AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #17

[not_my_kids]

We really need that sub-forum, so that we can split these issues up. Such as poster efforts, search efforts, photos, maps, blame CPS...
So, in response to Tricia's long ago post that they are looking for a mini mod and we need to consider if we really need the subforum, my answer is yes, yes, yes, please, dear admin, we need that forum.
It would keep us from trying to lynch each other on the thread, lol.

 

[OneLove]

Actually, EJ did have her rights terminated. LM got full custody. EJ kidnapped him. It happens all the time, parents who don't have custody kidnapping their child.

I believe that having full custody does not mean the other parent's parental rights are terminated.

A person having full custody cannot legally give a child up for adoption without the noncustodial parent giving up their parental rights also.

 

[TXHOPE]

Any takers TS will be on NG tonight?

I wish NG would stop kissing her B--T and ask the real questions! I think she wants TS to continue to come on her show so she's careful with her. Funny how she can beat up Marc Klaas, a crime victim, but can't question TS on anything..

 

[Gin]

We really need that sub-forum, so that we can split these issues up. Such as poster efforts, search efforts, photos, maps, blame CPS...
So, in response to Tricia's long ago post that they are looking for a mini mod and we need to consider if we really need the subforum, my answer is yes, yes, yes, please, dear admin, we need that forum.
It would keep us from trying to lynch each other on the thread, lol.

You're spot on. And maybe it's time for a group hug.:hug:

 

[dini1976]

D'oh! they are all private now..... Gabe's were gone! I checked and double checked to make sure i was seeing what i was seeing.

 

[Ives]

So no case of destruction is ever prosecuted unless LE is right there watching the activity??

there is plenty of proof what she did..she was put in an anger management class....I feel she should have been kept away from Gabriel right then and there

I have posted "proof" of her violence, her negligence and more right from the start..I think she was an unfit mother from the start and I blame everyone who allowed her access to this poor baby knowing "what" and "who" she was

Here in TX, A long time ago, LOL, My childrens father(not my current husband) had tore up my house, broke TV's and everything. Police could do nothing. I asked "so you mean to tell me, I can tear up anything in this house, and since it is Ours, you can't do anything??"

The answer was, no. Police cannot arrest you for tearing up your own stuff. You can break whatever you want, as long as the house is not on fire. there is nothing we can do. This was about 7 yrs ago. not sure how it works elsewhere. But if the police can't do anything than what can cps do?

I know, they should. but legally??

 

[not_my_kids]

I believe that having full custody does not mean the other parent's parental rights are terminated.

A person having full custody cannot legally give a child up for adoption without the noncustodial parent giving up their parental rights also.

Yes, there is physical custody, legal custody, and termination of rights.
Terminating rights requires a seperate hearing, which has not occurred in EJ's case.
The court case that she missed, released her of physical and legal custody of Gabriel, however left her rights intact, meaning that she would have been responsible for things such as child support, even though she did not have custody.
Her rights are, sadly, still intact, even now.

 

[jessicat]

Any takers TS will be on NG tonight?

uke:

 

[OneLove]

Doubt it. Her record came out and that shamed her. Her image is gone, she will hide now.

LOL, yea, you would think, wouldn't you?

But then after her public disclaimers that she didn't know EJ put Craig Cherry's name on those papers were disproven, she STILL went on national media.

Personally, I think she HAS NO SHAME.

(no sense of propriety, small intestine meridian issues, maybe from veeery serious blockages in colon meridian, muhahaha)

 

[Gin]

D'oh! they are all private now..... Gabe's were gone! I checked and double checked to make sure i was seeing what i was seeing.

I'm not on FB, so any and all updates help. As I've said before, it's pretty odd that TS was so happy to be posting on FB, having long interviews/discussions WHILE she was named a POI. That little designation would alarm most folks, and they would seriously want to keep their mouths shut.
What is it that has changed for TS that she is starting to curb her behavior? Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[LogicalMinds]

Yes....I think a forum for Gabe would be good

I personally don't feel that facebook, online candles and such helps anything much..if it "works" for you, fine

I have helped a few people create memorial pages for loved ones, and they can post poems and prayers and light candles and I am happy to help..but honestly I don't like to wade thru page after page of that here...if there was a "thread" for that I would stay out of it, and vice versa JMO

I have found a "new to me" place to post about "action" ideas..and I hope more people will join me there....[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=102"]A CALL TO ACTION! Take 3 minutes to change how we find the missing. - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

I started a thread there about my observation that sooooo many of these sad cases involving kids are kids that already "in the system"...ie court cases, social services, and parents criminal records

also there is good info there on Klaaskids and Truckers Network idea

something like that might have been a big help IN the early days when this case was not getting national attention when Elizabeth was moving around the country with Gabe in her clutches

 

[Salem]

Ya know, I serisouly wonder if Tammi told EJ to take the fall for this or something would happen to Gabe.

OK OK OK I know that she(EJ) didn't have much MOTHERING in her but even if she cared for this child even a LITTLE teeny tiny bit. And she DID want something "better" for him. When Logan refused to sign the papers and the Smiths knew all bets were off I wonder if Tammi said listen you either do this or you and the baby pay. Now that EJ knows the heat is on Tammi and I am sure she knows the cops are watching her and her house/family CLOSE EJ feels that it is OK to let the cat out of the bag without any repercussions from Tammi.

I'm kinda thinking TS said something like "ok, LM won't sign, here's what we do. While you still have custody, you need to change your jurisdiction, so go to Texas. I will get you some support" - BUT you can't ever tell. It won't be kidnapping cuz you still have custody. Now that everything has blown up in their faces and it appears EJ might be facing murder charges and TS could be implicated, TS is probably saying something like - keep your mouth shut or this is going to be really bad for you and there is NO NEED to tell where Gabe is because you are going to do 20 years regardless of whether or not Gabe is recovered.

All speculation on my part of course - but TS is the one that brought up "changing jurisdictions." And for the life of me, I can not understand any attorney that would tell EJ she is going to do 20 years, no matter what. In a family law case, 20 years is almost unheard of and if EJ were to help LE locate Gabe, I don't see any way in he?? she would do much time at all. Maybe required to do 6 months and get some counseling and not be around the baby. However, the longer this goes on, the more severe the consequences.

TS is NOT helping matters and I think, as a POI, she should be forbidden from talking to EJ. I think EJ may still trust her (although that seems to be falling apart, thank goodness) and TS continues to feed EJ nonsense!

All of this is just my opinion - nothing more.

Salem

 

[jjokelly1968]

Looks like she made all her photos private - deleted some - and then made them public again.

 

[captdj]

Getting back on topic! Let's get these posters out for Gabriel!

We also need people to post the smaller jpg poster on Craigslist in these cities, and in forums etc.

Updated

#1 City needing posters: San Antonio, TX

Other cities needing posters:

AR - Fort Smith

AZ - Cave Creek, Payson, Chandler, Glendale, Peoria, Phoenix, Scottsdale, Sun City West, Surprise, Tortilla Flat, Yuma

FL - Bokeelia, Fort Lauderdale, Miami, Miami Beach, Tallahassee

IL - Collinsville

LA - Arabi, Chalmette, Meraux

MA - Boston

MS - Pass Christian

NC - Charlotte

NM - Albuquerque

TN - Antioch, Brentwood, Chattanooga, Goodlettsville, Hendersonville, Hermitage, Lebanon, Madison, Mount Juliet, Murfreesboro, Nashville, Old Hickory

TX - Cuero, Curio, Dalhart, Lufkin, South Padre Island, Van Horn, Victoria, Waco

WA - Battle Ground


Gabriel's family has a new poster they prepared, that they ask people to use.

The file is available in different sizes and formats for both printing or posting online:

It's available as a PDF file on docstoc here:
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/23304781/Gabe

It's also available on the family's Bring Home Gabriel Facebook. No Facebook account is necessary to access it.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?p...al&view=global&subj=251236072296&id=506740741

It's available in photobucket here:
http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac272/rmorgan2379/GabeMissingPosterVigil.jpg

Bean
Is Logan going to San Antonio alone to search? Did he find help? If he is alone.... maybe some here from San Antonio might be able to assist him...
I know I would if I wasnt 3 states away....But heck If he needs help I might can arrange it anyways
If flyers are need in lower coastal Alabama let me know and I will place them around my area also....

 

[LogicalMinds]

Oh...and back to "speculation">>> I keep feeling as if Elizabeth and Logan and Gabe lived in a "bubble"...

no friends, neighbors, no other former babysitters are chiming in....usually they turn up in most cases??? any ideas on that?? thanks

 

[dini1976]

Bean
Is Logan going to San Antonio alone to search? Did he find help? If he is alone.... maybe some here from San Antonio might be able to assist him...
I know I would if I wasnt 3 states away....But heck If he needs help I might can arrange it anyways
If flyers are need in lower coastal Alabama let me know and I will place them around my area also....

OH! that's a great idea. There are few on here that are in the area, right?

 

[not_my_kids]

If it works for us we'll do it, sorry if you don't like to see it, Logical Minds. But we have to deal with things that we don't like to see, and it doesn't lead us to attempt to inspire hopelessness in those that say things we don't like.
We sit quietly until we see something that we can post on legitimately.

AS to the bubble, yes, I think they lived in one. Not so much Logan, he seems to have lots of family and friends. EJ was likely too jealous and crazy acting to have many friends. Or she's like me and simply can't get along with people her own age.

 

[BeanE]

Here in TX, A long time ago, LOL, My childrens father(not my current husband) had tore up my house, broke TV's and everything. Police could do nothing. I asked "so you mean to tell me, I can tear up anything in this house, and since it is Ours, you can't do anything??"

The answer was, no. Police cannot arrest you for tearing up your own stuff. You can break whatever you want, as long as the house is not on fire. there is nothing we can do. This was about 7 yrs ago. not sure how it works elsewhere. But if the police can't do anything than what can cps do?

I know, they should. but legally??

The person can be Baker Acted for at least 72 hours, but I know of a number of situations where LE didn't even mention it to the family/spouse/significant other.

When people are violent and out of control, they need to be confined - jailed or hospitalized - so they don't hurt the people around them.

 

[NewMommy09]

Snipped for space:
Feel free to help, but please do not try to discourage us. The old, "I'll do my thing, you do yours." We can agree to disagree, but remember, the main keywords for all of WS are Victim Friendly, and there are alot of family of Gabriel and Logan that visit this thread, and I feel it is good for them to see hope and positive belief until that is no longer possible.

AMEN!!! Even if Gabriel is not found safe, I will not feel my efforts were pointless, because I will know that at the very least, I brought some hope to his family, I will know that they felt the compassion of myself and others. God forbid that I were in their position ever, I would certainly hope and pray that there would be people doing all they could to help me, no effort would be too small.

 

[Ives]

Bean
Is Logan going to San Antonio alone to search? Did he find help? If he is alone.... maybe some here from San Antonio might be able to assist him...
I know I would if I wasnt 3 states away....But heck If he needs help I might can arrange it anyways
If flyers are need in lower coastal Alabama let me know and I will place them around my area also....

I would love to help him, but I think he is more interested in the other side of town. But if he needs anything, on the southside, then that is where I am located.