CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #4

[Edmo]

But public transportation takes longer, right? By what was posted, it takes 45 minutes by Trolley. Is there bus service, or other modes of transportation?

and since you are in Cali... if you rent a vehicle, isn't a credit card required? I know it is here... but I am not sure about there. Thank you so much, it's so helpful to have posters that are local and can help us out with understanding the area, the traffic, the times, etc.

I believe the Trooper location was literally across the street/walking distance from the actual border. I'm sure there are taxis, bus stops there as well. Some people walk across the border because they are afraid of having a car accident in Tijuana.

Yes, you need a CC to rent vehicles here.

 

[missy1974]

I believe the Trooper location was literally across the street/walking distance from the actual border. I'm sure there are taxis, bus stops there as well. Some people walk across the border because they are afraid of having a car accident in Tijuana.

Yes, you need a CC to rent vehicles here.

Thanks so much Edmo!

If Chase used a CC... I'm sure it would have been Joey's anyway and they would have looked at all ... I hope

 

[Edmo]

Thanks so much Edmo!

If Chase used a CC... I'm sure it would have been Joey's anyway and they would have looked at all ... I hope

Since taxis are usually parked at the border, I wonder if he simply took a taxi back to his truck? Would've cost a chunk of change, but we know he had deposited the checks and had $$$ to be able to do that.

I wonder if SDSO checked with the local cab companies, once they knew about CM's DNA and Id'd him?

 

[Tortoise]

I'm intrigued by this thought! We know Joey drove the Trooper to RC that day on the 4th, when do you think it arrived back at the house? Where was the Trooper during the neighbor's video footage at I believe it was 7:47? If it wasn't the Trooper in the footage leaving the driveway, all 3 vehicles couldn't have fit in the driveway, and we know that the garage was packed full of stuff so no vehicles were parked in the garage. So where was the Trooper at that time? If not at the house at 7:47, when did he bring it to the house? If the Trooper was at the house until the 8th, how did Merritt get to the house to pick it up and drive it to the border? Hmmm... maybe he drove his truck to the border, then someone drove him from the border to the McStay's to pick up the Trooper? Then he drove it to the border himself from there? Where his truck was waiting? That would explain how he got home from the border. But then how did he get to the McStay's? I'd love to hear your theories on this!

In his interview with detectives he says the Dodge was always parked in the drive and Joey parked the Trooper on the street so that Summer could open the doors to get the kids in and out of the Dodge.

Jennifer Mitchley says something different though. She remembered the Trooper was usually backed in on the driveway.

 

[Cricket28]

I think the trooper was at the McStay residence until it was dumped. It was the last step of the staging, after he had time to think about it, and critically, after he already got away with the murder for a few days.

Remember CM had no way to know that the McStays would not be missed immediately.

Except CM knew McGyver was painting at the house. If McGyver showed up and both the green truck and trooper were there but nobody was answering the door and his texts/calls were going unanswered. It would have rang an alarm before CM was ready. IMO

 

[missy1974]

Since taxis are usually parked at the border, I wonder if he simply took a taxi back to his truck? Would've cost a chunk of change, but we know he had deposited the checks and had $$$ to be able to do that.

I wonder if SDSO checked with the local cab companies, once they knew about CM's DNA and Id'd him?

unfortunately they didn't do the DNA testing until after the bodies were found So I'm not sure how helpful that would be, it was almost 4 years later.

 

[Cricket28]

I've never seen DNA/Blood Stain swabs taken from separate areas using a single swab stick? You contaminate by doing that. If it's true, I'm surprised they allowed it into evidence. That's like lifting 3 fingerprints using the same tape, lol.

How would they KNOW which DNA sample came from which part of the car, as a collective swab? Doesn't make sense to me?

ITA and was thinking the same thing.

MOO

 

[Edmo]

unfortunately they didn't do the DNA testing until after the bodies were found So I'm not sure how helpful that would be, it was almost 4 years later.

I'm talking about when they discovered the Trooper. DuGal said they took the Trooper from impound directly to their department's garage to examine it? They collected the swabs and sent for testing, no? This case was on the news almost every night as a missing family. I would think SDSO would want any information from the Trooper right away, to help them point to a possible suspect?

 

[Deleted member 192280]

What are your thoughts @smr ? do you think he is guilty? Not sure? Waiting to see more? You don't have to answer if you don't want to, just curious

Thanks for asking... Well, a few days ago I said I wished there was a poll feature here, I asked, do you think CM is guilty, if so do you think he did it alone, etc. A few replied. And there seemed to be a consensus that he's guilty. That was disappointing to me. Because when everyone agrees, then there is not much to discuss and argue about, especially in this case when it's all circumstantial, so when all or most people believe he's guilty without enough evidence, then the discussion becomes "let's see how we can interpret the evidence to support our belief that he's guilty". I think I read posts that said how he put his hand under his chin when the photos of the remains were shown, what does that mean, as if that somehow showed he's guilty (I am by no means being personal, but I'm talking about the way people make their judgement about guilty or not). For the sake of argument: so what if he didn't put his hand under his chin? What if he put his hand on top of his head? Or put his right hand over his left hand? Or put his left hand over his right hand? Was that what he would do when he's nervous or remembering something disturbing? Same about picture of him in the desert hole. Honestly I see nothing unusual or guilt-suggestive in these. There are probably more guilty-suggestive pictures of other folks that we haven't seen, but we are given this one suspect CM, so let's analyze every facial muscle and every picture of him to find signs that suit our belief that he's guilty. Seriously? If you do that, you can probably find most of ourselves guilty given a few more "circumstantial evidence" to put us on the defendant seat.

Please don't take this personal in any way - fact is, I haven't read most of the posts here, and don't remember who posted what.

 

[Tortoise]

Except CM knew McGyver was painting at the house. If McGyver showed up and both the green truck and trooper were there but nobody was answering the door and his texts/calls were going unanswered. It would have rang an alarm before CM was ready. IMO

I totally agree with this. I don't think the Trooper was at the house because he left the dogs outside and I think he was hoping neighbors would report that so that he wouldn't have to be the one to report them missing.

If police turned up to abandoned dogs and two cars still there they'd know immediately the family hadn't voluntarily disappeared.

It only adds to my belief that Joey was killed before he got home.

 

[Tortoise]

I'm talking about when they discovered the Trooper. DuGal said they took the Trooper from impound directly to their department's garage to examine it? They collected the swabs and sent for testing, no? This case was on the news almost every night as a missing family. I would think SDSO would want any information from the Trooper right away, to help them point to a possible suspect?

Yes they were certainly asking Merritt if he'd been in the Trooper in Feb 2010. I heard one of the investigators (may have been Heatherly Radeleff) saying she'd lifted I think it was four more prints from the Trooper when SB took over.

 

[A lucas]

With CMs background as a prospector I guess he could have quite confidently dug the graves a day or so before actual burial, and he had the equipment to do it. If anyone came across him (however unlikely) he could have said he was just prospecting for gold. I do hope the prosecution use that photo of him knee deep in the hole he dug, demonstrates he’s familiar with digging holes in the desert...

 

[Tssiemer]

Yeah but he would have dug a lot deeper imo if he planned it. If they hadn’t been deeper they never would have been, at least not then.

 

[Edmo]

I'm talking about when they discovered the Trooper. DuGal said they took the Trooper from impound directly to their department's garage to examine it? They collected the swabs and sent for testing, no? This case was on the news almost every night as a missing family. I would think SDSO would want any information from the Trooper right away, to help them point to a possible suspect?

I understand now. SDSO collected the DNA samples, but it wasn't until 2014 when SBSO compared them to CM's DNA. That is a huge facepalm for SDSO, IMO. I guess they must have been heading in a different direction on what they thought happened to the McStay's. They must have believed CM when he had said he had been in the vehicle and finding his DNA wasn't a "red flag" to them? Just wow, though.

 

[Cricket28]

McGyver testified that he got to the Fallbrook house btwn 8:30-9:00 am on 2/2/10 and left around 1:00 pm. He said while he was there CM came by. Wasn't there a handwritten check from JM to CM for $100.00? I guess that wasn't enough for CM because by 11:30 am he was back in RC creating and depositing a check to himself for $2,495.00.

If I'm not mistaken, besides the checks CM wrote to himself, there are no other checks to CM from JM from 2/1/10-2/4/10. CM CLEARLY lied when he told SDSO that his lunch meeting with JM on 2/4 was so JM could drop off checks to CM.

Also, I wonder if CM was jealous of McGyver's relationship with JM?

MOO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I absolutely agree! I hope that others that might be hesitant to post will join the discussion and won't be afraid that their viewpoint will be dismissed or not valid. I think this is a case where it is not as clear cut as some, and part of that is the years between and how much has been said or how much has been lost in between.

Some days I wish I had never stumbled upon these discussion forums (I was originally an InSession or CourtTV poster). I haven't figured out how the cases that I follow gripped me and why some don't LOL This case has been a bit different than some that I have followed, in the sense that we do not have all documents to decipher and read before the trial even starts, we have some reports and some media information (which I don't even know if we can trust lol), but we have a whole lot of rumours and things that have not been verified over the years as well, so it's interesting to see things for myself in this case and am finding things are not always as we thought we knew them. Just as examples... I seriously always thought the sheets and bedding was "missing" from the home. This was not the case as we can see them in the San Diego SD photo's, but they were stripped in the Tim Miller videos. Back in the day, we dissected everything in those videos!!! lol I always thought that the SDSD told the family it was okay to clean up and take the computers, which most thought that was crazy, well, according to DuGal, that was also not the case, they were not told they could clean and take the computers.

It's strange that you brought this up, Missy, but 'I' was one of the ones who was very hesitant to join this trial forum. LOL! I came very close to deciding I wasn't going to participate in this one.

I usually try to stay clear of forums that may become contentious at times. Anyone who has posted with me for years knows I'm very easygoing. That's just who I am, and always have been. I'm glad I worried needlessly because all posters have been a joy to post with.

I knew in this one I would immediately be considered an outsider since I was never one of those who consistently posted in any of the McStay discussion threads that went on for many years.

I knew I wouldnt be up to date on all of the past rumors or what was said by whom or against whom for many years.

When CM was arrested, I did post at that time in the discussion forum down under that his own interview long ago had made me highly suspicious of him so it didn't surprise me when he had finally been arrested.

I remember my opinion of Merritt even back then didnt go over very well with many of the long time posters. LOL!!

Reading occasionally before the bodies were found I did get the gist of it but none of the details that at that point when CM was arrested it seemed most of the dedicated discussion posters already had their own suspect in mind, and seem to be sure of it which is their entitled right to have ...then and now. I never delved into who all they suspected.

So all of the years before it became a homicide investigation I really felt I had nothing to say much or add during those long years of discussions.

I only posted and read every now, and then afterwards try to read pertinent information about CMs upcoming trial.

I have seen several other cases though where the majority were 100 percent certain it was a particular suspect/person before the actual suspect was arrested.

I never quite understood that concept either since an arrest has to be made first to even know who's responsible, and then a trial has to be held before all facts in evidence against any defendant can become fully known in this case or in all cases for that matter.

Sometimes jumping to conclusions prematurely without any evidence often winds up accusing many of those who were completely innocent having no involvement whatsoever. I sure have seen that happen over the years.

I really did expect to be in the teeny tiny minority group of posters in this trial forum when it comes to Merritt's guilt or legally NG, or believing he is innocent.

I know we all bring our own perspectives about how each one of us digests the same evidence. I've already seen much CE that already points to his guilt along with CoG.

I do realize however everyone on an individual basis weighs each CE fact differently even if they come to the same conclusion.

I'm not ever going to try to sway anyone's opinion who either believes he is NG or outright innocent or those who think the state isn't meeting their burden of proof.

Those are individual decisions which can only be made by each individual person.

I wouldn't ever do that nor have I ever done so. I'm just here only to post my own opinions based on how 'I' interpret the evidence submitted in any trial, and how 'I' view what has been said or on other informative information that has been provided.

I only can be true to myself, and always try to post my own opinions honestly, clearly as possible, and with respect on how I view something based on what is known.

That is why I don't have much prior knowledge at all on past rumors or prior theories including other suspects about this case.

I just go by what has been learned from the witness stand or when I read a past news article that clears up something asked during the trial discussion.

I only express my own held opinions. That's all.

Ocean.

 

[Plumeria5]

I totally agree with this. I don't think the Trooper was at the house because he left the dogs outside and I think he was hoping neighbors would report that so that he wouldn't have to be the one to report them missing.

If police turned up to abandoned dogs and two cars still there they'd know immediately the family hadn't voluntarily disappeared.

It only adds to my belief that Joey was killed before he got home.

There are so many combinations of ways CM got the bodies to where they were buried and the Trooper to the border. This is my first choice.

1. Joey was killed after lunch and never made it home, possibly storing his body in a storage unit and hiding the Trooper. He then drove his truck to Fallbrook and killed Summer and the boys, loaded them into his truck, and took them to the storage unit with Joey's body awaiting burial. CM drove the Trooper to the border and somehow got a ride back to his home.

 

[Edmo]

There are so many combinations of ways CM got the bodies to where they were buried and the Trooper to the border. This is my first choice.

1. Joey was killed after lunch and never made it home, possibly storing his body in a storage unit and hiding the Trooper. He then drove his truck to Fallbrook and killed Summer and the boys, loaded them into his truck, and took them to the storage unit with Joey's body awaiting burial. CM drove the Trooper to the border and somehow got a ride back to his home.

I like the theory: However, the storage units went "unpaid" and were later auctioned off. Unless CM wrapped their bodies so that not a single drop of blood/fluids would be found in them, which is possible, I would expect that when they were auctioned off, the "new" owners would have noticed any blood/fluids that would have been left behind? Those units would have been given new locks, by the storage company, once the fee's weren't paid. No one would be able to access them, unless they cut the locks etc . . . JMO

Also, I believe the cord(s), rope and tie-downs were used to transport the bodies to the gravesite. You wouldn't want 4 bodies flopping around on the freeway/Cajon Pass in the back of your truck, at least i wouldn't.

 

[asyousay]

Also, I wonder if CM was jealous of McGyver's relationship with JM?

MOO

Why would he be as McG was Summer’s friend not Joey’s?!

 

[missy1974]

I'm talking about when they discovered the Trooper. DuGal said they took the Trooper from impound directly to their department's garage to examine it? They collected the swabs and sent for testing, no? This case was on the news almost every night as a missing family. I would think SDSO would want any information from the Trooper right away, to help them point to a possible suspect?

No, that isn't how it happened. The swabs were taken and put in evidence. After the bodies were found, those swabs were sent to the FBI and were tested. So that was sometime after Nov. 2013.