Australia- Two sisters in their 20s found dead inside Sydney unit had been there lengthy time, Suspicious deaths, June 2022

[Charlot123]

Well,
if the sisters were indeed murdered, the perp/s didn't leave any traces it seems.

And after 2 months of being dead - can toxicology exams really find the cause?

Either if it is a routine drug they test for, or if the sisters were observed before death and some clinical symptoms were noticed. However, if exhumation is performed years later, for toxicology purposes, it is possible in principle to find something.

Samples of certain organs that can survive better, nails and hair should at least be kept for future testing.

 

[branmuffin]

OK I found something in Al Jazeera. There might be some confusion as AJ says their aliases were Reem and Rawan. DM says these were their initial names. But some things fit. Although, they have been living in Hong Kong for 6 mo and left on a family trip to Sri Lanka. But, abuse in home and renounced Islam.

Saudi sisters stuck in Hong Kong months after fleeing kingdom

The two sisters using the aliases Reem and Rawan say Saudi officials kept them from traveling to Australia.

www.aljazeera.com

Could it be the same girls?

Saudi sisters trapped in Hong Kong fear deportation

Two sisters say they fear dramatic repercussions, from forced marriage to death, if sent back to Saudi Arabia.

www.aljazeera.com

Wow. It does seem they are the same girls. While I understand their decision to flee the oppression of women in Saudi Arabia I am gobsmacked at the lengths the Saudi government went to stifle their attempts to escape oppression. Invalidating their passport? Attempted kidnapping? Who were these girls? They don't sound like ordinary wealthy females, they sound like they are related to some important people perhaps in the royal family which would be a major embarassment for the country.

 

[branmuffin]

Here are the voices when they were interviewed in 2019

Saudi Sisters Hiding in Hong Kong Apply for Emergency Visa

The pair say they will be killed for renouncing Islam if they are sent home

time.com

So incredibly sad, hearing the resignation in her voice. She sounds so tired of running and hiding. And that interview is over three years old. I can't imagine how the stress has increased tenfold over the following three years.

It baffles me how a culture can imprison one half of their population, treating them like cattle with little thought to their well being other than being recepticles for sperm when the time comes to marry them off. We shouldn't be too smug, though, since currently there are significant segments of western culture who would be okay with women being forced out of the work place, rescinding their rights to vote and self determination, spending their lives as incubators and as chattel of men.

 

[dotr]

rbbm.

Saudi sisters found dead in Sydney had active claims for asylum with Department of Home Affairs

Asra Abdullah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal Abdullah Alsehli, 23, were quiet and ‘would keep to themselves’, former landlord says

www.theguardian.com

by Mostafa Rachwani and Ben Doherty

''The sisters had arrived in Australia in 2017 and lived at a property in Fairfield before they moved to their unit in Canterbury.

Their previous landlord spoke to Guardian Australia under condition of anonymity, saying that they were shocked by the women’s deaths, and that nothing suspicious had happened in the two years they knew the sisters.

“I was shocked when I saw their photos, I have no idea how this could have happened. They were very cute and friendly girls, we never had any problems with them,” they said.

“They wouldn’t talk too much, and would stay up at night, but they never made any loud noises; nothing weird ever happened.


“They would keep to themselves mostly, didn’t have any friends, barely had anyone visit, and would only leave here and there,” they added.

Guardian Australia understands that the older sister, Asra, had a boyfriend when they were living in Fairfield, with the landlord saying he was “Iraqi” and had a beard.

Asra had also applied for an apprehended violence order in January 2019 against a man, although that application was withdrawn.

The landlord said the sisters’ mother had visited previously and that she had not liked Australia, leaving after only a brief stay. They had never heard the sisters discuss their father.

The women had been attending Tafe in Fairfield, with the landlord saying they would “only leave for Tafe, shopping or work”. Both sisters worked in traffic control for a construction company.

“They had come to Australia to study,” the landlord said.''

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Saudi Arabian sisters found dead daughters of 'well-connected' family

Asra Abdullah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal Abdullah Alsehli, 23, were found dead in their first-floor unit in Canterbury on June 7. It is understood they came from a 'well-connected' Saudi Arabian family.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[chimpface]

rbbm.

Saudi sisters found dead in Sydney had active claims for asylum with Department of Home Affairs

Asra Abdullah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal Abdullah Alsehli, 23, were quiet and ‘would keep to themselves’, former landlord says

www.theguardian.com

by Mostafa Rachwani and Ben Doherty

''The sisters had arrived in Australia in 2017 and lived at a property in Fairfield before they moved to their unit in Canterbury.

Their previous landlord spoke to Guardian Australia under condition of anonymity, saying that they were shocked by the women’s deaths, and that nothing suspicious had happened in the two years they knew the sisters.

“I was shocked when I saw their photos, I have no idea how this could have happened. They were very cute and friendly girls, we never had any problems with them,” they said.

“They wouldn’t talk too much, and would stay up at night, but they never made any loud noises; nothing weird ever happened.


“They would keep to themselves mostly, didn’t have any friends, barely had anyone visit, and would only leave here and there,” they added.

Guardian Australia understands that the older sister, Asra, had a boyfriend when they were living in Fairfield, with the landlord saying he was “Iraqi” and had a beard.

Asra had also applied for an apprehended violence order in January 2019 against a man, although that application was withdrawn.

The landlord said the sisters’ mother had visited previously and that she had not liked Australia, leaving after only a brief stay. They had never heard the sisters discuss their father.

The women had been attending Tafe in Fairfield, with the landlord saying they would “only leave for Tafe, shopping or work”. Both sisters worked in traffic control for a construction company.

“They had come to Australia to study,” the landlord said.''

Oh dear, if the mother knew where they were living...

Only leads me to one conclusion.

 

[Dotta]

rbbm.

Saudi sisters found dead in Sydney had active claims for asylum with Department of Home Affairs

Asra Abdullah Alsehli, 24, and Amaal Abdullah Alsehli, 23, were quiet and ‘would keep to themselves’, former landlord says

www.theguardian.com

by Mostafa Rachwani and Ben Doherty

''The sisters had arrived in Australia in 2017 and lived at a property in Fairfield before they moved to their unit in Canterbury.

Their previous landlord spoke to Guardian Australia under condition of anonymity, saying that they were shocked by the women’s deaths, and that nothing suspicious had happened in the two years they knew the sisters.

“I was shocked when I saw their photos, I have no idea how this could have happened. They were very cute and friendly girls, we never had any problems with them,” they said.

“They wouldn’t talk too much, and would stay up at night, but they never made any loud noises; nothing weird ever happened.


“They would keep to themselves mostly, didn’t have any friends, barely had anyone visit, and would only leave here and there,” they added.

Guardian Australia understands that the older sister, Asra, had a boyfriend when they were living in Fairfield, with the landlord saying he was “Iraqi” and had a beard.

Asra had also applied for an apprehended violence order in January 2019 against a man, although that application was withdrawn.

The landlord said the sisters’ mother had visited previously and that she had not liked Australia, leaving after only a brief stay. They had never heard the sisters discuss their father.

The women had been attending Tafe in Fairfield, with the landlord saying they would “only leave for Tafe, shopping or work”. Both sisters worked in traffic control for a construction company.

“They had come to Australia to study,” the landlord said.''

Curiouser and curiouser...

Mother visited them??

So, it might mean they weren't the girls described in press as runaways (via Hong Kong).
Or this woman visiting them wasn't their mother.

Oh well...

 

[UnDiluted7]

Curiouser and curiouser...

Mother visited them??

So, it might mean they weren't the girls described in press as runaways (via Hong Kong).
Or this woman visiting them wasn't their mother.

Oh well...

Or, if that was them, the mother supported them, or they had reconciled in some way. Lots of possible outcomes.

 

[Dotta]

Or, if that was them, the mother supported them, or they had reconciled in some way. Lots of possible outcomes.

But that would make mother an outcast too.

If they renounced their faith, they were damned by family.
Besides, they changed their names.
They were hiding.

Ok, it also might mean that mother came to convince them to repent and come back - beg for forgiveness.

But it is obvious to me that father must have known about this mission.

Could they really have disclosed their location?
They must have known what is the punishment for abandoning both family and faith.

MOO

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Curiouser and curiouser...

Mother visited them??

So, it might mean they weren't the girls described in press as runaways (via Hong Kong).
Or this woman visiting them wasn't their mother.

Oh well...

I would lean towards that it wasn't really their mother. As that would have endangered the mother so much, unless her sons, brothers, and husband were all approving - sounds unlikely.

Is it possible these young women were part of an activism / awareness / political or religious pressure movement? Have they maybe been assassinated?

 

[UnDiluted7]

But that would make mother an outcast too.

If they renounced their faith, they were damned by family.
Besides, they changed their names.
They were hiding.

Ok, it also might mean that mother came to convince them to repent and come back - beg for forgiveness.

But it is obvious to me that father must have known about this mission.

Could they really have disclosed their location?
They must have known what is the punishment for abandoning both family and faith.

I guess every possibility is on the table given how little we still know, but ultimately, I'm unconvinced by the whole 'vengeful family reaching out to have them killed' angle until there's something substantial that points to that.

 

[Dotta]

I guess every possibility is on the table given how little we still know, but ultimately, I'm unconvinced by the whole 'vengeful family reaching out to have them killed' angle until there's something substantial that points to that.

Well, Police said that:

- the sisters had contact with family - sporadic,

- the family was not involved in their demise,

- the sisters didn't flee their native country.

(In DM link)

Go figure...

 

[UnDiluted7]

Well, Police said that:

- the sisters had contact with family - sporadic,

- the family was not involved with their demise,

- the sisters didn't flee their native country.

Go figure...

Yeah, they've gone out of their way to refute that line of enquiry pretty strongly.

 

[SouthAussie]

RSBM

The women had been attending Tafe in Fairfield, with the landlord saying they would “only leave for Tafe, shopping or work”. Both sisters worked in traffic control for a construction company.

“They had come to Australia to study,” the landlord said.''

If they had arrived in Australia to study, they would likely have arrived on a Student visa.
It is curious that they were found deceased when that visa would expire (after 5 years). Coincidence?
It is also interesting that they were each found in their own bed, deceased.


"The Student visa (subclass 500) visa allows you to live, work and study in Australia for a maximum of five years, in line with your course.

On this visa, you are normally allowed to work a maximum of 40 hours per fortnight during term time and unlimited hours during study breaks. However, the Australian Government is temporarily allowing students to work over their normal limit of 40 hours per fortnight during term time across all sectors. Currently, students may also start working on arrival in Australia, and do not need to wait until their course commences."

Preparing to travel | Study Australia

Use our pre-departure checklist to help you prepare for your arrival as an international student in Australia.

www.studyaustralia.gov.au

 

[ElGato]

Wow. It does seem they are the same girls. While I understand their decision to flee the oppression of women in Saudi Arabia I am gobsmacked at the lengths the Saudi government went to stifle their attempts to escape oppression. Invalidating their passport? Attempted kidnapping? Who were these girls? They don't sound like ordinary wealthy females, they sound like they are related to some important people perhaps in the royal family which would be a major embarassment for the country.

Hmmm, I can't make the timing work:

Australian sisters: arrived in 2017..
Hong Kong sisters: arrived in Sept. 2018, on their way to Australia. Still in HK in Feb. 2019.

I think these are different sisters.

JMO

 

[Spartygirl]

This case is horrific.
I felt terror simply reading the reports.

I agree!!
These 2 beautiful girls lived in fear even after they made it to their destination of Australia.
I am sure they continued to constantly look over their shoulders, behind them, in front of them .. everywhere they went.

They must have felt trapped inside their apt for fear of going out and being found and sent back to the nightmare that was their previous lives.

Knowing this and my first instinct was suicide -- I can understand if they felt leaving this earth would be better than the horrors of being sent back to SA

HOWEVER... also now knowing the horrors and the fears (which are real fears, NOT imaginary) and of them Denouncing their religion, not to follow another religion even, but to become Atheists ---they would have the fear of other Islams in the area trying to harm them for this, I would imagine.

I believe their fear of someone(s) messing/tampering with their food orders is very real.
Another SA/Islamic person working in a restaurant, knowing they have, in this person's mind, brought shame onto themselves ??
Perhaps the guy with the AVO ?? where did he work ???

Food poisoning --of the fatal kind put into their food order.
When one gets food poisoning, whether mild or harsh, they tend to be violently ill for 24 hours or so.
I imagine LE /Investigators would know if there were signs of illness in the apt.

I just can't figure out what the heck happened to these sisters but if they took their own lives, it was out of fear of being found and returned back to the abuse and horrific lifestyle they had run away from.

What happened to you both, you beautiful young ladies ???
Hoping answers come soon.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I agree!!
These 2 beautiful girls lived in fear even after they made it to their destination of Australia.
I am sure they continued to constantly look over their shoulders, behind them, in front of them .. everywhere they went.

They must have felt trapped inside their apt for fear of going out and being found and sent back to the nightmare that was their previous lives.

Knowing this and my first instinct was suicide -- I can understand if they felt leaving this earth would be better than the horrors of being sent back to SA

HOWEVER... also now knowing the horrors and the fears (which are real fears, NOT imaginary) and of them Denouncing their religion, not to follow another religion even, but to become Atheists ---they would have the fear of other Islams in the area trying to harm them for this, I would imagine.

I believe their fear of someone(s) messing/tampering with their food orders is very real.
Another SA/Islamic person working in a restaurant, knowing they have, in this person's mind, brought shame onto themselves ??
Perhaps the guy with the AVO ?? where did he work ???

Food poisoning --of the fatal kind put into their food order.
When one gets food poisoning, whether mild or harsh, they tend to be violently ill for 24 hours or so.
I imagine LE /Investigators would know if there were signs of illness in the apt.

I just can't figure out what the heck happened to these sisters but if they took their own lives, it was out of fear of being found and returned back to the abuse and horrific lifestyle they had run away from.

What happened to you both, you beautiful young ladies ???
Hoping answers come soon.

Just to point out but true muslims with faith would never harm these women as it's against the teachings. Their own family, however, could be a different problem as they may be of the persuasion that it's their duty to 'deal with' them.

I agree with your sentiments and lines of enquiry - poisoning doesn't sound likely does it? Unless it was a form of extreme sedation but then people tend to collapse on the spot or stumble around. They bought drinks at the filling station but did they order home delivery fast food perhaps? If it came from the same place, it could often be the same delivery person?

 

[Dotta]

I think these are different sisters.

JMO

I am also beginning to think so.
If it is true their mother visited them - then they cannot be the runaways (in my opinion).

But they behaved strangely, seemed terrified and ended up dead.

I'm really interested in the results of autopsy.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I wonder if they were in contact with any medical services or registered with a local doctor?
Also I wonder if it could be a murder suicide? The one sister drugs the other with a powerful sedative, puts her to bed, assures herself that she's passed away and then does the same thing to herself?

Regarding the one sister cowering behind the other when someone called, perhaps that is for religious reasons or mental health reasons or perhaps one sister was dominant and controlling?

I am just speculating and hope that not to be the case, they look like beautiful young women and this is a tragedy and I hope there are answers.

 

[SouthAussie]

Curiouser and curiouser...

Mother visited them??

So, it might mean they weren't the girls described in press as runaways (via Hong Kong).
Or this woman visiting them wasn't their mother.

Oh well...

It sounds as though mum visited them when they lived in Fairfield, which was during their first two years in Australia. As it is their previous landlord who divulged this info.

Fairfield has a large Middle Eastern demographic - among other cultures - with only 3.4% of residents being 'Australian'.

Then they moved to Canterbury, which has no Middle Eastern demographic at all. But still has a prominent amount of residents from other cultures. Possibly this is when they denounced Islam? After mum had visited and left early because she didn't like Australia.

Fairfield
Canterbury