GUILTY Bali - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, found dead in suitcase, 12 Aug 2014 #2

[nightwatch]

When I read "interests of her unborn child are safeguarded", I think Sheila's estate be given to the child so that the lawyers can collect their fee.

Now there are maternity wagon chasers. Fly nine thousand plus miles to hold the hand of a killer. Real nice!

Protecting the baby's interests, they going to file a motion suggesting the best time to tell the child your mother and father killed your grandmother. Jmo This story continues to be as upsetting today as it was a month ago. Jmo

ciao

 

[FigTree]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/09/12/bali-indonesia-suitcase-murder/15516571/

For one thing, Djoko said, both hotel staff and security-camera footage saw Sheila Mack having a heated argument with Heather Mack and Schaefer in the lobby of the St. Regis before she was killed. The argument was about who would pay for Schaefer's room – Sheila Mack or Schaefer, according to reception-desk manager Nizella, who, like many Indonesians, uses only one name.

Seems the MSM are starting to look at this case a little more, and get some information, and aclarifying a few questions along the way.

For a Human Rights Lawyer to be there at this stage I wonder if they have found evidence in the US before SVM, HM & TS went to Bali that it may have been premeditated murder.

 

[WhitegateGirl]

Ahhh, that's a very good point, FigTree, and it may well explain the argument that was overheard. Some have simply reported it as an argument over who would pay "the" hotel bill--but it very well may have been about who would pay TS's bill. That makes a lot more sense to me than the other interpretation. Thanks for the reply, FigTree. ;-)

 

[Orange Tabby]

Having followed several major crimes over the years, from the time they first made the press to the end of the trial, I know it’s routinely the case that facts announced in the early days turn out to be wrong. I’m sure others on this board, if not absolutely everyone here, has experienced the same thing.

In this case, we have the added problem that there probably aren’t a lot of English language journalists covering the murder who are fluent in the language of the various Indonesians offering reports or comments. If any of those people – police, medical examiners, defense lawyers, and so on – don’t speak perfect English but choose to speak to some of the press in English, that’s another problem. (This may be the origin of the early reports that at least one of Sheila’s fingers was broken, while the medical examiner who spoke to the media was clear that it was a broken fingernail and not a finger.)

Add to this the fact that journalists are not all created equal. I’ve seen my share of very sloppy ones, and it’s too early for us to know how many of that type are the ones covering Sheila’s murder.

All of this means that it is inevitable that at least some confusion will emerge before any trial. Quester has shown us the photograph of Heather’s passport. This photo is clear and credible. It tells us that Heather is 18 years old. Yet most media outlets continue to report her as being 19. It’s a small point, but it represents a mistake and now that a month has passed since Sheila's life was taken it is an inexcusable mistake in my eyes.

I have gathered together here, in one place, some of the major issues, all vastly more important than being one year off on Heather’s age, which have been confused in the media and need to be cleared up:

1. What did the autopsy reveal as to time of death? My recollection is that an official was quoted in the press saying she died something like 12 hours before her body was discovered. But this makes no sense, as it would place the murder before the CCTV video at 3:45 a.m. showing Sheila walking about the resort in a distressed state. It makes even less sense if the case against Heather and Tommy is going to allege that the murder took place after Tommy, concealing something under his shirt, entered Sheila’s room – where Heather was already present – at 8:40 a.m.

2. Which room was Sheila’s and which room was Tommy’s? Who was on the third floor and who was on the sixth has been reported both possible ways.

3. Why did an Indonesian official in one of the early reports say that he believed Heather was the instigator of the attack? He couldn’t have then known about the numerous incidents of domestic violence Heather visited upon Sheila. Early reports concerning fingerprints on the purported murder weapons never mentioned Heather. Is there something investigators are holding back which is significant? Or was this claim made because Heather had behaved so badly during her stay at the St. Regis?

4. How long did the taxi driver with the now infamous suitcase in his boot wait at the hotel? Reports have said both one hour and two hours. Is either of those a reasonable time to have waited? Who specifically made the decision to have the driver take his car to the police? What exactly precipitated this decision? Was Sheila’s body discovered at the St. Regis or at the police station? (These last three issues have seen contradictory accounts in the media.)

5. Did Heather actually telephone Michael Elkin before she was arrested by Bali police? Obviously, Elkin says so. But Elkin also claims that he told Heather that the situation was as serious as a heart attack and she should visit the American consulate asap. Yet police claim to have entered the hotel room to arrest the couple only to find them asleep in bed. Would Elkin lie about a phone call which could be proven to be false? Would Heather actually go back to sleep after such stark advice?

6. Did Heather and Tommy place luggage in the back seat of the taxi and thereafter abandon it? Or did they return and remove it? If the latter, what explanation did they give the taxi driver?

I have ideas about some of these matters. For example, I think Quester is right when s/he pointed out that the photocopied passport page s/he posted with Heather’s info also contains information which appears to be the third floor room number crossed out and the sixth floor room number added. Quester concluded that this means Tommy was on the sixth floor, and I agree.

My point is that these are things which remain murky because of contradictory reports. If members of the press don’t work to sort them out, we may have to wait for the trial to get the level of detail required to make a solid, reasonable judgment.

 

[RR0004]

When I read "interests of her unborn child are safeguarded", I think Sheila's estate be given to the child so that the lawyers can collect their fee.

I don't know why I feel this, but IMO, I think the attorneys probably do have more of an interest in this child than HM ever would. I don't know what her plans were about the baby, but keeping it and raising it does not jive with my image of her.

 

[seaca]

I think the information stream seems to be hotting up at least a little today with these images of Heather Mack behind bars. The descent into insanity has begun
http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

 

[seaca]

and Tommy Schaefer speaks for at least 5 hours.....
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/09/13/us-murder-suspect-finally-faces-questioning.html

 

[seaca]

I think the information stream seems to be hotting up at least a little today with these images of Heather Mack behind bars.
http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

Well not that much more information, but the new images speak volumes

 

[Curious Me]

I think the information stream seems to be hotting up at least a little today with these images of Heather Mack behind bars.
http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

Ah, a finally crying Heather does make me smile. She looks much different than the calm, elegantly smoking her cigarette Heather from only one month ago. How much you want to bet she wants her Mommy about now.

 

[Curious Me]

and Tommy Schaefer speaks for at least 5 hours.....
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/09/13/us-murder-suspect-finally-faces-questioning.html

Thanks. This looks like an informative article. I'll have to read it more carefully after I get some sleep. Sounds like HM and TS haven't had a chance to see each other.

"Schaefer, who was being held at the Bali Police headquarters, was escorted to the Denpasar Police office in the morning and went straight to the interrogation room of the crime section office."

"The police have decided to hold the couple in separate locations to prevent communication between the two suspects, who were arrested on Aug. 13."

bbm ............................................................................................fftobed:

 

[newone]

Indonesia cops press boyfriend in suitcase murder case
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/09/12/bali-indonesia-suitcase-murder/15516571/

I am frosted that the only mention of the death penalty is in reference to TS in this article and not HM ((unborn child argument -- blah blah blah))

ok let the kid be born and then let her face dp if appropriate but pregnancy should not mitigate her penalty ((JMHO))

 

[SouthAussie]

Is this normal for foreign persons detained in Bali to receive this kind of attention and pro bono attorneys?

Yes, they often garner a lot of attention imo. The standards and penalties are so much harsher in Indonesia than in many foreign countries - and people step in to help. Not that they are necessarily successful in achieving a better outcome for the accused.

Australia has been known to issue a grant to assist with the defense of a Nigerian man on death row in Bali in 2010.

Schapelle Corby's legal team was apparently paid for by the Australian Govt (she had Lily Sri Rahayu Lubis S H & Associates, who I believe is HM's attorney's law firm). Schapelle also had pro bono lawyers who helped with the appeal of her 20-year conviction.

http://www.nationalprobono.org.au/page.asp?from=4&id=286
http://lawyerslawyer.net/2009/05/05/another-case-about-one-of-schapelle-corbys-lawyers/

 

[SouthAussie]

I notice that HM's Indonesian lawyer wants her psych test conducted at a non-police run hospital. Wonder how well that will sit with Bali police? And if this is actually Michael Elkin's request that is being carried forth by the Indonesian lawyer?

One would think that police would be leery of granting such a request, given the opportunity/possibility of paying for a false outcome at a different hospital.


Raja said Mack was taken to police-run Bhayangkara Hospital in Denpasar on Wednesday for a check-up on her pregnancy. He said his client had refused to undergo a psychiatric test in the same hospital.

“We have suggested that the police give permission for Heather to undergo a psychiatric test in Sanglah Hospital,” Raja said, without explaining the reason.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/09/13/us-murder-suspect-finally-faces-questioning.html

 

[FigTree]

I notice that HM's Indonesian lawyer wants her psych test conducted at a non-police run hospital. Wonder how well that will sit with Bali police? And if this is actually Michael Elkin's request that is being carried forth by the Indonesian lawyer?

One would think that police would be leery of granting such a request, given the opportunity/possibility of paying for a false outcome at a different hospital.


Raja said Mack was taken to police-run Bhayangkara Hospital in Denpasar on Wednesday for a check-up on her pregnancy. He said his client had refused to undergo a psychiatric test in the same hospital.

“We have suggested that the police give permission for Heather to undergo a psychiatric test in Sanglah Hospital,” Raja said, without explaining the reason.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/09/13/us-murder-suspect-finally-faces-questioning.html

Good Point SA.
Sounds a lot more like the 'Client' (HM) asking for further preferential treatment - unless it is par for the course and Clients are allowed a choice.
The thing is - it sounds to me like a double-edged sword.
Which report holds the advantage?
Possibly neither, because it will depend on which way the pendulum swings on trial day with no Jury. And no doubt, reports differ from Hospital to Hospital, and it will be well established what type of reports come out from each hospital from the Judges. And further more, it will be known if their has been leniency or severity within the reports - its a tight knit system.


And in HM's state of mind it wont matter which report she gets - she will blame everyone else but herself for the sentence she receives.

Do ALL other 'Clients' have to attend a certain nominated hospital and do a certain psychiatric assessment - if so, why should Heather Mack be any different to any other Client?
If it is allowed, will TS get to do his psychiatric assessment at the same Hospital, or will he have to be assessed at the Police nominated Hospital?

Is there a payment made for the psychiatric test in Sanglah Hospital?
Is there a payment made for the psychiatric test at the police-run Bhayangkara Hospital?

It will be more than interesting to see how this pans out, and who gets what between HM & TS.

Another thought was that HM is familiar with Psychiatric assessment processes.
But, this time, those that assess her will be very familiar also with someone who is trying to pull the wool over their eyes.
Yet, I think she may be oblivious to this, and she is under the impression that she can 'control' the situation - which she can to a point - but she may think she is making it better, but in her arrogance, she just may make it a whole lot worse for herself.
JMO

 

[PrimeSuspect]

I think the information stream seems to be hotting up at least a little today with these images of Heather Mack behind bars. The descent into insanity has begun
http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

Thank you seaca for article, just had to print this picture. I have absolutely no sympathy for her.

http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

 

[Quester]

Note: the following article was later revised, removing the room numbers altogether - room numbers that were contrary to what we have been led to believe:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/09/12/bali-indonesia-suitcase-murder/15516571/

 

[Quester]

Thank you seaca for article, just had to print this picture. I have absolutely no sympathy for her.

http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

Maybe it's just the angle but, boy ... that cell looks like it's the size of an old fashioned phone booth! JMO

[cue twilight zone music and I hear "help me, help me" from the little fly w/human head at the end of the classic: "The Fly"]


"Help Me! Help me!"

http://cinefantastiqueonline.com/2007/08/retrospective-the-fly/

 

[FigTree]

Note: the following article was later revised, removing the room numbers altogether - room numbers that were contrary to what we have been led to believe:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/09/12/bali-indonesia-suitcase-murder/15516571/

WoW - I wonder if that has something to do with impact on the Hotel and guest bookings.
Or if for some reason the reported room numbers were incorrect - or there is some legality they cant be published now?
Wonder if charges have been laid - or a date set?

Over-thinking :gaah:

 

[Kamille]

So HM's lawyers, via the Indonesian lawyers, are going to try to use her pregnancy and her possible psychiatric disorder as mitigating factors to determine her sentence? Not sure how either would change the fact that she may have killed her mother so I can only see them as mitigating factors to save her life or to reduce her sentence.

MOO

 

[FigTree]

Thank you seaca for article, just had to print this picture. I have absolutely no sympathy for her.

http://www.news.com.au/world/accuse...-her-unborn-baby/story-fndir2ev-1227057593001

A thousand word picture there!

The sign on the wall - 'kebersihan' translation from google - relates to 'cleanliness' 'hygiene'.
No cleaners coming to pick up your KFC and Macca's wrappers.