CA - Rebecca Nalepa - suicide or murder? #9

[elementry]

I concur that JS was a penny pincher, otherwise; why didn't he have full time household staff and a full time nannie/s to look after MS? Afterall, it's not a house...it's a mansion and imo warrants staff to maintain it. Was it the responsibility of Rebecca to maintain the house, cook the meals, watch the children, drive them to their activities, etc.?

An aside, from the beginning MS has been called a special child by multiple people. Was he a special needs child? Was he autistic or did he perhaps have ADHD or ADD? My reason for asking is that I wonder if he was more than a handful to care for. Was he always running around, was it difficult for him to sit down and have quiet time, did he have issues following directions (i.e.) no scooters allowed in the hall?

I was struck by JS's rather subpar treatment of the historic manse. Firstly how he vulgarly went about trying to alter its historic features, despite the preservation bylaws he agreed to upon buying the place (funny, though, if I recall correctly, he wanted another balcony.) That was just tacky and unclassy.

Also, in older pictures of the front, there was this lovely and elegant set of hedgerows lining the front walk; subsequent pictures showed small portions of the hedges dying off (implying insufficient watering.) Eventually, JS just had them ripped out entirely (as opposed to repair), detracting from the general proportioned charm of the front yard; it looks kind of threadbare and under-developed now.

Then, in viewing the LE close-ups of the death balcony railing, one can see it in the early stages of neglect, with rust and corrosion showing. If one sin't ready to rise to the occasion of the show property he has purchased, perhaps he shouldn't have taken on the responsibility in the first place. Well, no future moneybag will want to be living there probably, so it's probably destined for an eventual museum or Chamber of commerce function or something someday in the distant future. JS would probably at this point be satisfied in just tearing the whole damn thing down, if he could.

As to MS's possible "special" status, LE vouched for his healthy, fine status; considering their other vouchings in the case, one might still wonder. he did seem like a sweet little fella though, rest his soul.

 

[jjenny]

Can cell phone voice messages be deleted online? I've never tried on my cell but can do that on my other phone.

I am pretty sure that if you know the password to the phone, you can delete the voice mail message from a long distance, you don't have to physically have the phone.

 

[CalElliot]

There was an alarm system. Coronado commander was asked about it at the news conference. He said it was regularly not used. The sheriff Sgt. said he did not know whether the alarm was engaged. The Sgt. did say there was no sign of forced entry.

The alarm discussion is between 1:21:10 and 1:22:30

I live in a well-heeled neighborhood with plenty of ADT signs staked by front gates, etc. Few people use their alarms except when they're going away for an extended time...weeks or months. This is not at all unusual in small communities where crime is relative unheard of. Like Coronado.

 

[curiousjo]

Were those paint brushes and paint new, or hers? Did they match the brand she had in the home?

 

[JBean]

From the autopsy:

"On 07/12/11, the decedent drove her sister to the airport to return to her home. While at the airport, she picked up Jonah's brother (AS), who flew in from out of town to be with his brother. They went to the hospital to meet Jonah and then the three went out to dinner. Jonah returned to the hospital and the decedent and Adam returned to the home. The decedent was last seen by Adam at approximately 2000 hours."

tvscum if you have a copy of the autopsy you must scan it and post it or we cannot put it up for discussion. we have no way of reading it in context or confirming information.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Indeed? Then how did AS enter the house (to get a knife)? He either forced the door, or else it was unlocked. I suppose he could have had a key to both the guest house and to the main house...

I would think the guest house had a kitchen with knives in the drawers.

Or Adam could be like a lot of men and carried a pocket knife in his pocket.

IMO

 

[jjenny]

Sadly, not true, I know this from personal experience. When my son was going through a horrendous ordeal (he's fine now), I looked at a journal on his phone for clues to his misery. I was shocked and horrified by what I read.

But I doubt what was in RN's journal was horrifying. The family dynamics appear to be what one would expect when a rich older man with a couple of ex-wives and three children gets himself a new younger girlfriend. At least one ex-wife apparently wasn't too crazy about RN, and at least one teenage child and RN maybe didn't have the best relationship. None of it is surprising and I fail to see how that points to her being depressed or suicidal, even if she did have some issues with some of the members of her boyfriend's extended family.

 

[babette_gladney]

Hi all,

I've been following this page closely. Just a few thoughts while I drink my coffee...

Re the PR firm client list: Having County of San Diego listed as a client does not mean that the Sheriff's office is a client. San Diego County has had some very high-profile controversies over the past few years, including a county pension fund scandal.

Re the handwriting on the door: Writing on a door like that is more like sign painting than it is signing a painting or writing with a pen. It's meant to send a big message. It makes sense to use block letters in such a case. If we posit that the door message was written by RN, she would not be in her right mind. Why would she write as if in her right mind?

Re LE conspiracy theories: I live here. I follow local news closely and I am a very, very skeptical person. Dumanis' office has had some big, big problems with managing evidence (google Cynthia Sommer, who recently brought a lawsuit against Dumanis's office). I don't automatically take the side of LE. However, in this case, I strongly suspect LE is being careful beyond belief. The Sommer scandal, elections... there is too much at stake.

Re the Zahaus' attorney: Too bad prominent SD attorney Allan Bloom couldn't handle this. He is busy with the Sommer suit right now. A brilliant attorney and an incredible advocate. He would be the go-to guy to shine a light on LE improprieties.

Re the Zahau family: Asserting that suicide was out of character for RN because she was a Christian really is a disservice to Christians who have experienced the tragedy of suicide. I can understand they are devastated and seeking answers. I certainly would be. I would have been seeking answers on the ground, and not waited for LE to come to me. That's me, though.

Re the tone of JS' statement: I agree that it was cold vis-a-vis RN. It points to the likelihood that he blames her, the only adult in the home at the time, for the accident. This was his child. If this happened in my home, I would blame the adult present. Particularly at this stage of the bereavement process.

Re DS: My heart goes out to her. What happened here is every single parent's worst nightmare. And yes, every parent's worst nightmare. But the fact that this was a shared custody situation involving a significant other makes the whole thing all the more poignant. And yes, I am a single parent. Happily, my relationship with my kids' dad is excellent. And I know that if something similar happened in either of our homes -- God forbid -- the significant other would be out of there faster than a New York minute.

When this case first broke, I thought it was homicide. I don't think so anymore.

My sympathy and condolences to all involved.

 

[CalElliot]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/sep/03/officials-sure-bizarre-case-suicide-family-unconvi/

Bremner, though, said none of this would have overruled Zahau’s Christian faith: “She held a belief that suicide would mean she would go to hell.”

The lawyer said the journal entry was “standard relationship stuff,” pertaining to Zahau’s sometimes difficult interactions with Shacknai’s teenage daughter — not Max. Bremner also dismissed the talk with the friend as low-key gossip.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/sep/03/officials-sure-bizarre-case-suicide-family-unconvi/

Bremner, though, said none of this would have overruled Zahau’s Christian faith: “She held a belief that suicide would mean she would go to hell.”

The lawyer said the journal entry was “standard relationship stuff,” pertaining to Zahau’s sometimes difficult interactions with Shacknai’s teenage daughter — not Max. Bremner also dismissed the talk with the friend as low-key gossip.

The thing about that though is a lot of people have committed suicide who were believers in their particular faith.

I don't think they are thinking about that when they decide to kill themselves.

IMO

 

[CalElliot]

Of late what resonates for me is that simplest, most obvious answer often the right one.

Bound, gagged, hit on head, hung, naked, tape on ankles, cryptic note would all point to "murder."

Absence of other prints, no forced entry, no other signs of struggle (beyond blunt force trauma to head) would all point to someone she knew wearing gloves or experienced gloved killer, either armed and aiming for efficiency.

The suicide theory, while possible, is the long shot here.

 

[snapdragon2]

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/on-air/a...stery_Flawed__Family_San_Diego-129185438.html

Note on door as per above (no "YOU" in there).

Alleged phone message was from Jonah Shacknai, but deleted; LE based the existence of it and its contents purely on what JS said. Message is HEARSAY.

I wonder if Zahau family regret having JS in attendance at RZ's funeral?

Not according to this article: http://www.760kfmb.com/story/15388199/autopsy-rebecca-zahau-found-gagged-with-t-shirt-in-mouth

It said this:

"Medical Examiner Investigator Dana Gary also described a message found painted on a door inside the house.

"I noted black painted writings on the bedroom door that led into the room with the balcony," Gary wrote. "The writing ‘She Saved Him Can You Save Her' in black paint was on the hallway side of the bedroom door," the report said."

Was the sister paraphrasing?

 

[jjenny]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/sep/03/officials-sure-bizarre-case-suicide-family-unconvi/

Bremner, though, said none of this would have overruled Zahau’s Christian faith: “She held a belief that suicide would mean she would go to hell.”

The lawyer said the journal entry was “standard relationship stuff,” pertaining to Zahau’s sometimes difficult interactions with Shacknai’s teenage daughter — not Max. Bremner also dismissed the talk with the friend as low-key gossip.

I think it's telling that police couldn't find nothing better to support her supposed depression as some friend saying she stopped exercising in January. Even though she was regularly exercising all summer prior to supposed suicide. So I think the message after which she supposedly decided to kill herself in such a bizarre fashion would be pretty important-and yet it was erased. Have LE tried to retrieve it or see who erased it? I am sure RN's family lawyer would want to get hold of that phone.

 

[jjenny]

Not according to this article: http://www.760kfmb.com/story/15388199/autopsy-rebecca-zahau-found-gagged-with-t-shirt-in-mouth

It said this:

"Medical Examiner Investigator Dana Gary also described a message found painted on a door inside the house.

"I noted black painted writings on the bedroom door that led into the room with the balcony," Gary wrote. "The writing ‘She Saved Him Can You Save Her' in black paint was on the hallway side of the bedroom door," the report said."

Was the sister paraphrasing?

The phone message went to voice mail and was subsequently erased. The message on the door is not erased. I think the relatives were shown it but memory being imperfect they didn't memorize it exactly and thus "can you save her" became "can he save her."

 

[babette_gladney]

My daughter keeps a journal on her cell phone, too. And I use my BlackBerry to draft documents. It's far more than a phone. Smartphones are like portable desks, computer included.

 

[CalElliot]

Point of my post was simply re "phone journal" contents.

[Bremner] said the journal entry was “standard relationship stuff,” pertaining to Zahau’s sometimes difficult interactions with Shacknai’s teenage daughter — not Max. Bremner also dismissed the talk with the friend as low-key gossip.

 

[CalElliot]

Thanks. Then it has been reported both with YOU and with HE. Let's hope for ME sake that ME as per below is correct.

"I noted black painted writings on the bedroom door that led into the room with the balcony," Gary wrote. "The writing ‘She Saved Him Can You Save Her' in black paint was on the hallway side of the bedroom door," the report said."

 

[sdcali]

The phone message went to voice mail and was subsequently erased. The message on the door is not erased. I think the relatives were shown it but memory being imperfect they didn't memorize it exactly and thus "can you save her" became "can he save her."

I agree. Perhaps the family is interjecting the gender of the person who they believe the message was written to or for the benefit of?

I know it has been reported that the lettering of the message was block lettering. All caps? I noted the first letter of each word was capitalized in the quote. Was that the way it was written? Was that how RN wrote? I have noticed online that there are folks who write that way and I have never understood that.

 

[snapdragon2]

If they were HER art supplies, they would ALREADY have her fingerprints on them.
It is my opinion that the killer knew this and covered his tracks by wearing gloves.

It just doesn't make sense to me that she would go through all the trouble of getting her messy paints out during a stressful time....when she could just use a Sharpie marker. I doubt that she would keep messy paints in a carpeted bedroom. I doubt that she normally paints in a carpeted bedroom. Why would she walk around that big house gathering rope, art supplies etc. when she could have used stuff that was near by.

If she did, there's a ritualistic aspect to it. Was she a methodical or analytical person? More needs to be known about her personality. Painting something in black paint makes more of a statement than just using a sharpie. It's bold and it's messy and destructive, and that is in keeping with the suicide. (I'm not convinced, by the way, I'm just saying.)

If this was a suicide, it was either a) an attempt to make it look like murder or b) an act of extreme self-loathing, someone who is extreme pain AND c) an attempt to hurt someone else (make JS sorry?) But these feelings, and the plan, wouldn't have appeared overnight. She would have probably thought of this for a long time, in other circumstances. Her sister said she wouldn't know how to do any of this and it didn't show up on her computer e.g. how to tie her hands like that, but she might have thought of doing it that way long before that. It's very punishing.

A friend of mine knew someone years ago who cut her own throat (a woman.) I remember him saying "think of the amount of self-hatred you'd have to have to do something like that." There is the possibility this is similar. She'd have to be extremely distraught, but the accident alone wouldn't cause that - it would just be the straw that broke the camel's back.

Question: why do people say her legs were bent? Where is that written?

 

[elementry]

Been at a family reunion all day. Uggh...too much food and now I am trying to catch up.

I do believe you are correct and I don't know if that is Bremner's intentions or not but she isn't dealing with someone who is just going to rollover.

I don't know how Bremner can convince the court Jonah is responsible for Rebecca's death when he wasnt even on the property at the time. And suicide is a choice by the individual who made it.

I believe LE knows a lot more than they divulged so imo while I understand Rebecca's family being upset and wanting more answers .....pointing fingers is a very risky chance to take because if they keep it up then they will box themselves into having to back up those allegations and imo, they cant.

Neither Jonah or Dina are going to just sit here and take this for very long. Rebecca's family has to realize if they are incorrect in their speculations what they are doing is defaming and hurting someone who has already suffered an unimaginable tragedy of their own.

While the suicide was unusual I do believe the only proof anyone has points to suicide only. If Bremner files a civil suit then she has to have proof that either Jonah or Dina were responsible. That takes solid evidence .....not speculation. So I highly doubt one will ever be filed.

IMO

I'm not so sure the Shacknais would be so quick to attack the Zahau's. The net-net is perhaps not worth it. Do they really want to re-open that can of worms and give the Zahau team rights to further discovery? Jonah seems quite satisfied with the finding as is; there seemed no desire on his part to further the investigation.

Btw, if one recalls the OJ matter, the civil wrongful death suit had a different standard of evidence: a "preponderance" as opposed to "beyond a reasonable doubt". A lesser standard.