CA - Pacific Palisades - 30,000 People Ordered to Evacuate From L.A. Wildfires #2

[SophieRose]

Is it that long though?

Last year it was reported that Canadian forest fires continued smoldering under the snow - all winter. These are called 'zombie fires'. If they can continue under the snow, what could happen in places where there isn't snow and the accompanying temperature drop?

2024 wildfire season: Canada fights against "zombie fires" that survived underground from 2023

Last year, over 230,000 people were forced to flee their homes in Canada. The 2023 fire season in Canada was catastrophic for large parts of the North American continent, with smoke reaching as far Florida. 2024 could be worse still.

www.ctif.org

Note: I'm not a science genius so I may be missing something. But just putting the information out for mbrs with better scientific understanding.

The 2013 Rim Fire was near Yosemite was contained within two months but took over a year before it was fully extinquished.

Rim Fire - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The fire ignited on August 17, 2013, amid the 2013 California wildfire season, and burned 257,314 acres in largely remote areas of the Sierra Nevada, including a large portion of Yosemite National Park. The Rim Fire was fully contained on Thursday, October 24, 2013, after a nine-week suppression effort by firefighters. Due to a lack of winter rains, some logs smoldered in the interior portion of the fire footprint throughout the winter, and more than a year passed before the fire was declared extinguished in November 2014.

 

[Lilibet]

And, of course, new fires could break out anywhere, including Orange or Riverside counties.

I expect sicko arsonists are gleeful about the wind. Expect more fires, even in San Diego where there’s been a red flag warning.

 

[mickey2942]

I'm sure there will emerge a market for building more fire-proof home like his. Reportedly his home cost $9 million to build and was worth an estimated $14.9 million prior to the fire.

However, it's cost that really determines what is feasible. In the southern California market, a $1 millon home is not a luxury home. It is a starter home in areas with desirable schools and low crime. The number of homeowners that have been dropped by their home insurances for fire coverage is astonishing, and will clearly increase despite the moratorium imposed. You then need to come up with some means to finance all this construction, without a home to sell, with additional renter expenses, possibly without a job or a car.

The median home price in Altadena for December 2024 was $1,374,846
The median home price in Pacific Palisades for December 2024 was $3,462,178
The median home price in Encino, Ca was between $1.2 and $3.4 million, depending on price.

I was interested in the story of the fellow who saved his Pacific Palisade home by installing lawn sprinkler on his roof, and placed strategically around the home aiming at the vulernable eaves and siding. Sounds interesting, but where is everyone going to get water from to water their roofs?

In Montana, it is common for people to have extensive sprinkler systems, with their own wells drilled. Could people drill their own wells? Or use water from their swimming pools?

 

[Dotta]

"Multiple lawsuits claim
Southern California Edison equipment
sparked deadly LA fire."

Southern California Edison sued for 'sparking deadly LA fire'

The lawsuits claim SoCal Edison's electrical equipment started one of the major wildfires raging in the Los Angeles area, according to court filings.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[SophieRose]

I'm sure there will emerge a market for building more fire-proof home like his. Reportedly his home cost $9 million to build and was worth an estimated $14.9 million prior to the fire.

However, it's cost that really determines what is feasible. In the southern California market, a $1 millon home is not a luxury home. It is a starter home in areas with desirable schools and low crime. The number of homeowners that have been dropped by their home insurances for fire coverage is astonishing, and will clearly increase despite the moratorium imposed. You then need to come up with some means to finance all this construction, without a home to sell, with additional renter expenses, possibly without a job or a car.

The median home price in Altadena for December 2024 was $1,374,846
The median home price in Pacific Palisades for December 2024 was $3,462,178
The median home price in Encino, Ca was between $1.2 and $3.4 million, depending on price.

I was interested in the story of the fellow who saved his Pacific Palisade home by installing lawn sprinkler on his roof, and placed strategically around the home aiming at the vulernable eaves and siding. Sounds interesting, but where is everyone going to get water from to water their roofs?

I remember first reading about fireproof houses after the 1991 Oakland Fire, in fact one was shown on tv news I think it was still in the 90s, can't find it on youtube. Here's an old article from 2011, on 20th anniversary of the fire.

Twenty years after the Oakland hills fire, what has changed? - Oakland North

On October 19, 1991, the tiny flame that would become the Oakland hills fire was ignited. The ensuring wildfire, which lasted for several days, took 25 lives, consumed over a thousand acres land, and destroyed more than 3,500 homes. On the 20th anniversary of the fire, Oakland North takes a look...

oaklandnorth.net

Oakland now requires all new Oakland Hills houses to have Class A roofs, those with the most fire-resistant materials, which include slate, clay, concrete roof tile or steel shingles, according to the Builders Wildfire Mitigation Guide, published by UC Berkeley’s Department of Agriculture and Natural Resources.

Menell and Kessler rebuilt their house with new fire-resistant materials in 1994, and the city has continued to update its building codes over the years. The state building code now also demands such materials for all buildings in urban-wildland areas. The California Department of Forestry and Fire Prevention provides a list of materials that comply with Chapter 7A building requirements.

 

[SophieRose]

Another article from 2008 about fire resistant houses with some pictures at the beginning.

https://www.sfgate.com/homeandgarden/article/innovative-fire-resistant-oakland-hills-homes-3206125.php

 

[SophieRose]

In Montana, it is common for people to have extensive sprinkler systems, with their own wells drilled. Could people drill their own wells? Or use water from their swimming pools?

Does anyone remember this episode from Shark Tank?

Access to Pool Water During A Fire Emergency

FireFighter1 is an easy-to-use, fire fighting system for pool owners to protect property from fire. Fire suppression system. Fire Hose. Fire Hose on SharkTank. Fire System on SharkTank. Pool Water to Fight Fire. Fire Fighting System on Shark Tank. Fight Fire SharkTank. Shark Tank Fire Hose. As...

fightfirefirst.com

 

[Herat]

In Montana, it is common for people to have extensive sprinkler systems, with their own wells drilled. Could people drill their own wells? Or use water from their swimming pools?

A brief review of water regulations and permitting makes me think you are not allowed to have private wells within the Pacific Palisades Developements, as outlined in CC& R laws and regulations. The setback requirements would make it unfeasible for many areas. The water table in the higher elevations is more than 300 ft, so that's a significant drawback. You also are in earthquake zones so I don't know how that impacts wells. Generally, the developements are so tightly packed that there is no way to do it.

In homes more scattered in the hills, there appear to be wells allowed, such as in Topanga Canyon and areas of Malibu.

All highly regulated with stringent water quality standards, backflow prevention standards, and subject to zoning and permits.

 

[slowpoke]

“The Los Angeles County Fire Department has provided the following maps of the thousands of structures, primarily homes, that were damaged or destroyed in the Palisades and Eaton wildfires.”

They’re interactive maps where you can put in a specific address in. It’s great, but so sad to see.

https://ktla.com/news/california/wildfires/palisades-eaton-wildfire-damage-maps/

 

[SophieRose]

We've had them in Texas for quite some time. (At least 20 years) Red Flag Warnings. And we usually just get grass fires here.

Here's something Travis County Texas puts out for fire prone areas. I don't think I've seen anything like this in California. At bottomof news article.

https://www.sfgate.com/homeandgarden/article/innovative-fire-resistant-oakland-hills-homes-3206125.php

Travis County, Texas, has prepared a checklist of things everyone in a fire-prone area should know. The more checkmarks you have, the more prepared you are in the event of a wildfire threat.

The house

Fire-resistant roof, i.e. metal, tile, composition?

Non-flammable siding materials?

Home is located down-slope?

Wooden deck facing or overhanging level ground?

Large glass windows, facing level ground?

Deck, porch, vents or house screened to keep sparks out?

Chimney extending above the roofline?

Chimney spark arrester in place?

Roof and gutters clean of debris?

Around the house

A fire defensible space (D-space) zone of 30-100 feet?

Adequate clearance of weeds, tall grasses and brush?

Leaves raked?

Trees pruned 10 feet up from base of trunk?

Tree limbs pruned at least 10 feet from roof or within 15 feet laterally from chimney?

House location or address clearly marked (3-inch letters)?

Firewood and other burnable items stored at least 30 feet from the house?

Access

Easy access to home by emergency vehicles?

Road grade less than 15 percent (not steep)?

Road wide and accommodating to two-way traffic?

Road straight with wide turns?

Large areas for vehicles to turn around?

Short driveway from main road?

Home area level and easily plowed or raked for fire line?

Multiple roads into and out of developed area for safe and easy access and evacuation?

Water supply

Pressurized hydrants available?

Non-pressurized or dry hydrants available?

Water sources, such as ponds, or streams accessible?

Power lines buried and not susceptible to fire?

Well pumps maintained with uninterrupted electricity??

 

[DS2021]

Im not seeing any updates on the california fires website

California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection | CAL FIRE

CAL FIRE Serves and Safeguards the People and Protects the Property and Resources of California.

www.fire.ca.gov

 

[Izzylizzy]

Live video.
Fire burns in Jurupa Valley
Firefighters shown fighting fire.

Live News Stream: Watch FOX 11 Los Angeles

Stream local news and weather live from FOX 11 Los Angeles. Plus watch LiveNow, FOX SOUL, and more exclusive coverage from around the country.

www.foxla.com

 

[Izzylizzy]

KCAL
Jurupa fire
More news

 

[Izzylizzy]

Brush fire burning near homes in Jurupa Valley

Evacuation warnings have been issued for parts of one neighborhood.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[DS2021]

Im not seeing any updates on the california fires website

Hurst was updated to 97 percent contained earlier

Hurst Fire | CAL FIRE

www.fire.ca.gov

 

[LinasK]

In Montana, it is common for people to have extensive sprinkler systems, with their own wells drilled. Could people drill their own wells? Or use water from their swimming pools?

Swimming pool water may help, but it only goes so far in fighting a fire...

 

[DS2021]

Brush fire erupts east of Los Angeles

Firefighters are battling yet another wildfire in a riverbed in Riverside County Monday night. Crews reportedly responded to reports of the Jurupa Fire in the area of the Santa Ana River, west of V…

www.ktla.com

 

[LinasK]

Here's something Travis County Texas puts out for fire prone areas. I don't think I've seen anything like this in California. At bottomof news article.

https://www.sfgate.com/homeandgarden/article/innovative-fire-resistant-oakland-hills-homes-3206125.php

Travis County, Texas, has prepared a checklist of things everyone in a fire-prone area should know. The more checkmarks you have, the more prepared you are in the event of a wildfire threat.

The house

Fire-resistant roof, i.e. metal, tile, composition?

Non-flammable siding materials?

Home is located down-slope?

Wooden deck facing or overhanging level ground?

Large glass windows, facing level ground?

Deck, porch, vents or house screened to keep sparks out?

Chimney extending above the roofline?

Chimney spark arrester in place?

Roof and gutters clean of debris?

Around the house

A fire defensible space (D-space) zone of 30-100 feet?

Adequate clearance of weeds, tall grasses and brush?

Leaves raked?

Trees pruned 10 feet up from base of trunk?

Tree limbs pruned at least 10 feet from roof or within 15 feet laterally from chimney?

House location or address clearly marked (3-inch letters)?

Firewood and other burnable items stored at least 30 feet from the house?

Access

Easy access to home by emergency vehicles?

Road grade less than 15 percent (not steep)?

Road wide and accommodating to two-way traffic?

Road straight with wide turns?

Large areas for vehicles to turn around?

Short driveway from main road?

Home area level and easily plowed or raked for fire line?

Multiple roads into and out of developed area for safe and easy access and evacuation?

Water supply

Pressurized hydrants available?

Non-pressurized or dry hydrants available?

Water sources, such as ponds, or streams accessible?

Power lines buried and not susceptible to fire?

Well pumps maintained with uninterrupted electricity??

PGE has long been working on undergrounding power lines. We are also told not to have brush around our homes. Not all of these items are practical, like the grading of roads/multiple roads/size of driveways. Nothing could have prepared us for hurricane- force winds.

 

[iamshadow21]

Sixty nine year old Arthur Simoneau has been named as a victim of the Palisades fire. He'd just returned from a skiing holiday when the evacuation order came in, and decided to stay to try to protect the home he'd built by hand. He'd been a risk taker his whole life, an early pioneer of the sport of hang-gliding.

https://www.cnn.com/weather/live-news/los-angeles-wildfires-palisades-eaton-california-01-13-25-hnk#cm5vftkme000k3b6nclp8sctr

The L.A. fire victims: Who they were

Biden urges Congress to ‘step up’ on California aid as LA warned of ‘explosive fire growth’ – as it happened

Governor Newsom calls on state legislature to approve $2.5bn in extra aid as experts predict wildfires could be costliest disaster in US history

www.theguardian.com

Evelyn McLendon, 59, has been named as a victim of the Eaton fire. Evelyn's family were evacuating together from multiple houses, in multiple cars, and were heavily focused on the elderly grandmother and young children. They barely made it out and thought Evelyn was behind them in her car. Later, after the fire passed, they returned and found her body.
https://www.cnn.com/weather/live-ne...fornia-01-13-25-hnk#cm5vbksm200053b6nqsabmjch

Biden urges Congress to ‘step up’ on California aid as LA warned of ‘explosive fire growth’ – as it happened

Governor Newsom calls on state legislature to approve $2.5bn in extra aid as experts predict wildfires could be costliest disaster in US history

www.theguardian.com

All Los Angeles public libraries have N95 masks available for those who need them.

LA's sports teams lead wildfires donation drive

The region remains on high alert as the latest wind event continues.

www.nbclosangeles.com

Little follow up about the man whose dog was missing for five days and then found safe - apparently both dogs only survived because a firefighter went and busted down his door as the fire was approaching. One of the dogs was saved then, but the other had fled, and was found days later living in the ruins of his neighbour's house.
https://www.nbcnews.com/weather/wil...tinue-rcna187351/rcrd68178?canonicalCard=true

Brush fire burning near homes in Jurupa Valley, Riverside County

Southern California's winds weakening; at least 25 dead, 26 missing amid wildfires

Fires across the Los Angeles area have killed at least 25 people. The Palisades and Eaton fires continue to burn in Southern California.

www.cbsnews.com

Maps launched to help show home owners whether their properties have been damaged, lost, or unaffected by fires in areas still restricted

Southern California's winds weakening; at least 25 dead, 26 missing amid wildfires

Fires across the Los Angeles area have killed at least 25 people. The Palisades and Eaton fires continue to burn in Southern California.

www.cbsnews.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1878864244927783170

Table showing containment percentages of the fires

Southern California's winds weakening; at least 25 dead, 26 missing amid wildfires

Fires across the Los Angeles area have killed at least 25 people. The Palisades and Eaton fires continue to burn in Southern California.

www.cbsnews.com

Cultural institutions across LA are offering free entry and events to people impacted by the fires, especially families and children whose schooling has been disrupted.

Natural History Museum, La Brea Tar Pits Museum, and LACMA offer free entry

Enjoy free visits to the Exposition Park institution and the Miracle Mile art favorite through Jan. 17.

www.nbclosangeles.com

Small brush fire at Marine Corps Air Station Miramar fully contained.

https://www.nbcnews.com/weather/wildfires/live-blog/california-wildfires-live-updates-santa-ana-winds-continue-rcna187351/rcrd68214?canonicalCard=true

 

[Lilibet]

PGE has long been working on undergrounding power lines. We are also told not to have brush around our homes. Not all of these items are practical, like the grading of roads/multiple roads/size of driveways. Nothing could have prepared us for hurricane- force winds.

BBM/UBM

The Almeda fire here in Southern Oregon in Sept.2020 was primarily on level ground. It ran along 4-lane Old Hiway 99 through the towns of Talent and Phoenix and crossed it several times, roaring through both towns—-because of the wind. No preventive building techniques, underground power lines or road widths, etc would have stopped it. That’s not to say there aren’t precautions that can and should be taken by homeowners and cities, but when the wind is 40-45 mph or more, there is no way to effectively fight it, especially when it’s not the only fire happening in the area.

To this day, it’s not clear how the Almeda fire started AFAIK. It could easily happen again if conditions are “right.”

JMO