Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #7

[CJPRINCESS]

A good clarification on the gloves:


http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...eaned-when-police-found-it-murder-trial-hears

Glove 1: DM inside; TB, CN outside
Glove 2: DM, CN inside; DM, CN outside
Golve 3: CN inside; CN outside.

Someone had a run down of all the gloves with the DNA matches a while back. My internet is being horribly slow today so having a hard time flipping through everything. But wasn't there more then 3 gloves? I recall more (3 in DM's pocket, 1 at farm and 2 with the incinerator invoice)?

 

[deugirtni]

IMO, at this point it hasn't been made clear, and I'm just speculating due to the fact that Sachak has stated he is going to need 2 more hours with JV. At his point they have JV with some point of ownership in the red truck . He's the first person who owed DM money and the first that DM apparently owed money to (in way of back pay)

So the question is why in heavens name would Sachak need to cross examine JV for another 2 hours? He's already stated that he didn't really know MS. He's given his accounting of what he was doing during the week. He gave a statement to LE on May 13th, so he's been co-operating right from the start. IMO, DM's defence is going to make a run on the "framing aspect" with JV. MOO

Remember how long it took Sachak to cross SH? Same things, repeated questions, ongoing statements about what a great guy DM was, and offering a great opportunity to SH (even though it hasn't been established that that business ever would have actually come to fruition), how grateful SH should be and how beneficial to HIM to have a 'rich' contact like DM.

It is same old same old, with Mr. V. Almost like intimidation via, look at all he did for you, and yet here you are on the stand, giving evidence against him?. Everything out in the open.. same stories.. 'but he didn't hide the incinerator at the hangar, it was in full view, right?'. The Crown took a long time to get testimony form Mr. V, so the longer Sachak can make it take, the more he can repeat things, intimidate and make Mr. V sweat, and make his own statements about what a swell guy DM really was.

 

[andreww]

Did any of the gloves have MSs DNA on them? Of course it doesn't mean he wasn't there, just that he took more care in what he did with the ones he wore, unlike Millard who safely disposed of his in his pocket.


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[SnooperDuper]

Did any of the gloves have MSs DNA on them? Of course it doesn't mean he wasn't there, just that he took more care in what he did with the ones he wore, unlike Millard who safely disposed of his in his pocket.


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I don't think anything has turned up with MS's DNA on it yet.

 

[andreww]

Remember how long it took Sachak to cross SH? Same things, repeated questions, ongoing statements about what a great guy DM was, and offering a great opportunity to SH (even though it hasn't been established that that business ever would have actually come to fruition), how grateful SH should be and how beneficial to HIM to have a 'rich' contact like DM.

It is same old same old, with Mr. V. Almost like intimidation via, look at all he did for you, and yet here you are on the stand, giving evidence against him?. Everything out in the open.. same stories.. 'but he didn't hide the incinerator at the hangar, it was in full view, right?'. The Crown took a long time to get testimony form Mr. V, so the longer Sachak can make it take, the more he can repeat things, intimidate and make Mr. V sweat, and make his own statements about what a swell guy DM really was.

I think the defensive strategy here is that Millard wasn't hurting for money. He was paying JV, albeit late at times, he was letting him live in a place that he could rent for much more, and he was loaning him large amounts of cash without pressuring for payback. I think you are all jumping the gun on the framing angle and I highly doubt the evidence will support it. This case is Smich vs Millard. Millard is going to say Smich did it, he had no reason to kill over a paltry sum of a truck. Smich will say Millard acted on his own while he was in the other truck, and will try to minimize his involvement afterward to only the things the evidence can tie him to.

Personally I think the ship has sailed on Millards defence, Smich's is still in play.


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[Kamille]

Before we consider that MS wasn't there because his DNA/fingerprints weren't there, lets ponder the fact that the ONLY DNA/fingerprint evidence for DM (who had much more access to TB's truck that week) that was found was one fingerprint on the truck mirror and one on the driver's door and his DNA on gloves that he had in his pocket, likely from wearing to move evidence on the same morning of the day that he was eventually arrested. That is an incredible cleanup of their own DNA/fingerprints if you ask me. Apparently TB's DNA was a lot harder to get rid of, understandably.

MOO

 

[RandomName479]

I think the defensive strategy here is that Millard wasn't hurting for money. He was paying JV, albeit late at times, he was letting him live in a place that he could rent for much more, and he was loaning him large amounts of cash without pressuring for payback. I think you are all jumping the gun on the framing angle and I highly doubt the evidence will support it. This case is Smich vs Millard. Millard is going to say Smich did it, he had no reason to kill over a paltry sum of a truck. Smich will say Millard acted on his own while he was in the other truck, and will try to minimize his involvement afterward to only the things the evidence can tie him to.

Personally I think the ship has sailed on Millards defence, Smich's is still in play.


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I agree with you.....but why the "someone I work with is setting me up" text.....you think he was referring to MS? or he knew the $hit was hitting the fan and wanted to get some people in his corner by pretending he had nothing to do with it?

 

[SnooperDuper]

Someone had a run down of all the gloves with the DNA matches a while back. My internet is being horribly slow today so having a hard time flipping through everything. But wasn't there more then 3 gloves? I recall more (3 in DM's pocket, 1 at farm and 2 with the incinerator invoice)?

I don't think they got anything off the other ones.

 

[andreww]

I agree with you.....but why the "someone I work with is setting me up" text.....you think he was referring to MS? or he knew the $hit was hitting the fan and wanted to get some people in his corner by pretending he had nothing to do with it?

I think he was just saying something so as not to alarm her. He just put it out there and probably immediately regretted it. That was 3 years ago and we haven't heard a word of a frame up since.


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[matou]

[h=1]Tim Bosma Murder Trial: Testimony of Millard's business partner | EXHIBIT #113 and #115[/h]
[video=youtube;IUNqMhyndo4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUNqMhyndo4&index=1&list=UUnsj4TU7mOQ-4l2HOaRekgA[/video]

 

[Arnie M]

I wonder about CN realizing that she may be going to jail, and the lover got a $10,000 bonus.

Haaaaa .... you bad bad bad ....haaaaa .... but so true at the same time. I think most of us started out expecting a script right out of a Hitchcock Movie and now we find ourselves immersed in a soap opera .... I love your thinking Inspector Colombo

 

[Melzack]

While reading the tweets and reading the articles about the trial, I always wonder why MS doesn't glance over at DM during court. I think that perhaps DM gave police info to incriminate MS and now he's mad? Apparently DM always looks at him but he makes no eye contact. They were buddies once upon a time...

 

[Sphinx]

While reading the tweets and reading the articles about the trial, I always wonder why MS doesn't glance over at DM during court. I think that perhaps DM gave police info to incriminate MS and now he's mad? Apparently DM always looks at him but he makes no eye contact. They were buddies once upon a time...

He is probably acting on the advice of his smart lawyer. It looks better if he keeps his distance from DM as much as possible, and does not interact with him in any way. This might give the jury the impression he really is different from DM, and did not commit murder, but was just there when it happened, and then helped in the clean up. IMO

 

[MsSherlock]

Just jumping off your post...

I think JV's biggest disadvantage over other witnesses is that he is the last witness before a 5 or 6 day break...he is going to be over analyzed, particularly because the Defense said they need another 2 hours to cross examine him. That has a lot of people wondering what this guy could be up to that they need another 2 hours to dig into. MOO

Personally I think he is just another one of DM's partnerships/business relationships that was built on sand. No different than the young guy that thought they were starting an aviation endeavor together. JV was slugging his way through the renovation projects, late payments etc. because he had the vision of the new business partnership in his mind..building those big homes at the farm. The trend seems to be that all these guys thought DM was able to bankroll these big projects and he flashed enough cash to keep that image alive and well. So far the defense hasn't had much to go after but it appears they are going to try to attack this witness. But for me...tax evasion, un-clarified trips to Colombia etc. don't equate to him being involved in kidnapping/murder. In fact if his testimony hold up, his testimony is more damning to DM ie: switching of the vehicles etc. MOO

Just to clarify the tax evasion issue. FWIK, all that has been said is that JV received cash. There's no crime against that- anyone can get paid cash. What is law is that an employer (in this case DM via Millardair or Millard Properties) MUST issue a T4 prior to the end of February. If DM was paying him cash, it's actually DM that's circumventing the tax system. There's no indication that JV filed a tax return falsifying income info so IMHO, JV has simply not complied with the CRA's requirement to file an annual income tax return. Pretty hard to file when you don't have an accounting from the person who's paying you. DM was taking advantage of his "english as a second language" Columbian construction crew. Also, LW the book keeper never made mention of JV on the payroll. Wonder how DM was putting his rentals and auto lease thru his books. He's probably up to his neck with the CRA and we just don't know about it. MOO

 

[Kamille]

I think he was just saying something so as not to alarm her. He just put it out there and probably immediately regretted it. That was 3 years ago and we haven't heard a word of a frame up since.


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Except for here oddly. :waitasec:

MOO

 

[Sphinx]

I wonder about CN realizing that she may be going to jail, and the lover got a $10,000 bonus.

I wonder if MB ever tried to do something nice for CN after DN was arrested ? I believe DM payed for her lawyer, and MB likely had to pay for that, since she seems to be in charge of the family finances now. MB was generous with SS, and the real estate girlfriend, but not it seems with V, and his crew who were owed back wages. V also had to pay back taxes he thought DM had payed. Of course there was so much cash being payed that was not on any books, it is hard to tell what really happened.

I remember reading that CN was aware of LB's sexual relationship with DM. Perhaps she knew about the real estate agent's friendship "with benefits" as well. This does not mean that she was not angered by it, but maybe she thought he was a great catch, and she would be the one he would marry. Young girls often think like that unfortunately. IMO

 

[Kamille]

Just to clarify the tax evasion issue. FWIK, all that has been said is that JV received cash. There's no crime against that- anyone can get paid cash. What is law is that an employer (in this case DM via Millardair or Millard Properties) MUST issue a T4 prior to the end of February. If DM was paying him cash, it's actually DM that's circumventing the tax system. There's no indication that JV filed a tax return falsifying income info so IMHO, JV has simply not complied with the CRA's requirement to file an annual income tax return. Pretty hard to file when you don't have an accounting from the person who's paying you. DM was taking advantage of his "english as a second language" Columbian construction crew. Also, LW the book keeper never made mention of JV on the payroll. Wonder how DM was putting his rentals and auto lease thru his books. He's probably up to his neck with the CRA and we just don't know about it. MOO

I believe he also said he received cheques. Likely submitted through a Millard company using the blank invoices that DM happened to have on his computer. With JV's SIN attached to the company. Which is how the CRA likely tracked him down for back taxes as an independent contractor. So sometimes he was paid cash under the table, and sometimes he was paid through the company with a cheque that went through the books.

MOO

ETA: But to clarify, I don't think JV understood the ramifications of getting these cheques as an independent contractor.

 

[Kamille]

I wonder if MB ever tried to do something nice for CN after DN was arrested ? I believe DM payed for her lawyer, and MB likely had to pay for that, since she seems to be in charge of the family finances now. MB was generous with SS, and the real estate girlfriend, but not it seems with V, and his crew who were owed back wages. V also had to pay back taxes he thought DM had payed. Of course there was so much cash being payed that was not on any books, it is hard to tell what really happened.

I remember reading that CN was aware of LB's sexual relationship with DM. Perhaps she knew about the real estate agent's friendship "with benefits" as well. This does not mean that she was not angered by it, but maybe she thought he was a great catch, and she would be the one he would marry. Young girls often think like that unfortunately. IMO

I am very suspicious of the letter from DM that told CN to get in touch with the "friend" to change their testimony and that she knew what to do to get them to be able to do that. I think anyone who was willing to co-operate with DM's defence team and figure out how to "fix" their original statements on cross examination was rewarded. Wouldn't be the first time we've seen this either. Once again, think Jodi Arias and her magazine codes.

MOO

 

[MsSherlock]

I wonder if MB ever tried to do something nice for CN after DN was arrested ? I believe DM payed for her lawyer, and MB likely had to pay for that, since she seems to be in charge of the family finances now. MB was generous with SS, and the real estate girlfriend, but not it seems with V, and his crew who were owed back wages. V also had to pay back taxes he thought DM had payed. Of course there was so much cash being payed that was not on any books, it is hard to tell what really happened.

I remember reading that CN was aware of LB's sexual relationship with DM. Perhaps she knew about the real estate agent's friendship "with benefits" as well. This does not mean that she was not angered by it, but maybe she thought he was a great catch, and she would be the one he would marry. Young girls often think like that unfortunately. IMO

Everyone was submissive to DM. He killed or fired anyone who wasn't. MOO

 

[Sillybilly]

Stop the speculation about the witness JV as it relates to anything drug related. There is absolutely NOTHING in testimony or MSM that would indicate such a connection and the spec in that regard is unacceptable stereotyping.

:tyou: