CA CA - Emmanuel Haro, 7-months, reported kidnapped 7:30pm from Big 5 parking lot, Yucaipa Blvd, Yucaipa, 14 Aug 2025 *Arrest* #3

[angelainwi]

Hughes knew exactly what JH did to his 10 week old daughter and the aftermath, so I believe he knew what he was capable of.
It was a miracle that PF survived, which she wasn't expected to do.

Hughes reputation went into the gutter when people found out he represented JH in 2018, he was getting harassed.

In addition who was going to pay him this time?

Who paid Hughes and how much back in Oct 2018 thru when JH was charged in 2021 and then sentenced in 2023?
imo

Wasn't Hughes his public defender prior to 2025?

 

[angelainwi]

You make an excellent point. In all events, I wonder why his lawyer wasn’t there. Maybe they got around it by not asking him any questions, but what was their plan if he started talking? Maybe the lawyer was there but not in the photos? Unusual for a lawyer to let that happen without him there, and speculating here since I don’t know this area of the law, but I would be surprised if the attorney wasn’t given the opportunity to come.

IT appears that Hughes stopped representing Jake right around the arrest. The split could have happened shortly after the arrest.

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

I would also say that we had been abused and neglected from the day he came home from the hospital. I see the Deputy Public Defender has said that the parents will need public defenders, with at least one requiring separate counsel. Does that mean they will be tried separately?
I wonder why the arraignment was moved to September 5th?

https://www.newsnationnow.com/missing/emmanuel-haro-jake-rebecca-court-hearing/

They’re not likely to be tried separately, but they still need separate counsel because an attorney can’t effectively represent both because of the conflict of interest.

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

IT appears that Hughes stopped representing Jake right around the arrest. The split could have happened shortly after the arrest.

Aaah okay that makes a lot more sense then.

I wonder if he’s still on the hook for representing him in the hearing for the parole violation — the court won’t always allow you to quit when you’re a criminal attorney, even if your client doesn’t pay (which is why it makes total sense that VH would represent him up until the point of the arrest for murder, and then peace out).

 

[Nieves]

View attachment 611140

Parents of missing 7-month-old baby Emmanuel Haro charged with murder in California

They were also charged with knowingly filing a false police report, according to Riverside County prosecutors.

www.cbsnews.com

I was waiting for this

 

[angelainwi]

Aaah okay that makes a lot more sense then.

I wonder if he’s still on the hook for representing him in the hearing for the parole violation — the court won’t always allow you to quit when you’re a criminal attorney, even if your client doesn’t pay (which is why it makes total sense that VH would represent him up until the point of the arrest for murder, and then peace out).

Wasn't he acting as a public defender in the original case?

 

[Izzylizzy]

You say hola
We say adiós

"In this screen grab from a video, Rebecca Haro is shown in court, in Riverside County, Calif., on Aug. 26, 2025."
KABC

Parents of missing 7-month-old child appear in court first time since arrest, charged with murder

The parents of Emmanuel Haro -- the missing 7-month-old child -- appeared in a California court on Tuesday after they were charged with his murder.

abcnews.go.com

 

[Nieves]

From Newsnation RE: attorneys, bail and Jake's other pending (trailing?) case.

I was waiting for this

 

[JoeFromLB]

JMO but the death penalty is entirely appropriate here. Not sure this qualifies as "special circumstances" though. Of course, they both might be in their 80's before it would be carried out. And now they're emptying Death Row at San Quentin and farming out condemned inmates to various other prisons.

 

[Nieves]

JMO but the death penalty is entirely appropriate here. Not sure this qualifies as "special circumstances" though. Of course, they both might be in their 80's before it would be carried out. And now they're emptying Death Row at San Quentin and farming out condemned inmates to various other prisons.

There's a sense of peace when the judicial system takes over and begins the process of trying to clarify what happened. And on top of that, it's the beginning of the end for these criminals, these evildoers.

 

[Nieves]

You say hola
We say adiós

"In this screen grab from a video, Rebecca Haro is shown in court, in Riverside County, Calif., on Aug. 26, 2025."
KABC

Parents of missing 7-month-old child appear in court first time since arrest, charged with murder

The parents of Emmanuel Haro -- the missing 7-month-old child -- appeared in a California court on Tuesday after they were charged with his murder.

abcnews.go.com

Why isnt she acting now?

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

I checked the California definition:

First-degree murder, as defined under California Penal Code § 187, requires proof of malice aforethought, meaning the defendant intended to kill or acted with a reckless disregard for human life. Convictions can lead to severe penalties such as life without parole or the death penalty.

https://www.findlaw.com/state/california-law/california-first-degree-murder-laws.html

I am confused about the difference between first-degree and murder with malice in CA. Would love if someone here could explain it. tia

jmopinion

Honestly had to look it up myself, and I remain confused. I’m in California, but they didn’t teach us California criminal law.

So what I can tell you based on what I found is that the section you’ve quoted there isn’t the crime of first degree murder, but rather the crime of murder in general. It is section 189 that defines whether a crime meeting the definition of murder is first degree or second degree. First degree murder is murder that meets any of the criteria outlined in that section (of which there are several). Second degree murder is defined as all other murders. So, “murder with malice” doesn’t seem to be a lower charge from first degree murder, it’s just an umbrella charge.

What I don’t know is what this would look like in those jail records that have been posted. You can see that both RH and JH have charges for violating 187. The one that specifies first degree murder for Rebecca still just references 187, not 189(a).

I think we need to see the criminal complaint to know for sure what degree of murder they’re each charged with. Does anyone have the PDF? There’s no copyright issue with those so we should be able to copy them here in full.

 

[Absoluterubbish]

Honestly had to look it up myself, and I remain confused. I’m in California, but they didn’t teach us California criminal law.

So what I can tell you based on what I found is that what you’ve quoted there isn’t the crime of first degree murder, but rather the crime of murder in general. It is section 189 that defines whether murder is first degree or second degree. First degree murder is murder that meets any of the criteria outlined in that section (of which there are several). Second degree murder is defined as all other murders. So, “murder with malice” doesn’t seem to be a higher or lower charge from first degree murder, it’s an umbrella charge.

What I don’t know is what this would look like in those jail records that have been posted. You can see that both RH and JH have charges for violating 187. The one that specifies first degree murder for Rebecca still just references 187, not 189(a).

I think we need to see the criminal complaint to know for sure what degree of murder they’re each charged with. Does anyone have the PDF? There’s no copyright issue with those so we should be able to copy them here in full.

It wasn't specified in the DA's documents whether it was first or second degree.

From what I have read and posted you are correct that murder with malice is the blanket charge. This then needs to be updated to either first or second degree murder before proceeding as the penalties are different for each. It appears Rebeccas has been updated to first degree already and Jake's will be updated to either first or second degree sometime soon.

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

Wasn't he acting as a public defender in the original case?

Good question, I’m not sure whether he was court-appointed for that case.

 

[caradana]

Trying them together would open up decades of potential grounds for appeals after. Hopeful for the most long-term cost-effective, most invincible route of separate trials.

 

[sunspun]

You make an excellent point. In all events, I wonder why his lawyer wasn’t there. Maybe they got around it by not asking him any questions, but what was their plan if he started talking? Maybe the lawyer was there but not in the photos? Unusual for a lawyer to let that happen without him there, and speculating here since I don’t know this area of the law, but I would be surprised if the attorney wasn’t given the opportunity to come.

IMO, you can always talk to the police with no lawyer present, whether you've been charged or not, whether you're a witness/suspect/POI or whatever (generally not a good idea though).

And LE is allowed to ask as many questions as they want of anyone with no lawyer present, UNLESS and UNTIL the person asks for a lawyer. Then as I'm sure you know, they have to end the questioning and let them call a lawyer. (That's what they're supposed to do anyway!)

The police wouldn't have been breaking any rules or violating any rights by bringing him there without a lawyer. And they had the right to ask him questions while there without a lawyer. JH has the right to answer or not answer any questions. He could also say he'll talk, but not without a lawyer.

IANAL so please correct me if I'm wrong!

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

It wasn't specified in the DA's documents whether it was first or second degree.

From what I have read and posted you are correct that murder with malice is the blanket charge. This then needs to be updated to either first or second degree murder before proceeding as the penalties are different for each. It appears Rebeccas has been updated to first degree already and Jake's will be updated to either first or second degree sometime soon.

Interesting they can charge murder without specifying! Maybe that means it’s 2nd degree murder by default, unless they affirmatively charge it as 1st degree. But if there has been no superseding charging document charging her with 1st degree, I question whether those jail records can be relied on.

ETA: I found a full version of the Complaint, but won’t quote it out of an abundance of caution because I didn’t pull it myself and it wasn’t linked by MSM, but I confirmed that there is indeed nothing charging her with first degree murder. So I’d take the jail records asserting that she’s been charged with first degree murder with a grain of salt.

 

[agilbe]

JMO but the death penalty is entirely appropriate here. Not sure this qualifies as "special circumstances" though. Of course, they both might be in their 80's before it would be carried out. And now they're emptying Death Row at San Quentin and farming out condemned inmates to various other prisons.

Farming out to other prisons to be executed?

 

[BlaiseFinlay]

IMO, you can always talk to the police with no lawyer present, whether you've been charged or not, whether you're a witness/suspect/POI or whatever (generally not a good idea though).

And LE is allowed to ask as many questions as they want of anyone with no lawyer present, UNLESS and UNTIL the person asks for a lawyer. Then as I'm sure you know, they have to end the questioning and let them call a lawyer. (That's what they're supposed to do anyway!)

The police wouldn't have been breaking any rules or violating any rights by bringing him there without his lawyer. And they had the right to ask him questions while there without a lawyer. JH has the right to answer or not answer any questions. He could also say he'll talk, but not without a lawyer.

IANAL so please correct me if I'm wrong!

I was under the impression VH was representing him in this matter, so he would have had a lawyer — once you retain a lawyer, they’re not going to question you without your lawyer present. But, I was mistaken and VH is not representing JH.

 

[Izzylizzy]

I was waiting for this

Thanks, the reporter said they did not look at each other,
Curious if that is on instructions from their lawyers?

Nothing was said about the 1 million bond being cash
.
Looks like JH's probation violation hearing is going forward as scheduled, I was thinking that they might put that on hold.
Isn't there a child abuse investigation hearing also in the beginning of September for both of them?
imo