GUILTY Bali - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, found dead in suitcase, 12 Aug 2014 #2

[gitana1]

Does anyone have the statistics of how many Americans have actually been put to death by firing squad in Bali. Or any non Indonesians for that matter?

I think none. At least no westerners. (Foreigners, yes, westerners, no). Tourism is huge in Bali. Executing a westerner would probably really turn off a lot of would-be tourists even while life sentences for a bit of pot does not.

It's huge international news when a westerner is executed in a foreign country.

 

[Suthrnqt]

The following articles are from 2008. Wonder if the dynamic duo had read anything about those Indonesian suitcase murder cases?

... arrested three suspects ... body was found dead in a suitcase ... gave [victim] alcohol until he was drunk and nearly unconscious ... Two other suspects, including a US citizen, remain at large. ...

7/28/08: http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2008/07/28/police-arrest-men-over-039suitcase-murder039.html

7/29/08: http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2008/07/serial-killer-c/
​

* * *

The second article also included this little ditty:

... Over the past month, Indonesia has executed four people convicted for murder. Two were serial killers, according to the Associated Press.
​

Good find Quester. Things that make you go hmmmm!

 

[SouthAussie]

In 2013, four people were executed (one was from Malawi)
In 2008, ten people were executed (two were from Nigeria)
In 2007, one person
In 2006, three people
In 2005, two people
In 2004, three people (one from India, two from Thailand)
In 2001, two people

Currently, people from 18 other countries are included among the death row inmates (although I don't think they have an actual physical 'death row' in prison).

A study from about 10 years ago showed that, at the time, executed people waited 2-12 years until facing the firing squad. Now they say it is more than a 10 year wait.

http://www.hawaii.edu/hivandaids/A_Long_Way_to_the_Abolition_of_the_Death_Penalty_in_Indonesia.pdf
http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Indonesia

 

[Quester]

Rooting around on youtube ...

The following looks like news video/report from Bali or Indonesia. It appears the silver suitcase belonged to SWM. HM is shown saying: "No comment until my lawyer's here." Also, looks like one clip shows TS handing over his cell phone.

Note: Turn your volume way, way down prior to starting, it is unusually loud.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VGubaNzkew

 

[SouthAussie]

Rooting around on youtube ...

The following looks like news video/report from Bali or Indonesia. It appears the silver suitcase belonged to SWM. HM is shown saying: "No comment until my lawyer's here." Also, looks like one clip shows TS handing over his cell phone.

Note: Turn your volume way, way down prior to starting, it is unusually loud.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VGubaNzkew

Good video Quester! (how about the dramatic background music during their news report :giggle

Shows bits and pieces we haven't seen before .. Shelia's name on the luggage tag of the suitcase, bloody clothing and sheet, bit more of the hotel room, TS being fingerprinted ...

It never ceases to amaze me how emotionless HM is. Other than the frequent sips of water, she doesn't really show much nervousness (and no upset) at all.

 

[Lovejac]

Rooting around on youtube ...

The following looks like news video/report from Bali or Indonesia. It appears the silver suitcase belonged to SWM. HM is shown saying: "No comment until my lawyer's here." Also, looks like one clip shows TS handing over his cell phone.

Note: Turn your volume way, way down prior to starting, it is unusually loud.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VGubaNzkew

Great find Quester

 

[otto]

I think none. At least no westerners. (Foreigners, yes, westerners, no). Tourism is huge in Bali. Executing a westerner would probably really turn off a lot of would-be tourists even while life sentences for a bit of pot does not.

It's huge international news when a westerner is executed in a foreign country.

Capital punishment is practiced in the US, so I can't see anyone having serious objections if it is applied to a US citizen convicted of murder in another country ... that is, Bali and the US seem to have the same philosophy about what to do with murderers, so there aren't really any grounds for objections. If someone from Germany, where capital punishment is perceived as barbaric, was subjected to capital punishment in the US, that would be huge international news.

 

[Curious Me]

Rooting around on youtube ...

The following looks like news video/report from Bali or Indonesia. It appears the silver suitcase belonged to SWM. HM is shown saying: "No comment until my lawyer's here." Also, looks like one clip shows TS handing over his cell phone.

Note: Turn your volume way, way down prior to starting, it is unusually loud.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VGubaNzkew

Thank You Quester.

Good video Quester! (how about the dramatic background music during their news report :giggle

Shows bits and pieces we haven't seen before .. Shelia's name on the luggage tag of the suitcase, bloody clothing and sheet, bit more of the hotel room, TS being fingerprinted ...

It never ceases to amaze me how emotionless HM is. Other than the frequent sips of water, she doesn't really show much nervousness (and no upset) at all.

Emotionless, you aren't kidding! She's the opposite of a drama queen here. She didn't even try to look upset about "those armed men that overpowered them and killed her mother". She's calmer than calm, like it's just another day. Hard to feel pity or anything looking at her. Tough exterior, empty inside, dulled emotions, whatever it is it's like looking into a blank void. Hey, hello in there, you know that woman you used to call Mom?

 

[Kamille]

I think none. At least no westerners. (Foreigners, yes, westerners, no). Tourism is huge in Bali. Executing a westerner would probably really turn off a lot of would-be tourists even while life sentences for a bit of pot does not.

It's huge international news when a westerner is executed in a foreign country.

I didn't really think there was much of a chance that either or both of them would actually ever face a firing squad. But it does make a catchy headline and a good scare tactic for raising money.

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Capital punishment is practiced in the US, so I can't see anyone having serious objections if it is applied to a US citizen convicted of murder in another country ... that is, Bali and the US seem to have the same philosophy about what to do with murderers, so there aren't really any grounds for objections. If someone from Germany, where capital punishment is perceived as barbaric, was subjected to capital punishment in the US, that would be huge international news.

I think it's the manner of execution more than the actual act itself that makes westerners a little squeamish.

MOO

 

[otto]

I think it's the manner of execution more than the actual act itself that makes westerners a little squeamish.

MOO

They can be blindfolded if they like, and it's done privately in the middle of the night. That seems a little better than having a room of spectators.

 

[Curious Me]

I think it's the manner of execution more than the actual act itself that makes westerners a little squeamish.

MOO

It's also shocking that someone could be sentenced to a Firing Squad execution for transporting drugs, and not actually harming another person.

 

[SouthAussie]

They can be blindfolded if they like, and it's done privately in the middle of the night. That seems a little better than having a room of spectators.

Not to mention the botched attempts at execution by lethal injection that we have heard of fairly recently. Odds of immediate success seem somewhat better with 12 men in the firing squad.

 

[SouthAussie]

It's also shocking that someone could be sentenced to a Firing Squad execution for transporting drugs, and not actually harming another person.

I think their take on it is that drugs harm many, many people.

"Group 1 drugs are viewed by the Indonesian government as therapeutically useless with a high potential for causing addiction. Group 1 drugs merit the weightiest sentences - life imprisonment for possession, and the death penalty for convicted drug traffickers."

http://goseasia.about.com/od/indonesia/a/Drug-Laws-In-Bali-And-The-Rest-Of-Indonesia.htm

 

[SouthAussie]

Interesting article.....

Drug Laws and Penalties in Southeast Asia – by Country

Southeast Asian countries have strict laws in place for drug-related offenses, and aren't afraid to use them.

The region's diplomats aren't afraid to ignore appeals for clemency from Western governments, if any are made at all. Americans under arrest on drug-related charges pose a dilemma for the State Department - the U.S. government may jeopardize its own war on drugs if it intercedes in such cases.

The pertinent laws and penalties for each country are listed in brief below.

http://goseasia.about.com/od/travelplanning/a/seasia_drugs.htm

 

[Mountain Misst]

Interesting article.....

http://goseasia.about.com/od/travelplanning/a/seasia_drugs.htm

Thanks SA. Jumping off your post... For those curious about HM and TS getting fed and watered, with the odd sarong thrown in:

A US Embassy officer will brief you about Indonesia's legal system and provide you with a list of attorneys. The officer can also notify your family or friends of the arrest, and facilitate the transfer of food, money, and clothing from family or friends back home.

BBM

http://goseasia.about.com/od/indonesia/a/Drug-Laws-In-Bali-And-The-Rest-Of-Indonesia.htm

 

[Kamille]

They can be blindfolded if they like, and it's done privately in the middle of the night. That seems a little better than having a room of spectators.

Crazy discussion but I think that lethal injection sounds better than standing blindfolded in front of 12 people with guns aiming at my heart. And if they miss, or I don't die instantly, some other guy shooting me in the head.

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Thanks SA. Jumping off your post... For those curious about HM and TS getting fed and watered, with the odd sarong thrown in:


BBM

http://goseasia.about.com/od/indonesia/a/Drug-Laws-In-Bali-And-The-Rest-Of-Indonesia.htm

Thanks for that info. I wondered who would be facilitating communication between HM, TS and their supporters in the US.

 

[Quester]

No Verified Insiders on this case yet? We usually have a few on each case.

Any Chicago locals interested in filling in some of the blanks / give a clearer picture of these players? TIA

* * *

Can the US Consulate get word to HM & TS that there is a standing invitation for them to join us? I'm sure we could come up with a few questions for them.

 

[SwampMama]

I am just incredulous at how very stupid these 2 "masterminds" were in the things they did. Hard to believe there was a lot of premeditation going on (in the sense of real planning) but a definite premeditated acts of in the years before as the police were called 86 times, HM assaulted her mother, stole from her and obviously believed that her mother was denying HM all of the money that she believed she had a right to. She was obviously very hostile, aggressive and abusive towards her mother and saw her mother as an obstacle in her life. Well, now her big "obstacle" is gone and she is now alone, pregnant and facing life/death in a notoriously rough foreign prison.

It will be interesting to see how she deals with her sudden change in circumstances as she no longer has her mother to bail her out and look out for her as she also faces becoming a mother herself. Not that i think becoming a mother will suddenly make HM see how much her mother went thru for her, no, she seems the type that will consider her child to be more of a prop while she continues to put herself first. I understand they said that it is possible for her to keep the baby with her in prison but I would hope the child would be taken away. Considering how HM treated her mother, she should not be allowed to have control over a helpless infant.

People like this astound me. Just like Dellon Millard who was very affluent and privileged yet committed a stunningly stupid and senseless crime when he killed a man over a truck worth a few thousand dollars that he could have easily bought, many times over. To brazenly throw away your life, freedom and everything because you insist on having your way.