GUILTY Bali - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, found dead in suitcase, 12 Aug 2014 #3

[SouthAussie]

Oh .... look at this Indonesian article about the reenactments of the crime. It took 2 hours, done in both rooms 317 and 616. Tommy just had the handle under his shirt (is the Indonesian word for fruit bowl handle the same as fruit bowl .. what is the confusion with this item??) Heather opened the door for him. They both laid Sheila on the bed (or laid on the bed themselves?) once the murder was done. Tommy tried to resuscitate Sheila by placing her head between her knees.

This article contains info by Sudiarta, TS' lawyer presumably. Bit of a different version to HM's lawyer. No HM hiding in the bathroom in this one, though it could just be not mentioned in the article.

Translation on right hand side:
https://translate.google.com/#auto/...ukkan ke dalam koper besar," singkat Sudiarta.

Actual article:
http://www.merdeka.com/peristiwa/rekonstruksi-pembunuhan-st-regis-bali-digelar-tertutup.html

 

[SouthAussie]

Here's another Indonesian article .. bit harder to understand what they are saying, and less informative.

Translation on right hand side:
https://translate.google.com/#auto/...otongan tubuh korban itu ditenteng," tukasnya.

Actual article:
http://news.okezone.com/read/2014/10/13/340/1051747/pembunuhan-bule-as-di-bali-direka-ulang

 

[SouthAussie]

A Malaysian article.

Translation on right hand side:
https://translate.google.com/#auto/...a yang membawa koper menuju lobby," Terangnya.

Actual article:
http://www.merdeka.com/peristiwa/hotel-st-regis-minta-polisi-agar-rekonstruksi-digelar-tertutup.html

 

[newone]

the gist I got from both of the articles is that reconstruction took 2 hours and it was done discretely at the hotel without a lot of spectators ..... results reported to the news by phone

mother did not approve of the relationship (not much of a surprise there)

 

[SouthAussie]

I think it will probably go to court soon. It sounds as though there are only 3 main differences between the BAP (police dossier) and the reconstructed events. It is really hard to tell what those differences are .... maybe who put the suitcase on the trolley, who wheeled it to the lobby, and who carried the suitcase?

http://www.kabarnusa.com/2014/10/pembunuhan-bule-as-dalam-kardus.html
(Google offers the option to translate this page when you open it.)

 

[newone]

I hope it hurries right along! Hopefully HM & TS by now realize that they don't have the option of a defence other than to be ''good and polite'' during their court appearance.

 

[Quester]

RE: "upright" when assaulted

Still stumped on the "upright" when assaulted part and the resulting damage to nose/face so bad that it blocked windpipe. Seems easier to image that damage having happened if the victim was lying down, in bed with the head against pillow/bed or on the floor with floor behind it. There was a lot of blood on a pillow in one of the photos.

ETA: *If* the coroner actually determined [despite the reports to date] the victim was not upright when assaulted, and now that we have the duo's latest version of events, well that could blow a giant hole through the duo's concocted story.

ETA2:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-c...-was-found-suitcase-was-warned-not-go-n179901

- - - >>> Check out the video at that link and note the amount of blood on the pillow!

 

[Kamille]

I'm guessing they are suggesting that they put SWM's head between her knees and that they put her on the bed, probably to explain why there was so much blood on the bed linens. Upright does not have to mean standing up. She could have been sitting up in bed? After being startled by someone standing beside it with a weapon?



ETA: It seems like they are satisfied with the reconstruction matching the evidence though. Only 3 "not influential" differences? Still concerned that they really would like to wash their hands of this.

MOO

 

[Quester]

My point was going more so to the suggestion that something behind the head (pillow/bed, floor, etc) would have held the head somewhat stationary (rather than in air and unsupported) and, therefore, the resulting damage more likely. JMO

ETA: I think LE are still going through the motions in order to coax the truth out that HM was the sole assailant. JMO

 

[Kamille]

My point was going more so to the suggestion that something behind the head (pillow/bed, floor, etc) would have held the head somewhat stationery (rather than in air and unsupported) and, therefore, the resulting damage more likely. JMO

Absolutely agree. She would have fallen down after the first blow unless she had the ability to stay upright and start moving away from the attack. Doesn't look like either happened or were possible based on the description we've been given. I also don't think she would have been foolish enough to have started choking a person while she was not free to move away herself if necessary. Unless they had her pinned up against a wall and were threatening her.

MOO

 

[Quester]

Do Bali LE/DA have to share all discovery with the accused at this investigative point in the case? TIA

 

[ajaylee]

SouthAussie, thanks for the Indonesian articles!

I don't see anything in the current scenario (TS struck SWM 4 times) that explains the alleged blow to the back of the head that broke her neck.

The thing I find most horrifying about the latest scenario is the apparent admission on their part that she was still alive, they knew it - but beyond token alleged efforts to 'revive' her, they did nothing to help her.

I'm trying to remind myself that this is just their official story. We have no way of knowing whether the police are buying a word of it or what the courts will think.

HM is very crafty. If you notice in the videos, she seems to be trying to keep her 'attitude' under control. In one video she can be heard asking her minder to hold her hand and wait for her - talking to her like a kid to its mom, giggling like it's all a big joke. Because she's pregnant, any outbursts on her part will likely be attributed to her hormones and understandable fears for her child.

I've read elsewhere that these reconstructions are a common part of Indonesian trials. Interesting that everything was acted out first by TS, with HM as 'witness', then by HM with TS observing.

 

[gracehatter]

I've read elsewhere that these reconstructions are a common part of Indonesian trials. Interesting that everything was acted out first by TS, with HM as 'witness', then by HM with TS observing.

Yes, and I'm still a little baffled by the fact they would be watching each other's re-enactment. Wouldn't you want them each to do it apart from each other but if the defense lawyers offered this up, it's to their advantage that their client's stories match.

I hate to say this because I really suspect HM did more than what she is saying but I was looking at pictures of her hands when she is first in custody, wearing the black and white outfit where she is holding up a newspaper, her nails look almost pristine. I'd expect some damage..but maybe not. I've been told the gel-coat shellac type polishes are very durable. I don't wear polish so I'm not even sure I'm calling it the right thing.

 

[Kamille]

Noticed a link to another story on the first article that SouthAussie posted. It appears that someone who stabbed their grandmother to death and stole items from her, including cash, mobile phones and a gold chain back in January, was sentenced to a whopping 13yrs in prison. Apparently because he was young and admitted his crime and his grandmother said some bad things to provoke him is why such a lenient term.

SMH

http://www.merdeka.com/peristiwa/bunuh-nenek-sendiri-arvian-dihukum-13-tahun-penjara.html

 

[Orange Tabby]

Yes, and I'm still a little baffled by the fact they would be watching each other's re-enactment. Wouldn't you want them each to do it apart from each other but if the defense lawyers offered this up, it's to their advantage that their client's stories match. [SBM]

I couldn't agree more! They keep the pair apart for two months, and then when they are finally ready to talk the police let each of them tell their stories in the presence of the other, making it much easier for them to concoct the same fairy tale. Very strange.

 

[Kamille]

Yes, and I'm still a little baffled by the fact they would be watching each other's re-enactment. Wouldn't you want them each to do it apart from each other but if the defense lawyers offered this up, it's to their advantage that their client's stories match.

I hate to say this because I really suspect HM did more than what she is saying but I was looking at pictures of her hands when she is first in custody, wearing the black and white outfit where she is holding up a newspaper, her nails look almost pristine. I'd expect some damage..but maybe not. I've been told the gel-coat shellac type polishes are very durable. I don't wear polish so I'm not even sure I'm calling it the right thing.

Both of their hands, arms and faces are completely devoid of any damage being inflicted by someone who was frantically fighting for her life. Other than that bruise on TS's arm, which could have been caused by the handcuffs for all I know, I see nothing on either of them. So how could there have been any attempt on Sheila's part to defend herself against her assailant and why wouldn't there be? We know she had marks on her forearms and a broken fingernail (or finger, that needs to be clarified I guess). But that could have been just from putting her arms up to her face to shield against the blows in self defense. I would think that someone who was supposed to be having the type of argument that has been described, calling someone highly charged names and putting their hands around their neck to choke them, would be aware of and reactionary against any weapon that was being raised to hit them with. Doesn't seem to be the case here. :thinking:

MOO

 

[Kamille]

I couldn't agree more! They keep the pair apart for two months, and then when they are finally ready to talk the police let each of them tell their stories in the presence of the other, making it much easier for them to concoct the same fairy tale. Very strange.

I found it odd that the police would keep releasing evidence to the press that would obviously trickle back to both of them. Although I guess it's the same in our system. No one is required to say anything at any time and they have all the evidence shown to them before a trial so they can make up their stories to their defense attorney to explain it all away.

MOO

 

[Quester]

Yes, and I'm still a little baffled by the fact they would be watching each other's re-enactment. Wouldn't you want them each to do it apart from each other but if the defense lawyers offered this up, it's to their advantage that their client's stories match.

I hate to say this because I really suspect HM did more than what she is saying but I was looking at pictures of her hands when she is first in custody, wearing the black and white outfit where she is holding up a newspaper, her nails look almost pristine. I'd expect some damage..but maybe not. I've been told the gel-coat shellac type polishes are very durable. I don't wear polish so I'm not even sure I'm calling it the right thing.

HM certainly had time, between mid-day Tues when they scampered away from the St R until they were arrested Wed AM, to fix any broken nail if she had the supplies and know-how. She also could have applied a new layer of polish and put her hands in the sun to cure - if I understand correctly how the gel product works.

I understand taking the gel-coat off is quite another story, time consuming, and probably partially why, each time we see a new photo of HM, her gel-coat appears more grown out.

I wonder if she was forced to cut the nail length when she was put on suicide watch?

 

[Hiandmighty]

The gel manicure is hard as a rock-- it doesn't chip or anything. You can peel it off after a while though.

I think a gel manicure could have survived intact with no Damage

 

[Orange Tabby]

.... is the Indonesian word for fruit bowl handle the same as fruit bowl .. what is the confusion with this item?? ... [SBM]

Very vexing indeed. And is it also the same word for "metal plant stand"?! (Ha ha ha.)