AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #18

[panthera]

It's the window...why would a would be abductor spend time taking the screen off when he could just have cut it ? I am wondering, if he opened the window to go in, wouldn't he have to leave it open,in case he needed to get out of the house in a hurry ? And,if he left it open,he took the huge risk of Isabel screaming and hollering.With the window open.In the dead of night ? Maybe she wouldn't scream.But maybe she would... MOO

And,if the neighbor woke up and heard men talking in low voices,and her dogs were going crazy at 6 :30 am, wouldn't the same thing have happened if an abductor had walked into the same breezeway area,and stood around taking the screen off etc. in the middle of the night ? MOO

To analyze it, that window was what first made me think that,as Fabiano Pacheco said "Things are not always what they seem to be " JMO

Absoolutely agree. My belief is that window was staged to make it appear the perp had entered and/or exited through it. It would be quite difficult, IMO, to remove the screen from the outside without bending or damaging it, and much simpler to cut it for access. If the neighbors dogs barked at voices that morning wouldn't they also have sensed someone outside that night removing the screen and taking the child out of her room? It would also be difficult, IMO, to remove Isabel through the window unless there was a second person outside to hand her off to. And then how did they exit the yard? Was a gate open or unlocked? And again, no dogs alerted to any noise?

:waitasec:

MOO

 

[carole]

I don't even want to deal with attempting to understand this one. If possibly Sergio was involved with someone at the age of 25 in 1995, then that person needs to be shown his picture, or it at least brought to her attention, and let her decide if it is him, or if it isn't. AND, I can't imagine with this amount of national coverage that whoever this may or may not have to do with hasn't been reading the news or watching it. They would have to live under a huge rock. JMHO

The person who knows this woman has lost touch with her over the years (if I understood correctly), this woman with the boys could have already contacted the police, we have no way of knowing.

 

[mck16]

When this first came out that night, I thought SC speaking the way she did was really inappropriate. At first it was just the quote, and I assumed that it was just a one on one with a reporter, which would be fine. But then I saw the video and IMO it was inappropriate.

Who is this? tia

 

[WhatsupAZ]

I would like to know what all the surveylance video from that night shows. With all the cameras in the area you would think that le has watched the entire night unfold right before their eyes.

 

[mamamia54]

The person who knows this woman has lost touch with her over the years (if I understood correctly), this woman with the boys could have already contacted the police, we have no way of knowing.

Yep, and that's fine, I just don't wanna keep going on with speculating on it. LOL

 

[curiousc]

I would like to know what all the surveylance video from that night shows. With all the cameras in the area you would think that le has watched the entire night unfold right before their eyes.

I sure the heck hope there is something on video. With all the talk about the video cameras there has to be something!

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I think people who follow these cases know that when a child goes missing it is most likely due to a parents involvement. They are the most common types of these cases. So when Isabel went missing, obviously there is already automatically suspicion on her parents and learning that a parent coaches a team of children could make some people worry about their free access to more children. No one said "Any man who would dare coach is bad".

This is extremely judgmental and accusatory to the poster. I am sure if SC wasn't somehow involved with this situation no one would give a flying hoot that he was a coach. It is BECAUSE of this case that someone had those feelings of him being a coach, not JUST because he is a coach.

Thank you, Lava. You are correct.

 

[Lava]

Who is this? tia

Ha, sorry, my bad....it should say SC's sister.

 

[callyn]

When this first came out that night, I thought SC speaking the way she did was really inappropriate. At first it was just the quote, and I assumed that it was just a one on one with a reporter, which would be fine. But then I saw the video and IMO it was inappropriate.

BBM, who is the SC you are speaking of? Or do you mean Sergio's sister, Elena? sorry, confused here

ETA: I see your answer above. Thanks.

 

[abstr]

Yep, and that's fine, I just don't wanna keep going on with speculating on it. LOL

Funny, I usually disagree with you Mama but I got smacked down for saying that the poster needed to either provide more or STFU. It was posted as a fact. I was pretty much told to shut up my self and I have but I totally agree with you.

As always...Anything I post is only MOO

 

[mck16]

Ha, sorry, my bad....it should say SC's sister.

Thanks. I was afraid we had two SC's in the mix now. lol

 

[mamamia54]

Funny, I usually disagree with you Mama but I got smacked down for saying that the poster needed to either provide more or STFU. It was posted as a fact. I was pretty much told to shut up my self and I have but I totally agree with you.

As always...Anything I post is only MOO

Every now and then I can make sense lol, and I read wrong last night and thought it was SC's boys, but then found out it was actually the other persons boys, and at that point at least I had figured out that SC would have only been 25 and just sat back and really thought about it. That's why I finally came to the conclusion that there is almost no way in h... she wouldn't already know with the amount of nation wide coverage this case has gotten and just decided to let it go.

 

[Hatfield]

All JMO.
Just catching up and I agree with a lot of the points mentioned. Especially regarding that I feel the window scene was staged. If not, I agree it would take at least 2 people to remove her. Because even though the height of the window was not that far down, its not like one person would toss her out or let her down by an arm and say "wait for me while I crawl out". The whole window/screen thing just doesn't sit right. I think the boy may have carried the screen to the backyard and ruined the "faked scene" as it was probably originally left right near the window on the side.

The thing I have been losing sleep over though, is that it "seems" the Mom did not confront SC right away once she got home. IMO, most moms would have ran right to the husband and confront them. At a minimum to throw their arms around each other and confort each other. This is the part that bugs me the most. She took all that time to get on the phone, talk with the 911 operator, provide numerous details about hair braiding, how the perp may have jumped the fence, etc. etc. All the while, she has not yet even confronted the husband to get a face-to-face discussion about what happened. Or, at a minimum, to rush + comfort each other.

I realize it is tough to tell the timing of things on the calls, but IMO, I think that when SC was talking right at the end of his 911 call, and he mentions that the Mom is talking with someone and that she may have called LE herself, I firmly believe the boy has passed the phone to her already and if so, this would prove she never confronted him prior to her whole 911 discussions. If this is the way it went down, then where is the running into each other's arms that I would expect most parents to do upon seeing each other for the first time, after a tragedy such as this.

Sorry, I just don't buy the whole story. Escpecially the way SC told it on his call.

Anyway, just checking in and wanted to thank everyone for their great posts the past 2 days. I have agreed with a lot of them.

 

[southsleuth]

For that matter when living in Phoenix it was not uncommon for hispanic friends of mine to whom I was close with to introduce me to the Children as Uncle ______. It's really not not that uncommon as a sign of respect and also kinda like saying this is mama or papa's close enuff friend to consider them a brother and giving someone an uncle title as a symbol that this person is part of our family, respect them as such.

"Aunt" and "Uncle" so-in-so is common here in the south as well.

 

[abstr]

Every now and then I can make sense lol, and I read wrong last night and thought it was SC's boys, but then found out it was actually the other persons boys, and at that point at least I had figured out that SC would have only been 25 and just sat back and really thought about it. That's why I finally came to the conclusion that there is almost no way in h... she wouldn't already know with the amount of nation wide coverage this case has gotten and just decided to let it go.

and it might be true...but state it that way.....that is all i was saying as well as why are we indicting LL coaches......and I guess I didn't do enough of MOOing but .....

 

[FrayedKnot]

It would be helpful, I think, if you could point me to the post that stated that the poster did not have the address? the post that says the address was speculation, specifically? TIA! I just went through a bunch of posts and could not find it.

Sorry, my doggy is ready with his ball in his mouth to go to the park...bbl

I'll go back and find it for you since you're off to the park.

IIRC it was a couple of posts later where the warrant info was posted and the OP said that there was not an address on that warrant.


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[panthera]

I would like to know what all the surveylance video from that night shows. With all the cameras in the area you would think that le has watched the entire night unfold right before their eyes.

And there might be absolutely nothing on it showing anyone going near Isabel's house, at least from the rear. Would this video show someone going in and out of the front or driveway?

 

[mamamia54]

and it might be true...but state it that way.....that is all i was saying as well as why are we indicting LL coaches......and I guess I didn't do enough of MOOing but .....

I think in all honesty, I'm gettin too old for this stuff, I mean OY. I mean, huge families, aunts, uncles, cousins, sisters, brothers on both sides, this one married that one and it turned out that the last name was changed to another last name, then I begin to go blank and almost black out. :floorlaugh:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I am not the poster that saw SC, but I did read her posts about it. I am not speaking for her, but for myself when I say I was very moved by the feelings she expressed about seeing SC. I hope the poster answers your question so you will know how they felt about it. I did not get the impression it was a creepy thing, but a broken man looking at a vigil he wanted to be part of but couldn't be there. Again, this is my perception of their post. jmo

I did see his photo in the DailyMail article and there was nothing sinister about it from my perception, imo. He certainly didn't look threatening. He looked sad, IMO, and there hasn't been one word said that he tried to intimidate his boys or anyone else.

Do we even know if they realized he was there watching from afar?

Becky has already said the boys miss their father so why would seeing him be intimidating to them anyway?

 

[Deleted member 718]

I do remember one case where a child disappeared,and the parents were never suspects. It happened in Miami in the 50's, and it was a little girl,aged about 5. Cannot recall names,but I am going to look.

The child was sleping in a bedroom at the front/side of the house. Her bedroom window was left open ( no A/C), and the window had a screen in it. She was put to bed, and found to be missing in the morning. No one heard anything at all. The scren on the window was pushed out.

IIRC, I think she was an only child. But the only other people there were her parents, and,IIRC they both took and passed LDTs.

I read about the case when we lived in Miami, I think it was an anniversary of her disappearance. Parents never really susects. Why I do not know. Maybe the LDTs ? Anyway, she was never found. If I get a chance I will try to access the Miami Herald archives to get more info. I did some research on the case when we lived there,but no longer have my notes...

I suppose that technically one could say that Sierra Lamar's mother and her mother's BF were not considred to be suspects at the beginning of her case. I think it was mentioned that they had alibis. And I'm sure that LE pinged their cells right away...Later on, another LEO in the case said something different, so IDK...

Just some thoughts...and MOO

Thanks! Back to the original question, can anyone remember a missing child case where the parents were home at the time and ruled out as suspects?

I can't think of any.