AZ - Man who followed teen into Phoenix restroom beaten to death by girl's father, 2 Aug. 2018

[Alisha8191]

Link to EuTuC's post.

AZ - Man who followed teen into Phoenix restroom beaten to death by girl's father, 2 Aug. 2018

That is what the daughter said.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

From what I've read, the information about the deceased having a history of trying to get at young girls in that QT store, came from the daughter. She reported she was told that by employees at the QT. I haven't actually read an interview with the employees themselves. And what was the crime the deceased committed? Going into a different genders bathroom isn't a crime. Shaking a door isn't a crime. What if we find out the deceased was suffering from schizophrenia? What if he was actually confused, having distorted thoughts, hallucinations? What if he's innocent? I'm not saying he is.....but what if? He's someone's son, brother maybe a father himself. In our great nation we have the right to be judged by a jury of our peers, not beaten in the street by an enraged man.

Innocent by reason of insanity is a strict standard and it’s one that only the court to decide.

Gosh, the minority here are only ones saying the guy deserved to be beaten.

Once the dad left the scene and followed the man, it because another venue, so to speak, and a separate crime. Which is probably why he’s charged with manslaughter, iirc.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Are you accusing the young girl, and the other people who've been terrorized by that pervert, of lying? Why?

Absolutely not. I would just like to hear from the employees first hand as they seem to be familiar with this man.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Innocent by reason of insanity is a strict standard and it’s one that only the court to decide.

Gosh, the minority here are only ones saying the guy deserved to be beaten.

Once the dad left the scene and followed the man, it because another venue, so to speak, and a separate crime. Which is probably why he’s charged with manslaughter, iirc.

I certainly wasn't implying he was innocent by reason of insanity. I clearly said in my comment that I didn't know his mental health history although family said he suffered from mental illness. I was only saying that we don't know why this man did what he did. I also asked what crime he actually would have been accused of. Would the crime be entering the bathroom of the opposite gender? Rattling the door in the bathroom of the opposite gender?

 

[flourish]

I suppose it's too bad the victim here didn't have a gun. Because, you know, Americans don't have to meekly submit to being beaten.

 

[flourish]

Innocent until proven guilty and sentenced in a court of law is the process in the US. I support the system. I don't support vigilante justice.

Random citizens aren't law enforcement, judge, jury, nor executioner.

Do we have a link with the victim's record? He could have a pristine record for all we know.

I request links for his background record.

 

[KaaBoom]

Are you accusing the young girl, and the other people who've been terrorized by that pervert, of lying? Why?

I have no idea if she is lying or not. That could have been determined in a trial. But the father decided not to let that happen.

 

[flourish]

I have no idea if she is lying or not. That could have been determined in a trial. But the father decided not to let that happen.

And she apparently got her info from the store employee(s) and we don't know how accurate the information is.

I've worked with people with disabilities for decades. Sometimes one of them will use a public restroom and depending on their level of independence, they may walk ahead of staff. Depending on the types of bathroom signs, they may enter the incorrect restroom. They don't need to die for it, nor are they being perverts.

Once in a fast food restaurant bathroom, I opened a stall which was unlocked with no feet visible underneath the door. However there was a little girl sitting on the toilet. No adult present. Of course I apologized and went to another stall. However, the little girl could have gone out and told her adult that i walked in on her and while true it was not nefarious not intentional. I don't deserve to die for that. It's too bad there isn't any opportunity for clarification here.

Still waiting for the link proving the victim had a record. Which still doesn't excuse getting beaten to death.

 

[flourish]

No apologies necessary.
The article, from the Daily Mail (not known for their awesomeness) indicates the dad claimed later that he was struck first, not that he was actually struck first.
It is nice to have additional information regarding this heinous unlawful slaying.

 

[flourish]

From the Daily Mail article:
"Armstrong had a history of run-ins with the law related to shoplifting, trespassing and obstructing police, according to his criminal record."

None of those are sexual crimes.

Has Harris's record been mentioned?

 

[flourish]

I just wanted to bump some particularly good posts, imo.

I bet this was the same guy that I used to see at QuikTrip. The schizophrenia would definitely fit the conversations I had with the man.

I am simply stunned that anyone thinks this was okay. There is a huge addiction issue down there. I have family members who have been in this man's situation. I cannot fathom anyone thinks this was okay.

Dozens of arrests and never anything serious. This guy was a mentally ill man trying to survive in a country with inadequate mental health care. He could have been anyone of our family members.

People think it'll never happen to their family members because they are too good for it to happen to them. Until it happens to them.



I lived down there, went to QuikTrip almost daily. QuikTrip's generally have stronger bathroom doors yes. However, there is still more than enough room to crawl under or over them. I've had to when family member's overdosed in them.

If he really wanted to victimize this girl he could have climbed under the stall door. If he really wanted to victimize a girl he would have had plenty of chances considering he lived on the streets from what we know.

Our justice system disappoints me a lot. However, it is there for a reason. Beating someone to death because YOU think they did something is never okay. If you CATCH the man IN THE ACT of raping your child, I can excuse you losing control. This was nothing like that. No justification.

I have not made any posts on WS for awhile. This may well be one of the last ones I will make.

Some posters on here turn my stomach. You do NOT have any right to take another life unless you or your loved one is in danger of losing theirs. You detain that person until LE arrives. All the 'Go Dad!' posts make me wonder what is wrong with some of you. It is sickening.

Utterly disgusting..

Where do you draw the line? The next time, a guy harrasses a woman, you simply shoot him? Maybe he just talked to her and gave her that look? Whatever, he‘s a weirdo! A woman stealing a handbag has no place in society, right? Hang her high! A speeding driver endangering pedestrians, punch him until he‘s dead! Someone is mentally ill and acting strange? Whatever, EXECUTION all the way!

We don‘t need police and judges. Vigilante - it‘s wild west! Everybody will be judge and executioner. The constitution is useless. Is it that what y‘all are saying?

<modsnip: snipped quoted post>

 

[bluesneakers]

From the Daily Mail article:
"Armstrong had a history of run-ins with the law related to shoplifting, trespassing and obstructing police, according to his criminal record."

None of those are sexual crimes.

Has Harris's record been mentioned?

Does Harris have a record?

 

[LaborDayRN]

Does Harris have a record?

I'm terrible at looking up records. I was wondering the same thing.

 

[flourish]

Does Harris have a record?

I don't know. I would not be surprised, as his actions in this case, however understandable TO A POINT, demonstrate a lack of self control and a temper. It's reasonable for him to be alarmed and very concerned. It's even perhaps reasonable to attempt to detain the guy until law enforcement arrived... I could even be more forgiving of him punching him knocking him out then waiting for law enforcement.

It will be curious to see if he had a record and, if so, for what.

People need to assess situations. For safety. I'm going to forever be nervous to knock on or check the door at any kind of public restroom. Just in case. (Obviously I can read English well and don't generally go into men's rooms, but non specified bathrooms are everywhere).

 

[eucalyptuz]

I understand the flight or fight response.
I understand protective parental behavior.
Hell, on some level the « Stand your Ground » law can be justified....
This is none of those.
This is a murder. If this attack happened after the daughter left the bathroom, after the father spoke to security etc...well this goes beyond some kind of defense and becomes an attack.

 

[eucalyptuz]

It's according to if the man actually hit the father first, and he responded. If the man was perverted enough to try to attack a girl in the bathroom, why wouldn't he strike the father who told him he was a pervert?
Phoenix dad 'kills man after he tried to get into daughter's bathroom' | Daily Mail Online

From this article....BBM
Father charged with murder in alleged fatal beating of man
“Melvin went into the business and told a security guard he needed to handle the situation, or he would do it himself,” according to the court document. “Security told him they would handle the situation.”

Harris went back to his car and started to drive away, but then saw Armstrong and confronted him, court documents showed.

“According to witnesses, Melvin approached the victim and punched him in the face causing the victim to fall. Witnesses described the victim as snoring and moaning while on the ground,” the court records say. “Melvin then, while standing over the victim, struck the victim in the face several more time and also kicked and stopped [sic] on him.”

He then got into his car and drove away, the records said.

Police obtained a detailed description of Harris’ car from video surveillance footage and tracked down the man at his home, which is near the convenience store, and detained him for questioning.

“During the interview, he admitted to punching the victim in the face but said it was only because the victim swung at him first, striking him near the neck and shoulder area,” according to court records. “After hitting the victim, the victim fell to the ground and curled up into a ball.

=Murder

 

[akazia1978]

Well..... I'm sure glad I don't live somewhere people think it's fine to kill you for walking into the wrong bathroom, because I'd be dead 100 times over in my lifetime. I've even sat in the stall, came out and realized it was the wrong bathroom. I just get very lost in thought at times and walk through the wrong door. It was also the middle of the night, people tend to be in a more altered state at that time-drunk/drugs/whatever.

Also, please tell me this is not the typical gas station bathrooms, one male, one female on each side....because I try the doors at those all the time and will use the male one if the female one is locked. Rattling a handle should not be an excuse for murder-that's ridiculous.

Poor guy just sounds like he was mentally ill and not able to get appropriate care, which in this country is an unfortunate thing. I feel bad for the girl, for having to witness that level of violence from her father when it should never have gone anywhere near that far. That's a terrifying thing in itself. This was taken entirely too far by her father, as a poster said above, a scary loss of self-control on his part.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

Innocent until proven guilty and sentenced in a court of law is the process in the US. I support the system. I don't support vigilante justice.

Random citizens aren't law enforcement, judge, jury, nor executioner.

Do we have a link with the victim's record? He could have a pristine record for all we know.

I request links for his background record.

I’ve looked it up; not sure it can be mentioned here. I’ll ask a mod. He did have multiple arrests. I won’t say any more till it’s OK’d.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

And she apparently got her info from the store employee(s) and we don't know how accurate the information is.

I've worked with people with disabilities for decades. Sometimes one of them will use a public restroom and depending on their level of independence, they may walk ahead of staff. Depending on the types of bathroom signs, they may enter the incorrect restroom. They don't need to die for it, nor are they being perverts.

Once in a fast food restaurant bathroom, I opened a stall which was unlocked with no feet visible underneath the door. However there was a little girl sitting on the toilet. No adult present. Of course I apologized and went to another stall. However, the little girl could have gone out and told her adult that i walked in on her and while true it was not nefarious not intentional. I don't deserve to die for that. It's too bad there isn't any opportunity for clarification here.

Still waiting for the link proving the victim had a record. Which still doesn't excuse getting beaten to death.

Thank you for this post, @flourish. Well said.

 

[DexterMorgan]

So the employee says the guy is known for harassing young girls or customers. But they still allow him to frequent the store?

What are we missing?

 

[MillenialMeg]

Intent is everything. What were the intentions of the man who went into the women’s bathroom? He was up to something nefarious or seriously confused about the female and male symbols on bathroom doors.

 

[Jealoushe]

I’m not sure the guys Aunt vouching for him is the best defence. Another case of “that person would never do something like that”, which is heard in almost every single murder case.