Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #68

[SouthAussie]

Yes although even one small spot of blood could make her want to discard it IMO

At the end of her mother's street? Pretty foolhardy place to discard evidence that would point to her. imo

 

[Blues Clues]

that’s an interesting question Blues. Are we talking Now or when it first happened ?

I understand the initial 72 hrs to be critical as so much potential evidence can change in that time, be it memory, witnesses, clear scent & prints, disturbed surroundings, weather etc.

IMO, this is where it all went horribly wrong. I won’t bore you with my plan but perhaps if was in Sydney ( or a major city), it may’ve been different. And I think the way the Cleo Smith disappearance was handled was an indication that Police also feel that may be the case.

What a challenge to have to start over after Many Years ! I’m good with the latest search areas.
But where was the place that FA was supposed to have said had a ‘dead body’ smell ?
Sex offender failed to report 'peculiar smell' near to where William Tyrrell vanished

Hi Warsh, The post I was replying to was calling out the FC's for having not searched for William.

There are several points throughout the last 7yrs where I think it could be interesting to see how people would try to work out where to search.
* on the first day
* after the 9 day initial search
* just prior to handing the brief to the Assistant Coroner
* at the conclusion of the inquest
* right now

One of the difficulties with this case is the lack of 'real' leads. The point is if you are the family of a missing person, without leads or expert skills or access to private information, where do you search? There have been at least a dozen searches by experts conducted on the basis of leads, tip offs and witness statements which have turned up nothing.

The appeals, the police interview, the awareness raised and the ongoing information provided by the Where's William campaign has been quite extra-ordinary when compared to long term missing child cases of the past. If only every missing person could receive the same awareness.

After being confronted by Scott Cook telling her the case was going to Unsolved Homicide - the FFC has pushed and begged for William's case to remain active. What does that tell us?

William Tyrrell's foster mother says Scott Cook told her she's 'not the only victim of crime' (smh.com.au)

The search where FA said there was a dead human smell is in this video.... at 1.30 in. It is the red dot area labelled Searched August 2019

A 4 day search is underway on the Mid North Coast, as police try to solve the disappearance of William Tyrrell

 

[Blues Clues]

Thanks SA, I did miss that. For some strange reason ( and I’ve asked this previously) I see ‘posts’ in ‘’responses ’ that don’t appear in my conversation trail earlier)

However, this is the ‘tit for tat’ stuff that I dislike, particularly when I say I want healthy debate in trying to find an answer for William.

I don’t actually care how long someone searched for, nor where they searched - I care about the ‘actions’ contained in evidence, which is what someone has said they did / has been determined to have done. No matter who this person is.

Maybe I’m not doing well with my articulation, but I wish we could all please embrace a respectful debate in consideration of everyone’s individual thoughts & opinions.

I'm with you Warsh, it is far more productive to discuss and debate the known facts, and theorise 'realistically' with the goal of solving what happened to little William being above all else.

 

[SLouTh]

I went back last night to re-watch DCI Bennet's Presser announcing the last dig in Kendall:
Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube

I was reminded of a few things........the main one being that DCI Bennet said

"New Information" came to light in September last year.....

The update from police today comes after detectives revisited the Kendall and announced new information had "come to light" in mid-September.
William Tyrrell search: 'No doubt' police are looking for the boy's remains (newstalkzb.co.nz)

So then I was thinking.... "What else happened in September?????"

1. It was the Anniversary of William going missing in September............ Did someone go back and visit a grave???

2. The Fosters also released the "Fake News" statement in September ..........
William Tyrrell's foster parents say reports of new lead is 'fake news' (9news.com.au)

3. Then as I was searching for other WT News that was released in September........ I found a 7 News Clip .... Caroline Overton's special was also released in September............. and there was another "new thing" that was released in that ............. that I had forgotten about.....

CO released information that FA also had a child go missing at the same age that William was ...... but that the Inquest Documents into FA's son have been made "Top Secret".
Disturbing new twist in William Tyrrell case | 7NEWS - YouTube

And this News Clip William Tyrrell investigation on Channel 7 reveals person of interest Frank Abbott has no alibi on day of disappearance | 7NEWS
FA has no alibi and also new info that his phone had no activity for 3 days around the period William went missing....

4. Did FA make a comment in Prison on the Anniversary of WT disappearance OR after the Chanel 7 CO Doco???? ..... I have no idea???? But just wondering?????


5. Then there is this on Peter O'Brien's Blog:
Principal Solicitor Peter O’Brien features in the new documentary by Channel Seven focusing on the manhunt for William Tyrrell.

“The disappearance of William Tyrrell” is a four-part series exploring on the various aspects of the mystery surrounding Tyrrell’s sudden disappearance.

And this....

You can watch the full episode of the documentary here. (Channel 7 has removed this link as at November 17, 2021). This coincides with new developments in the William Tyrrell case. The Sydney Morning Herald and other sources saying that police identify his foster mother as a person of interest.

William Tyrrell: Peter O'Brien features in documentary (obriensolicitors.com.au)

In hindsight, we have all wondered why that CO Documentary went ahead at that time??? Especially considering that there was little new information contained in it, and apparently the Police were onto a new focus in the investigation by that time......

From memory only 2 parts of the Documentary were shown on television.... and this Documentary was also subpoenaed by NSW Police....IIRC

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other points to note / remember DCI Bennet also said the following in that initial presser:

• They were acting on behalf of the Coroner.
• There is a scheduled Coroners Inquest to continue "early in the New Year"..... (we are at the end of March and this has still not occurred ......)
• DCI Bennet stated he was not anticipating a "swift end to the disappearance of William Tyrrell"

Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What does it all mean??? Perhaps nothing, but interesting to consider none the less....

Can you remember WHAT ELSE may have happened in September????


P.S. I am probably just getting frustrated with the whole process .......and all IMO

 

[Travelling Wilbury]

I went back last night to re-watch DCI Bennet's Presser announcing the last dig in Kendall:
Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube

I was reminded of a few things........the main one being that DCI Bennet said

"New Information" came to light in September last year.....

The update from police today comes after detectives revisited the Kendall and announced new information had "come to light" in mid-September.
William Tyrrell search: 'No doubt' police are looking for the boy's remains (newstalkzb.co.nz)

So then I was thinking.... "What else happened in September?????"

1. It was the Anniversary of William going missing in September............ Did someone go back and visit a grave???

2. The Fosters also released the "Fake News" statement in September ..........
William Tyrrell's foster parents say reports of new lead is 'fake news' (9news.com.au)

3. Then as I was searching for other WT News that was released in September........ I found a 7 News Clip .... Caroline Overton's special was also released in September............. and there was another "new thing" that was released in that ............. that I had forgotten about.....

CO released information that FA also had a child go missing at the same age that William was ...... but that the Inquest Documents into FA's son have been made "Top Secret".
Disturbing new twist in William Tyrrell case | 7NEWS - YouTube

And this News Clip William Tyrrell investigation on Channel 7 reveals person of interest Frank Abbott has no alibi on day of disappearance | 7NEWS
FA has no alibi and also new info that his phone had no activity for 3 days around the period William went missing....

4. Did FA make a comment in Prison on the Anniversary of WT disappearance OR after the Chanel 7 CO Doco???? ..... I have no idea???? But just wondering?????


5. Then there is this on Peter O'Brien's Blog:
Principal Solicitor Peter O’Brien features in the new documentary by Channel Seven focusing on the manhunt for William Tyrrell.

“The disappearance of William Tyrrell” is a four-part series exploring on the various aspects of the mystery surrounding Tyrrell’s sudden disappearance.

And this....

You can watch the full episode of the documentary here. (Channel 7 has removed this link as at November 17, 2021). This coincides with new developments in the William Tyrrell case. The Sydney Morning Herald and other sources saying that police identify his foster mother as a person of interest.

William Tyrrell: Peter O'Brien features in documentary (obriensolicitors.com.au)

In hindsight, we have all wondered why that CO Documentary went ahead at that time??? Especially considering that there was little new information contained in it, and apparently the Police were onto a new focus in the investigation by that time......

From memory only 2 parts of the Documentary were shown on television.... and this Documentary was also subpoenaed by NSW Police....IIRC

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other points to note / remember DCI Bennet also said the following in that initial presser:

• They were acting on behalf of the Coroner.
• There is a scheduled Coroners Inquest to continue "early in the New Year"..... (we are at the end of March and this has still not occurred ......)
• DCI Bennet stated he was not anticipating a "swift end to the disappearance of William Tyrrell"

Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What does it all mean??? Perhaps nothing, but interesting to consider none the less....

Can you remember WHAT ELSE may have happened in September????


P.S. I am probably just getting frustrated with the whole process .......and all IMO

Great post!

Yes I think there are things happening behind the scenes which contain new information but are not in the public domain as yet due to either ongoing investigations or suppression orders.

 

[Blues Clues]

I went back last night to re-watch DCI Bennet's Presser announcing the last dig in Kendall:
Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube

I was reminded of a few things........the main one being that DCI Bennet said

"New Information" came to light in September last year.....

The update from police today comes after detectives revisited the Kendall and announced new information had "come to light" in mid-September.
William Tyrrell search: 'No doubt' police are looking for the boy's remains (newstalkzb.co.nz)

So then I was thinking.... "What else happened in September?????"

1. It was the Anniversary of William going missing in September............ Did someone go back and visit a grave???

2. The Fosters also released the "Fake News" statement in September ..........
William Tyrrell's foster parents say reports of new lead is 'fake news' (9news.com.au)

3. Then as I was searching for other WT News that was released in September........ I found a 7 News Clip .... Caroline Overton's special was also released in September............. and there was another "new thing" that was released in that ............. that I had forgotten about.....

CO released information that FA also had a child go missing at the same age that William was ...... but that the Inquest Documents into FA's son have been made "Top Secret".
Disturbing new twist in William Tyrrell case | 7NEWS - YouTube

And this News Clip William Tyrrell investigation on Channel 7 reveals person of interest Frank Abbott has no alibi on day of disappearance | 7NEWS
FA has no alibi and also new info that his phone had no activity for 3 days around the period William went missing....

4. Did FA make a comment in Prison on the Anniversary of WT disappearance OR after the Chanel 7 CO Doco???? ..... I have no idea???? But just wondering?????


5. Then there is this on Peter O'Brien's Blog:
Principal Solicitor Peter O’Brien features in the new documentary by Channel Seven focusing on the manhunt for William Tyrrell.

“The disappearance of William Tyrrell” is a four-part series exploring on the various aspects of the mystery surrounding Tyrrell’s sudden disappearance.

And this....

You can watch the full episode of the documentary here. (Channel 7 has removed this link as at November 17, 2021). This coincides with new developments in the William Tyrrell case. The Sydney Morning Herald and other sources saying that police identify his foster mother as a person of interest.

William Tyrrell: Peter O'Brien features in documentary (obriensolicitors.com.au)

In hindsight, we have all wondered why that CO Documentary went ahead at that time??? Especially considering that there was little new information contained in it, and apparently the Police were onto a new focus in the investigation by that time......

From memory only 2 parts of the Documentary were shown on television.... and this Documentary was also subpoenaed by NSW Police....IIRC

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other points to note / remember DCI Bennet also said the following in that initial presser:

• They were acting on behalf of the Coroner.
• There is a scheduled Coroners Inquest to continue "early in the New Year"..... (we are at the end of March and this has still not occurred ......)
• DCI Bennet stated he was not anticipating a "swift end to the disappearance of William Tyrrell"

Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What does it all mean??? Perhaps nothing, but interesting to consider none the less....

Can you remember WHAT ELSE may have happened in September????


P.S. I am probably just getting frustrated with the whole process .......and all IMO

Hi Slouth, you have gone to a lot of trouble and I appreciate your detailed post. I wonder though if that statement by DCI Bennett means something slightly different.

I’m not sure if it’s meant to say new information came to light in September or detectives revisited the Kendall area in September.

It’s not very well written imo

 

[SLouTh]

Hi Slouth, you have gone to a lot of trouble and I appreciate your detailed post. I wonder though if that statement by DCI Bennett means something slightly different.

I’m not sure if it’s meant to say new information came to light in September or detectives revisited the Kendall area in September.

It’s not very well written imo

Thanks Blues ....
The "New Information in September" came during questions to DCI Bennett, after his initial announcement .....

I used that article as I searched for those words in particular, regarding the presser that day ....

But yes, I also seem to remember Detectives visiting Kendall in September too .... Is that when the last search with the Coroner was planned??? When they all went back to FGM's former home and walked through the yard???

Edit to add - in the presser at 2:09 Bennet states there has been an investigative review and there has been new evidence.

 

[Serenanicole]

From what I can gather from the most recent discussions, it is very difficult to believe the FM would be involved in Williams disappearance. Her actions and dedication to finding him would go completely against this theory. The recent media attention around the alleged assault of another child in her care would seem deliberate as a strategy to change the minds of the public. I am not downplaying any alleged assault but we really don’t know the nature of the alleged events. All IMOO
For me it is like sitting on the fence.
If she had no involvement, this will ruin her life forever, a never ending nightmare.

 

[iiiii's]

I went back last night to re-watch DCI Bennet's Presser announcing the last dig in Kendall:
Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube



What does it all mean??? Perhaps nothing, but interesting to consider none the less....

Can you remember WHAT ELSE may have happened in September????

MFC secret interview at the NSW Crime Commission?
Fathers Day? which was 5 days before WT disappeared back in 2014.

RS and BBM

 

[JBowie]

P.S. I am probably just getting frustrated with the whole process .......and all IMO

You would not be the only one!

Recall that the media was saying that the FM was the current POI the time of The Big Dig and neither Bennett nor any other senior police officer denied that.

 

[SLouTh]

MFC secret interview at the NSW Crime Commission?

Hmm..... September is an excellent and interesting thought ....... I wonder if we will find out exactly when this occurred, at the court case in October???

The NSW Crime Commission works alongside NSW Police to investigate serious crimes, including homicides and has the power to compel people to give evidence.
William Tyrrell's foster father faces hearing after denying giving false evidence to NSW Crime Commission - ABC News

Fathers Day? which was 5 days before WT disappeared back in 2014.

Also, a very interesting point iiii's..... Anniversaries can definitely be a trigger .... and interestingly isn't it every seven years that anniversaries fall on the same day of the week.....

Anniversary reactions usually make symptoms that are common reactions to trauma or part of PTSD get worse. Reliving the event (or re-experiencing). Perhaps the most common reaction on the anniversary of a trauma is a repeat of the feelings, bodily responses, and thoughts that occurred at the time of the event.
Trauma Reminders: Anniversaries - PTSD: National Center for PTSD (va.gov)

 

[Blues Clues]

Thanks Blues ....
The "New Information in September" came during questions to DCI Bennett, after his initial announcement .....

I used that article as I searched for those words in particular, regarding the presser that day ....

But yes, I also seem to remember Detectives visiting Kendall in September too .... Is that when the last search with the Coroner was planned??? When they all went back to FGM's former home and walked through the yard???

Edit to add - in the presser at 2:09 Bennet states there has been an investigative review and there has been new evidence.

JMO I think the planning and perhaps the development of the latest 'accident' theory could go back as far as the time of the inquest findings being delayed SLouth. Happy to be corrected. Here's a couple of links which could support that thinking.


26/6/21
‘No stone left unturned’: Detectives urge people to come forward on William Tyrrell’s 10th birthday (smh.com.au)

"“Detectives are reviewing all evidence obtained since William’s disappearance and have recently sought the assistance of numerous experts to ensure no stone is left unturned."

18/7/21
Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw believes he knows who is responsible for William Tyrrell’s disappearance | Sky News Australia

"Stefanovic then bluntly asked, “do you believe you know who the person is?” with Mr Laidlaw replying, “we believe we can identify who it may be or the circumstances of him going missing yes”.

Stefanovic told Mr Laidlaw “you know what happened don’t you”.

“We have thoughts about what occurred to William yes and there’s a range of thoughts about what happened to him yes,” Mr Laidlaw responded.

The detective replied with a simple “yes” after Stefanovic asked if he has thoughts on who is responsible."

12/9/21
William Tyrrell breakthrough: NSW Police return to missing boy’s grandmother’s home in Kendall to mark seven years | 7NEWS

Officer-in-Charge, Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw, said police on Sunday returned to Kendall as part of their review into the circumstances around his disappearance.

“The Strike Force Rosann team returned to Kendall with local detectives and specialist forensic officers to have another look at the residence where William was last seen, as well as other areas nearby,” Laidlaw said.

“Further information has since come to light, as part of our ongoing review of the materials gathered by investigators since the moment William went missing seven years ago.

“As our team continue to conduct inquiries and explore all avenues of investigation, our focus has been identifying if anything has been missed, or if there are any details – no matter how small – that need to be clarified.

Also statements by police aligned with William's birthday in June and the anniversary of his disappearance in September. Perhaps that is more of an investigation update rather than the timing of new evidence? as well as a process of engaging the publics interest for what was to come in November? All IMO

 

[SLouTh]

You would not be the only one!

Recall that the media was saying that the FM was the current POI the time of The Big Dig and neither Bennett nor any other senior police officer denied that.

Yes ..... I was actually thinking about that when I wrote the post ...... NSW Police have never come to the defense of the FM and sought to clarify that as incorrect information......

However, stating the "FM is a POI" has never actually been said by a NSW Police Officer, directly to the media either..... IIRC?

I also noted another line by DCI Bennet when he was answering questions, that could be taken a number of ways.......
He said "I don't know who took William Tyrrell" is that because, that is a true and honest statement???

Or is it similar to "lying by omission" as in "I don't know who "took" WT " because nobody actually took/abducted him???

Probably over thinking it .... but interesting that the same words can mean different things in context.....

Police launch new searches for William Tyrrell | 9 News Australia - YouTube

 

[Blues Clues]

MFC secret interview at the NSW Crime Commission?
Fathers Day? which was 5 days before WT disappeared back in 2014.

RS and BBM

The MFC was interviewed by NSW Crime Commision in November

"The foster father testified for up to two hours after being secretly summonsed to appear at the NSWCC Surry Hills headquarters on November 11.

This was four days before NSW Police launched a surprise 'high intensity' search of bushland around 800m from the house where William had been staying with his foster parents when he vanished seven years ago."

William Tyrrell's foster dad to face lengthy trial for allegedly lying to crime commission | Daily Mail Online

 

[SLouTh]

JMO I think the planning and perhaps the development of the latest 'accident' theory could go back as far as the time of the inquest findings being delayed SLouth. Happy to be corrected. Here's a couple of links which could support that thinking.


26/6/21
‘No stone left unturned’: Detectives urge people to come forward on William Tyrrell’s 10th birthday (smh.com.au)

"“Detectives are reviewing all evidence obtained since William’s disappearance and have recently sought the assistance of numerous experts to ensure no stone is left unturned."

18/7/21
Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw believes he knows who is responsible for William Tyrrell’s disappearance | Sky News Australia

"Stefanovic then bluntly asked, “do you believe you know who the person is?” with Mr Laidlaw replying, “we believe we can identify who it may be or the circumstances of him going missing yes”.

Stefanovic told Mr Laidlaw “you know what happened don’t you”.

“We have thoughts about what occurred to William yes and there’s a range of thoughts about what happened to him yes,” Mr Laidlaw responded.

The detective replied with a simple “yes” after Stefanovic asked if he has thoughts on who is responsible."

12/9/21
William Tyrrell breakthrough: NSW Police return to missing boy’s grandmother’s home in Kendall to mark seven years | 7NEWS

Officer-in-Charge, Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw, said police on Sunday returned to Kendall as part of their review into the circumstances around his disappearance.

“The Strike Force Rosann team returned to Kendall with local detectives and specialist forensic officers to have another look at the residence where William was last seen, as well as other areas nearby,” Laidlaw said.

“Further information has since come to light, as part of our ongoing review of the materials gathered by investigators since the moment William went missing seven years ago.

“As our team continue to conduct inquiries and explore all avenues of investigation, our focus has been identifying if anything has been missed, or if there are any details – no matter how small – that need to be clarified.

Also statements by police aligned with William's birthday in June and the anniversary of his disappearance in September. Perhaps that is more of an investigation update rather than the timing of new evidence? as well as a process of engaging the publics interest for what was to come in November? All IMO

Excellent post and links Blues...... Yes I agree its a bit of everything like you have suggested, and possibly some new evidence that caused this turn of events in William's Case....

More than anything I just want William found and for the case to be solved..... He so certainly deserves that!

It is certainly interesting looking at the past events and trying to put them together ...... IMO
I was actually surprised when I went back to look at September that so much had happened then....

 

[Blues Clues]

Excellent post and links Blues...... Yes I agree its a bit of everything like you have suggested, and possibly some new evidence that caused this turn of events in William's Case....

More than anything I just want William found and for the case to be solved..... He so certainly deserves that!

It is certainly interesting looking at the past events and trying to put them together ...... IMO
I was actually surprised when I went back to look at September that so much had happened then....

Yes he does SLouth, very much so

 

[Underbelly]

I’m not certain in Australia that spanking is illegal and would qualify as assault.

Physical punishment legislation

*** Outgunned by JBowie (or is that outknifed?)

 

[Underbelly]

BBM

With all due respect, do you have any proof (and a msn link) that the alleged assault charges are connected in any way to the alleged "lying" charges, as you call them......???? I have not read that anywhere....

No, but as I stated, it was all theory.

 

[katydid23]

Dr do you really think we would be privy to what results they may have ? If it was my investigation I’d be keeping everything pretty tight until I was ready to say Go. but that’s just my opinion. I want the end result to be a success so I’m pretty thorough in my process development, no holes in my dykes

If they found any remains of William, or a piece of his spiderman suit, or proof that FM buried something there in the dirt----I have no doubt we would have heard plenty about it all over the news. JMO

 

[katydid23]

The initial search was certainly a good combined effort and a quick response from emergency services.
But that search may only be relevant if the current line of enquiry is wrong- they have suggested an accident and WT moved to elsewhere. This still is yet to be proven (along with a lot of other things), but if it eventuates that the fosters have hidden the events of that day it’ll go down as one of the darkest acts of anyone in this country. This is only a suggestion if that scenario eventuates IMO

You overlooked the point of my reply and the reason I posted this article.

I replied to the post which said something like " Good to see the police officers actually searching on the ground for a change, getting their hands dirty" <or something like that , I paraphrased...

And this article shows quite the opposite. They were getting their hands dirty with their boots on the ground. To me it is another example of people underestimating how devoted the ofiicers have been from the start to try and solve this tragic case. JMO