CA - Murder victims Identified as Rob Reiner and wife Michele - LA Dec 14 2025

  • #1,961
Is NR being held in a county jail or mental health secure facility atm
per my notes:
Being held in Twin Towers Correctional Facility

Twin Towers is the newer, larger, and more modern facility while Men’s Central Jail (MCJ/Central Jail) is older and harder to staff.
MCJ (Mens Central Jail) and 'Twin Towers' are county jails... Twin Towers is around 1.5 million square feet... It is the more modern jail, easier to staff, where the majority of inmates with physical or mental disabilities are housed, along with maximum security inmates.
 
  • #1,962
The hypothesis here is each addict is different in the same way each person has their own individuality. Each addicts reason for using is personal to them and although shared feelings are common such as insecurity and anger etc . It is not strictly down to feelings as to why addicts use drugs otherwise anyone with negative thought patterns and negative feelings would use drugs as an emotional security blanket . A lot of it boils down to coping skills and boundaries

A one size fits all approach is why many addicts fail in their journey to recovery

A mental illness disorder like schizophrenia can exuberate the issue but again it is down to the individual neurology of those affected

I feel a lot of attention was given to fixing nick the addict without addressing the neurological reasons behind the use . Personality also affects the form in which an individual will express themselves in either drug abuse or mental illness

Life circumstances and expierence will also have an impact

So with Nick it would appear he had many of the negative traits before drugs even entered the domain , the drugs fed the devil ,the devil grew with the drugs not the devil was created solely by drug use .

I do feel Nick knew what he was doing at the moment of murder but with his history it may be easy to present a case for psychosis or insanity but presenting and winning are two very different things and if a jury is made up of our fellow peers I don't think what is known will win them over . I still feel the best approach is a plea deal . But with Nick being known for his deviance and defiance will he agree or will he just plead not guilty
Well said!
 
  • #1,963
The huge problem with a psychiatric institution is that he can (and might be) released at some point.

Just a swish of a pen and he’s out.

That fails to protect the citizens from this murderous monster as now required by law.

If he’s sentenced to life without parole in a prison, he’s not getting out. Ever.

That is what’s needed, IMO, to protect the citizens and fulfill the law.

The family ought not to be calling the shots IMO.
This whole family Shielded Nick his whole life, even after the murders, they still continue to shield him…
 
  • #1,964
He may reject a plea deal because although he knows he is cooked, he may want what's been swept under the rug for so long to be exposed. Knowing the lawyer will figuratively drive a very public stake into the hearts of the family, those dead and those alive. His last and final revenge on those who loved him for 32 years.
My opinion, Nick didn’t put a lot of thought into how he came across. Drugs were his main focus. He took drugs, had mental illness, and acted out, No real remorse, or self reflection.

He just moved on day after day, more drugs, more anger. I think he was often upset at his parents, because they were trying to put down boundaries, stop the drugs.

He snapped and killed them. Lost his mind, that night. Then, Nick carried on with his life, went to hotel, gas stations for drinks, Expo area for more drugs, like nothing happened, again, no self reflection!

He may have loved the parents in moments of lucidity, but mostly he hated them and almost everyone else, too.
 
  • #1,965
Well, they're different categories, but my point was brain damage, no matter the cause. Someone with dementia, someone with traumatic brain injury, and someone with chronic substance use all have some degree of damage to their brain and depending on where that damage is, it can and does impact emotions, impulsivity, disinhibition, ability to reason, and understanding of consequences. That was the point. It's not all about vocabulary or frustration.

With regard to word salad, that's a phrase that's been perverted by social media. It is a real thing, but it's been misunderstood and distorted online. Not everyone with dementia has "word salad" and not everyone with "word salad" has dementia. In fact, people who are drunk or high often exhibit "word salad" as do people who are coming out of anesthesia, etc. All it really means is incoherence because their words are strung together in an unusual way.

But word salad and inability to be understood is NOT often what drives behavioral disturbance in dementia. There's an entire field of study around this. There are many different causes, but my point was only that damage to brain structure can cause it.

The reference on TBI is very simplistic to the point of being irrelevant to the discussion about NR or my point about anger. There are many, many forms of TBI and while some may be described as "brain fog" that's generally in the case of concussion or post-concussive syndromes, not the type of TBI I'm referring to. A brain injury, say from lack of oxygen to the brain or mechanical impact like someone being beaten with a hammer or someone falling out of a window absolutely can lead to irreparable damage to the structure of the brain with the same impact on emotions, impulsivity, disinhibition, ability to reason, and understanding of consequences.

As for child tantrums, we don't know enough to know if this was by choice or not. I don't think we can dismiss neurodevelopmental disorders that can and do predispose someone to the same symptoms one would see with dementia and TBI. Was NR born on time? Were there complications with his birth (umbilical cord complications can cause TBI)? Was there an injury in infanthood/childhood? Did he meet all his milestones on time? Was there any type of damage to the brain as a child? Was he diagnosed with some type of disorder in childhood? Was he put on medications in childhood? Add substance to that, and there's no way any mental health professional worth their salt will argue he was making rational choices.

To clarify, I'm not saying he's not responsible for the murders. I'm saying that we know next to nothing about his medical history (that I've seen). We only know symptoms (like tantrums). There's no way we can say his anger was a "choice" yet.
Regarding the tantrums starting in Childhood, I thought mental illness, or maybe, a personality disorder. Dad had to control him with “ bear hugs”.

My neighbor, a while ago, had an autistic son, had to stay home and or special school. Dad had to control with “bear hugs”, starting at 8 years old( small) all the way up to full grown, huge bigger than Dad. Dad still controlled with “ bear hugs”. I know it’s a completely different situation, son was never lucid at all, out of control.

To the Dr., Will you please share about the brain scan that shows pre frontal cortex? I understand, this can be done to give psychiatrist info re impulsivity, anger, lack of control, choices. TIA if you know about this, want to share.
 
  • #1,966
This whole family Shielded Nick his whole life, even after the murders, they still continue to shield him…
I think the surviving family wants accountability for Nick, but they also feel that psychiatric care is preferable over just prison care. I understand that, completely, and understand why they would hire a good attorney to try to get that outcome for him. There is nothing else they can do for him now, he is in the hands of the criminal justice system. I hope this allows them to move forward with their lives over time, as they will know that they have done their best for their parents and for their brother. I don't think it is unreasonable. It is out of their hands now.
 
  • #1,967
Oh yes, thank you for finding that! That’s it, in the same article as preference for psychiatric confinement.
Yes, I heard about the 2 kids ( Jake and Romy) wanted AJ to try to secure a soft landing for Nick, in a psychiatric hospital, not jail. I think the family still don’t understand this type of aggression, (not victim blaming), with Schizophrenia, major mental illness, and constant hard drug use( my opinion, Meth). Nick was very dangerous.

I know these living victims are suffering, and they still want to Love Nick, Help him.
They are operating the only way they know, continue to have Hope!
And Throw Big Bucks at the court problem, money always worked in the past!

My own hope is that they go the regular court path, ok to have Jackson, plea LWOP.
Since it was 2 violent murders, I really hope he never gets out.
 
  • #1,968
I think the surviving family wants accountability for Nick, but they also feel that psychiatric care is preferable over just prison care. I understand that, completely, and understand why they would hire a good attorney to try to get that outcome for him. There is nothing else they can do for him now, he is in the hands of the criminal justice system. I hope this allows them to move forward with their lives over time, as they will know that they have done their best for their parents and for their brother. I don't think it is unreasonable. It is out of their hands now.
Yes, I hope the family can eventually move forward with their lives. Really sad situation
 
  • #1,969
This whole family Shielded Nick his whole life, even after the murders, they still continue to shield him…
Last night I was with family and lots of kids. one 3 yr old was a little cranky, late night/tired and he would cry if other kids wouldn’t give him their toys (not usually like this at all ) but 2 other parents would tell the kids,” just let him have it, just to keep the peace” so it starts early, with things as simple as that. It’s also teaching the other kids how to appease.
 
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  • #1,970
Regarding the tantrums starting in Childhood, I thought mental illness, or maybe, a personality disorder. Dad had to control him with “ bear hugs”.

My neighbor, a while ago, had an autistic son, had to stay home and or special school. Dad had to control with “bear hugs”, starting at 8 years old( small) all the way up to full grown, huge bigger than Dad. Dad still controlled with “ bear hugs”. I know it’s a completely different situation, son was never lucid at all, out of control.

To the Dr., Will you please share about the brain scan that shows pre frontal cortex? I understand, this can be done to give psychiatrist info re impulsivity, anger, lack of control, choices. TIA if you know about this, want to share.

Autism is one of many neurodevelopmental disorders and agitation is a common symptom, so your neighbor doesn't surprise me. We don't know if NR had any type of neurodevelopmental disorder though.

As for personality disorders, those, by diagnostic criteria, are not present/diagnosed until a person is over the age of 18 (and for myself and many of my colleagues, we are very careful about diagnosing until after early 20s), so that wouldn't explain childhood tantrums. That's because a child's personality isn't formed until their brain is closer to full development (age 25).

In childhood, tantrums or symptoms of "personality disorders" are either the result of neurodevelopmental disorders (like autism, intellectual disabilities, cerebral palsy, ADHD, etc), or other types of dysregulation/impulsivity disorders, or a response to their environment (such as trauma or neglect), or any combination of the three. But a child won't have a personality disorder. The only caveat to this is children who exhibit signs of conduct disorder (which I'm not aware of NR exhibiting) as that leaves them vulnerable to antisocial personality disorder. We still wouldn't know until the age of 18, but we might see signs of it earlier in childhood if they have conduct disorder. But again, we don't know anything that makes us think NR had conduct disorder.

As to brain scans, this is a somewhat controversial area of research still. Social media (and pop psychologists like Dr. Phil) try to make it seem like more than it actually is. The truth is, there's no significant reliability of brain scans YET that could adequately see or predict what we're talking about here. There's a lot of research being done and certainly there are scans that show damage to specific areas of the brain, but those macro brain structures do a lot of things. We haven't yet reached the amount of specificity needed to see/correlate changes in the limbic system with aggression, impulsivity, and anger with any kind of reliability. If we had, then we'd be scanning all criminals before parole to give us hints into post-prison treatment and recidivism.
 
  • #1,971
As to brain scans, this is a somewhat controversial area of research still. Social media (and pop psychologists like Dr. Phil) try to make it seem like more than it actually is. The truth is, there's no significant reliability of brain scans YET that could adequately see or predict what we're talking about here. There's a lot of research being done and certainly there are scans that show damage to specific areas of the brain, but those macro brain structures do a lot of things. We haven't yet reached the amount of specificity needed to see/correlate changes in the limbic system with aggression, impulsivity, and anger with any kind of reliability. If we had, then we'd be scanning all criminals before parole to give us hints into post-prison treatment and recidivism.
I used to study neuroanatomy, and years ago I read a really good book, can't remember the author's name offhand- Dr. Robert somebody, but he had found correlations between the limbic system-size of the amygdala and aggression/violence, and in my previous career as a Speech-Language Pathologist, I did a brief stint in a juvenile psych facility. When asking these teenagers how they would verbally confront someone they were angry with- they had no coping skills for that. The typical response to me was,"I wouldn't, I'd just punch them".
 
  • #1,972
Autism is one of many neurodevelopmental disorders and agitation is a common symptom, so your neighbor doesn't surprise me. We don't know if NR had any type of neurodevelopmental disorder though.

As for personality disorders, those, by diagnostic criteria, are not present/diagnosed until a person is over the age of 18 (and for myself and many of my colleagues, we are very careful about diagnosing until after early 20s), so that wouldn't explain childhood tantrums. That's because a child's personality isn't formed until their brain is closer to full development (age 25).

In childhood, tantrums or symptoms of "personality disorders" are either the result of neurodevelopmental disorders (like autism, intellectual disabilities, cerebral palsy, ADHD, etc), or other types of dysregulation/impulsivity disorders, or a response to their environment (such as trauma or neglect), or any combination of the three. But a child won't have a personality disorder. The only caveat to this is children who exhibit signs of conduct disorder (which I'm not aware of NR exhibiting) as that leaves them vulnerable to antisocial personality disorder. We still wouldn't know until the age of 18, but we might see signs of it earlier in childhood if they have conduct disorder. But again, we don't know anything that makes us think NR had conduct disorder.

As to brain scans, this is a somewhat controversial area of research still. Social media (and pop psychologists like Dr. Phil) try to make it seem like more than it actually is. The truth is, there's no significant reliability of brain scans YET that could adequately see or predict what we're talking about here. There's a lot of research being done and certainly there are scans that show damage to specific areas of the brain, but those macro brain structures do a lot of things. We haven't yet reached the amount of specificity needed to see/correlate changes in the limbic system with aggression, impulsivity, and anger with any kind of reliability. If we had, then we'd be scanning all criminals before parole to give us hints into post-prison treatment and recidivism.
Thank you, whole post is very interesting.
 
  • #1,973
  • #1,974
wasn't it happening when he was a kid, not an adult?
the 'bear hug' that I think of is less about comfort and more about control - called a 'wrap hug'
the experts used to recommend it when kids were lashing out
I don't know if this is what Rob was doing but it's what I first think of when I read that
you sit the kid down and wrap your legs around them from behind and wrap your arms around them and get them breathing deeply until they calm down
It was said that RR restrained NR in a bear hug to control him while still at Conan’s holiday party.
 
  • #1,975
When I look at Nick Reiner, he clearly had issues. He was consumed by intense jealousy and envy. When he was sent to rehab, it likely contributed to his never ending and always growing resentment. He likely thought of killing people for a long time. Nick Reiner could very well be an injustice collector.
I had the same thought.
 
  • #1,976
  • #1,977
Huh? He looks like a completely normal kid. I'm curious how did you come to the conclusion he looks mentally ill in his childhood pictures.

No, people aren't hardwired at birth, that's your opinion.

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>
What does mental illness look like? What's a normal kid?

I have diagnosed bipolar 1, which is well known to have a big genetic component. It's been documented that I've had it since being a little kid, though I wasn't diagnosed until my 20's... I'm normal! I don't look any more "mentally ill" than say you for example... Mental illness isn't necessarily visible. Sure when I'm manic I may look a bit different but thankfully I'm on fantastic meds so that's not very often, but I always have bipolar 1 and unfortunately I always will.

I need to catch up on this whole thread as I'm a little behind the legalities but I imagine this is gonna be a go at NGRI and very likely succeed.

Tragic all round.
 
  • #1,978
It was said that RR restrained NR in a bear hug to control him while still at Conan’s holiday party.

oh I haven't seen that

What does mental illness look like? What's a normal kid?

I have diagnosed bipolar 1, which is well known to have a big genetic component. It's been documented that I've had it since being a little kid, though I wasn't diagnosed until my 20's... I'm normal! I don't look any more "mentally ill" than say you for example... Mental illness isn't necessarily visible. Sure when I'm manic I may look a bit different but thankfully I'm on fantastic meds so that's not very often, but I always have bipolar 1 and unfortunately I always will.

I need to catch up on this whole thread as I'm a little behind the legalities but I imagine this is gonna be a go at NGRI and very likely succeed.

Tragic all round.

what is NGRI? not guilty .... ?
 
  • #1,979
  • #1,980
DBM
 

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