GUILTY Australia - Lisa Harnum, 30, killed in 15-storey fall, Sydney, 30 July 2011 #1

[SouthAussie]

I suspect that the 33secs that SG spent inside the apartment, before re-emerging pulling a tshirt on, was spent straightening up from his violence. Lisa may have knocked things over or thrown things at him ... a chair, a book ... in her efforts to get free of him, or keep him away from her. He may have taken her passport so needed to throw it onto/near the suitcase by the door. She may have scratched at him so he quickly made sure he wasn't bleeding (as well as surreptitiously checking himself in the elevator mirror).

It seems he had already turned off the interior cameras (in anticipation of the violence?)

He didn't actually put the shirt on inside the apartment.

33secs is quite a long time - try very quickly wizzing around straightening up your living room - you can get a surprising amount picked up/straightened in just 30secs.


"Then, at 9.55.27am Gittany, in pyjama bottoms but without a shirt, is seen leaving through the front door of the apartment, putting his hands on his head, before walking back inside a few seconds later.

For the next 33 seconds there is no security camera record of what he did next.

But then at 9.56.08am he is seen leaving apartment 1503 for the second time, pulling a white T-shirt over his head."


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...partment-door-shaking-heard-screams-help.html


(This was a very charged-up, adrenalin-pumped man .. he would have been moving fast in there IMO)

 

[Makara]

Im thinking by that time possibly there would have been quite a few people (bystanders) looking up to the direction of the balconys to see where she may have come from. If SG did go out and wipe the balcony glass - hopefully someone would have seen something unusual and reported it. I guess it also depends upon who stayed at the scene of the accident and did Police take their names or call for anyone who had seen anything to come forward.

.

I'm still hoping against hope that other buildings in the area captured CCTV footage of those final seconds.

 

[marlywings]

I'm still hoping against hope that other buildings in the area captured CCTV footage of those final seconds.

Very interesting point Makara!! What's across the road apart from a park??

 

[sleepinoz]

Very interesting point Makara!! What's across the road apart from a park??

The park and the station and not much else

 

[Brightbird]

I'm still hoping against hope that other buildings in the area captured CCTV footage of those final seconds.

So am I! But I believe it would have been presented by now if it existed. Maybe it is a 'no no' to have cameras directed at residences?

 

[FigTree]

I'm still hoping against hope that other buildings in the area captured CCTV footage of those final seconds.

Me too!
There has to be something - there are enough roof top cameras around that area.
*sigh*

 

[enzeder]

I suspect that the 33secs that SG spent inside the apartment, before re-emerging pulling a tshirt on, was spent straightening up from his violence. Lisa may have knocked things over or thrown things at him ... a chair, a book ... in her efforts to get free of him, or keep him away from her. He may have taken her passport so needed to throw it onto/near the suitcase by the door. She may have scratched at him so he quickly made sure he wasn't bleeding (as well as surreptitiously checking himself in the elevator mirror).

It seems he had already turned off the interior cameras (in anticipation of the violence?)

He didn't actually put the shirt on inside the apartment.

33secs is quite a long time - try very quickly wizzing around straightening up your living room - you can get a surprising amount picked up/straightened in just 30secs.


"Then, at 9.55.27am Gittany, in pyjama bottoms but without a shirt, is seen leaving through the front door of the apartment, putting his hands on his head, before walking back inside a few seconds later.

For the next 33 seconds there is no security camera record of what he did next.

But then at 9.56.08am he is seen leaving apartment 1503 for the second time, pulling a white T-shirt over his head."


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...partment-door-shaking-heard-screams-help.html


(This was a very charged-up, adrenalin-pumped man .. he would have been moving fast in there IMO)

BBM - "(in anticipation of the violence?)"

I believe that's precisely why he turned the interior cameras off. imo

Just minutes after Ms Harnum died, Mr Gittany told police he hoped the hidden cameras in the unit were working.

This was despite him repeatedly telling the court he remembered turning the internal cameras off.

''You knew both cameras internally were off?'' Mr Tedeschi asked.

"Yes," Mr Gittany said.

"So why did you say to [police], 'I hope the cameras inside the unit work?'"

After a few more questions, Mr Gittany replied: ''I was hoping there was a chance they might [have been] left on.''

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/please-do...ttany-sent-to-lisa-harnum-20131106-2x0pn.html

 

[enzeder]

Screenshot from video
http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/19701702/court-hears-balcony-murder-accused-rage/

 

[marlywings]

Slightly off topic...for any of our overseas members, a beautiful live view of Sydney Harbour, Opera House etc. Looks to be raining there at the moment.


http://www.captiveye-therocks.com/camera_ds/camera.htm

 

[SouthAussie]

BBM - "(in anticipation of the violence?)"

I believe that's precisely why he turned the interior cameras off. imo

Isisrising may be able to speak to this with her professional knowledge, but very sadly, I think that Lisa was subjected to far more violence than we (or anyone) will ever know about. Whether it was the holding of her head by her hair, or forcing her arm up her back, or squeezing her hand intolerably hard, or throwing something at her, or pushing her, or hitting her …. I do not believe that SG throwing Lisa over the balcony was the first act of violence he ever committed on her.

She may have become terrified when he turned the internal cameras off … just knowing what usually followed such an action. She may have sneaked out while he was in the bathroom and tried to get help from next door, and was then caught by him and dragged back inside in that suffocating headlock.

But whatever happened, I don’t believe a person starts his violence toward a ‘loved’ one by throwing them off a balcony.

And I believe that Lisa was fighting for her life that morning … she somehow knew that this was as bad as it gets.

 

[marlywings]

Me too!
There has to be something - there are enough roof top cameras around that area.
*sigh*

I agree FigTree...there's so many cams all around these days!

How ironic it would be if a cam caught SG tossing Lisa over the balcony after all the time he'd spent watching her via cam.

 

[SouthAussie]

Ooh .. Media Watch are grilling the Today Tonight Gittany debacle right now here in SA!

One court reporter said he had never seen anything like it before.

Media Watch find it 'extraordinary' that any media organisation would act in this way.

 

[marlywings]

Isisrising may be able to speak to this with her professional knowledge, but very sadly, I think that Lisa was subjected to far more violence than we (or anyone) will ever know about. Whether it was the holding of her head by her hair, or forcing her arm up her back, or squeezing her hand intolerably hard, or throwing something at her, or pushing her, or hitting her …. I do not believe that SG throwing Lisa over the balcony was the first act of violence he ever committed on her.

She may have become terrified when he turned the internal cameras off … just knowing what usually followed such an action. She may have sneaked out while he was in the bathroom and tried to get help from next door, and was then caught by him and dragged back inside in that suffocating headlock.

But whatever happened, I don’t believe a person starts his violence toward a ‘loved’ one by throwing them off a balcony.

And I believe that Lisa was fighting for her life that morning … she somehow knew that this was as bad as it gets.

BBM

I agree. There was the report about her having a broken finger, him pushing her into a garden or pot plants??. The morning she died was definitely not the first time he'd been violent towards her.

Bottom line for me is...no one who is suicidal would be banging on a neighbours door screaming for help. That just doesn't happen.

 

[enzeder]

Isisrising may be able to speak to this with her professional knowledge, but very sadly, I think that Lisa was subjected to far more violence than we (or anyone) will ever know about. Whether it was the holding of her head by her hair, or forcing her arm up her back, or squeezing her hand intolerably hard, or throwing something at her, or pushing her, or hitting her …. I do not believe that SG throwing Lisa over the balcony was the first act of violence he ever committed on her.

She may have become terrified when he turned the internal cameras off … just knowing what usually followed such an action. She may have sneaked out while he was in the bathroom and tried to get help from next door, and was then caught by him and dragged back inside in that suffocating headlock.

But whatever happened, I don’t believe a person starts his violence toward a ‘loved’ one by throwing them off a balcony.

And I believe that Lisa was fighting for her life that morning … she somehow knew that this was as bad as it gets.

BBM

Ohhh, I never thought of that. :facepalm:

Here's one instance of the violence that Lisa was subjected to by SG.

"Marjory Joan Harnum told the Supreme Court that her daughter told her Gittany had pushed her into a planter and then down some stairs."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-...rer-was-27extremely-possessive-and-co/5035488

 

[MsAnais]

Isisrising may be able to speak to this with her professional knowledge, but very sadly, I think that Lisa was subjected to far more violence than we (or anyone) will ever know about. Whether it was the holding of her head by her hair, or forcing her arm up her back, or squeezing her hand intolerably hard, or throwing something at her, or pushing her, or hitting her …. I do not believe that SG throwing Lisa over the balcony was the first act of violence he ever committed on her.

She may have become terrified when he turned the internal cameras off … just knowing what usually followed such an action. She may have sneaked out while he was in the bathroom and tried to get help from next door, and was then caught by him and dragged back inside in that suffocating headlock.

But whatever happened, I don’t believe a person starts his violence toward a ‘loved’ one by throwing them off a balcony.

And I believe that Lisa was fighting for her life that morning … she somehow knew that this was as bad as it gets.

Just want to say that I completely agree with you SouthAussie.

There is no way that this would have been the first time a man like SG was violent with Lisa (or any previous partner for that matter. Would be interesting to speak to his previous girlfriends.....).

SG fits the classic profile of a domestic violence perpetrator. Isolate and dominate the woman - and domination is typically physical, as well as emotional. Just like you said :seeya:

 

[FigTree]

Ooh .. Media Watch are grilling the Today Tonight Gittany debacle right now here in SA!

One court reporter said he had never seen anything like it before.

Media Watch find it 'extraordinary' that any media organisation would act in this way.

Unless they are pushing the boundaries on purpose...

Just a thought.

 

[FigTree]

I agree FigTree...there's so many cams all around these days!

How ironic it would be if a cam caught SG tossing Lisa over the balcony after all the time he'd spent watching her via cam.

Oh yes!

There are camera in Hyde Park.
There are RTA cameras on the corner of Liverpool/Oxford/College street.
There are cameras on rooftops over the Pool areas of the Hotels nearby
Did the Marriot or Telstra have their camera on?
You can see Sydney Tower - it has camera ...
You can see the building 180 degrees from around the park...

You can see the park opposite from Google.
If you take a street view walk you will be amazed at the amount of locations you can see this building from.

http://goo.gl/maps/j57HF

 

[FigTree]

Still up late thinking....

Was Lisa wearing her engagement ring when she was found?
If not, why - and where is it now?

Was the things she put in storage retrieved?

Why was Lisa's Passport not in her handbag?
Had it been 'confiscated/taken from her'?

:coffeews:

 

[MsAnais]

Unless they are pushing the boundaries on purpose...

Just a thought.

That's an interesting thought FigTree.

I feel like we just have no idea who this guy knows - a lot of leeway seems to have been given to him so far. :banghead:

 

[sleepinoz]

http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s3888649.htm