Cadaver dog hit on scent in DBs bedroom

[Donjeta]

I don't know what happened to the cell phones or the baby but I don't see a problem with the lights, supposing someone in the family did it.

Theory A) If JI and DB are both in it: did anybody outside the family see the lights on in the middle of the night? if not, maybe they were not on and it's just a story to make people think an intruder came and turned on the lights.

Theory B) If DB is in it but JI is not: the lights were on because DB was up just before JI came home, she had checked her voicemail and ditched the phones just minutes before, and she didn't have time to turn the lights off and it would have been a bit difficult to pretend to be asleep if JI had noticed lights going out

 

[Sherbie]

Even smart people tend to make dumb mistakes that trip them up in the crimes they commit. So I don't buy that someone couldn't pull off a, b, c in seemingly spectacular fashion and yet not take care of the simple x, y, z things. It happens.

Whoever committed this crime has done a well enough job (and/or has been lucky) not to be arrested thus far, but that doesn't mean there's not something left undone or unattended that will nail them...eventually.

 

[matou]

Oriah may be able to answer this but can the smell of death transfer fairly easily from one object to another? What about after items are washed?

 

[askfornina]

not buying it until or unless it is confirmed by LE.

i have seen Ron Rugen report things that were questionable. two off the top of my head: the rumor that PN was handed a dufflebag outside of the N Lister house the night Lisa went missing, and something related to the MW end of the case that i don't want to repeat here because it involves a person that apparently lives down the street from the "flophouse" that has nothing to do with this crime. to be fair to Ron Rugen though, in both of these instances he either clearly stated it was a rumor or he redacted the information. still, i don't like that he seems to not mind spreading questionable information.

i'm not sure what "a source close to law enforcement" means, but i too would like to know RR's confidence in the source.

 

[Ronso]

I'm sure if LE was asked to confirm, the response would be:

"We've moved on from the cadaver dog hit."

:innocent:

 

[hambirg]

And go through all of this and leave the clothes and blanket behind??????

That's why I said it doesn't take a brainiac.

 

[hambirg]

So far, I haven't read even one <believable> theory about how she accomplished that. Everyone can say 'she did it' 'baby is in the river', but nobody can tie the loose ends, like the cell phones and the lights into the timeline.

We don't know what LE has. They may be able to tie the loose ends, but still not know exactly who is responsible. There was plenty of time that night that dang near anything is possible.

We don't know if LE has video of a blurry figure throwing a bag off one of the bridges, but can't tell who it is, let alone know if that person is responsible for Lisa's death. It is not an impossible theory knowing what we know. Anybody have a link from LE stating that they know for a fact that didn't happen?

 

[3doglady]

Can LE just take property out of a house if a search dog hits on it? The search warrant was executed on the 19th and the dog hit on the 17th: http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf

The search warrant states that LE searched the house with permission on Oct.4 and CSI took items at that time related to the search.

 

[In da Middle]

The search warrant states that LE searched the house with permission on Oct.4 and CSI took items at that time related to the search.

And they searched the house with permission and took items and the parents STILL cooperated for 4 more days. Then the parents consented to the cadaver dogs to search the property. People are stating that the parents totally quit cooperating, but, to me, consenting to searches of your house and letting a cadaver dog search your house and property is anything but not cooperating.

 

[menmo]

Yes, and even though the river looks close on a google map, it does not show you what all you have to go through to actually get to the water and be able to toss a baby in it in the dark, no less. The bridges have cameras also.

Are the bridge cameras actually known to be on and working?
I only ask because around here there's cameras everywhere, but they aren't taping.

 

[Oriah]

Oriah may be able to answer this but can the smell of death transfer fairly easily from one object to another? What about after items are washed?

We discussed scent transfer earlier in, I think the SAR thread?

A lot depends on what the composition of the scent is (to simplify- gas, liquid, solid, etc) and what it is deposited ON.

 

[Donjeta]

And they searched the house with permission and took items and the parents STILL cooperated for 4 more days. Then the parents consented to the cadaver dogs to search the property. People are stating that the parents totally quit cooperating, but, to me, consenting to searches of your house and letting a cadaver dog search your house and property is anything but not cooperating.

People might as well because likely the police would be back with a warrant if they wouldn't.

Then, later, you can always say, hey, why would I have consented to a search if...

Is DB's consent required or just JI's if he's the owner of the property?

 

[natsound]

I can tie the cell phones into the timeline. They were still in the house the first 24-72 hours. DB disposed of them when she had the opportunity.

 

[natsound]

We don't know what LE has. They may be able to tie the loose ends, but still not know exactly who is responsible. There was plenty of time that night that dang near anything is possible.

We don't know if LE has video of a blurry figure throwing a bag off one of the bridges, but can't tell who it is, let alone know if that person is responsible for Lisa's death. It is not an impossible theory knowing what we know. Anybody have a link from LE stating that they know for a fact that didn't happen?

Or, they know who is responsible but don't feel confident making a murder/manslaughter arrest without a body.

 

[matou]

The search warrant states that LE searched the house with permission on Oct.4 and CSI took items at that time related to the search.

Were dogs used on the 4th? I was asking specifically about items that are hit by a search dog.

 

[spamelope]

I can tie the cell phones into the timeline. They were still in the house the first 24-72 hours. DB disposed of them when she had the opportunity.

This! ^^^^
Very early on, one of our awesome sleuths, (I can't remember which one and can't find the original post!) noticed from poring over pictures that the bird feeder was there, then disappeared, and then reappeared. I think the phones were in the feeder. I also think that's what the spokesman meant when he said something like they were looking at something that hadn't been there, but had returned.

 

[cityslick]

I can tie the cell phones into the timeline. They were still in the house the first 24-72 hours. DB disposed of them when she had the opportunity.

It all depends how much access the parents had in those 72 hours. Also, I'm curious to know when exactly the pings stopped on the ping map. Was it when the last vm attempt was made? And would DB have known how to make the phones stop pinging after that (I ask this because it seems many people even on here did not know this info)?

 

[Detective Klimpt]

I can tie the cell phones into the timeline. They were still in the house the first 24-72 hours. DB disposed of them when she had the opportunity.

Ok then, why did DB call MW's number? Why was she checking her email and internet at 3:15am? What on earth could someone that just killed a baby and disposed of the body want to see on the internet at 3:15am? Why did she even feel a need to dispose of the cell phones, because LE is/was obviously able to tell the activity on the phones. If she wasn't smart enough to know that, then she wasn't smart enough to remove the battery or put them in water so they would no longer ping after 3am.

I have been seriously wracking my brain on this case. I'm obsessed with it; specifically the part about the cell phones. I've already stated my theory back in middle of Nov. (on the theory thread) and it hasn't changed much at all. I still think those cells phone calls were made by Jersey. I really wish we could know if Jersey was completely cleared of anything involved in this case, or that anyone was completely cleared (rather than LE is moving on, whatever that means.)

Sorry, this really belongs in the cell phone thread or maybe even the theory thread, but the topics on this case are starting to get a bit inter-twined within threads.

 

[cityslick]

Or, they know who is responsible but don't feel confident making a murder/manslaughter arrest without a body.

I still don't think FBI would be following up tips for an alive BL halfway across the country if this was the case. IMO

 

[cityslick]

Ok then, why did DB call MW's number? Why was she checking her email and internet at 3:15am? What on earth could someone that just killed a baby and disposed of the body want to see on the internet at 3:15am? Why did she even feel a need to dispose of the cell phones, because LE is/was obviously able to tell the activity on the phones. If she wasn't smart enough to know that, then she wasn't smart enough to remove the battery or put them in water so they would no longer ping after 3am.

I have been seriously wracking my brain on this case. I'm obsessed with it; specifically the part about the cell phones. I've already stated my theory back in middle of Nov. (on the theory thread) and it hasn't changed much at all. I still think those cells phone calls were made by Jersey. I really wish we could know if Jersey was completely cleared of anything involved in this case, or that anyone was completely cleared (rather than LE is moving on, whatever that means.)

Sorry, this really belongs in the cell phone thread or maybe even the theory thread, but the topics on this case are starting to get a bit inter-twined within threads.

I haven't seen anyone come up with a theory that involves the actual calls (where DB is the one making the calls) where it actually makes sense. The vm attempts are even more bizarre, since if it was her phones, she would know if she had a vm or not (by a visual indicator) so it doesn't make sense that she would still check for vm's (twice at that).