GUILTY Bali - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, found dead in suitcase, 12 Aug 2014 #5

[gitana1]

In watching the video interview with William Weiss on both the Tribune and the sun times, Weiss says he thought this was a good first step for justice. He also talks about all the lies that came out of Indonesia. And he says they tried to get Stella out of the prison for a year and a half and that HM would not cooperate.

I'm glad to hear that it sounds like this is not over.


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I'm afraid they won't deport her. They get money from Sheila's estate by keeping her there. And Stella is an Indonesian citizen so they will likely keep her if HM demands it. I can see her making Stella stay there even if she is deported. Ugh.

Justice has not been served in this case. This witch is being rewarded for the murder of her mother.

 

[Weezer Fan]

Stella is not an Indonesian citizen. You must have one parent that is Indonesian to be in information. Just being born there does not make you a citizen like it does in the US


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[Weezer Fan]

https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews..../man-emojis-advise-killers-sentenced-47784331

At Robert Bibbs' sentencing in Chicago federal court, a prosecutor placed the fruit-stand handle used to bludgeon Sheila von Wiese-Mack at a Bali beach resort by the judge's bench. Relatives cried later as prosecutors displayed a photograph of the 62-year-old's body in a suitcase, where her killers stuffed the body.

Autopsy photos showed to the judge showed Wiese-Mack's body with deep gashes across her face and wounds on her arms that prosecutors say resulted from her desperate bid to fend off the blows.
Bibbs pleaded guilty in December to conspiracy to commit foreign murder of a U.S. citizen, which carries a sentence of up to 20 years. But Bibbs lack of a previous criminal record and other factors meant he wouldn't face the maximum penalty. Prosecutors had asked for up to 11 years.

Wiese-Mack's youngster sister, Debbi Curran, also spoke at Bibbs' sentencing. She described how she had searched the internet the day she learned of her sister's death in Bali — only to see a crime photo online of the suitcase that still contained her sister's body.

"I can't look at a suitcase (now) without thinking of my sister's half-naked body ... in a suitcase," she said. "This will haunt me for the rest of my life."



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[Kamille]

[video=youtube;UzzkldPhyJU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzzkldPhyJU[/video]

 

[FigTree]

In watching the video interview with William Weiss on both the Tribune and the sun times, Weiss says he thought this was a good first step for justice. He also talks about all the lies that came out of Indonesia. And he says they tried to get Stella out of the prison for a year and a half and that HM would not cooperate.

I'm glad to hear that it sounds like this is not over.


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Thanks for the quote Weezer Fan
My bold above -

I just wanted to add that way back in the thread I was so hoping that any of Stellas biological families (both TS's mother & the Wiese family members) would try to get Stella out of Indonesia, and I know I was screamingly pushing the point of action.
Im so glad to hear that they did try - the Wiese family - and feel that with all they have been confronted with regarding this nightmare, they have tackled it head on with dignity and
with more integrity than most people could ever muster.

Im feel so sorry for them - they know they have been lied to, they know where the trust fund had been squandered to through bribes and illegal means, they know HM is a psychopathic liar and manipulator who would held Stella as a ransom in prison (Sheilas grand-daughter) for a buck, and yet they still stand together to help bring justice for Sheila. I think they are all very strong people.

-----------

Sister, brother of Bali murder victim speak out at sentencing

CHICAGO 06/03/2017
http://chicago.suntimes.com/news/ma...ving-advice-in-sheila-von-wiese-mack-slaying/

The feds have said Mack and her mother arrived for a vacation in Bali on Aug. 4, 2014.
Bibbs told the feds he knew Mack wanted to try to kill her mother there.

Authorities have said Schaefer arrived on the island a few days later,
on Aug. 12. Mack allegedly told him in a text message they should wait until her mother “passes back out” before trying to kill her.
While waiting, Schaefer texted Bibbs and said an earlier attempt by Mack to kill her mother by overdose had failed.

Well there it is - Heather Mack did try to kill her mother by overdose, prior to Tommy Schaefer coming in and then them both killing her together.
That is two separate attempts to murder SvWM. Mainly because HM had a back up plan if her attempt didnt work - to bring in TS.
To me thats two different charges.
(I am not standing with the Indonesian version of what happened - bits and pieces of information point to HM being involved in the murder much more than what she has been charged with)
When I read the text messages between Bibbs / Mack / Schaeffer it hinted towards HM making a veiled attempt to kill her mother herself, but calling in her boyfriend as she 'couldn't' succeed with it.
This was also pre-meditated. HM had no intention of being the one the finger was going to be pointed at.
Lets see how this turns out down the track.

I think Bibbs took a bargain for 2 years to be shaved off his sentence.
And the Feds might be saving that for when HM returns to the States.
She hasn't been charged with her own exclusive attempt at murder, but I bet they have enough information to get that charge activated.


ETA - Thanks everyone for the links.

 

[FigTree]

Robert Bibbs jailed for nine years after helping advise Tommy Schaefer and then-girlfriend
Heather Mack how to kill her mum Sheila von Wiese-Mack in Indonesia
JUNE 4, 20173:33AM
http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/r...a/news-story/3f88663f7ba5af2ec09b477d3d91f293

 

[Weezer Fan]

Thanks for the quote Weezer Fan
My bold above -

I just wanted to add that way back in the thread I was so hoping that any of Stellas biological families (both TS's mother & the Wiese family members) would try to get Stella out of Indonesia, and I know I was screamingly pushing the point of action.
Im so glad to hear that they did try - the Wiese family - and feel that with all they have been confronted with regarding this nightmare, they have tackled it head on with dignity and
with more integrity than most people could ever muster.

Im feel so sorry for them - they know they have been lied to, they know where the trust fund had been squandered to through bribes and illegal means, they know HM is a psychopathic liar and manipulator who would held Stella as a ransom in prison (Sheilas grand-daughter) for a buck, and yet they still stand together to help bring justice for Sheila. I think they are all very strong people.

-----------


Well there it is - Heather Mack did try to kill her mother by overdose, prior to Tommy Schaefer coming in and then them both killing her together.
That is two separate attempts to murder SvWM. Mainly because HM had a back up plan if her attempt didnt work - to bring in TS.
To me thats two different charges.
(I am not standing with the Indonesian version of what happened - bits and pieces of information point to HM being involved in the murder much more than what she has been charged with)
When I read the text messages between Bibbs / Mack / Schaeffer it hinted towards HM making a veiled attempt to kill her mother herself, but calling in her boyfriend as she 'couldn't' succeed with it.
This was also pre-meditated. HM had no intention of being the one the finger was going to be pointed at.
Lets see how this turns out down the track.

I think Bibbs took a bargain for 2 years to be shaved off his sentence.
And the Feds might be saving that for when HM returns to the States.
She hasn't been charged with her own exclusive attempt at murder, but I bet they have enough information to get that charge activated.


ETA - Thanks everyone for the links.

You may recall Sheila's friend, (Jacob?? something like that), sharing emails he had received from Sheila. That's how it was proven that Sheila knew HM was pregnant before the left for Bali.

In one of those emails, Sheila said HM had gone to the on site clinic, and had gotten a prescription for pain pills. She may have gotten them under Sheila's name, I don't remember. But Sheila knew about it and was upset about it and wrote to her friend about it. Then, HM used them to try to OD her mother. We learned that from the text messages. This isn't new info. Just a reminder since all this had been going on for almost 3 years.

 

[Weezer Fan]

Here it is. The friend of Sheila's is Elliot Jacobson.

In one email to Jacobson dated August 9, while von Wiese-Mack and her daughter were in Bali, von Wiese-Mack wrote, "Heather ran off a few hours ago and she cannot be located. Upon checkout, I discovered that she visited the clinic here and fraudulently signed my name and room number for prescription pain killers four days ago. She secured quite a supply it seems. I am more frightened than ever… I will keep in touch."

Source: Mother Was Concerned For Daughter Months Before Her Bali Murder, Emails Show | NBC Chicago http://www.nbcchicago.com/investiga...fore-Bali-Murder-296950421.html#ixzz4j4EqqrLT

 

[Kamille]

You bring up an interesting point Fig Tree. The FBI know from text messages and emails, that HM apparently tried to kill Sheila herself with drugs but did not succeed. But is there anything that says it was definitely the same night that she then beckoned for TS to come to the room with a weapon or did she try this earlier in the vacation before TS got there? I wonder if they got a toxicology report as part of Sheila's autopsy?

Either way, I don't suppose HM could be charged with that attempted murder when (if) she returns to the US can she?

:waitasec:

 

[FigTree]

Thanks Weezer Fan & Kamille,

yes, Jacob was aware from Sheilas emails that something was going on - Sheila thought there may be some attempt to harm her when she was in the US before she left for Bali.
Thank Goodness for Jacob.

If you cross reference the full text & dates of the Schaefer /Bibbs/ texts the FBI have, and the texts/emails Sheila was sending Jacob - you'll sense the correlation - though we are missing HM's which haven't been published.
If HM's first attempt to kill Sheila by overdose had worked - TS would not have been necessary to come into the room with the fruit bowl. He would have been there for the removal of the body.
Regardless of the attempts, he still would have been involved to the full extent - he wanted the money promised.

I believe that the way the body would be removed will be on HM's phone - and I think that the removal had been planned to be done still via the suitcase.
That would have worked if SvWM had passed out completely and/or died from the overdose and been transportable in an unconscious/deceased state.
They would have still placed Sheila in the suitcase and got a taxi -
then taken the body to the beach (or a similar location like they had planned) and have taken her out of the suitcase, placed her unconscious in the water to drown to make it look like a suicide or an accident and then returned to the hotel with the suitcase, looking as if they did not know what had happened.
The forged prescription of pain killers would have been linked to Sheila and unless there had been some sort of followup (which there would have been because the FBI already knew of the texts) HM & TS might have thought they got away with it.

So the attempt by HM to overdose her mother into unconsciousness/death doesn't work completely - she then calls in the stronger TS to bludgeon her mother because she didn't think she could do it by herself.
She was the first attempt and link in the process of this murder.
But, when Sheila revived from the first attempt, it meant that the first murder attempt failed.
That's when a second attempt was made.

And the reason why I think like this relates to a few things:
The sequence of texts and the directions given of how to kill SvWM after HM's first overdose attempt didn't work,
And the type of murder weapon chosen - a fruit bowl? Thinking about it, of all the weapons to use, a fruit bowl!!?? really??!! Sounds like plan 2 to me - and badly thought out.
Why didn't Sheila scream for her life. Why did no one hear Sheila screaming for her life? Not a murmur.
And the payment to TS. HM had no intention of paying TS much at all for the murder, if anything, but his expenses. She would have said that her involvement would have lessened his payment.
She has coveted the money, the child and any defence she could get involved with her plan.

If we were to believe the story HM & TS gave they were in a heated conversation before TS attacked SvWM. You'd hear Sheila scream.
If Sheila was in a state of drugged unconsciousness and coming too at times, she may have not been able to scream - especially if someone had a pillow over her mouth to muffle her
screams.
Now TS cant hit her and hold a pillow over her mouth at the same time.
Sheila fought for her life. She had a broken finger and bruising from trying to defend herself.
When she died, she was most likely on her back - her nose was damaged so badly - and she choked on her blood going back down her throat after a hit in the face with the bowl.
And I assume that was because she couldn't breath, she was on her back and was pinned down, and a pillow was muffling any sound and suffocating her.
That I think was HM's part and part of her plan.

If HM's first attempt had worked then there would have been no blood on the suitcase and no need for the panicked aftermath reaction and response from HM & TS.
Both of them would have walked out of that room with a suitcase on the trolley to a taxi to the beach or where-ever.
They would not have needed to get the passports out of the safe - they could have returned to the Hotel, feigned ignorance and reported Sheila missing or wait until someone else found her body.
If their sole and only plan had been to bludgeon Sheila in the room, they would have been more prepared - plastic bags to wrap her in, cleaning products, gloves, or they would have done a big act about the break-in and the vandals and wrecked the room and made it look like a robbery gone wrong. There was no thought what so ever to this second attempt, but then again, HM had stolen money to get her boyfriend over there - it was always going to go ahead, but HM's first attempt failed to knock her mother out.

HM instigated every aspect of this murder IMO - she needs to be charged as such.
She had the need and motive, She procured the associates - she stole and fraudulently obtained the airfares for the accomplice, she fraudulently obtained the medication for the purpose of committing murder on her mother, she administered the drugs, she instigated the first attempt to OD her mother, she co-operated in the second attempt with the conspirators before and after the murder.


Really, if the first attempt to knock SvWM out didnt work and Sheila came too, then there was an opportunity to call this all off right there and then. Besides Bibbs not reporting the plans to the Police, when Sheila came too this was the second notable chance they all had not to kill Sheila.
But they proceeded.

JMO

 

[ajaylee]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Tina_Watson

The above-referenced case may hold some clue about the future.

An American man and his new bride went diving in Australia and she died under odd circumstances. He was tried and convicted in Australia. After he returned to the US, he was tried again (and got off, unfortunately).

Based on the Watson case, I'm guessing (hoping!) that even if HM can't be tried for murdering her mother, she can be tried for the separate charge of conspiracy.

FigTree, I've often thought there had to be something incriminating or HM wouldn't have refused to unlock her phone. What I'm waiting for now is to hear TS tell us what actually happened between his last text after he entered the room and the text he sent to RB after it was all over.. I want HM's brutality and nastiness exposed in detail.

 

[Weezer Fan]

Thanks, ajaylee. I copied a few things from your wikipedia link:

He (Gabe Watson) was subsequently sentenced to a term of imprisonment for her manslaughter. (in Austrailia) While he was serving his term, authorities in Alabama flagged an intention to charge him with murder at a later date. After his release, he was deported from Australia to Alabama....

In May 2010, Alabama Attorney-General Troy King announced he had information not yet made public and wanted to try Watson for capital murder, asserting jurisdiction based on the theory that the alleged crime was planned in Alabama....On 25 November 2010 he was deported to the United States and immediately arrested....Alabama prosecutors charged Gabe Watson with murder at the conclusion of his prison sentence in Australia after finding what they claimed was evidence he had plotted to kill his wife while still in the United States.

I copied and pasted bits and pieces that may apply to HM's future murder charges.

 

[Kamille]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Tina_Watson

The above-referenced case may hold some clue about the future.

An American man and his new bride went diving in Australia and she died under odd circumstances. He was tried and convicted in Australia. After he returned to the US, he was tried again (and got off, unfortunately).

Based on the Watson case, I'm guessing (hoping!) that even if HM can't be tried for murdering her mother, she can be tried for the separate charge of conspiracy.

FigTree, I've often thought there had to be something incriminating or HM wouldn't have refused to unlock her phone. What I'm waiting for now is to hear TS tell us what actually happened between his last text after he entered the room and the text he sent to RB after it was all over.. I want HM's brutality and nastiness exposed in detail.

BBM

Yes and maybe the attempted murder as well. I'm still not sure whether she tried that prior to TS arriving, after he arrived or both.

As far as HM not unlocking her phone, that just shows how defiant and sociopathic she is. TS was likely scared to death of the police and his situation and did everything they asked of him. HM was defiant, devious and manipulating. She's not afraid of anything.

I don't think they're going to find anything on her phone from that evening that they haven't already found on TS and RB's phones. What they are looking for IMO, is any other contact she had with anyone other than those two regarding the conspiracy or any other criminal act.

Did we ever find out if they had found and confiscated Sheila's phone? Did she even have one? :waitasec:

MOO

 

[Weezer Fan]

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/p...ing-his-cousin-and-heather-mack-murder-mack-s

My apologies if someone already posted this link. It's from the US Attorney's office and had a few tidbits I did not recall seeing:

...Michael J. Anderson, Special Agent-in-Charge of the Chicago office of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Indonesian law enforcement provided valuable assistance....(We knew the FBI was involved, but here is a name. Also, notice how Indonesian law enforcement gets good marks).

“Repeatedly, the prospect of Von Wiese’s killing was broached and defendant elected to push the plot forward, rather than stop it or extricate himself from it,” Assistant U.S. Attorney Bolling Haxall argued in the government’s sentencing memorandum. “When Schaefer stood at the precipice, defendant provided a push forward.”

Evidence revealed that Bibbs, Schaefer and Mack discussed the murder during a meeting in Bibbs’ Chicago home prior to Mack and Schaefer traveling to Indonesia. ... Soon after his arrival, Schaefer sent a text message to Bibbs, who was in the United States. The message stated that Mack had unsuccessfully attempted to kill Von Wiese, Bibbs’ plea agreement states.

I didn't realize they had plotted in Bibbs' home. Also, it looks like there is texts about Mack, and, it says here, HM tried to kill SVW on her own. We have been saying this, but this is a statement by the US Attorney's office.

 

[FigTree]

Thanks ajaylee, Weezer Fan & Kamille,

Seems they know much of what happened.
Site playing up - I'll post more later.
:tyou:

 

[Kamille]

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/p...ing-his-cousin-and-heather-mack-murder-mack-s

My apologies if someone already posted this link. It's from the US Attorney's office and had a few tidbits I did not recall seeing:

...Michael J. Anderson, Special Agent-in-Charge of the Chicago office of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Indonesian law enforcement provided valuable assistance....(We knew the FBI was involved, but here is a name. Also, notice how Indonesian law enforcement gets good marks).

“Repeatedly, the prospect of Von Wiese’s killing was broached and defendant elected to push the plot forward, rather than stop it or extricate himself from it,” Assistant U.S. Attorney Bolling Haxall argued in the government’s sentencing memorandum. “When Schaefer stood at the precipice, defendant provided a push forward.”

Evidence revealed that Bibbs, Schaefer and Mack discussed the murder during a meeting in Bibbs’ Chicago home prior to Mack and Schaefer traveling to Indonesia. ... Soon after his arrival, Schaefer sent a text message to Bibbs, who was in the United States. The message stated that Mack had unsuccessfully attempted to kill Von Wiese, Bibbs’ plea agreement states.

I didn't realize they had plotted in Bibbs' home. Also, it looks like there is texts about Mack, and, it says here, HM tried to kill SVW on her own. We have been saying this, but this is a statement by the US Attorney's office.

Wow...thanks. So it appears she did try to kill her mother before TS ever got there. And they met at Bibbs house to discuss murdering Sheila for money?! He should have got 20 years at least.

MOO

 

[ajaylee]

I'm not sure, but it's possible that one reason the FBI wants HM's phone is to prove that she originated the plot to hire someone to kill her mother while she was in the US. The conversations that took place right before the murder took place in Indonesia, so it's possible that they aren't relevant under US law. The RB conversations (phone and apparently in person) took place in the US. For a really solid case, the FBI probably wants hard evidence, not just testimony, that HM actually solicited someone to kill her mother while still on US soil. I notice that RB originally tried to claim some of the texts on his phone were probably from unidentified people borrowing his phone and using it - and him not noticing, yeah, right.

I'm guessing this might be a factor because in the case I cited above, the American who took his wife to Australia and murdered her, he was tried in Australia because that's where the murder was committed, but he also fell under US jurisdiction because he planned the murder in the US.

 

[possumheart]

Inside the prison
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4583244/Kerobokan-prison-Bali-Foreign-Correspondent-ABC.html
Reiterates that money can buy anything there.

 

[FigTree]

Inside the prison
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4583244/Kerobokan-prison-Bali-Foreign-Correspondent-ABC.html
Reiterates that money can buy anything there.

Just trying to find the full episode on Foreign Corespondent - but TS makes an appearance in the trailer for the episode.

[video]https://youtu.be/0GJlO0p_Frc[/video]

 

[FigTree]

I'm not sure, but it's possible that one reason the FBI wants HM's phone is to prove that she originated the plot to hire someone to kill her mother while she was in the US. The conversations that took place right before the murder took place in Indonesia, so it's possible that they aren't relevant under US law. The RB conversations (phone and apparently in person) took place in the US. For a really solid case, the FBI probably wants hard evidence, not just testimony, that HM actually solicited someone to kill her mother while still on US soil. I notice that RB originally tried to claim some of the texts on his phone were probably from unidentified people borrowing his phone and using it - and him not noticing, yeah, right.

I'm guessing this might be a factor because in the case I cited above, the American who took his wife to Australia and murdered her, he was tried in Australia because that's where the murder was committed, but he also fell under US jurisdiction because he planned the murder in the US.

Good point!
I think they have all they need with Bibbs being sentenced.
I wonder who else she asked prior to RB & TS.
One or more of her crew maybe.

Currently Im wondering what Favia is doing - is she representing HM?
Wouldnt that a huge conflict of interest.
I know it was discussed early on when Favia put her hand up to represent HM & then Stella who was not yet born.
I wondered what involvement she still has.
Anyone know?