses, if they can. Even if the subject matter is inconsequential to the case.

imo

 

[JBowie]

Mushroom chef's Facebook messages leak

Mushroom chef Erin Patterson lashed out at her local community while putting together the local newspaper, an insider has revealed.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Thanks. I now recall reading about those Facebook posts (and they are very interesting reading!) but I had completely missed the flying witch avatar.

 

[Corina]

I am not sure why this matters. Either Erin did/does have cancer or she doesn't. Whether the family believed her or not seems insignificant to me.

The family all seemed like compassionate individuals who wanted to help others. Remembering that SP's parents were international missionaries when he and his brother were growing up.

The defence seem to be just butting heads about an insignificant thing.

I wonder if the defence is trying to reduce the apparent importance that Erin seemed to put on the get-together.

 

[drsleuth]

7m ago11.35 AEST
Simon is being questioned about Erin’s actions at Leongatha hospital after the mushroom lunch.

Under cross-examination by Mandy, he agrees Erin “hates hospitals” when asked about her leaving the hospital against medical advice.

Mandy also tells Simon there was “some sensitivity” about the need for their children to attend the hospital.

Simon agrees, saying his two children both had past experiences with hospitals which were “difficult”.

Erin Patterson trial live updates: mushroom cook had ‘tension’ with inlaws and struggled with mental illness, estranged husband says

Australian woman has pleaded not guilty to charges of murder and attempted murder relating to a beef wellington lunch she served at her Leongatha home in 2023. Follow live updates

www.theguardian.com

 

[SouthAussie]

I wonder if the defence is trying to reduce the apparent importance that Erin seemed to put on the get-together.

I think the defence is just using something inconsequential to try to discredit Simon's recall of matters.

They don't have much to go on to defend EP, so discrediting witnesses will be important to them.

imo

 

[Detechtive]

11.26am

‘Miscommunications happen’: Family confusion over Erin’s cancer diagnosis​

By​

Erin Patterson’s defence lawyer Colin Mandy, SC, is now asking Simon about a conversation he had with his father, Don, at the hospital the day after the beef Wellington lunch on July 29, 2023, where he first told Simon about Erin’s cancer diagnosis.

He is asking Simon whether his father said the cancer diagnosis was a possibility and not a certainty. At that point, Don Patterson had been in pain, awake, and distressed physically for about 12 hours.

Simon said he had come out of that conversation believing that Erin had had a diagnosis of cancer, or at least she told Don that she had a diagnosis of cancer.

“Miscommunications happen. It’s possible I’ve misunderstood everything you’ve said so far, and you’ve misunderstood me as well. But I don’t think we probably have. And so to me, that’s the flying teapot end of possibility,” Simon said, following repeated questioning from Mandy.

I love the sass!

 

[Detechtive]

I think the defence is just using something inconsequential to try to discredit Simon's recall of matters.

They don't have much to go on to defend EP, so discrediting witnesses will be important to them.

imo

Definitely... literally trying to create (reasonable) doubt.

 

[JBowie]

I am not sure why this matters. Either Erin did/does have cancer or she doesn't. Whether the family believed her or not seems insignificant to me.

The family all seemed like compassionate individuals who wanted to help others. Remembering that SP's parents were international missionaries when he and his brother were growing up.

The defence seem to be just butting heads about an insignificant thing.

I don't get the purpose of this line of interrogation either. What I am getting from it is that EP is either a hypochondriac or an attention seeker, or both.

If she was in the habit of claiming all sorts of illnesses, then no wonder SP wasn't interested in hearing about yet another one.

 

[drsleuth]

‘Erin hates hospitals’: Erin had a history of discharging herself against medical advice​

​

Colin Mandy, SC, is now asking Simon about his conversations with Erin following the deadly lunch and about her discharging herself against medical advice when she attended Leongatha Hospital. She wanted to pick her children up from school, the jury heard.

The jury heard she had a history of discharging herself against medical advice. “Erin hates hospitals,” Simon said.

Simon mentioned that there were some sensitivities regarding how to deal with their children and hospitals due to prior negative experiences. This included an instance where one of the children had a tube inserted up their nose, and another where the wrong knee was scanned for the other child.

The jury heard Erin wanted to collect the children from school herself to avoid scaring them.

Erin ‘never actually asked’ about condition of lunch guests after meal, court hears: Trial day three, as it happened

Estranged husband Simon Patterson will continue providing evidence in the murder trial of Erin Patterson. Follow our live blog.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Detechtive]

I don't get the purpose of this line of interrogation either. What I am getting from it is that EP is either a hypochondriac or an attention seeker, or both.

If she was in the habit of calining all sorts of illnesses, then no wonder SP wasn't interested in hearing about yet another one.

I also found the emotional videos of the kids with the grandparents not quite the flex the defence thought it would be. It would have made the jury very empathetic for Simon and his parents, rather than perhaps trying to make them feel empathy for Erin, or whatever the hell he's trying to do.

To be fair, he doesn't have a lot to work with.

 

[MsMarple]

I don't get the purpose of this line of interrogation either. What I am getting from it is that EP is either a hypochondriac or an attention seeker, or both.

If she was in the habit of claiming all sorts of illnesses, then no wonder SP wasn't interested in hearing about yet another one.

And possibly creating drama with her children regarding hospitals. Weird.

 

[Detechtive]

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/truecrimeaustralia/the-mushroom-cook/inside-the-courtroom-mushroom-cook-erin-patterson-faces-court-for-day-4-of-murder-trial/live-coverage/414947665965cf975a9016b62f1861a2#/entry/31379233

 

[MsMarple]

A few technical issues have arisen, and Justice Beale has taken the opportunity to call for the morning break.

More to come from courtroom 4 in a bit.

 

[drsleuth]

1m ago11.54 AEST
Jurors have been shown messages between Simon and Erin between 14-15 October 2022 exchanged on the app Signal.

Simon says there was “a lot of tension” in his relationship with Erin at this point. He says her relationship with his parents was also tense.

In the messages shown to the court room, Erin says she is “very very hurt” she was not invited to Simon’s mother’s 70th birthday. Simon says this was due to a misunderstanding with his father, Don.

In a message to Erin on 14 October 2022 Simon says:

Hey are you coming to mum’s Birthday lunch.

Erin says she is not aware of it, to which Simon replies he thought his father had invited her. But says his father may have gotten mixed up.

Erin replies:

I’m not too sure how your dad could have been confused..... Seems that my invite tomorrow is a bit of an afterthought and not even from your parents so I might pass thanks...

She later messages Simon:

What I recon is everybody forgot to actually invite me to this thing and I feel very very hurt about that..

Simon says Erin is free to “choose to think whatever you want”. But he says the birthday event is “very important” to his mother, Gail.

Erin later messages that she’ll attend the lunch and will bring their children.

The following evening, Erin sends a message to Simon:

I’m sorry for shouting at you this afternoon. I was feeling very hurt and lashed out... I’d like to not do that again.

Simon says “thanks for that” and says he is “sorry I raised my voice and tone too.”

Erin Patterson trial live updates: mushroom cook had ‘tension’ with inlaws and struggled with mental illness, estranged husband says

Australian woman has pleaded not guilty to charges of murder and attempted murder relating to a beef wellington lunch she served at her Leongatha home in 2023. Follow live updates

www.theguardian.com

 

[drsleuth]

12.02pm

How a ‘missing’ 70th birthday invitation sparked a family rift​

Colin Mandy, SC, is now showing Simon a series of messages on the Signal app between Erin Patterson and himself, dating back to mid-October 2022.

The conversation started around changing the times the children would stay with Simon, but quickly turned to Gail’s 70th birthday celebrations, and whether Erin had been invited to come.

Gail Patterson.

Asked whether she would be attending, Erin said she had not received any information about the celebrations. “I might pass things as I’d rather not go somewhere I’m not welcome,” Erin texted Simon.

After discussing the issue over a series of texts, Erin said she felt “very hurt” about not being invited.
“And your response is to say, I’m being ridiculous,” she texted Simon.

I’m sorry I lashed out. I was feeling very hurt and lashed out. It’s no excuse. I’d like to not do that again

Simon responded: “You’re as far off the mark as you possibly could be on this, you already have the facts, however, of course, you’re free to choose to think whatever you want to despite them.″⁣

Several hours after that initial message exchange, Simon said he understood why Erin was “mad” at him but asked her to consider Gail’s feelings. “I know they would love you to be there because they’ve been talking about this and losing sleep over this,” Simon said.

About an hour later, Erin messaged Simon again to apologise for lashing out.

“I’m sorry I lashed out. I was feeling very hurt and lashed out. It’s no excuse. I’d like to not do that again,” she said.

Simon responded by apologising for raising his voice.

“That’s for that. I’m sorry I raised my voice and my tone, too. I wouldn’t call what either of us did shouting, but I’m sure we’re referring to the same thing, no matter what you call it,” he texted.

Simon told the jury the issue had caused a lot of stress for his parents.

“Mum and Dad were really stressed about it. They had genuinely believed that they’d invited Erin to the lunch. I think they thought Dad had invited her to the lunch. That’s what happened,” Simon said.

He said the conversation had occurred around the time he and Erin were discussing child support arrangements following the changes to his tax return status.

The jury heard that at the time, there was a lot of tension between Simon and Erin, and between Erin and Simon’s parents, Don and Gail.

Erin ‘never actually asked’ about condition of lunch guests after meal, court hears: Trial day three, as it happened

Estranged husband Simon Patterson will continue providing evidence in the murder trial of Erin Patterson. Follow our live blog.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Did Erin cook a couple of dishes? So she would have known the other one was safe for her to eat?

Did Ian Wilkinson see Erin eat the meal? That's going to be interesting, hearing from him

 

[drsleuth]

4m ago12.17 AEST
Court shown more Signal messages between Simon and Erin Patterson

The court is being shown more Signal messages between Simon and his estranged wife, Erin, between 21 November 2022 and 15 August 2023.

The first message in November 2022 is Erin writing to Simon about their son’s surgery and an anaesthetist bill.

She requests Simon pay the bill.

Simon replies:

The department of human services instructed me not to pay you anything for the kids from now on, so I cannot pay that, I’m afraid.

Erin replied that the payment is not to her but to the anaesthetist.

Simon says this is “exactly the kind of thing they explicitly instructed me not to pay for”.

Erin Patterson trial live updates: mushroom cook had ‘tension’ with inlaws and struggled with mental illness, estranged husband says

Australian woman has pleaded not guilty to charges of murder and attempted murder relating to a beef wellington lunch she served at her Leongatha home in 2023. Follow live updates

www.theguardian.com