Bosma Murder Trial 02.24.16 - Day 14

[sleuther76]

What if...this is just the beginning of a lengthy trial? I don't think the crown is done presenting it's case, do you? Do you believe they would indict MS solely on "suspect" evidence?

Based on their opening statements (which outlines the case they are going to present) it does look like it is just suspect and cell phone evidence.

 

[sleuther76]

But they have witness testimony that he was there when TB went on the test drive with two men. So between that and his cell phone history, he was likely one of the men who got in the truck for the test drive. Question is, was he there when TB was being confined and ultimately killed?

MOO

Can you link to that witness testimony that identifies MS as the person that went on the test drive with TB? I do not believe SB or the tenant (forgot his name) were able to identify MS in a police line up (or that police tried). The only person to identify MS at this point is one of the other truck owners.

 

[Ironworker736]

Based on their opening statements (which outlines the case they are going to present) it does look like it is just suspect and cell phone evidence.

I see what you're saying, but with all due respect, an opening statement is basically just a summary. They can't possibly list every piece of evidence, otherwise it would likely take a week for the opening statement alone (in this case anyway). JMO

 

[Kamille]

And this is where I start asking the questions that get me yelled at.

Say I have done things that should at least qualify me for a charge of "accessory" or whatever. LE knows I did those things. Under what specific circumstances do I NOT get charged for those things, and do the specifics of that transaction ever end up in any official record?

Or to state the obvious, if it's not a plea deal, what is it called? How is he not getting charged?

(I'm not trying to be argumentative or obtuse, and I know this probably isn't the first time I've asked this. Bear with me; I'm at the age where the short and mid term memory doesn't stick so well, and each week we learn more about SS's involvement. Plus I really don't do trials.)

I have no idea really. But if a witness is "co-operating" even if they are lying their butts off about their own personal knowledge of things, then I guess LE just go with their testimony if they can't prove otherwise. And if it's helpful to the case against the main perpetrator than that's a real bonus isn't it?

:dunno:

MOO

 

[ABro]

I suspect Abro's gonna come back tonight and yell at us again for being curious about "deals", but the SS situation just gets more and more inscrutable. And infuriating.

I would never ever yell at you Ariane.
:fence:

 

[ArianeEmory]

I would never ever yell at you Ariane.
:fence:

Well, to be fair I basically ask the same dumb question once a week.

Edit: and I'm just trying to figure out the MECHANICS of it on paper, not being righteously indignant about the morality of it or anything.

 

[RandomName479]

Can you link to that witness testimony that identifies MS as the person that went on the test drive with TB? I do not believe SB or the tenant (forgot his name) were able to identify MS in a police line up (or that police tried). The only person to identify MS at this point is one of the other truck owners.

Day 4/5 - IT testimony. IIRC IT picked MS out of a line up after DM had been arrested. There was also an agreed statement of fact submitted as evidence in which MS admitted to being present for that test drive. MOO cuz I'm too lazy at the moment to find the tweets.....really wish we had transcripts....

 

[aawaterloo]

But they have witness testimony that he was there when TB went on the test drive with two men. So between that and his cell phone history, he was likely one of the men who got in the truck for the test drive. Question is, was he there when TB was being confined and ultimately killed?

MOO

Additionally, MS has already admitted to be the person who went "along" to test drive Igor's truck. Also I believe crown's OS says that video captured outside the hanger would show DM and MS firing up the incinerator. So in my opinion there is enough evidence already to believe that MS was with DM on the 6th and the 7th.

 

[Night_is_Mine]

Additionally, MS has already admitted to be the person who went "along" to test drive Igor's truck. Also I believe crown's OS says that video captured outside the hanger would show DM and MS firing up the incinerator. So in my opinion there is enough evidence already to believe that MS was with DM on the 6th and the 7th.

I know Igor picked him out of the line up but why would he admit to it?? His case would be much stronger if he denied it. What's in it for him admitting it???

 

[ArianeEmory]

Wasn't there a thing where there was a specific reason that witnesses like SB were not outright asked to confirm DM/MS as being the persons that night?

 

[Night_is_Mine]

Wasn't there a thing where there was a specific reason that witnesses like SB were not outright asked to confirm DM/MS as being the persons that night?

Was there? I thought it's because they weren't 100% sure.

 

[Gibson67]

Lol...I think she is referring to plea deals. The deal with SS, if there was one, would not be a plea deal because he was never arrested.

MOO

we did not know that MM was arrested until today either though so you never know.

 

[deugirtni]

Hmm, so he's not THAT short (as a trialgoer described). Maybe he's got bad posture.

I'm just catching up (again), but wanted to say that during the times when I have been at court, MS has actually been sitting up straight, with straight back, good posture.... can't say the same for DM however. He (MS) may have just *seemed* short in relation to DM.. I'm not sure of DM's actual height (or MS's for that matter), I think we have heard anywhere between say 6'1 and 6'4"?

 

[sleuther76]

Day 4/5 - IT testimony. IIRC IT picked MS out of a line up after DM had been arrested. There was also an agreed statement of fact submitted as evidence in which MS admitted to being present for that test drive. MOO cuz I'm too lazy at the moment to find the tweets.....really wish we had transcripts....

Yes, that proved he was at the IT test drive, but it doesn't prove that he was at the TB test drive. You said earlier that a witness testified that MS went on the TB test drive of which we have heard nothing along those lines ... just that a cell phone which is allegedly MS's was at TB's house that day, but we have no actual proof that that was MS's cell phone.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

SS is clearly going to take the stand for the prosecution at some point. It's also clearly the reason he is not charged. He knows what happened and will spill it all, if he's to keep his deal with the Crown and LE. He traded Smich's a$$ for his. That's the rationale for what is going on right now. If SS didn't have the goods on them (and I mean DM AND SS), then he would not be sitting pretty right now. Lucky for SS, he had the currency LE needed, and cashed it in. All IMO of course.

 

[sleuther76]

Additionally, MS has already admitted to be the person who went "along" to test drive Igor's truck. Also I believe crown's OS says that video captured outside the hanger would show DM and MS firing up the incinerator. So in my opinion there is enough evidence already to believe that MS was with DM on the 6th and the 7th.

I just wonder whether that prove's 1st degree murder. IMHO it doesn't at this point. Let's see what else we hear ...

 

[RandomName479]

Yes, that proved he was at the IT test drive, but it doesn't prove that he was at the TB test drive. You said earlier that a witness testified that MS went on the TB test drive of which we have heard nothing along those lines ... just that a cell phone which is allegedly MS's was at TB's house that day, but we have no actual proof that that was MS's cell phone.

BBM - I did?

 

[Arnie M]

Did this bunch plan of replacing the wind shield also? Perhaps TB's truck had the security feature of etching. I once owned a vehicle that had a security feature of the VIN number being etched into one or all windows. The numbers were not visible to the naked eye, special lighting was needed to find and and view these numbers. MOO.

Arnie was the one that mentioned it was necessary to remove the windshield to change the VIN, so maybe he can give us a bit more detail- Arnie??? Toss us your "coles notes" version on changing a VIN Please & thank you!!

Years ago vehicle serial numbers were stamped on a metal tag riveted on a permanent part of the car that will never be removed or replaced during its lifetime ... such as the firewall (under the hood) or on a door pillar .

In modern day nearly every vehicle has a visible identification tag under the lower left corner of the windshield. That way police , insurance agents , towing companies , part suppliers , (etc) can quickly and easily access the factory specs and production serial number without having to enter a locked vehicle , or peer into a dark engine compartment

Because it is so visible , car thieves usually try to alter , or replace , or hide this tag. The only way to access it properly is to remove the windshield and special tools are required because the glass is bonded to the steel car body with a very strong urethane adhesive ... and in the case of the thief he tries to remove the glass without breaking it so he can use it again ... hard to do , but not impossible. Someone like DM or SS may simply buy new glass but they are expensive and thieves usually have a lack of money.

Even after all that , it is very difficult to change or alter a VIN tag ... they are made of special material and use special rivets that indicate tampering. Plus for the serious investigator there are many other (secret) and hidden places on the chassis where a VIN is also stamped.

As well , many cars have several digits of the serial number stamped on the engine block ... so if you ever see a collector car for sale and it says ... "numbers match" ... it means the car still has the original engine block as installed by the factory which is important to purist collectors.

 

[ADAWG]

So you believe that they have a connection between the DNA swab they picked up and something in the case? I don't believe we heard anything to that effect in the opening statements.

What if there is no DNA evidence to connect MS? What then? Just a cellphone history for a cellphone that isn't conclusively connected to him.

This all just seems very suspect. On one hand you have a lot of evidence against someone who is not in the witness box and on the other hand you have very little evidence against someone who is. What's more it would appear that the person not in the box cut some sort of deal ... MOO

I don't think LE would've had Someone follow him strictly to grab something with his DNA to be proactive. I think they found something whether it was hair, straw, cigarette butt at one of the scenes that they wanted to test against his to put him at the scene.


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[aawaterloo]

I know Igor picked him out of the line up but why would he admit to it?? His case would be much stronger if he denied it. What's in it for him admitting it???

In my opinion, that's a tactical move from his (MS) defense. Igor said smaller guy was quite like a fish. Igor also testified that taller guy did the talking. Igor also said taller guy also looked at the shorter guy he made the army comment (in my opinion to indicate "abort"). So implying MS just went along to check out a truck his friend planned on buying