Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #73

[Olivia Reed]

Each state is in charge of its own Dept for Child Protection. I'm not sure that a national Royal Commission would work.

My state is the opposite. We don't remove at-risk children quickly enough. We offer the parents program after program after program and still Chloe Valentine (4), Ebony Napier (4 months old), Amber Rigney (6), Korey Mitchell (5) are all dead - because they weren't removed from their various biological parents.

All were known to DCP (our Dept for Child Protection) .... with DCP interventions, but no removals.

We keep having inquests and inquiries, as explained in these linked articles. Recommendation after recommendation has been given.

Chloe Valentine
Ebony Napier
Amber Rigney & Korey Mitchell

What I wish most of all is that all parents would realise how very important it is to straighten up when they've brought children into the world.

Thank you so much, so totally true

 

[LolaAngelina]

How do you know what concepts a child has at 9month old.

Science? Commonsense?

 

[k-mac]

<quoted post was deleted>

The Foster parents had commenced adoption proceedings, unbeknown to the biological parents……

This is not a conspiracy theory….the details are provided in this news article: William Tyrrell's biological grandmother speaks out

IMO - there needs to be a Royal Commission into the Department of Families and Community Services operandi…for the serious physical and psychological Safety of Children….now and in the future…
I ask…how are their policies in the best interests of innocent children?

How can this happen in our modern day society…
1) Two Small children are ’removed‘ from their biological parents by Docs…(imagine being a small child taken away from your Mum and Dad, grandparents and extended family… all the people you ever knew and loved you....)
2) These Small children are ‘given” transported..arrive..or handed over..to a brand new family…strangers…foster parents..but with nice cars, big houses and all the things they may never have had….but these adults are not your Mum and Dad and they certainly don’t know you…what would that be like to a three year old?
3) Then after a while, one morning, one of those children disappears…whilst in the care of the foster parents…from a house in a quiet area.. in a cul-de-sac ..a three year old little boy disappears…into thin air….never to be found…..
4) Big searches happen…it’s in all the News…not a scent detected beyond the place he was last playing…the FFC was the last to see the little boy alive….the little boys last photo is delivered to the public nationally and internationally…peoples hearts break for WT..
5) Despite this little boy disappearing, the other child, the sister remains in the care of the same Foster Parents..what would that have been like for her?
6) The Foster Carers battle for anonymity, a privilege that biological parents of missing children no not have…why is that?..
7) Years later, despite the trauma and turmoil of the disappearance of WT, FACS/DOCs consider it Ok to place another child in the care of the same Foster Parents responsible for protecting WT at the time he disappeared..Despite WT never being found and the FFC suffering psychiatric Conditions (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and Depression) FACS allocate another Child to the same Foster Carers..
8) The outcomes of all of the above FACS policies are a Missing little Boy, a Biological family severely traumatised by the loss of thier children, a little girl kicked, hit and beaten with a wooden spoon by her Foster Carer/s, the FFC & MFC investigated for child assault and losing all three children from their care…and an ex disgraced cop remaining adamant the Foster Carers are ‘decent people’…

I apologise for this long post…but my heart breaks for William and his Sisters Family..those who loved him deeply..

And seriously..what ever happened to the Department of Child Protection? There needs to be a Royal Commission into the Foster Care/Adoption System in Australia..

exactly


The AUCTION charges against them just highlights again how entitled they are.

Above the law..... pattern regular behaviour for them.

MOO

 

[Couldbe]

exactly,

(my post was removed because of wording choice.)

The AUCTION charges against them just highlights again how entitled they are.

Above the law..... pattern regular behaviour for them.

MOO

JMO - I am sure there are divided opinions when ingesting information in the following Media article from November 2021:
Privileged life of William Tyrrell's foster mum haunted by final photo
“She wanted William to grow up being 'socially aware, a good contributor to society and is happy and is fulfilling ... doing the things he wants to do'.”

MOO - that in her assurance about what she had in mind for the 3 year old William, the FFC has tried to focus on what we, as a Society would want to hear (My Question: Why would this be of interest, when her facts about his disappearance were related in a hazy fashion?).... SO we can say that consequently, this assurance was another diversion away from what had happened to William ....

 

[sleepinoz]

Lia Harris

@LiaJHarris


A new episode of Where’s William Tyrrell? has just dropped, discussing all the recent developments. It will be my last episode as I’m leaving Channel 10. But rest assured I will still be following the case closely in my new role. #whereswilliam



podcasts.apple.com
‎Where's William Tyrrell?: A Theory Revealed on Apple Podcasts
‎Show Where's William Tyrrell?, Ep A Theory Revealed - 9 Nov 2022

 

[SouthAussie]

Lia Harris
@LiaJHarris


A new episode of Where’s William Tyrrell? has just dropped, discussing all the recent developments. It will be my last episode as I’m leaving Channel 10. But rest assured I will still be following the case closely in my new role. #whereswilliam

podcasts.apple.com
‎Where's William Tyrrell?: A Theory Revealed on Apple Podcasts
‎Show Where's William Tyrrell?, Ep A Theory Revealed - 9 Nov 2022

That's interesting. It seems that anyone who appears at the CC cannot be charged with what they reveal. It sounds as if they can only be charged with lying, if they have been found to lie about the matter for which they are appearing at the CC.

(Presumably, this doesn't apply to the hitting/kicking incident because it was not the matter for which FM was appearing - even though she was asked about it (sort of) at the CC hearing.)

 

[JBowie]

That's interesting. It seems that anyone who appears at the CC cannot be charged with what they reveal. It sounds as if they can only be charged with lying, if they have been found to lie about the matter for which they are appearing at the CC.

(Presumably, this doesn't apply to the hitting/kicking incident because it was not the matter for which FM was appearing - even though she was asked about it (sort of) at the CC hearing.)

... but there's a gotcha. See last paragraph here:

Can my answers at the NSW Crime Commission be used against me?​

In short, direct use is prohibited, but derivative use is not in specific circumstances. Section 35A(3) states that ‘evidence obtained pursuant to leave granted for the purposes of this section cannot be used against the person in any civil or criminal proceeding (other than a proceeding for an offence against this Act or an offence relating to the falsity of evidence given by the witness) or in any disciplinary proceeding, but is not inadmissible as against other persons.’

Derivative evidence is not admissible against you if it was derived from evidence following a grant of leave under section 35A.

[My emphasis] However, the rule against derivative evidence does not apply if that same evidence could have been obtained without your testimony at the Crime Commission.

What happens if I am summoned to attend the NSW Crime Commission? | NGM Lawyers

What happens if I’ve received a Summons to attend the NSW Crime Commission? Get sound advice from our criminal defence lawyers now.

ngm.com.au

 

[SouthAussie]

... but there's a gotcha. See last paragraph here:

Can my answers at the NSW Crime Commission be used against me?​

In short, direct use is prohibited, but derivative use is not in specific circumstances. Section 35A(3) states that ‘evidence obtained pursuant to leave granted for the purposes of this section cannot be used against the person in any civil or criminal proceeding (other than a proceeding for an offence against this Act or an offence relating to the falsity of evidence given by the witness) or in any disciplinary proceeding, but is not inadmissible as against other persons.’

Derivative evidence is not admissible against you if it was derived from evidence following a grant of leave under section 35A.

[My emphasis] However, the rule against derivative evidence does not apply if that same evidence could have been obtained without your testimony at the Crime Commission.

What happens if I am summoned to attend the NSW Crime Commission? | NGM Lawyers

What happens if I’ve received a Summons to attend the NSW Crime Commission? Get sound advice from our criminal defence lawyers now.

ngm.com.au

Yes. That could be why the police could charge her with hitting/kicking. Because they had derivative evidence from elsewhere.

 

[JBowie]

Lia Harris
@LiaJHarris


A new episode of Where’s William Tyrrell? has just dropped, discussing all the recent developments. It will be my last episode as I’m leaving Channel 10. But rest assured I will still be following the case closely in my new role. #whereswilliam

podcasts.apple.com
‎Where's William Tyrrell?: A Theory Revealed on Apple Podcasts
‎Show Where's William Tyrrell?, Ep A Theory Revealed - 9 Nov 2022

I have a real problem with Xanthe Mallet making ill-advised statements of fact about Crime Commission process when she is not a qualified legal practitioner.

 

[SouthAussie]

I see Lia Harris is moving to the ABC.


"Another established Ten newsroom reporter, crime writer and podcaster Lia Harris, has taken up a gig at the ABC.

Harris produced the award-winning 'Where's William Tyrrell?' podcast three years ago which uncovered new information about the child's baffling disappearance.

The podcast was even subpoenaed by the NSW coroner as part of its investigation into the boy's case."

Exodus at Network Ten continues as morale hits 'new low'

Several senior staff have joined the exodus at Ten with a number of high profile names following Carrie Bickmore out the door of the embattled network.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Doesitmakesense]

I see Lia Harris is moving to the ABC.


"Another established Ten newsroom reporter, crime writer and podcaster Lia Harris, has taken up a gig at the ABC.

Harris produced the award-winning 'Where's William Tyrrell?' podcast three years ago which uncovered new information about the child's baffling disappearance.

The podcast was even subpoenaed by the NSW coroner as part of its investigation into the boy's case."

Exodus at Network Ten continues as morale hits 'new low'

Several senior staff have joined the exodus at Ten with a number of high profile names following Carrie Bickmore out the door of the embattled network.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Do we know what the new info from the podcast is?

 

[drsleuth]

https://twitter.com/LiaJHarris
Lia Harris

@LiaJHarris


Personal news: today is my last day at Channel 10. It’s been a privilege to work alongside some great people, but it’s time for the next chapter. I’ll be taking over the ABC News Sydney crime round from my dear friend
@ReddieNews
, who’s left very big (and stylish) shoes to fill.

 

[sleepinoz]

I have a real problem with Xanthe Mallet making ill-advised statements of fact about Crime Commission process when she is not a qualified legal practitioner.

I understand that she is not a "qualified legal practitioner" but I assume she would have a whole lot more knowledge than the rest of us laymen, given her actual qualifications.

"Another area of focus is understanding and combatting bias within legal proceedings, with Xanthé investigating cases she believes to be unjust."

Associate Professor Xanthe Mallett / Staff Profile / The University of Newcastle, Australia

www.newcastle.edu.au

 

[sleepinoz]

Do we know what the new info from the podcast is?

Have you listened? No new info, but a very interesting explanation of the last few weeks court proceedings and occurrences.

 

[JBowie]

I understand that she is not a "qualified legal practitioner" but I assume she would have a whole lot more knowledge than the rest of us laymen, given her actual qualifications.

In post 832, I quoted actual lawyers regarding process as regards answers at the NSW Crime Commission being used against the witness.

Most qualified people are sensible enough not to make statements in the media on subjects outside of their field, especially when the subject is legal process.

 

[sleepinoz]

Speaking of Legal aspects, and Political aspects. After all he was in charge when the decision was made to make FFC their sole POI. Maybe an outgoing try to solve it??????

Investigation into former police commissioner reopened after oversight body disputes decision to clear him of misconduct

The New South Wales law enforcement watchdog has reopened its investigation into former police commissioner Mick Fuller, after its own oversight body disputed findings clearing him of misconduct over undeclared racehorse shares.

www.abc.net.au

 

[sleepinoz]

In post 832, I quoted actual lawyers regarding process as regards answers at the NSW Crime Commission being used against the witness.

Most qualified people are sensible enough not to make statements in the media on subjects outside of their field, especially when the subject is legal process.

May I ask, what qualifications do you have to determine what "most qualified people" would be sensible enough to state? Or is that just your opinion?

 

[SouthAussie]

I have a real problem with Xanthe Mallet making ill-advised statements of fact about Crime Commission process when she is not a qualified legal practitioner.

I didn't hear anyone legal say Xanthe's statements were ill-advised. But, regardless, I think many of us can see the paradox.

On the one hand the prosecutor conceded (I think it is at 19:30ish in the podcast) that FM is of good character and has no criminal convictions ..
and the investigator(s) says FM didn't harm William but she did dispose of him.

And on the other hand, the investigator(s) are saying that her assault charges are tendency evidence in the disappearance of William. Tendency evidence of harm.

(And that is not even considering that their supposed tendency evidence happened 7 years after William's disappearance and all the accompanying trauma of that, so how could it reliably show any tendency prior to or during William's disappearance - in a court of law? I think any good defence barrister could likely attack that tendency evidence with success. imo)

imo

 

[SLouTh]

Stratton SC (FM Barrister) is actually a bit of an expert in “tendency evidence” … He first delivered a paper on it in 2008.

The Public Defenders Home

Homepage and welcome to the Public Defenders website. Public Defenders are salaried barristers independent of the government who appear in serious criminal matters for clients who have been granted legal aid.

www.publicdefenders.nsw.gov.au

IMO

 

[LolaAngelina]

I didn't hear anyone legal say Xanthe's statements were ill-advised. But, regardless, I think many of us can see the paradox.

On the one hand the prosecutor conceded (I think it is at 19:30ish in the podcast) that FM is of good character and has no criminal convictions ..
and the investigator(s) says FM didn't harm William but she did dispose of him.

And on the other hand, the investigator(s) are saying that her assault charges are tendency evidence in the disappearance of William. Tendency evidence of harm.

(And that is not even considering that their supposed tendency evidence happened 7 years after William's disappearance and all the accompanying trauma of that, so how could it reliably show any tendency prior to or during William's disappearance - in a court of law? I think any good defence barrister could likely attack that tendency evidence with success. imo)

imo

Wasn’t that a great point they made? The police said their reason for questioning FM about the assault during the CC was because it showed “tendency”. So a tendency for violence or abuse towards a child, yet they then say that they don’t believe FM actually harmed William just disposed of him.