Found Deceased CA - Kiely Rodni missing from Party Near Prosser Family Campground in Truckee #9

[ItalyReader]

Is manually turning off a phone able to be differentiated from the phone no longer being reachable?

So related to multiple posts and trains of thought for days now on this forum about the phone -

It appears that the iPhone can be traceable even when turned off (iPhone 11+ and os 15+)

I am not expert on this but looking at links/comments above and also iPhone capabilities I am following this line of thought:

EITHER:
1) LE has her phone but is currently not releasing this information (which I get)

OR

2) her phone is in someone else’s possession or otherwise lost, AND:

- 2A - her phone was not updated to that version and therefore unfindable
- 2B - or she or someone had changed that setting and therefore unfindable
- 2C - or her phone if/since being manually switched off hasn’t passed near any other Apple device that could recognize it (and here I still wonder about the idea that it might have washed further / deeper into the reservoir or not be able to receive a signal under a barrier of water)

Thoughts?

 

[ItalyReader]

For me, it is hard to believe that whomever saw / took pic of KR's car leaving at 12:33 also saw it drive into the lake. Because if that is what Captain Brown meant on 8/10, you'd think LE would have only searched Prosser Lake from then on...

I think LE is saying that the last ping was 12:33, after which point in time the car was not seen.

I don’t think LE intended there was a last sighting of the vehicle at 12:33.

(But I originally took their statement to mean that as well - only in reflecting now I believe they meant the ping was 12:33 after which there was no sighting of her vehicle)

 

[Ixchel13]

this may help answer your question.

"The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) passed a regulation in 2012 which requires that EDR boxes record 15 specific data points, including speed, steering, braking, acceleration, seatbelt use, and, in the event of a car crash, the force of impact and whether airbags deployed in a car accident."

from this website:

Event Data Recorder | NHTSA

www.nhtsa.gov

so, to know how many people in the car, they would need to have a seatbelt on...or would the black box record if it *told* someone to put it on%

 

[ItalyReader]

2. and we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

It’s thorny, but LE saying the car *was not* seen after 12:33 does not mean the car *was* seen at 12:33.
I had thought that too but now it makes sense: last phone ping at 12:33 after which point the car was not seen again until found. (Not that the car was seen at the same time as the last ping).

 

[Ixchel13]

It’s thorny, but LE saying the car *was not* seen after 12:33 does not mean the car *was* seen at 12:33.
I had thought that too but now it makes sense: last phone ping at 12:33 after which point the car was not seen again until found. (Not that the car was seen at the same time as the last ping).

Yes. also, Italy, I am not sure they even said SS saw her car, iirc they met up again during the party, and decided KR would be SS ride home, but then SS texted and said she had another ride, and then KR texted back a little later and asked SS if she still needed a ride, and SS told her she was already on highway 89. So SS was not standing by KR car
at any point at that time, iirc.

 

[OldCop]

Yes. also, Italy, I am not sure they even said SS saw her car, iirc they met up again during the party, and decided KR would be SS ride home, but then SS texted and said she had another ride, and then KR texted back a little later and asked SS if she still needed a ride, and SS told her she was already on highway 89. So SS was not standing by KR car
at any point at that time, iirc.

If I recall, SS said she saw KR in person at 12:25 and told her she she had another ride home. She said she felt KR was too drunk to drive. She even mentioned that they hugged before separating. SS then said she was surprised when she got the 12:36 phone call from KR asking SS if she was still going home with her. I will try to find the link but SS said she was on her way home, almost at 89, sitting in the passenger seat, when her phone rang and she looked down to see that it was KR calling, so she answered. This was all so very specific on SS’s part.
I have often wondered if they never had the 12:25 conversation, that SS had just blown KR off and left without her. I’ve thought KR was waiting by her car at 12:15 to take SS home and SS never showed up, making KR late for her extended curfew. This may have caused KR to be driving faster than she should have been, possibly in an inebriated state, in the woods, in the dark, and she made one fateful turn.
If SS told the story about the goodbye hug at 12:25 to cover possible guilt about going off and leaving her friend, it could have set LE’s timeline off about when KR was last seen. Otherwise, her last known sighting, (that we know about), was around midnight as told to LE by EP. To the best of my knowledge, LE has never used SS’s purported 12:25 meetup with KR or the 12:36 phone call as part of their public timeline. They have said the last sighting was around 12:00 am and the last phone ping was 12:33. This tells me they probably did get a warrant for SS’s phone and realized that SS’s statements were not accurate. I don’t think this was viewed by LE as any type of a cover up or any evidence of wrong doing, but the statement of a person who may have been feeling some guilt. However, she is also a person who enjoyed the limelight and attention and may have embellished her importance to the narrative.
This is MOO and is not meant to cast any aspersions against SS. She is a young adult cast in the spotlight of a major news event.

 

[RedHaus]

If I recall, SS said she saw KR in person at 12:25 and told her she she had another ride home. She said she felt KR was too drunk to drive. She even mentioned that they hugged before separating. SS then said she was surprised when she got the 12:36 phone call from KR asking SS if she was still going home with her. I will try to find the link but SS said she was on her way home, almost at 89, sitting in the passenger seat, when her phone rang and she looked down to see that it was KR calling, so she answered. This was all so very specific on SS’s part.
I have often wondered if they never had the 12:25 conversation, that SS had just blown KR off and left without her. I’ve thought KR was waiting by her car at 12:15 to take SS home and SS never showed up, making KR late for her extended curfew. This may have caused KR to be driving faster than she should have been, possibly in an inebriated state, in the woods, in the dark, and she made one fateful turn.
If SS told the story about the goodbye hug at 12:25 to cover possible guilt about going off and leaving her friend, it could have set LE’s timeline off about when KR was last seen. Otherwise, her last known sighting, (that we know about), was around midnight as told to LE by EP. To the best of my knowledge, LE has never used SS’s purported 12:25 meetup with KR or the 12:36 phone call as part of their public timeline. They have said the last sighting was around 12:00 am and the last phone ping was 12:33. This tells me they probably did get a warrant for SS’s phone and realized that SS’s statements were not accurate. I don’t think this was viewed by LE as any type of a cover up or any evidence of wrong doing, but the statement of a person who may have been feeling some guilt. However, she is also a person who enjoyed the limelight and attention and may have embellished her importance to the narrative.
This is MOO and is not meant to cast any aspersions against SS. She is a young adult cast in the spotlight of a major news event.

I concur with you @OldCop.

 

[ItalyReader]

so, to know how many people in the car, they would need to have a seatbelt on...or would the black box record if it *told* someone to put it on%

Is it also related to weight on the seat?

 

[RedHaus]

It’s thorny, but LE saying the car *was not* seen after 12:33 does not mean the car *was* seen at 12:33.
I had thought that too but now it makes sense: last phone ping at 12:33 after which point the car was not seen again until found. (Not that the car was seen at the same time as the last ping).

An interesting idea.

But having listened a few times to Captain Brown make that 'definitive' statement (1) about when KR's car was last seen, I have a hard time thinking he was actually talking about KR's phone. To me her car and phone are different and separate possessions of KR's. Both were presumably missing on 8/10 but not necessarily together.

That said, would LE or a phone / network carrier know if a phone was connected to a car's Bluetooth and as such the car was processing the phone signals? Looks like 2013 is the first model year Honda's CRV had Bluetooth technology.(2)

Do any of our phone experts know that answer?

(1) @35:45:

(2)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.cars.com/research/honda-cr_v/&ved=2ahUKEwiF_ODpl7D6AhUij2oFHfXGD1IQFnoECAYQBQ&usg=AOvVaw2Y_RuHmXaKeEa7vYY-mEf6

 

[RedHaus]

REPOSTING WITH LINKS TO AVOID CAUSING CONFUSION

1. yes we know from 8/13 PCSO presser (Captain Brown, NCSO) that KR's phone last pinged of a tower(s) at 12:33am (1)

2. we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am (2)
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

3. we know from PCSO 8/10 presser (Angela Musallam, PCSO PIO) that KR's phone was turned off just after 12:30am (3)

That is an odd set of facts... but no photos or any evidence supplied by LE... they wouldn't share that anyhow.

You take these three things and the statement PCSO made (I'd have to go back and find at which presser) that 'KR may have gone somewhere else' (4) and the idea KR may have gone to an after party at ~12:33am rattles in my head.

For me, it is hard to believe whomever saw / took pic of KR's car leaving at 12:33 also saw it drive into the lake. Because if that is what Captain Brown meant on 8/10, you'd think LE would have only searched Prosser Lake from then on...

However, as I opined yesterday, what if someone saw KR's car still parked when there was an exodus at 12:30? (5)

SOURCES:
(1) @8:09

8/13 Press Conference regarding the Kiely Rodni missing person investigation & search. | By Placer County Sheriff's Office | Facebook

8/13 Press Conference regarding the Kiely Rodni missing person investigation & search.

fb.watch

(2) @35:45:

(3) @16:07:
We are providing a recap of today’s press conference on our latest efforts along with the Nevada County Sheriff's Office, CHP - Truckee, FBI – Federal... | By Placer County Sheriff's Office | Facebook

(4) Found Deceased - CA - Kiely Rodni Missing From Party Near Prosser Family Campground in Truckee #3

(5) https://www.news.com.au/world/north...y/news-story/3ed0f93b181e3d309cbfafbe6f844a28

 

[ss90]

2. we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am (2)
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

Of course that was their statement then. Surely theres the possibility that facts may have changed afterward due more interviews and investigation. (not that I personally believe that)

so, to know how many people in the car, they would need to have a seatbelt on...or would the black box record if it *told* someone to put it on%

I dont know, I guess it could but why would it since the weight can be literally anything. I once had a pretty lightweight shopping bag on a front seat and the damn thing started beeping. I dont think its designed to record if in an accident situation there was someone else in the car, only wether the victims were belted or not?

 

[OldCop]

REPOSTING WITH LINKS TO AVOID CAUSING CONFUSION

1. yes we know from 8/13 PCSO presser (Captain Brown, NCSO) that KR's phone last pinged of a tower(s) at 12:33am (1)

2. we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am (2)
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

I have listened to the statement a couple of times. I think it was poorly worded and can be perceived either way.
My interpretation of what he was trying to say was that as of the date of the community meeting on 8/10, that KR’s car had not been seen since her phone last pinged at 12:33. They were continuing to investigate to determine if there were any sightings of the vehicle after that time.
(We now know that a week later, RA guy reported to LE that he believed he had serviced KR’s vehicle on a callout to Boca on Saturday morning, 8/6, and that there was a male and a female who fit KR’s description with the vehicle at the time. If LE investigated and believed this to be KR’s vehicle, LE’s next statement might be something to the effect of “We have now definitively identified KR’s vehicle as having been at Boca Lake at 11:00 am on the morning of 8\6”, but there have been no further pings on her phone since 12:33 am that day”.)
Edited for clarity.

 

[O.Incandenza]

So related to multiple posts and trains of thought for days now on this forum about the phone -

It appears that the iPhone can be traceable even when turned off (iPhone 11+ and os 15+)

I am not expert on this but looking at links/comments above and also iPhone capabilities I am following this line of thought:

EITHER:
1) LE has her phone but is currently not releasing this information (which I get)

OR

2) her phone is in someone else’s possession or otherwise lost, AND:

- 2A - her phone was not updated to that version and therefore unfindable
- 2B - or she or someone had changed that setting and therefore unfindable
- 2C - or her phone if/since being manually switched off hasn’t passed near any other Apple device that could recognize it (and here I still wonder about the idea that it might have washed further / deeper into the reservoir or not be able to receive a signal under a barrier of water)

Thoughts?

To me this is just another piece of data that suggests that Kiely's car and phone went into the lake soon after the 12:33 ping. If it had merely been turned off (or if the battery had died), then it would likely have still been traceable via the Bluetooth find my phone method. We know her mother used something that sounds very like the find my phone app to trace her last location to the party. However, a bluetooth signal is definitely not penetrating 15-20 feet of water (+ the distance to the shore).

 

[ItalyReader]

To me this is just another piece of data that suggests that Kiely's car and phone went into the lake soon after the 12:33 ping. If it had merely been turned off (or if the battery had died), then it would likely have still been traceable via the Bluetooth find my phone method. We know her mother used something that sounds very like the find my phone app to trace her last location to the party. However, a bluetooth signal is definitely not penetrating 15-20 feet of water (+ the distance to the shore).

That seems to be the scenario that makes the most sense. Occam's.

The phone had a ping, then somehow the vehicle with KR and her phone entered the water, at which point the phone no longer had contact. And the vehicle had no further sightings.

 

[ItalyReader]

2. we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am (2)
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

Let me preface this, @RedHaus, by saying I have the most utmost respect for you! Just to try to clarify what I was saying earlier -

What is bolded above is the original quote. IMO, and I agree with @OldCop that the PCSO statement was worded poorly, it is stating that the car was not seen after 12:33 but does not specify that the car WAS seen at 12:30/33. We can all agree on that (right?)

So this does not mean and I personally IMOO do not believe the person intended to convey, that the car WAS seen at 12:33.

IMOO: I am going to rewrite that PCSO statement in just one of a million possible better worded ways, all hypothetical:
MOO: "The phone's final ping was at 12:33 am. We do not know when the last sighting of KR's car was. It could have been at 12:00. But there are definitely no sightings recorded after the phone's final ping.
MOO!!!!!! Rewritten for an example of a more clearly worded statement

See what I mean?

Your first sentence above, instead, indicates that you infer from from the bolded statement that the car itself was seen at 12:33 - is that right?

So where there is room for interpretation is, was the car seen at/around 12:30/12:33, or was there just a final phone ping at 12:33?

We can differ on how we interpret the bolded statement, but I think it's important for all to keep in mind, that this is an important difference, and not a given that the vehicle was seen at almost exactly the same time as the last phone ping.

(Also - the coincidence of final phone ping and final vehicle sighting being within 3 minutes of each other seems incredibly unlikely, but that aside, IMOO I believe the time stamp reference by LE refers only to the phone ping.)

It doesn't matter which interpretation is right, that the 12:33 refers to the phone and/or the vehicle but I just want to stress that it is not a given that the vehicle was last seen at 12:33. It is open for interpretation (fortunately or unfortunately!)

 

[SteveP]

<RSBM>

REPOSTING WITH LINKS TO AVOID CAUSING CONFUSION

1. yes we know from 8/13 PCSO presser (Captain Brown, NCSO) that KR's phone last pinged of a tower(s) at 12:33am (1)

2. we know from PCSO 8/10 Comm Mtg (Captain Brown, NCSO) KR's car (not KR) was last seen at 12:33am (2)
"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

Respectfully, we do NOT know that that Kiely's car was last seen at 12:33am. The official statement makes no mention at all of when the car was last seen, and to infer otherwise, from the following official statement, would be merely speculation on someone's part. I think LE give press conferences to share information, not to hide it in intentionally obscure statements that leave listeners to try to figure out what was actually said. Had her car actually been seen at 12:33, I think the official statement would have been preceded by the statement that her was last seen at 12:33.

"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

I am pretty sure that time was mentioned, as it was the last time Kiely's phone pinged as well. JMO

 

[Ixchel13]

If I recall, SS said she saw KR in person at 12:25 and told her she she had another ride home. She said she felt KR was too drunk to drive. She even mentioned that they hugged before separating. SS then said she was surprised when she got the 12:36 phone call from KR asking SS if she was still going home with her. I will try to find the link but SS said she was on her way home, almost at 89, sitting in the passenger seat, when her phone rang and she looked down to see that it was KR calling, so she answered. This was all so very specific on SS’s part.
I have often wondered if they never had the 12:25 conversation, that SS had just blown KR off and left without her. I’ve thought KR was waiting by her car at 12:15 to take SS home and SS never showed up, making KR late for her extended curfew. This may have caused KR to be driving faster than she should have been, possibly in an inebriated state, in the woods, in the dark, and she made one fateful turn.
If SS told the story about the goodbye hug at 12:25 to cover possible guilt about going off and leaving her friend, it could have set LE’s timeline off about when KR was last seen. Otherwise, her last known sighting, (that we know about), was around midnight as told to LE by EP. To the best of my knowledge, LE has never used SS’s purported 12:25 meetup with KR or the 12:36 phone call as part of their public timeline. They have said the last sighting was around 12:00 am and the last phone ping was 12:33. This tells me they probably did get a warrant for SS’s phone and realized that SS’s statements were not accurate. I don’t think this was viewed by LE as any type of a cover up or any evidence of wrong doing, but the statement of a person who may have been feeling some guilt. However, she is also a person who enjoyed the limelight and attention and may have embellished her importance to the narrative.
This is MOO and is not meant to cast any aspersions against SS. She is a young adult cast in the spotlight of a major news event.

good one

 

[OldCop]

<RSBM>

Respectfully, we do NOT know that that Kiely's car was last seen at 12:33am. I think 12:33am was only mentioned, as a reference to when Kiely's phone last pinged. The official statement makes no mention at all of when the car was last seen, and to infer otherwise, from the following official statement, would be merely speculation on someone's part. I think LE give press conferences to share information, not to hide it in obscure statements that leave listeners to try to figure out what was actually said. Had her car actually been seen at 12:33, I think the official statement would have been preceded by the statement that her was last seen at 12:33.

"But what we know is that Kylie's car after 12:33 am [8/6] has not been seen I can tell you that definitively"

I am pretty sure that time was mentioned, as it was the last time Kiely's phone pinged as well. JMO

We would all rest easier if he had only said, “Kiely’s car has not been seen since her phone last pinged at 12:33”.

 

[RedHaus]

I dont think its designed to record if in an accident situation there was someone else in the car, only wether the victims were belted or not?

RSBM
My understanding @ss90, while we don't yet know for sure (although likely) KR's car was manufactured on or after this NHTSA requirement went into effect (9/1/2012), is the EDR would capture essential data #9-12, below, as it pertains to determining if the driver was buckled in, if someone was in passenger seat or not, and if airbag(s) deployed.

But there may be an OP who is more versed on EDRs for 2013 Honda CRVs... I am learning as I go here, like others!

Source: Excerpted from Table 1 in U.S. Department Of Transportation National Highway Traffic Safety Administration PRELIMINARY REGULATORY EVALUATION FMVSS No. 405 EVENT DATA RECORDERS (EDRs) Office of Regulatory Analysis and Evaluation National Center for Statistics and Analysis November 2012 (only a PDF available).

 

[Ixchel13]

Of course that was their statement then. Surely theres the possibility that facts may have changed afterward due more interviews and investigation. (not that I personally believe that)

I dont know, I guess it could but why would it since the weight can be literally anything. I once had a pretty lightweight shopping bag on a front seat and the damn thing started beeping. I dont think its designed to record if in an accident situation there was someone else in the car, only wether the victims were belted or not?

They said they are NEVER going to charge Jagger. If we had an LE on here, hint, hint,
maybe they could tell us how thorough they would have to have checked his whereabouts to say that publicly.