AZ - Timothy Romans, 39, & Vincent Romero, 29, slain, St Johns, 5 Nov 2008 - #4

[MeoW333]

I thought the neighbor's wouldn't be able to hear the sound of a .22 as one the boy had, if it were shot indoors? I thought the sound wouldn't be loud enough to carry?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I thought the neighbor's wouldn't be able to hear the sound of a .22 as one the boy had, if it were shot indoors? I thought the sound wouldn't be loud enough to carry?

Imo, the neighbors did not hear the shots that killed Vinnie, inside the enclosed home. They heard some of the shots that were fired to the outside at Tim. It isn't uncommon for ear witnesses to not know exactly how many shots they heard. They will usually say "about shots." At the time they are being heard their brains aren't processing how many they are hearing and most often will have to try and remember after the fact. Often times it is off one way or the other as to the actual amount of gunshots that were fired. Even police officers sometimes during an exchange of gunfire do not remember exactly how many shots the perp fired.

imo

 

[dgfred]

Is that you G B ? You better look out, I'm tailing ya. :crazy:

Hearing the shots like you said can not be relied on.

 

[dgfred]

1. And we don't know if there was another weapon. We do know it was a 22. and the statement given by the neighbors who heard the shots is consistent with a single bolt action rifle that has a "pop" and then a "delay" each time....and is not consistent with a semi automatic or automatic.

2. The child has no alibi as to his whereabouts from the time he got off the bus until he went to the neighbors in back of him. He was conveniently not seen as he did his multiple walkabout. Which means he very likely went home and waited for his dad. He would know the approximate time he arrived as it was said that Vinnie and Tim get off around 4:30 everyday.

3. The police did try to find who drove a white car.

4. We have no clue if a gun is missing. The gun did not belong to Vinnie, it very well may have been picked up prior to this happening.

5. No, I have no need to wonder where the fil was at the time he called. They have the cell records and can tell which tower pinged when the call was made.

6. The boy did not say it was his grandfather's car, he was describing it being "white" like his granddaddy's. He would know his car by sight.

7. Lots of coworkers don't like it each other. People get fired and someone else becomes the foreman. A car is not a truck and the boy would know the difference.

8. The shot to Tim's truck happened on the reservation at a party in San Carlos. The caliber was not the same as the weapon used to commit the murders.

9. I think Tanya was extremely upset upon learning of the alleged affair and left the room out of raw emotions. I do believe she is in communication with the DA, since that time, imo.

10. Irrelevant. IMO she has an iron clad alibi.

11. There was no robbery. No drugs found in the home nor in both of their systems at autopsy. No evidence to support that drugs were being used or sold. Tiffany said they did not do drugs. I believe her because the evidence bolsters her statement.

12. That has been cleared up and were people that were with the Davis' at the crime scene.

All the forensics that we are aware of is they found his fingerprints on the box of bullets and GSR on his clothing. Both does not point away from this boy.

We haven't seen the actual results because all we ever see is the cover sheet to the supplemental disclosures. With almost 400 pages of documents from the DPS investigation and a 26 page lab report, I do believe the results are back and there is some wrangling going on behind the scene.

I saw no emotion in this child until he knew his story wasn't going to wash and he was going to juvie. Then he cried for himself. Before then he was very chatty and engaging. Seeming to feel no pressure at all. He did not even show one ounce of sadness when he talked about his dad.



imo

1. Can't be the bolt-action imo... we have talked this over.
2. No way the kid 'laid in wait' for his dad to come imo.
3. Why didn't they ask ANY questions about the white car and person seen?
4. A 10-shot 22 is probably missing imo... we have discussed this too .
5. Doesn't mean it was planned by and performed by someone else.
6. Right, still they didn't ask him anymore about it.
7. Still the co-workers would be valid suspects 'in most cases'.
8. The statement was about talking to him about his use of the gun anyway.
9. Probably thought they were moving toward her as a suspect too.
10. Very strange and far from ironclad imo.
11. Oh I'm sure she would tell if they were into drugs .
12. I don't believe it was really 'cleared up'.

He didn't change his story until he was lead there. How can you pick and choose what is a lie and what isn't? There is no way for us to really tell.

Cheers, your pal

 

[fran]

1. And we don't know if there was another weapon. We do know it was a 22. and the statement given by the neighbors who heard the shots is consistent with a single bolt action rifle that has a "pop" and then a "delay" each time....and is not consistent with a semi automatic or automatic.

2. The child has no alibi as to his whereabouts from the time he got off the bus until he went to the neighbors in back of him. He was conveniently not seen as he did his multiple walkabout. Which means he very likely went home and waited for his dad. He would know the approximate time he arrived as it was said that Vinnie and Tim get off around 4:30 everyday.

3. The police did try to find who drove a white car.

4. We have no clue if a gun is missing. The gun did not belong to Vinnie, it very well may have been picked up prior to this happening.

5. No, I have no need to wonder where the fil was at the time he called. They have the cell records and can tell which tower pinged when the call was made.

6. The boy did not say it was his grandfather's car, he was describing it being "white" like his granddaddy's. He would know his car by sight.

7. Lots of coworkers don't like it each other. People get fired and someone else becomes the foreman. A car is not a truck and the boy would know the difference.

8. The shot to Tim's truck happened on the reservation at a party in San Carlos. The caliber was not the same as the weapon used to commit the murders.

9. I think Tanya was extremely upset upon learning of the alleged affair and left the room out of raw emotions. I do believe she is in communication with the DA, since that time, imo.

10. Irrelevant. IMO she has an iron clad alibi.

11. There was no robbery. No drugs found in the home nor in both of their systems at autopsy. No evidence to support that drugs were being used or sold. Tiffany said they did not do drugs. I believe her because the evidence bolsters her statement.

12. That has been cleared up and were people that were with the Davis' at the crime scene.

All the forensics that we are aware of is they found his fingerprints on the box of bullets and GSR on his clothing. Both does not point away from this boy.

We haven't seen the actual results because all we ever see is the cover sheet to the supplemental disclosures. With almost 400 pages of documents from the DPS investigation and a 26 page lab report, I do believe the results are back and there is some wrangling going on behind the scene.

I saw no emotion in this child until he knew his story wasn't going to wash and he was going to juvie. Then he cried for himself. Before then he was very chatty and engaging. Seeming to feel no pressure at all. He did not even show one ounce of sadness when he talked about his dad.



imo

This is filled entirely with opinions and assumpitions, but lacks the basics, {proof} and {fact}.

Until these assertions are investigated, proved, documented and presented as FACT,.................there's a whole world out there of suspects and for the murderer of these two men to hide.

Just sayin'
fran

 

[OrdinaryLife]

This is filled entirely with opinions and assumpitions, but lacks the basics, {proof} and {fact}.

Until these assertions are investigated, proved, documented and presented as FACT,.................there's a whole world out there of suspects and for the murderer of these two men to hide.

Just sayin'
fran

Well, I am just simply going to share I agree with Fran's post. 100%.

Just sayin' as well.

 

[Linda7NJ]

1. And we don't know if there was another weapon. We do know it was a 22. and the statement given by the neighbors who heard the shots is consistent with a single bolt action rifle that has a "pop" and then a "delay" each time....and is not consistent with a semi automatic or automatic.

2. The child has no alibi as to his whereabouts from the time he got off the bus until he went to the neighbors in back of him. He was conveniently not seen as he did his multiple walkabout. Which means he very likely went home and waited for his dad. He would know the approximate time he arrived as it was said that Vinnie and Tim get off around 4:30 everyday.

3. The police did try to find who drove a white car.

4. We have no clue if a gun is missing. The gun did not belong to Vinnie, it very well may have been picked up prior to this happening.

5. No, I have no need to wonder where the fil was at the time he called. They have the cell records and can tell which tower pinged when the call was made.

6. The boy did not say it was his grandfather's car, he was describing it being "white" like his granddaddy's. He would know his car by sight.

7. Lots of coworkers don't like it each other. People get fired and someone else becomes the foreman. A car is not a truck and the boy would know the difference.

8. The shot to Tim's truck happened on the reservation at a party in San Carlos. The caliber was not the same as the weapon used to commit the murders.

9. I think Tanya was extremely upset upon learning of the alleged affair and left the room out of raw emotions. I do believe she is in communication with the DA, since that time, imo.

10. Irrelevant. IMO she has an iron clad alibi.

11. There was no robbery. No drugs found in the home nor in both of their systems at autopsy. No evidence to support that drugs were being used or sold. Tiffany said they did not do drugs. I believe her because the evidence bolsters her statement.

12. That has been cleared up and were people that were with the Davis' at the crime scene.

All the forensics that we are aware of is they found his fingerprints on the box of bullets and GSR on his clothing. Both does not point away from this boy.

We haven't seen the actual results because all we ever see is the cover sheet to the supplemental disclosures. With almost 400 pages of documents from the DPS investigation and a 26 page lab report, I do believe the results are back and there is some wrangling going on behind the scene.

I saw no emotion in this child until he knew his story wasn't going to wash and he was going to juvie. Then he cried for himself. Before then he was very chatty and engaging. Seeming to feel no pressure at all. He did not even show one ounce of sadness when he talked about his dad.



imo

I agree 100% with this post.

Just saying:crazy:

 

[OrdinaryLife]

I agree 100% with this post.

Just saying:crazy:

Cute.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

http://www.azcentral.com/video/?type=mavenfull&id=videopage&videoID=1025059515 Click on St. John update.

I had a feeling that once the DPS investigation was turned in and the 33 witness statements were turned over in discovery things would come out.

I always felt it possible that the boy had already told someone he was going to kill him. Kids talk.

I don't see any abuse proved to have been done by Vinnie except slapping the boy when the boy threatened to kill him. It says there was an unidentified photo on Vinnie's phone of a child with a black eye. I wonder since Vinnie kept it whether it was someone the boy played with and the boy hit them with something causing the black eye. If Vinnie had done it himself and it was this boy, I cant see him taking a picture of it and placing it on his phone to be found.

Now I am really wondering if the poking a stick at a cat that was trapped in a culvert was really just playing.

Now I do wonder just what kind of child this boy really is. The trying to drown his half sister is frightening. Also I would think the witness would have to be someone that was around the Bloomfield family, not the Romero family.

On Tim's phone they say pictures were found, there was no mention if it was kiddie and I do believe, if so, the reporter would have ran with that story.

It does clear up some why the grandparents thinks this boy, over other boys, was capable of doing this.

imoo

 

[SoobsinMI]

http://www.azcentral.com/video/?type=mavenfull&id=videopage&videoID=1025059515 Click on St. John update.

I had a feeling that once the DPS investigation was turned in and the 33 witness statements were turned over in discovery things would come out.

I always felt it possible that the boy had already told someone he was going to kill him. Kids talk.

I don't see any abuse proved to have been done by Vinnie except slapping the boy when the boy threatened to kill him. It says there was an unidentified photo on Vinnie's phone of a child with a black eye. I wonder since Vinnie kept it whether it was someone the boy played with and the boy hit them with something causing the black eye. If Vinnie had done it himself and it was this boy, I cant see him taking a picture of it and placing it on his phone to be found.

Now I am really wondering if the poking a stick at a cat that was trapped in a culvert was really just playing.

Now I do wonder just what kind of child this boy really is. The trying to drown his half sister is frightening. Also I would think the witness would have to be someone that was around the Bloomfield family, not the Romero family.

On Tim's phone they say pictures were found, there was no mention if it was kiddie and I do believe, if so, the reporter would have ran with that story.

It does clear up some why the grandparents thinks this boy, over other boys, was capable of doing this.

imoo

The witness statements are disturbing. So is the police report that little boys underwear was found in the home, with blood in it. I would be curious to know where the blood was located. Also, the sexual assault by Tim Romans, that was reported. I'm withholding judgement on the possibility of abuse...I said in the beginning that more than likely, some abuse would be found. It's still possible that this child is just a sociopathic little monster, as some on here have suggested (not you, OBE) but I still have my doubts. I also said it was probable that the child did this, but that I wanted to know WHY.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The witness statements are disturbing. So is the police report that little boys underwear was found in the home, with blood in it. I would be curious to know where the blood was located. Also, the sexual assault by Tim Romans, that was reported. I'm withholding judgment on the possibility of abuse...I said in the beginning that more than likely, some abuse would be found. It's still possible that this child is just a sociopathic little monster, as some on here have suggested (not you, OBE) but I still have my doubts. I also said it was probable that the child did this, but that I wanted to know WHY.

Since LE checked the boy from top to bottom when he said he had been spanked, I don't think any evidence of abuse was found. Even four days later both Brewer and Melnick said they had uncovered no abuse. And then even months later the defense attorneys told JR that they have never claimed that abuse was being done.

It wouldn't surprise me if he got blood on his underwear when he may have gone to the bathroom afterward and it is blood from one of the victims but we will see. I can see him hiding them, if it got on there.

Imo, this boy is not normal by any stretch of the imagination. Telling what he planned to do. Trying to drown his half sister. All of this is disturbing behavior unlike any 8 or 9 year olds that I have known.

I can certainly understand more why there has been some heavy wrangling going on behind the scenes. I think it started happening when all of this was turned over in discovery.

Another chilling thing is there is an eye witness that saw him playing outside with the dog shortly after the men were murdered.

imoo

 

[Linda7NJ]

Since LE checked the boy from top to bottom when he said he had been spanked, I don't think any evidence of abuse was found. Even four days later both Brewer and Melnick said they had uncovered no abuse. And then even months later the defense attorneys told JR that they have never claimed that abuse was being done.

It wouldn't surprise me if he got blood on his underwear when he may have gone to the bathroom afterward and it is blood from one of the victims but we will see. I can see him hiding them, if it got on there.

Imo, this boy is not normal by any stretch of the imagination. Telling what he planned to do. Trying to drown his half sister. All of this is disturbing behavior unlike any 8 or 9 year olds that I have known.

I can certainly understand more why there has been some heavy wrangling going on behind the scenes. I think it started happening when all of this was turned over in discovery.

Another chilling thing is there is an eye witness that saw him playing outside with the dog shortly after the men were murdered.

imoo

The kids twisted for sure. He needs to spend the next 9 years in a treatment facility.

 

[Salem]

My comments in green -

http://www.azcentral.com/video/?type=mavenfull&id=videopage&videoID=1025059515 Click on St. John update.

I had a feeling that once the DPS investigation was turned in and the 33 witness statements were turned over in discovery things would come out.

I always felt it possible that the boy had already told someone he was going to kill him. Kids talk. Kids also say things in anger. It is not uncommon for a 6,7,8,9 or even 10 year old to tell their parents or a friend they are fighting with "I hate you" or "I'm gonna kill you." It is necessary to put these comments in perspective.

I don't see any abuse proved to have been done by Vinnie except slapping the boy when the boy threatened to kill him. It says there was an unidentified photo on Vinnie's phone of a child with a black eye. I wonder since Vinnie kept it whether it was someone the boy played with and the boy hit them with something causing the black eye. If Vinnie had done it himself and it was this boy, I cant see him taking a picture of it and placing it on his phone to be found. I agree with this, I wouldn't think the father would carry around a picture of his son with a black eye, unless there was a story that went with the black eye.

Now I am really wondering if the poking a stick at a cat that was trapped in a culvert was really just playing.

Now I do wonder just what kind of child this boy really is. The trying to drown his half sister is frightening. Also I would think the witness would have to be someone that was around the Bloomfield family, not the Romero family. The boy is currently with his mother. I would like to hear more about this, given that his mother has never indicated there were problems and she is more than willing to take him home with her. I agree this would be frightening, but why was Ms.Bloomfield fighting for custody, if she knew the child had deliberately tried to kill his half sister?

On Tim's phone they say pictures were found, there was no mention if it was kiddie and I do believe, if so, the reporter would have ran with that story. This bothers me greatly. How many people do you know that walk around with on their cell phone for heaven's sake? I think this raises some very huge red flags, if it is true.

imoo

As for playing with the dog after the shooting - I don't believe this. The timeline does not allow any time for playing with a dog. NOR does the timeline allow for any time to go to the bathroom and hide his under wear. If the boy did this, he barely had time to shoot and go to the neighbors. There was no time for anything else - not playing, not peeing and not hiding underwear.

I'm thinking if a man walks around with on his cell phone, he is a man to be wary of. Not the type of person I am likely to let into my home and around my children.

Just sayin'

Salem

 

[fran]

It's my understanding that the boy's clothes that were recovered were lying on the floor in the hallway for four or five days, that would be close to where the dad's body was found, and it could have gotten blood on it from anywhere, like from people's shoes walking around the crime scene. I mean, these were recovered after LE had served one, if not two SW's on the residence. If they overlooked them, they most likely mean nothing. In addition, as they were retreived from the trash, transference from anything else is most likely.

Wonder how Roman's wife is taking it her husband is being accused of 'sexual assault?'

Curious we've been told there's no way this child could have layed on the ground beside his father's body and cried (even for a few minutes) because there was not enough time. Yet now we're to believe that he may have changed his clothes after the murder AND played with his dog as well, before he alerted neighbors.

I guess if it fits your agenda, it works for you.

I agree with you Salem, children say a lot of things out of anger and don't mean it. They also tend to exaggerate. You tell them something is expensive (ie meaning $50) and they throw out thou$and$.

Well, I'm still waiting for the ballistics evidence. Oh yeah, and the fingerprint stuff.

This just shows what picking and choosing the news media can do. There were hundreds of pages of discovery released yet they pick these. Guess the rest didn't fit their agenda.

IF this child did this, he does need therapy. IF not, well...........

JMHO
fran

 

[oceanblueeyes]

My comments in green -

As for playing with the dog after the shooting - I don't believe this. The timeline does not allow any time for playing with a dog. NOR does the timeline allow for any time to go to the bathroom and hide his under wear. If the boy did this, he barely had time to shoot and go to the neighbors. There was no time for anything else - not playing, not peeing and not hiding underwear.

I'm thinking if a man walks around with on his cell phone, he is a man to be wary of. Not the type of person I am likely to let into my home and around my children.

Just sayin'

Salem

I think it does. Doesn't take any time at all to lay the gun on the cage, remove the dog and pet her on the head outside before he runs to the neighbors.

No evidence that the he had on his phone was kiddie so having girly would be irrelevant. It was Tim's personal phone and I am sure he didn't pass it around to the Romero family. I am sure they had no clue what was on his phone nor thought it was any of their business.

imoo

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think it does. Doesn't take any time at all to lay the gun on the cage, remove the dog and pet her on the head outside before he runs to the neighbors.

No evidence that the he had on his phone was kiddie so having girly would be irrelevant. It was Tim's personal phone and I am sure he didn't pass it around to the Romero family. I am sure they had no clue what was on his phone nor thought it was any of their business.

imoo

Tim wouldn't be the first man to take a pic while engaged in a sex act.
Nor the first to download . IMO it's meaningless.

A quick playful romp with his dog could take 30 seconds before heading off to tell his tale.

 

[fran]

Wonder if the picture Tim had was of the sexual assault he's being accused of by the witness statement given to LE?

Guess there's another 'motive' for Tim's murder. PERHAPS someone was taking revenge for the victim of Tim's sexual assault?

So many suspects, so little time!

This case just keeps getting deeper and deeper.:waitasec:

JMHO
fran

 

[Linda7NJ]

Wonder if the picture Tim had was of the sexual assault he's being accused of by the witness statement given to LE?

Guess there's another 'motive' for Tim's murder. PERHAPS someone was taking revenge for the victim of Tim's sexual assault?

So many suspects, so little time!

This case just keeps getting deeper and deeper.:waitasec:

JMHO
fran

IMO everything thus far points to the boy as the only suspect.

 

[fran]

IMO everything thus far points to the boy as the only suspect.

Oh, really?

Adultry, sexual assault, missing guns, drug addict relatives that shoot at you or your vehicle, drinking every day at the local bar, fights with unknown patrons of the local watering hole, deep rooted disputes with fellow employees.

Everything points to the boy?

We must be watching different cases.

I see MANY potential suspects!

fran

 

[Linda7NJ]

The time-line

His claim he was out walking around the block 10+ times doesn't hold water.

The ear & now EYE witnesses. Tanya on phone. Neighbor heard shots and sees boy outside with his dog, playing, immediately after hearing gun pops.

The threats the boy made in anger at family reunion

Threats he made to another child that caused that child to be so concerned he reported it to the bus driver.

The kid was quite capable of shooting his own gun & had access to it. The gun was left on the dog cage.

The GSR doesn't exclude him and his prints were found on the box holding ammo. That too doesn't exclude him.

His own grand parents thought he was the likely killer and thought he was capable.

His own mother said he changed recently.

Friend of the family says witnessed this boy trying to drown his half-sister.

Teachers called him manipulative and intelligent.

He was misbehaving in school

Grounded recently

Spanked recently

Very obviously angry over it, he brought it up. That anger seems to have been directed at his father. Tim it seems, was in the wrong place at the wrong time