AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #11

[LisaB]

bbm, I agree with this. IF it was him, and he was already johnny-on-the-spot that early in the morning right after she was discovered missing, then she would already be gone.

I keep coming back to his early arrival at the scene.

At that time, there was nobody questioning him, he was not a suspect in any way. He and Sergio and the boys seem to have split up to cover more ground (i.e. the child going to the store alone and asking the clerk if Isa had been there). He could have strategically arranged to search the area she was actually in at that time and declared it "clear". Then later he could move her again (assuming he had not initially placed her in one of the commercial dumpsters that were emptied Saturday). He could EASILY have steered the search away from where the "clues" would be found... may have made it a point to handle the screen when it was found outside and to monkey with the window to explain any fingerprints he'd left... IMO MOO JMO

 

[Patty G]

I remember this. What do you need?

I was looking for the property records for the 1 & 1/2 story house to see what there square footage is etc.

I found it.

The house across the street is 5601; Celis 5602

The County Assessor records for 5601 is actually for 5602.

Is this what you recall?

 

[liz b.]

I can't imagine the parents, after having seen all of their media input, weighing a debt in one hand and their beloved daughter in the other hand having purposefully chosen to sacrifice their daughter for the debt.

Never mind mortgages. Let's talk about drug debts. I believe, in this family, the parents would expose themselves to their core family, group together and pay up.

I think ethnicity does have a play here. (Please I am not "profiling." I have personal experience; Mexican daughter-in-law and 4 grands.) God, family, work. They're beautiful! This family would, imo, group together to solve this problem before they would ever sacrifice a family member (let alone an innocent child) no matter how much it cost them. . . and everyone in this culture knows this.

Nope, can't buy into money owed as the motive. Just plain isn't logical to me.

IDK about any money owed being a motive.But I do believe that no group of people is all the same. Some good.Some not so much..... JMO

 

[Patty G]

Perhaps one of our locals can check with Pima County to see if the Property Records on file are accurate. :crazy:

 

[Prof]

I keep coming back to his early arrival at the scene.

At that time, there was nobody questioning him, he was not a suspect in any way. He and Sergio and the boys seem to have split up to cover more ground (i.e. the child going to the store alone and asking the clerk if Isa had been there). He could have strategically arranged to search the area she was actually in at that time and declared it "clear". Then later he could move her again (assuming he had not initially placed her in one of the commercial dumpsters that were emptied Saturday). He could EASILY have steered the search away from where the "clues" would be found... may have made it a point to handle the screen when it was found outside and to monkey with the window to explain any fingerprints he'd left... IMO MOO JMO

I am not pointing at anyone, but this seems to be another reason many are posting about JM and thinking he's hinky.
Is JM knocking on doors a known item?
I would like to know how
we know that it was JM arriving early at the scene?

As far as I recall, the neighbor said the policeman said the uncle is the one knocking on her door.

Did she name the uncle by name? Did she give a description of what she looked like?

For example, could Sergio have one or more brothers who live just down the street with his parents? They would actually be uncles.

My question is how exactly are we linking JM with the uncle knocking on the door?

Yes, we see JM much later in the day being interviewed by local news. Yes, he does say he came over as soon as he heard, but we do not know what time that was, do we? Does he say he was knocking on doors?

Maybe it's too early for me and I need more coffee lol

Anyone?

 

[Taminator]

It's possible that LE has cleared the family, but don't want the perp to know that. As long as the perp thinks no one is being ruled out, that person goes on with their life until they either can't hold back the urge to commit another crime or they let things slip that, unless you are close to the case, you can't possibly know.

Are we allowed to discuss a particular FB friend of JM? Probably not, but just thought I'd ask....

 

[Boodles]

or they are not telling the truth and protecting someone? With that said, I don't think a parent would lie for anyone when it comes to their missing child unless it is another child who may have gotten themselves in a lot of trouble or there is a reason like a death threat. Not saying that is the case but I can't see no reason why a parent would cover up for an uncle, cousin or extended family.

IMO

What puzzles me is how the uncle/cousin got there from wherever he supposedly was Friday night by 8:05am Sat. Isn't that supposedly when he was knocking on the neighbor's door? *

Instead, I suspect it was a busy night at the Celis house. I think uncle/cousin arrived sometime in the night to 'help' with things.

 

[Prof]

I was looking for the property records for the 1 & 1/2 story house to see what there square footage is etc.

I found it.

The house across the street is 5601; Celis 5602

The County Assessor records for 5601 is actually for 5602.

Is this what you recall?

Yes, that's what I remember. Do you want me to find that original post/poster?

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Re: floor plan. The central part of the house (probably a great room or family room) appears to have a high ceiling, so that might be the reason that some see it as a story and a half or two-story home. From the street, our house looks like a two-story because we have a cathedral ceiling in our great room and a vaulted ceiling in the master bedroom, but it is ranch - all living space on one floor.

Happy Cinco de Mayo! arty:

 

[Prof]

It's possible that LE has cleared the family, but don't want the perp to know that. As long as the perp thinks no one is being ruled out, that person goes on with their life until they either can't hold back the urge to commit another crime or they let things slip that, unless you are close to the case, you can't possibly know.

Are we allowed to discuss a particular FB friend of JM? Probably not, but just thought I'd ask....

Nope, not unless the person has been named a POI by LE .
I agree with your first point!

 

[LisaB]

Do some posters think the parents were lying about there being no other person except for the parents and children at the home that night?

They would have to be lying about that, and they would have to be lying throughout the interview it would seem. Why would they cover that fact up?

The neighbor said that someone came to her door looking for Isa at 8am. She was later told by LE that he was Isa's uncle. Sleuths have determined he is a cousin by marriage. Regardless, the 911 call had not even been made yet at that time. Rebecca had not yet returned from work. IOW, he was there within minutes of Sergio discovering Isa missing. Some have speculated that he stayed over, possibly in the car from which blankets and pillows were seized. It is also rumored that he lived with the family at some point during 2011.

 

[joedotnet]

I am not pointing at anyone, but this seems to be another reason many are posting about JM and thinking he's hinky.

Is JM knocking on doors a known item?

I would like to know how

we know that it was JM arriving early at the scene?



As far as I recall, the neighbor said the policeman said the uncle is the one knocking on her door.



Did she name the uncle by name? Did she give a description of what she looked like?



For example, could Sergio have one or more brothers who live just down the street with his parents? They would actually be uncles.



My question is how exactly are we linking JM with the uncle knocking on the door?



Yes, we see JM much later in the day being interviewed by local news. Yes, he does say he came over as soon as he heard, but we do not know what time that was, do we? Does he say he was knocking on doors?



Maybe it's too early for me and I need more coffee lol



Anyone?

I have asked a media source to try and verify this for us...he said he would ask. To me, it is a great question...and when JVM asked the real uncle and he said he had no information...i think that raised the old hinky meter.

Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I am not pointing at anyone, but this seems to be another reason many are posting about JM and thinking he's hinky.
Is JM knocking on doors a known item?
I would like to know how
we know that it was JM arriving early at the scene?

As far as I recall, the neighbor said the policeman said the uncle is the one knocking on her door.

Did she name the uncle by name? Did she give a description of what she looked like?

For example, could Sergio have one or more brothers who live just down the street with his parents? They would actually be uncles.

My question is how exactly are we linking JM with the uncle knocking on the door?

Yes, we see JM much later in the day being interviewed by local news. Yes, he does say he came over as soon as he heard, but we do not know what time that was, do we? Does he say he was knocking on doors?

Maybe it's too early for me and I need more coffee lol

Anyone?

I am glad you asked that question because I have never seen it verified that it was JM but LE said it was an Uncle. For all we know JM could have arrived later once he got word that Isa was missing.

It is understandable that if any of the family lived close by ..Sergio would immediately contact them, and they could have been there in minutes. It also makes sense the family would first scour the neighborhood hoping to find Isa before they dialed 911.

IMO

 

[Patty G]

Yes, that's what I remember. Do you want me to find that original post/poster?

ONLY if you have time. :blowkiss:

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

I have asked a media source to try and verify this for us...he said he would ask. To me, it is a great question...and when JVM asked the real uncle and he said he had no information...i think that raised the old hinky meter.

Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express

Isa was scheduled to play in a ball game that morning, yeah? Maybe JM was there for that...like maybe he was gonna have breakfast with the family and then travel to the game with them. I didn't play club sports as a kid, but I think if I did that would've been a huge treat for me.

May today be Isa's day!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I have asked a media source to try and verify this for us...he said he would ask. To me, it is a great question...and when JVM asked the real uncle and he said he had no information...i think that raised the old hinky meter.

Sent from my SGH-i937 using Board Express

Thanks.

Becky's brother may not have known anything about who was searching for her before 911 was called. He may have arrived at the home later after LE was called?

Or did the Becky's brother say he arrived before they called 911?

thanks

 

[Patty G]

I feel JM is a blood Uncle to Sergio Isa and perhaps a half-brother to Sergio based solely by their last names.

Sergio and JM have many of the same features, at least to me.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Isa was scheduled to play in a ball game that morning, yeah? Maybe JM was there for that...like maybe he was gonna have breakfast with the family and then travel to the game with them. I didn't play club sports as a kid, but I think if I did that would've been a huge treat for me.

May today be Isa's day!

I really think the parents were honest when they said no one was there with them the night Isa went missing.

 

[Patty G]

Thanks.

Becky's brother may not have known anything about who was searching for her before 911 was called. He may have arrived at the home later after LE was called?

Or did the Becky's brother say he arrived before they called 911?

thanks

Becky's brother got a phone call at work to let him know that Isa was missing. Considering Isa's mother was at work, and she received a phone call, "time unknown" so I guess they went down the line with relatives once Becky was informed.

 

[LisaB]

I am not pointing at anyone, but this seems to be another reason many are posting about JM and thinking he's hinky.
Is JM knocking on doors a known item?
I would like to know how
we know that it was JM arriving early at the scene?

He was the spokesperson and represented himself as Isa's uncle to LE and the media in his first statement.

As far as I recall, the neighbor said the policeman said the uncle is the one knocking on her door.

It was never clear if she meant the uncle knocked at 8 and later an officer knocked and she mentioned the guy who stopped by earlier and LE said he was Isa's uncle.

Did she name the uncle by name? Did she give a description of what she looked like?

Isa has only one uncle. He is Becky's brother, and appeared on TV this week to say he was not the person who knocked and did not know who it could be (as he is only uncle).

For example, could Sergio have one or more brothers who live just down the street with his parents? They would actually be uncles. Isa has just the one uncle, LR.

My question is how exactly are we linking JM with the uncle knocking on the door?

Because he is the one who addressed the press, identified himself as the uncle & spokesperson, stated that he "woke up" to this nightmare (paraphrased) and then disappeared from the public eye.

Yes, we see JM much later in the day being interviewed by local news. Yes, he does say he came over as soon as he heard, but we do not know what time that was, do we? Does he say he was knocking on doors?

He hasn't said anything since the first interview. But again, Isa's uncle is LR, on Rebecca's side, and he was not there and he was not knocking on doors. If he was there right away, I would HOPE he was helping to search "knocking on doors". What else would he do? Grab a beer and turn on the XBOX? (sorry, that was snarky).

Maybe it's too early for me and I need more coffee lol

Anyone?

All of the blue stuff above is my take on things. I could be misinformed.