CA - Rebecca Zahau Nalepa - suicide or murder? #10

[IWannaKnow]

Thank you tvscum for posting those!

Is anyone else struck by the similarities in the injury patterns between Rebecca and Max? Head and back injuries. Granted Max doesn't have all the damage to his legs....

 

[belimom]

The red flags that I see:
- someone with no known depression supposedly commits suicide
- in doing so, this person creates a bizarre and gruesome suicide scene
- including writing 'she saved him can you save her' in black paint on the back of a door
- conjures up the whole hanging scenario (including calculating the rope length)
- figures out how to tie her own hands in a cleat hitch (a la the video) on the spot with supposedly no prior experience or guidance in how to do it
- is able to throw herself off the balcony with hands AND feet bound, only leaving one set of distinct footprints and one set of distinct toe print --- no scuffling, doesn't fall down, etc.

I just do not buy it.

 

[IWannaKnow]

BBM

Perhaps as she came out of the shower, wrapped in a towel, she was surprised and hit over the head....then strangled...

Exactly! Perhaps surprised as she was removing her makeup and clothing....I wonder if her shower was before she was hung to remove trace evidence. MOO.

 

[belimom]

If this is murder, there has to be a motive. A lover's rage? Or, IMO, money. If someone starts eliminating the folks most likely to stand in the way of an inheritance or a fortune, then you would start with children (such as Max) and maybe go next to the girlfriend (if she was in JS's will). I do not think JS had anything to do with it. Other than that, all bets are off - MOO.

I know this is a conspiracy-type of theory and it's farfetched, but then again, so are two deaths within days of each other - each in and of itself looking very suspicious.

 

[CalElliot]

I know this was discussed many pages ago but I'm not gonna go try to find it. I think that cactus is a Cereus repandus, Peruvian apple cactus.

No it is not the above cactus. It is euphorbia ingens.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Euphorbia_ingens_plant.jpg

http://www.djamas.com/pictures/cacti/succulents.html

 

[jjenny]

If LE was even remotely thorough they should have started by figuring out if there is anything in her background to suggest she would know how to tie the cleat hitch knots on her hands. It's not something somebody is just naturally going to come up with without having done this before, IMO.
Like, if you give me a rope, no way I am going to come up with this.

 

[belimom]

If LE was even remotely thorough they should have started by figuring out if there is anything in her background to suggest she would know how to tie the cleat hitch knots on her hands. It's not something somebody is just naturally going to come up with without having done this before, IMO.
Like, if you give me a rope, no way I am going to come up with this.

I totally agree. I knew how to tie a cleat hitch, yet when I did my 'experiment' last night before watching the video, I never thought of doing what they did. It took some thought and planning do recreate it the way they did. MOO

 

[belimom]

"She saved him can you save her".

This may have been from someone who did not know the latest news about Max - that it didn't seem that he would make it. I wonder who else JS called besides RN?

ETA: Or, more importantly regarding the note, who he *didn't* call.

 

[IWannaKnow]

Noted from MS autopsy:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...DctZGRjMy00ODVkLTk1YWItODAxZjAxMzE5OTVl&hl=en

He was initially pronounced brain dead on 7/15/11 at 2358 hours, confirmed on 7/16/11 at 1130. Organ procurement was 7/17/11 at 0600.

The 25-30 minutes before they regained a pulse was what killed him, not the head trauma from the fall.

:rose: Rest in peace Maxfield Shacknai. My sincere condolences to the Shacknai family.

 

[CalElliot]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ACCURATE-HE...ultDomain_0&hash=item336ab2b4aa#ht_761wt_1348

This Accurate Marine tow rope on eBay today matches the colors (red with yellow tube) and capacity (two riders or 340 pounds). Accurate Marine is in NY, but products sold all over the country.

 

[jjenny]

Noted from MS autopsy:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...DctZGRjMy00ODVkLTk1YWItODAxZjAxMzE5OTVl&hl=en

He was initially pronounced brain dead on 7/15/11 at 2358 hours, confirmed on 7/16/11 at 1130. Organ procurement was 7/17/11 at 0600.

The 25-30 minutes before they regained a pulse was what killed him, not the head trauma from the fall.

:rose: Rest in peace Maxfield Shacknai. My sincere condolences to the Shacknai family.

Yes, brain damage from lack of oxygen is what killed him. His neck was not actually broken and spinal cord not severed, only damaged. So if he was not brain dead presumably he could have recovered and maybe not even as a quadriplegic.

 

[IWannaKnow]

Yes, brain damage from lack of oxygen is what killed him. His neck was not actually broken and spinal cord not severed, only damaged. So if he was not brain dead presumably he could have recovered and maybe not even as a quadriplegic.

So, given the dates listed in the AR, why was the 12th/13th such a catastrophic date? So catastrophic as to cause Rebecca to throw herself off the balcony? They didn't definitely determine he was brain dead until 2 to 3 days later. Shouldn't there still have been a little hope at that point?

Those women's clothes in the guest house are looking more and more suspicious.

 

[elfie]

So she hit her head four times on the balcony on the way down?

See balcony photos below:

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...MjY5NjBkMjQ2MDdi&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...YTM5ZWZiYTBmOTc5&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...ZjM1NjRjYjI5Mzk4&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...NzE1M2FhYjlkOTFk&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...OTAyNzA2ZTkwMjIx&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5...OGYzM2E4ZDRkODE3&sort=name&layout=list&num=50

FYI, the last two photos on the list were taken months before the deaths.

I agree - I'm trying to understand how others think that such head trauma could be possible, who are interpreting the 9 ft differently.

Seriously thinking now (emphasis on now, subject to change) that recent evidence points to: hit on head, tied up & gagged, strangled, staged hanging.

 

[jjenny]

So, given the dates listed in the AR, why was the 12th/13th such a catastrophic date? So catastrophic as to cause Rebecca to throw herself off the balcony? They didn't definitely determine he was brain dead until 2 to 3 days later. Shouldn't there still have been a little hope at that point?

...

I don't know. When were parents told Max took turn for the worse? Brain death was pronounced on 7/15, not 7/13. The message that was left in voice mail at 12:50 am was erased-no way to independently verify what was in it.

 

[IWannaKnow]

Does JS have any other family members other than AS? Why weren't they called to come too?

 

[jjenny]

Does JS have any other family members other than AS? Why weren't they called to come too?

Maybe AS is the favorite family member?

 

[elfie]

Okay, going to try this again since the other one really blew the margins. Here's a photo that may help with how far down the rope was hanging:

(ETA: Keep in mind that the rope is slack with no weight pulling it down further in these photos).

http://www.sdsheriff.net/coronado/images/rz-courtyard.jpg

Then add in the line that was still attached to her.

 

[chasing.halos]

I don't know. When were parents told Max took turn for the worse? Brain death was pronounced on 7/15, not 7/13. The message that was left in voice mail at 12:50 am was erased-no way to independently verify what was in it.

I noticed the same thing. Would they know 2 days before that Maxie would likely be brain-dead I wonder?

FWIW, I have not asked about the timeline and when DS was informed of the turn for the worst. DS is in so much pain, as we all can imagine and there is belief that Maxie was suffocated so talking about it usually revolves around that belief, not the events leading up to it. I'll keep everyone updated though if I hear anything else.

 

[Carioca]

A strangulation would have to be around the neck and there are no marks noted on the back of Rebecca's neck. The ligature furrows noted are consistent with a hanging.

Stella5, after some research based on autopsy report, please note the following:

Autopsy Report
----------------------
petechiae: tiny red or purple spots on various parts of body....sometimes in clusters
----------------------
World of Forensics: strangulation vs hanging....."if petechial hemorrhages and facial congestion are present, it is a strong indication of asphyxia by strangulation as cause of death."
-----------------------
Autopsy Report - page 5 - External Description - "…the face is generally congested. There are dense, innumerable, focally confluent, fine red petechiae.
------------------------
Medical Examiners (research): If the victim has marked congestion in the face with petechiae and fine petechiae, then it is more likely death by strangulation.
---------------------
World of Forensics...."hanging victim will have a pale face and a protruding tongue."

Autopsy Report - page 5 - External Description...."the mouth is slightly open and the tongue is NOT protruding."
--------
Based solely on these findings, the autopsy report should conclude:
Cause of Death: Strangulation
Manner: Murder

 

[sorrell skye]

Regarding the tape residue on RZ's shins: I'm wondering if LE attempted to locate the matching tape. If the residue was from athletic tape, and if RZ used it recently to tape her shins, I would think there would still be a remnant of the roll somewhere in the house.

It doesn't appear to me that LE located a roll of athletic tape, otherwise it would have been mentioned in the AR, IMO.

I wonder if LE attempted to locate ANY tape that would have matched the residue.