CA - Rebecca Zahau Nalepa - suicide or murder? #11

[CDS22]

Do you have a link? I only get supply stores & acrylic review sites when I type in Amsterdam Acrylic Paint. TIA!

Yes. Here you go:

Dosing Nozzles, Package of 5 — These dosing nozzles fit both the 75 ml and 120 ml tubes of Amsterdam Acrylic Color, making it easy to paint directly from the tube. Each package contains 5 nozzles

From here:

http://www.dickblick.com/products/a...lic/?wmcp=amazon&wmcid=feeds&wmckw=00643-2020

Click on the link and you'll see that the image matches the type of paint Rebecca allegedly used.

 

[elfie]

Yes. Here you go:



From here:

http://www.dickblick.com/products/a...lic/?wmcp=amazon&wmcid=feeds&wmckw=00643-2020

Click on the link and you'll see that the image matches the type of paint Rebecca allegedly used.

Thanks. When I was studying art in college there was a Dick Blick warehouse nearby going out of business and made several trips. Years ago, of course.

Still having difficulty finding the manufacturer site, though.

 

[jjenny]

Yes. Here you go:



From here:

http://www.dickblick.com/products/a...lic/?wmcp=amazon&wmcid=feeds&wmckw=00643-2020

Click on the link and you'll see that the image matches the type of paint Rebecca allegedly used.

You have to add a special nozzle to "make it easy" to paint directly from the tube.

 

[JBean]

Please take the paint/ message convo to the appropriate thread-thanks.

 

[CDS22]

You have to add a special nozzle to "make it easy" to paint directly from the tube.

Rebecca allegedly used a brush, but you can only attach a nozzle to a tube of acrylic paint that doesn't have to be diluted (in other words, that is tube-ready). You never dilute acrylic paint when you're painting letters. The only time you'd dilute acrylic paint is if you're trying to mimic oil and doing shading. Very, very rare.

 

[JBean]

Please take the paint/ message convo to the appropriate thread-thanks.

[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148929"]The message on the door - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[HowLoveCanBe]

I don't see why the method for applying the paint to the brush would have anything to do with this case at this point. How do we know that a possible murder suspect wasn't also a part-time painter?

 

[LaLaw2000]

All is JMO:

I have a problem with how LE so matter of factly showed the power point and stated that it was a projection of how Maxie fell. It does not look plausible to me at all. I also do not like how LE came across so smug and arrogant. I am a big LE advocate, but not in this case. I do not claim to know how Maxie's tragic accident happened, but do feel it was an accident.

When CPD got to the scene of Rebecca's death, they saw it looked suspicious and stated she had died a 'violent death'. That was their first impression according to the first PC, IIRC. Other agencies were called in that afternoon and search warrants obtained.

LE deemed Rebecca's death suspicious and violent on the first day. That was their first impression at the scene. They (LE) saw the evidence up close and personal before evidence was carted away. I just have to wonder at what point their collective minds changed.

Who would LE think of first if this was a suspicious death? The boyfriend, the ex-husband, the mother of a child who had had a horrific accident under Rebecca's care, and the mysterious brother ( would be first as he was actually there) of the boyfriend would seem to be the ones LE would have to clear first. Then the only other would have been an intruder.

This is not being personal or trashing anyone. It is logic. Who would have reason to want Rebecca dead and why? I know what I think and have said from the beginning that I thought this was a murder. The very least Rebecca's death should have been deemed is undetermined, IMO.

I also simply cannot believe that Rebecca would abandon her little sister in this manner. Her little sister was there at the home when Max fell according to Mary's statement on Dr. Drew. Rebecca would have known how her death would affect her little sister. Look at what they had just been through together. This is something I have not seen mentioned in any posts so far and I have tried to read them all in every thread.

Bottom line; I do not believe this was suicide. I do not believe LE did a thorough job. I was astounded at the PC and how some facts were not mentioned. In fairness to everyone, this case should be re-opened and investigated by the California State Police in concert with the FBI.

JMO, MOO, and IMO

 

[sdcali]

Rebecca came to the US as an adult.

yes, 10 years ago.

 

[katydid23]

All is JMO:

I have a problem with how LE so matter of factly showed the power point and stated that it was a projection of how Maxie fell. It does not look plausible to me at all. I also do not like how LE came across so smug and arrogant. I am a big LE advocate, but not in this case. I do not claim to know how Maxie's tragic accident happened, but do feel it was an accident.

When CPD got to the scene of Rebecca's death, they saw it looked suspicious and stated she had died a 'violent death'. That was their first impression according to the first PC, IIRC. Other agencies were called in that afternoon and search warrants obtained.

LE deemed Rebecca's death suspicious and violent on the first day. That was their first impression at the scene. They (LE) saw the evidence up close and personal before evidence was carted away. I just have to wonder at what point their collective minds changed.

Who would LE think of first if this was a suspicious death? The boyfriend, the ex-husband, the mother of a child who had had a horrific accident under Rebecca's care, and the mysterious brother ( would be first as he was actually there) of the boyfriend would seem to be the ones LE would have to clear first. Then the only other would have been an intruder.

This is not being personal or trashing anyone. It is logic. Who would have reason to want Rebecca dead and why? I know what I think and have said from the beginning that I thought this was a murder. The very least Rebecca's death should have been deemed is undetermined, IMO.

I also simply cannot believe that Rebecca would abandon her little sister in this manner. Her little sister was there at the home when Max fell according to Mary's statement on Dr. Drew. Rebecca would have known how her death would affect her little sister. Look at what they had just been through together. This is something I have not seen mentioned in any posts so far and I have tried to read them all in every thread.

Bottom line; I do not believe this was suicide. I do not believe LE did a thorough job. I was astounded at the PC and how some facts were not mentioned. In fairness to everyone, this case should be re-opened and investigated by the California State Police in concert with the FBI.

JMO, MOO, and IMO

BBM

People kill themselves and abandon loving and vulnerable family members every single day. Fathers kill themselves, as do mothers, husbands, wives, grandparents, fiances. It happens all the time.
She sent her home first, took her on a little shopping trip and sent her back to family.

 

[LaLaw2000]

Miraculously wiped clean of fingerprints even though there is no full time cleaning lady or maid. Hmmm....very perplexing. Also interesting that no one had been on that balcony to leave footprints before the day of the death. (I am not calling this a suicide as it is not proven to be one in my mind)

I agree, stilettos.

BBM:

Also, prints really can still be lifted even years later. Prints have been lifted from years back from evidence not known at the time. JMO. The prints do not just disappear. I taught fingerprinting to many booking officers, and had taken a thorough course in order to do so. Prints can and do become smeared and so forth but do not disappear unless wiped.

ETA: I should clarify that the fingerprinting course I had to take also encompassed everything about fingerprints, including lifting.

MOO

 

[LaLaw2000]

The Psychology Career Center

Loss of a Child
The death of a child may be the most intense grief a person will face ...
The loss of a child is generally considered the worst possible grief, making it one of the leading causes of prolonged grief. In the natural order of life, children are supposed to outlive their parents.

“The death of a child is like no other,” says clinical social worker and grief counselor at the Children’s Hospital and Clinics, Minneapolis, Minn., Theresa Huntley, in her book “When Your Child Dies.” “Your life has been irrevocably changed. Life is different. You are different.”

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...+of+a+child+the+worst+grief+there+is?&ct=clnk

I very much agree with this and know it is true from experience.

 

[deanna82437]

“The death of a child is like no other,” says clinical social worker and grief counselor at the Children’s Hospital and Clinics, Minneapolis, Minn., Theresa Huntley, in her book “When Your Child Dies.” “Your life has been irrevocably changed. Life is different. You are different.”

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...+is?&ct=clnk

I very much agree with this and know it is true from experience.

My child had grown into adulthood, but I believe it was the same as if he'd been a child. A parent is just not prepared to have a child go first. I'm sure it was the same for Rebecca's parents.

 

[Rhyme & Reason]

Rebecca's Autopsy - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Hi JBean, thank you for giving Rebecca her own forum! I don't see the media links thread in her forum. Or am I just not seeing it there?

Here's the link

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148814&page=2

 

[LaLaw2000]

Once 911 is called and LE responds with the EMT's, LE does not have to have a warrant at all. It would be deemed a crime scene and even the owner of the property could not refuse LE access. Ever.

The warrant, IMO, was to enter the home. Not the back lawn. LE had every right to be there. YES, even early on LE could have errected an open side cover over Rebecca's body. I am still furious that it was not done and she was left all day open to the sun, breeze, or whatever elements existed. I do blame LE for even allowing a media helicopter over Rebecca's body and photographing it. LE had the authority to contact FAA officials and have that area declared off limits.

Where the warrant comes in is when LE wanted to enter the residence and look for evidence within it.

MOO, IMO

 

[Pach]

didn't she live in europe somewhere before coming to the US ? unless Im mistaken, she was in Austria in some christian Bible college before moving to the US. the question is what age she left Burma. the earlier she left Burma, the more westernized she would be.

Rebecca came to the US as an adult.

 

[SunnieRN]

First off, worked last night and do tonight also, so haven't been able to say thank you to JBean!!!! This is what we needed to be able to process information and keep it pertinent to specific subjects!!!! :woohoo::great:

The internal neck injuries in the AR could be explained by either a long drop hanging with the knot being to the right, or manual strangulation. The problem I have with the long drop hanging scenario that the police are putting forth is that there is no injury to the spine.
Also, if we are to accept that RN leaned over the railing and fell head first, where are the injuries to the front of RN’s torso as she scraped over the metal edges of the railing?
In the AR we see only one line describing RN’s torso injuries: None.

Cynic, once again you have shown me how important your expertise is!!! Thank you so much, and you are right! NONE of this makes any sense with the evidence as presented!!! Thank you for helping us out!!:seeya:

TY so much, Cynic, for taking the time to come here & give us your opinion.

I've wondered the same thing about the lack of scrapes and/or injuries to RZ's anterior torso.

I agree - if she leaned forward over the railing & somehow managed to hurl herself over, why is there no evidence of that on the front of her body? Since her hands were bound behind her back, and since the placement of footprints & toe prints on the balcony indicates that she DID go over the railing facing forward, where are the torso injuries?

Another thing - if the railing is 36" high (as LE indicated in their PC), that would put the railing several inches above RZ's hip area. I question how it is that she bent over a railing that was too high for her 5'3" frame to bend over without the aid of a stool or some other device to assist in clearing the railing.

I also find it very hard to believe that a 9'2" drop would not have resulted in a cervical spine fracture - or, at the very least, a significant displacement of those vertebrae when she was jerked by the rope. IIRC, the AR indicated the cervical vertebrae were not fractured or displaced, nor was her spinal cord injured.

Fantastic questions. We need to start a thread *hint hint* entitled Rebecca - information and evidence as it would relate to a murder. No arguments, information, links and discussion. This is not the place for suicide believers to post, there should be a different post for that. This will keep the arguments for either one, front and center, so to speak. As in RDI or IDI in the JonBenet forum, I think I am an RMV kinda gal! (Rebecca murder victim).

I dont think she hit it that hard to do any damage to the railing/wall. The hemmoraging under her scalp was minor so the impact wasn't that hard, imo.

IMO

This argument has been refuted and discussed prior. The impacts were hard enough to bring about a loss of consciousness, per medical examiners and doctors.

Thank you, and ITA with your observations.
The lack of injuries to the torso stands in stark contrast to the injuries sustained to RN’s back.
From the AR:

Back: There are many punctate, linear, and slightly irregular abrasions on the back, extending from the neck to the mid buttocks and from each side of the back to the other. They are slightly more concentrated on the right thoracic back, with other ill defined groups across the lower lumbar back at the upper buttocks and on the left scapular and lateral mid thoracic back. Some appear to be paired and separated by a distance of 3/8 – ½ inch. On the right paraspinal thoracic back, two pairs appear to be discontinuous linear abrasions measuring 3/8 and 5/8 inches in length, separated by 3/8 inches. The larger ovoid abrasions measure up to 3/16 inch in greatest dimension. The linear abrasions measure up to 3/16 inch in length. However, on the posterolateral right upper back along the right posterior axillary line there are two linear abrasions, the longest of which measures 5/16 inch.
On the lateral right thoracolumbar back there is a vertically oriented 3-1/2 x ¾ inch patterned contusion. There is a vertically oriented linear component. There appear to be three thin linear parallel components situated ¼ inch apart.

As far as I’m concerned this means that RN’s back dragged over something, whether it be the railing or something else.
How the ME does not find this to be completely inconsistent with the theory that he and police have proposed is beyond me.

BINGO!!! This needs to be posted in the arguments for murder thread!!! Cynic, have I told you lately that I truly believe you are a genius??!!:seeya::great:

Yes and the victim wasn’t bound, gagged or nude.
The manner of death in the RN case should have been listed as undetermined at the very least, and the investigation ongoing.

Seems obvious, does it not?!:waitasec:

BBM
In some cases that's possible, but it's not the norm.

Since then, criminals have invested thought and energy in how to successfully foil the detective’s brush and powder. Latex gloves, nitrile gloves, synthetic gloves, they have all been used by malicious perpetrators with varying degrees of success. Today, it is not at all uncommon to find discarded Nitrile gloves at the edge of a crime scene. Black nitrile gloves seem to have become a favorite of many criminals, for various reasons.
Fortunately, it is quite possible to obtain fingerprints from the gloves themselves at this point. They are found left either on the outside from the criminal’s donning or stripping of the glove or on the interior of a tightly fitted glove when it is turned inside out. A pair of Nitrile gloved hands, if tightly fitted, may even leave a print on an exterior surface. After the Nitrile is worn for a while, warming and conforming to the fingers, and the criminal touches any oily surface (something as simple as rubbing one’s neck), a detectable fingerprint can transfer to objects.
http://www.glovenation.com/nitrile-gloves/nitrile-gloves-fingerprints.htm

Cynic, please correct me if I am wrong, but can't prints be taken from a garbage bag also? I have seen other cases where this has occurred. If the perp used it to cover his hands while painting, there would be finger prints inside the bag where he touched it, correct?:waitasec:

ITA, there are well documented cases where there is a complete absence of the perpetrators DNA and fingerprints. Hence the adage of "absence of evidence does not mean evidence of absence."

Have I told you that I love the fact that you are such an amazing wealth of knowledge?! You rock!:rocker:

Evidence must be sourced to its original location. If an item of evidence came from a location other than the immediate crime scene, then the original location of the item of evidence must be checked for potential fingerprints & DNA, as well as other potential trace evidence.

Exactly! Case in point. The rope. If it was on the shelf in the garage, it was either brand new, in a package (where is the package), or it would have OTHER DNA on it somewhere, from being put on said shelf.

Also it doesn't say 'no dna, except that of Rebecca and Adam, where he touched it to cut her down or move her on the ground.:banghead:

I just went back and looked at all of the photos that were released of the guest bedroom and could not find a single red rope fiber on the floor anywhere. But I did notice something else that is bothering me. The plastic trash bag in the room has some paint on it and it is covering the tube of black paint. Why would the trash bag be put on top of the tube of paint? Is it possible that someone else who painted the "message" on the door used the plastic trash bag to not leave fingerprints behind on the tube of paint, the paintbrushes and the knives? I can see no other reason for it to be in the room.


http://sdsheriff.net/coronado/

If someone had a plan and gathered the 'evidence' for Rebecca to use, before 'approaching her', this may make sense. Otherwise, not so much.:waitasec:

BBM

I don't recall LE saying that anything specific about the quality of Rebecca's fingerprints--whether whole or partial, etc. Do you have a link for that information?

Re the gloves, it has not been determined what type of gloves a perp may have been wearing at the time. But I am curious about the information you provided and would appreciate a link for your statement. TIA

IMO, here has been no evidence discovered that anyone else was in the mansion, at the time Rebecca died because no one was looking for it at the time.

Thank you for this!!! Awesome point. Were there several prints? One print on each item? Smeared prints, barely recognizable?? Lots of questions about these 'prints'.

I wonder why they didn't hire a clean up crew. According to Rebecca's sister, their younger 13 year old sister had cuts and wounds on her hands that needed to be cleaned and cared for by the sister who's a nurse. I wonder why they didn't hire a crew, and take the 13 year old to the hospital to get her hands treated.

I thought it was her leg that got cut, according to some places. This concerns me, because if it was her hands, did she turn Max over? Also, early reports stated DS had cuts to her hands, later reports stated XZ had cut to her leg.:crazy:

 

[SunnieRN]

Oh, one more point. Just sayin, that gloves are easily and readily available in hospitals/ They are in every patient room. They can easily be brought anywhere to be disposed of also, as they are small and will fit anywhere.

 

[CDS22]

didn't she live in europe somewhere before coming to the US ? unless Im mistaken, she was in Austria in some christian Bible college before moving to the US. the question is what age she left Burma. the earlier she left Burma, the more westernized she would be.

Apparently the Christian Bible college was done by correspondence.

 

[CDS22]

I thought it was her leg that got cut, according to some places. This concerns me, because if it was her hands, did she turn Max over? Also, early reports stated DS had cuts to her hands, later reports stated XZ had cut to her leg.:crazy:

Rebecca's sister said it was her hands.