Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #48

[they'll get you]

The sad thing is that he told 12 different people about it, but not one of them went to the police. Maybe he has a strong personality and told them not to? I just can't figure it out.
It took a 3rd party who had heard it through the grapevine to go to the police.


The message somehow wasn’t passed on, but The Australian understands Mr Chapman told 12 other people, including his five sisters, what he had seen, and word did eventually make its way to police, who talked to him in 2015 and 2016 before taking a formal statement in April 2017.

NoCookies | The Australian
Shock Tyrrell evidence: ‘I saw William in car’
August 29, 2019

If you were one of those people who heard that from a fair dinkum bloke who you believed you’d encourage him to, at least call the cops.

If you were one of those people who heard that from a known foolish liar then you’d take him with a grain of salt and promptly forget it.

It makes you wonder why not all of 12 did nothing.

 

[sosocurious]

The sad thing is that he told 12 different people about it, but not one of them went to the police. Maybe he has a strong personality and told them not to? I just can't figure it out.
It took a 3rd party who had heard it through the grapevine to go to the police.


The message somehow wasn’t passed on, but The Australian understands Mr Chapman told 12 other people, including his five sisters, what he had seen, and word did eventually make its way to police, who talked to him in 2015 and 2016 before taking a formal statement in April 2017.

NoCookies | The Australian
Shock Tyrrell evidence: ‘I saw William in car’
August 29, 2019

Do his sister live in the area?
Wonder if any of the sisters are older than he?

 

[SouthAussie]

Do his sister live in the area?
Wonder if any of the sisters are older than he?

Sounds as if the sisters wanted him to tell the police, but still he didn't pick up the phone (nor did they, nor did the 7 other people that he told besides them).


The retiree did not tell police about what he saw because he had heard on the news that officers would be doorknocking all residents within a one-kilometre range of the Benaroon Drive address from which William disappeared.

When that did not happen, he said, his sisters encouraged him to report what he had seen to police.

'I recognised the boy': neighbour saw William being driven away, inquest told

 

[SouthAussie]

Any idea at what time ps saw the cars the day before ? Did he say

No, the article just said that he said he saw the cars on the Wednesday - and William disappeared on the Friday.
Maybe it was in the morning as he came back up Benaroon on his morning walk, but that would just be a big guess.

 

[Cleaver Greene]

And yet surely the topics are carefully planned. They don't just put up the witness, make small talk, and hope something useful comes out.

The questions are all carefully planned. An inquest isn’t “adversarial” like a trial, so cross examination isn’t as aggressive as a trial. Questions are generally directed towards clarifying and looking for possible further avenues of investigating. Lawyers in an inquest don’t try to unsettle a witness so that the witness will start agreeing with whatever they are asked, as sometimes occurs in a trial. The Coroner wants the truth. In a criminal trial, defence lawyers want their clients acquitted. It’s a totally different approach.

The reason a lot of questions seem random and irrelevant are because the parties have a lot of information the public doesn’t have access to, so the questions would be directed to discreet areas of the evidence that needs clarification.

 

[SouthAussie]

I wonder why they seemed to keep looking for the reason why Mr Chapman delayed for so long in speaking with the police, waited for someone else to tell the police. With none of the 12 people he told telling the police either.

Do they suspect that he thinks he knows who took William? That he was concealing his knowledge until he could conceal it no longer? They are all afraid of the person Mr Chapman might have thought took William?

 

[JLZ]

Sounds as if the sisters wanted him to tell the police, but still he didn't pick up the phone (nor did they, nor did the 7 other people that he told besides them).


The retiree did not tell police about what he saw because he had heard on the news that officers would be doorknocking all residents within a one-kilometre range of the Benaroon Drive address from which William disappeared.

When that did not happen, he said, his sisters encouraged him to report what he had seen to police.

'I recognised the boy': neighbour saw William being driven away, inquest told

If the sisters told him to tell the police, that doesn't necessarily mean they believed him. It could mean they don't believe it and they're sick of hearing about it.

 

[stormbird]

I know he looked at the clock. But if it was a clock with hands, 10:45 looks similar to 9:50, especially if the two hands are not very much different in length. Now you wouldn't mistake say 9:00 with 11:45 although they look similar, because you know whether it's about midday as opposed to early/mid-morning. But I think it's possible to mistake 9:50 for 10:45: both mid-morning.

Following on from JLZ's question about the time on the clock:
- Did Mr C need glasses for distance viewing? If so, was he wearing them? (I wish that had been reported about every witness, and their hearing abilities/aids as well.)
- He walked from a sunny room at the back (northern) end of the house through the middle of the house, where it would be darker. How quickly could his eyes adjust to read the clock?
- I saw an NBN News report which played part of the walk-through video, and (in my memory, at least) as Mr C walks through the house he says he'd noticed it was "quarter to eleven". That's not the same thing as "10:45". Maybe he was rounding the time to the nearest five minutes or etc, and if he was making some sort of mental adjustment on the run it might be easier to mistake where the hour hands were.
My device won't load the video file now, so I can't check it, but here's the report:

"Kendall local recalls seeing toddler in back of car", NBN News, 28 August 2019

- One other thing I wonder about: where did Mr C park his car? Where did his visitors park theirs (if they had one)? On the Google Maps street and satellite views, there doesn't appear to be a driveway into his house from Laurel St, and no garage or carport that I can see either. If any vehicle was parked at the front of his house (on Laurel St) the 4WD would likely have hit it, and also Mr C's view of the road would have been partly obscurred.

 

[deugirtni]

Following on from JLZ's question about the time on the clock:
- Did Mr C need glasses for distance viewing? If so, was he wearing them? (I wish that had been reported about every witness, and their hearing abilities/aids as well.)
- He walked from a sunny room at the back (northern) end of the house through the middle of the house, where it would be darker. How quickly could his eyes adjust to read the clock?
- I saw an NBN News report which played part of the walk-through video, and (in my memory, at least) as Mr C walks through the house he says he'd noticed it was "quarter to eleven". That's not the same thing as "10:45". Maybe he was rounding the time to the nearest five minutes or etc, and if he was making some sort of mental adjustment on the run it might be easier to mistake where the hour hands were.
My device won't load the video file now, so I can't check it, but here's the report:

"Kendall local recalls seeing toddler in back of car", NBN News, 28 August 2019

- One other thing I wonder about: where did Mr C park his car? Where did his visitors park theirs (if they had one)? On the Google Maps street and satellite views, there doesn't appear to be a driveway into his house from Laurel St, and no garage or carport that I can see either. If any vehicle was parked at the front of his house (on Laurel St) the 4WD would likely have hit it, and also Mr C's view of the road would have been partly obscurred.

Good points about the eye-glasses and the differing light.. but how do you figure 10:45 and 'quarter to eleven' are not the same thing? Maybe it is a translation issue, but that is common for people to say 'quarter to eleven' instead of '10:45' - they are one and the same.

What's The Time? - English Grammar | English4u

 

[JLZ]

- One other thing I wonder about: where did Mr C park his car? Where did his visitors park theirs (if they had one)? On the Google Maps street and satellite views, there doesn't appear to be a driveway into his house from Laurel St, and no garage or carport that I can see either. If any vehicle was parked at the front of his house (on Laurel St) the 4WD would likely have hit it, and also Mr C's view of the road would have been partly obscurred.

(snipped)

(Sixmaps)
Chapman may have had an arrangement with the east-side neighbour to park alongside his own house in front of theirs which is set well back. It's possible there was vehicle access to his block from Steinmetz Lane as with some of the other houses though it doesn't look like it from Google Maps streetview. The block to the west was built on at some time between 2010 and 2018.

 

[they'll get you]

Following on from JLZ's question about the time on the clock:
- Did Mr C need glasses for distance viewing? If so, was he wearing them? (I wish that had been reported about every witness, and their hearing abilities/aids as well.)
- He walked from a sunny room at the back (northern) end of the house through the middle of the house, where it would be darker. How quickly could his eyes adjust to read the clock?
- I saw an NBN News report which played part of the walk-through video, and (in my memory, at least) as Mr C walks through the house he says he'd noticed it was "quarter to eleven". That's not the same thing as "10:45". Maybe he was rounding the time to the nearest five minutes or etc, and if he was making some sort of mental adjustment on the run it might be easier to mistake where the hour hands were.
My device won't load the video file now, so I can't check it, but here's the report:

"Kendall local recalls seeing toddler in back of car", NBN News, 28 August 2019

- One other thing I wonder about: where did Mr C park his car? Where did his visitors park theirs (if they had one)? On the Google Maps street and satellite views, there doesn't appear to be a driveway into his house from Laurel St, and no garage or carport that I can see either. If any vehicle was parked at the front of his house (on Laurel St) the 4WD would likely have hit it, and also Mr C's view of the road would have been partly obscurred.

he says he'd noticed it was "quarter to eleven". That's not the same thing as "10:45".

Am I not understanding this?

I did a bit of research on 30 Laurel and I see what you are saying about no driveway considering he said he had a car and licence at the time.

There is a laneway (Steinmetz Lane) behind his property but still no gate or driveway in the picket fence that I can see.

Also interesting on Instant Google maps, although taken in 2018 (I couldn’t upload screenshot) there appears tyre marks on the bend of Bartar and Laurel which makes me wonder if it’s a common event that that bend is taken quickly. I see also the neighbour parks off the road on his lawn so he’s away from the road.

For the heck I did a Google walk from Steinmetz Lane behind his property and around to Bartar and his property is very interesting to say the least. The maps were done before the new house was built next door.

 

[stormbird]

Good points about the eye-glasses and the differing light.. but how do you figure 10:45 and 'quarter to eleven' are not the same thing? Maybe it is a translation issue, but that is common for people to say 'quarter to eleven' instead of '10:45' - they are one and the same.
View attachment 207854
What's The Time? - English Grammar | English4u

You're right, they could be referring to the same time, but if Mr C was rounding the time (say to the nearest five minutes) he might have said "quarter to eleven" even if it was 10:43 or 10:47. If he was rounding to the nearest quarter hour, it could have been anywhere from 10:37 to 10:53, or thereabouts... My point being that "quarter to eleven" is not necessarily specific, whereas "10:45" is. And then, say he was reporting a rounded approximation instead of a specific time, then what he is reporting is an interpretation - which leaves more room for him to get it wrong, IMO.

 

[SouthAussie]

(snipped)

View attachment 207855
(Sixmaps)
Chapman may have had an arrangement with the east-side neighbour to park alongside his own house in front of theirs which is set well back. It's possible there was vehicle access to his block from Steinmetz Lane as with some of the other houses though it doesn't look like it from Google Maps streetview. The block to the west was built on at some time between 2010 and 2018.

Google Earth shows the house on the west side not being there on 11/5/16 and then it is there on 17/9/16.

Going back through the dates available in 2011, 2013, 2014, 2016, 2019, there is always that white car parked near the back of his place on the east side of his house - though the types of cars in the driveway of the east side property change throughout the dates.

I think you may be right that they share the driveway, and the white car is likely his.

Also, no access via Steinmetz Lane. A very overgrown block behind his filled with trees, fenced with no open vehicle access.

 

[they'll get you]

(snipped)

View attachment 207855
(Sixmaps)
Chapman may have had an arrangement with the east-side neighbour to park alongside his own house in front of theirs which is set well back. It's possible there was vehicle access to his block from Steinmetz Lane as with some of the other houses though it doesn't look like it from Google Maps streetview. The block to the west was built on at some time between 2010 and 2018.

Oh wow six maps is more comprehensive than Google maps!

 

[they'll get you]

Google Earth shows the house on the west side not being there on 11/5/16 and then it is there on 17/9/16.

Going back through the dates available in 2011, 2013, 2014, 2016, 2019, there is always that white car parked near the back of his place on the east side of his house - though the types of cars in the driveway of the east side property change throughout the dates.

I think you may be right that they share the driveway, and the white car is likely his.

Also, no access via Steinmetz Lane. A very overgrown block behind his filled with trees, fenced with no open vehicle access.

No. 32 vacant block was sold 9th Sept. ‘15
32 Laurel Street, Kendall, NSW 2439

Anyone else notice no interior shots exist now on the real estate pages?

 

[they'll get you]

(snipped)

View attachment 207855
(Sixmaps)
Chapman may have had an arrangement with the east-side neighbour to park alongside his own house in front of theirs which is set well back. It's possible there was vehicle access to his block from Steinmetz Lane as with some of the other houses though it doesn't look like it from Google Maps streetview. The block to the west was built on at some time between 2010 and 2018.

Sixmaps show a gateway on Steinmetz Lane where I did a Google walk along the back fence and there is no gate.

 

[SouthAussie]

Sixmaps show a gateway on Steinmetz Lane where I did a Google walk along the back fence and there is no gate.

Not wide enough for a car, though. I noticed that, too.
I think he may even own the piece of land where his car sits, and right up to the driveway. It looks like the house on the east side of his is built back on a block off the laneway.
Both houses might have right of way for that driveway, seeing that Mr Chapman has a deep roadside culvert where a driveway otherwise could have been built.

When you zoom in close, where the white car sits is on a gravelled little turn off.

 

[they'll get you]

Not wide enough for a car, though. I noticed that, too.
I think he may even own the piece of land where his car sits, and right up to the driveway. It looks like the house on the east side of his is built back on the laneway. Both houses might have right of way for that driveway, seeing as Mr Chapman has a deep culvert roadside where a driveway otherwise could have been built.

SA did you see the tyre rubber on the road on the corner of Bartar and Laurel? It looks like many take that corner fast enough to leave rubber.

Instant Google 2018.

 

[SouthAussie]

SA did you see the tyre rubber on the road on the corner of Bartar and Laurel? It looks like many take that corner fast enough to leave rubber.

Instant Google 2018.

Yes. I wouldn't want to be parking in front of his house. Instant car wipe out, if you ask me.
He is probably afraid that they'll come through the front of his house one day.

 

[deugirtni]

You're right, they could be referring to the same time, but if Mr C was rounding the time (say to the nearest five minutes) he might have said "quarter to eleven" even if it was 10:43 or 10:47. If he was rounding to the nearest quarter hour, it could have been anywhere from 10:37 to 10:53, or thereabouts... My point being that "quarter to eleven" is not necessarily specific, whereas "10:45" is. And then, say he was reporting a rounded approximation instead of a specific time, then what he is reporting is an interpretation - which leaves more room for him to get it wrong, IMO.

He did state 10:45 during his sworn testimony at the inquest though.

Aug 28th:
Lia Harris@LiaJHarris·
Mr Chapman told the court he thought he heard the “postie” deliver something in the mail box, so he went outside. As he walked through the house he noticed the clock said it was 10.45am. @10NewsFirst @10Daily