CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death hiking area, Aug 2021 #6

[Campizi67]

As I recall, the Sheriff took a question about the keys and said they were found on the trail between JG and EC.

Could be possible EC set out for help/the car and didn't take the keys and in his dehydrated state JG threw them towards her (unknowingly to EC) and is why they were found on trail between the two. Imo

Such a tragedy. I think they set out for a fun day of hiking with just enough water.. (obviously they didn't think the amount was an issue). I have done this many times dressed same as they were, and never even thought about having to survive anything. Mainly because I'm not an experienced hiker. Sadly they are no longer able to learn from their mistakes. RIP

 

[Campizi67]

As I recall, the Sheriff took a question about the keys and said they were found on the trail between JG and EC.

Could be possible EC set out for help/the car and didn't take the keys and in his dehydrated state JG threw them towards her (unknowingly to EC) and is why they were found on trail between the two. Imo

Such a tragedy. I think they set out for a fun day of hiking with just enough water.. (obviously they didn't think the amount was an issue). I have done this many times dressed same as they were, and never even thought about having to survive anything. Mainly because I'm not an experienced hiker. Sadly they are no longer able to learn from their mistakes. RIP

 

[Curious_in_NC]

It’s my understanding that the witness saw the vehicle driving towards the trailhead and the same witness saw it parked with no one around 15 minutes later. There’s only one road they were driving on so if the witness was returning from their hike they couldn’t have seen them 15 minutes earlier. MOO

I think there's many other possible explanations without assuming it was another hiker. The witness could have been mountain biking or out for a run on Hites Cove Rd., for example. Or maybe they were just out walking their dog down to the trailhead/parking area and back. Unless MSM or LE disclose more details, I don't see a reason to doubt this witness. MOO

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I’d like to know who was the ‘witness’ who saw the vehicle at 7.45am driving in the direction of Hites Cove and again saw the vehicle parked at the trailhead 15 minutes later. Was this person out on a hike? Did they know the family or were they just visitors to the area? If he/she was walking in the same direction there are only two paths to take (the same as Jon and Ellen). The one which LE says Jon and Ellen took to the left and the on the right, the Savage Lundy where they were found.
Surely the same conditions prevailed for this person? Where did they go? What did they see? If they had continued on the same trail as Jon and Ellen wouldn’t he/she have passed them being less encumbered? If he/she chose to trek down SL trail to the right, what was their experience? Obviously, at least one other person didn’t think it strange to be out walking that way on a hot Sunday morning - but nobody else.

My guess is that it was a person walking a dog. They may have recognized Oski, and the family.

The temperatures at that time were in the mid-70s, so comfortable. I walk my dog twice a day, I know all the dogs and owners who walk regularly in my area.

My guess is the truck passed the walker slowly as there is limited space on Hites Cove Road. Maybe Oski had his head out the window and the family waved hello, which is common in that type of community. Maybe they were a neighbour and just recognized them and their vehicle.

They then walked to/past the Hites Cove trailhead and possibly turned around to go home and passed the park truck at 8:00 am.
Just my theory.

 

[IceIce9]

I think this is key when trying to figure out WHY they went. 70’s is very comfortable, especially in dry heat. I think it’s so easy to not think ahead to the last part of the hike when starting out. We SHOULD do that, but they aren’t the first to not think ahead and won’t be the last. I’ve done it and got myself into quite a pickle once in New Mexico desert. It was the only time I was actually scared, but thankfully I made it. I started out way too late for how hot the last hour or so would be at the end where there was no shade—no trees. It happens a lot, but most of the time we scrape by and learn from it. Sometimes, tragically, we don’t scrape by.

Overconfidence, most likely, IMO.

But even on a short hike they should have taken a water dish for the pup.

 

[Skigh]

I just cannot excuse them for not taking care of their dog. Even on a winter walk in England I took water and a bowl for my dogs.

 

[ilovewings]

I think the “more” that people want to know is actually the WHY, and we will never know.

Why they decided to hike on a day with a brutal heat forecast, why they didn’t take proper supplies and wear appropriate clothing, why they didn’t turn around and return to the car.

The “why” will never, can never, be known.

Sadly we will never know the answers to those questions. All I know is, it is a terrible tragedy.

 

[IceIce9]

The fact that no other hikers were out to come upon the family while they were in distress, or later on the horrible death scene, confirms that hikers don’t attempt this trail in the summer months.

 

[sfinkz]

The dog possessed superior canid sensory perception. Left alone, IMO, Oski would have sought the sanctuary of the South Fork.

My dogs have always trended feral and stubborn. They would only participate in a Death March if I carried them.

For other more domesticated dogs, loyalty trumps all else. Licking the last of the salts of loved ones may have been reward enough.

I am much more heartbroken over the 1-year old child.

I just cannot excuse them for not taking care of their dog. Even on a winter walk in England I took water and a bowl for my dogs.

 

[lotus777]

I was thinking about San Francisco this morning, due to my recent reflections on the values and lifestyle of that city, and an element of yoga came to mind: bikram yoga, also called “hot yoga”.

Ellen as a practitioner of yoga was surely familiar with Bikram yoga, where one sustains temperatures of 105 degrees for 90 minutes in a closed room while performing yoga.

She may or may not have been an expert in bikram yoga per se, but as a yoga person she surely had some level of familiarity or experience in it.

What if the weather forecast did not phase her because she was accustomed to those temps?
What if Jon had participated in a few of those classes with her? And he too was not phased?

It could be one reason that they thought it would be ok to hike in those same high temps.

This does not explain taking the baby and the dog because young children (let alone babies) should not participate in the temperatures of bikram.
Bikram Yoga for Kids — Bikram Yoga Nairobi

But perhaps it explains their lack of preoccupation about the high temps before setting out?

moo and truly just a theory

Very interesting theory. I will say though that not all yoga practitioners do or have done Bikram or other hot yogas. I for one have practiced yoga for 15+ years and have never taken a single hot yoga class because it sounds miserable to me. But if she was familiar with it she certainly could have underestimated the risk of heat.

 

[IceIce9]

I just cannot excuse them for not taking care of their dog. Even on a winter walk in England I took water and a bowl for my dogs.

Yes, I agree. The dog had no choice in the matter and relied on his humans to take care of him

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I am a bit confused, and was hoping someone here could clarify something. We die at body temp of approximately 105 degrees, correct? So how could anyone exert themselves in environmental conditions over 100 degrees, and not succumb? Even sitting out in a 105 + degree environment, with no protection from the sun, WITHOUT exerting yourself would kill you after a certain amount of time, wouldn't it? And at some point, having enough water doesn't matter, hyperthermia sets in. Same idea when it is cold, hypothermia sets in and people succumb? Philip Kreycik went on a very challenging run in extreme heat and succumbed this past year. So incredibly tragic, praying these cases educate others who love the outdoors.

I don’t know much about thermal biology, just the general things most of us know.

I found this paper about mathematical predictions of core body temperature based on some of the variables: hydration, activity, environmental temperature, clothing etc. Age and fitness level factor in. It’s too advanced for my knowledge, but it touches on the issue you were asking about.

“Highlights
•summarizes progression scientific understanding of applied thermoregulation.
•outlines steps to modeling responses to environment, activity, and clothing.
•explains the Heat Strain Decision Aid (HSDA).
•outlines, each of the foundational equations and inputs needed for using HSDA.
•includes a usable supplementary Excel file coded with a version of the HSDA”
Mathematical prediction of core body temperature from environment, activity, and clothing: The heat strain decision aid (HSDA) - ScienceDirect

I don’t know the variables in this case, just what most of us see: poorly planned, long, advanced hike where the most strenuous & challenging end part was at very high temperatures. With two dependents that added to gravity of the situation.

I’d be very interested to know their past approaches to hiking in similar conditions.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Studies I posted back thread also found a genetic connection, proof some are just more prone than others.

I think that’s an interesting point.

 

[10ofRods]

I think the "why's" of this are fairly uncomplicated. They attempted a difficult uphill trail on a very hot day, because they over-estimated their abilities (were inexperienced on steep trails with switchbacks, may not even have known how steep that section would be). More water might have helped, but that's not a certainty.

Early stages of heat exhaustion are often disguised by cognitive changes, including euphoria.

 

[IceIce9]

Another puzzling thing to me is that the lived there, they would have been aware that early morning cool gives way to extreme heat.

I could understand if they had been vacationing from out of state and weren’t aware of the cool mornings and brutally hot afternoons.

 

[neesaki]

That’s a guess I made about the one pack. It’s actually not very common to have 3 liter Camelbaks in women’s packs because the bladder is too long. For comparison, my new pack (a women’s model) can theoretically fit a 3 liter bladder, but this hasn’t been a common thing, and I’m not sure it wouldn’t be tower over the loop you hang it on. So, yeah, theoretical. If I get a photo of EC’s pack, I can tell you.

If it was a 2.5 liter bladder in the GC pack, my experience would be an Osprey (not a Camelbak or non-Osprey Hydrapak). Osprey bladders tend to have a lot of plastic and are unusually bulky and very long. I don’t know for sure with this couple, though. I’m saying this because the pieces are assembling in my head into a picture from experience, not because I have information that others don’t.

So far, logic doesn’t seem to be working well. It’s possible they didn’t even fill the bladder to 2.5 liters. We only know the capacity, not how much they took.

Also, IME you wouldn’t drink much if you have a Camelbak attached to someone else’s pack. It’s awkward. The whole point of carrying a bladder is so you can be drinking more regularly than having to stop and fish out a water bottle.

Again, I’m making a guess about whether she was carrying a pack.

In the PC, the sheriff said they had an 85 oz. of water water bladder , so not even three liters.

ETA: I found a link with that information.
Heat stress likely caused the deaths of a California family while they were hiking

 

[ilovewings]

Another puzzling thing to me is that the lived there, they would have been aware that early morning cool gives way to extreme heat.

I could understand if they had been vacationing from out of state and weren’t aware of the cool mornings and brutally hot afternoons.

As someone else has so eloquently pointed out, for whatever reason (and we shall never ever know those reasons), this apparently intelligent, caring couple made some really bad and fateful decisions on that day. They paid with their lives, as well as that of their precious child and pup.

 

[happyday]

Overconfidence, most likely, IMO.

But even on a short hike they should have taken a water dish for the pup.

Agree!

 

[ItalyReader]

Very interesting theory. I will say though that not all yoga practitioners do or have done Bikram or other hot yogas. I for one have practiced yoga for 15+ years and have never taken a single hot yoga class because it sounds miserable to me. But if she was familiar with it she certainly could have underestimated the risk of heat.

I agree, bikram sounds miserable! I always resisted my friends' invitations to bikram - but when I lived in SF bikram had a very big following.
Wasn't she an instructor? I would think to get an instructor certification she would need to have various basic experience in all the different types of yoga - eg hatha, ashtanga, vinyasa, bikram etc etc and then at least one actual specialization? MOO. How does it work? I don't know what it takes to officially become a yoga instructor.

 

[happyday]

Overconfidence, most likely, IMO.

But even on a short hike they should have taken a water dish for the pup.

Agree!