Cadaver dog hit on scent in DBs bedroom

[KsStormy]

yes-- both the FBI and the handler of the dog used that day in the house assert the reliabilty and accuracy of FBI-trained dogs.

and, we know for a fact that at least one of martin grime's dogs (he was called in for the lister search) has never had a false positive hit.

i posted an article about this in the pat brown thread last week...

BBM
I saw that too...I suspect that is why LE called off the Amber alert so soon, they know the dogs are top of the line, & that there was a dead body in that house.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

BBM
I saw that too...I suspect that is why LE called off the Amber alert so soon, they know the dogs are top of the line, & that there was a dead body in that house.

I don't think that the dog alert and LE cancelling the Amber Alert are related. The Amber Alert was canceled on Oct 4 at 7:00 PM. The cadaver dog alert took place nearly two weeks later on Oct 17.

Once 12 hours have passed, Amber Alerts are often called off as searches continue. Kansas City police said that cancelling the Amber Alert does not change the nature of the search.

"Lisa Irwin is still considered a missing/endangered juvenile," police Sgt. Stacey Graves said in a news release.

The affidavit also revealed that "On October 17, 2011, an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of (Jeremy) Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-mi...al-plea-return/story?id=14670008#.UEEcK5az5nA

http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/local_news/amber-alert-issued-for-missing-10-month-old-girl-in-kcmo

http://www.kmbc.com/Lisa-Irwin-Sear...it/-/11664900/12264286/-/108618q/-/index.html

 

[Deleted member 39678]

So, would you say that the FBI dogs that were used for Lisa's case were trained with the "real thing"? I believe I read that Mr Grimes' dogs were...?

From what I been reading, I'm sure that the FBI would have access to "the real stuff" to train their dogs. What I've been wondering is how hard would it be for someone to plant some "real stuff" scent in Lisa's home? Or was "real stuff" scent there for purely innocent reasons?

I'm still not sure if Martin Grimes was involved in Lisa Iriwns case. I looked for a link but couldn't find one. JMO.

 

[KsStormy]

There are pictures of him & his dogs at the scene.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

There are pictures of him & his dogs at the scene.

There is? Do you have a link? If you can't find one that will be ok. It doesn't matter to me other than having the fact that he worked this case on record. We know that the dog used to search Lisa's home for human remains was an FBI dog and would have had good training. JMO.

 

[Melon]

i believe yes, with eddie... sure looks like eddie in this video

http://eddieandkeela.blogspot.ca/2011/10/fbi-cadaver-dog-lisa-irwin.html

Found another pic and the handler looks like it could be Eddie's handler as pictured from your site. http://media2.kshb.com//photo/2011/...9-1f9fcf8ba9e80000_20111021181948_640_480.JPG ETA: I couldn't say one way or the other if it is Eddie and his handler, I cannot make out enough of the pic.

I did have some videos of various dogs filmed the day of the search but the one I really wanted to reference has been taken down.

And a late edit. The markings on this dog seem to differ from what I can find of Eddie. The markings on the side of the dog are pretty distinct in the pic I posted. Hrmm.

 

[KsStormy]

From what I have read of Grimes, he doesn't use just one of his dogs when he works cases, but uses 2 or more , and with the no-fly zone that was enforced, we have no way of knowing which exact dogs were used.

 

[KsStormy]

KMBC news piece on the dogs...
http://news.yahoo.com/video/kansasc...pecial-dogs-in-baby-lisa-search-27013087.html

 

[redheadedgal]

yep-- that pic shows that dog isn't eddie (or keela)... might've even been the dog with the zero false positives -- morse.


(btw, morse was used early december 2011 in detroit... so methinks he was most likely used in KC too)

 

[Deleted member 39678]

yep-- that pic shows that dog isn't eddie (or keela)... might've even been the dog with the zero false positives -- morse.


(btw, morse was used early december 2011 in detroit... so methinks he was most likely used in KC too)

Do you know where Martin Grimes lives or where his search dog operation is based? I can't find much information on him. When the search warrant affidavit says that an FBI dog made the "hit", do you think that it actually was one of Martin Grimes's dogs instead? Or were his dogs used in other types of searches like trailing?

 

[sarx]

The FBI has lots of great dogs at their disposal, and I think they had the knowledge in this case to use the right dogs and the right amount of dogs, IMO.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

The FBI has lots of great dogs at their disposal, and I think they had the knowledge in this case to use the right dogs and the right amount of dogs, IMO.

Thanks sarx. Do you know if Martin Grimes and his dogs were used in this case?

 

[sarx]

Thanks sarx. Do you know if Martin Grimes and his dogs were used in this case?

Couldn't say, but he's just one of many with great dogs out there.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Couldn't say, but he's just one of many with great dogs out there.

Thanks. I've been unable to find anything that shows for sure that he worked Lisa's case.

 

[KsStormy]

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/...-MO-/?action=view&current=101711cadaverk9.jpg

 

[Deleted member 39678]

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/...-MO-/?action=view&current=101711cadaverk9.jpg

Isn't that the same screen capture that Melon posted? That could be Martin Grimes and one of his dogs, but I'm not sure. JMO.

 

[Melon]

yep-- that pic shows that dog isn't eddie (or keela)... might've even been the dog with the zero false positives -- morse.


(btw, morse was used early december 2011 in detroit... so methinks he was most likely used in KC too)

BBM, that would be excellent news. Truly. I did a brief search and couldn't find any pics of that particular dog. I did find video where the screen cap of the "mystery spaniel" was taken from. http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/cadaver-dog-'hits'-inside-baby-lisa's-house# The face of the handler is maddeningly unclear on my laptop. Not sure if it's the video or me.



So, there are at least 4 dogs that were present at the Irwin home the day of the warrant execution (3 dogs here shown a few times starting around :30 http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/lisa-irwin-parents-home-searched-14792120) and the dog from the video in the first paragraph makes the 4th. Who they are and what agency they are with are unknown to me. Whether they were all worked that day is also unknown.


Prior to the warrant execution we don't seem to have much info on the number of dogs that were brought in for the hit in the bedroom that was the basis of the warrant being granted. It certainly seems LE covered their bases with an ample amount of dogs.

 

[KsStormy]

BBM, that would be excellent news. Truly. I did a brief search and couldn't find any pics of that particular dog. I did find video where the screen cap of the "mystery spaniel" was taken from. http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/cadaver-dog-'hits'-inside-baby-lisa's-house# The face of the handler is maddeningly unclear on my laptop. Not sure if it's the video or me.



So, there are at least 4 dogs that were present at the Irwin home the day of the warrant execution (3 dogs here shown a few times starting around :30 http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/lisa-irwin-parents-home-searched-14792120) and the dog from the video in the first paragraph makes the 4th. Who they are and what agency they are with are unknown to me. Whether they were all worked that day is also unknown.


Prior to the warrant execution we don't seem to have much info on the number of dogs that were brought in for the hit in the bedroom that was the basis of the warrant being granted. It certainly seems LE covered their bases with an ample amount of dogs.

I remember watching it on TV on our local KC channels & seeing several different dogs,but hard to find many videos online now. I remember one in particular they did a "dog's eye view" story where the dog had a camera strapped to it & they followed it along as it worked... I suspect they like to keep the info about them somewhat quiet, as witnessed by the no-fly order.

 

[Melon]

I remember watching it on TV on our local KC channels & seeing several different dogs,but hard to find many videos online now. I remember one in particular they did a "dog's eye view" story where the dog had a camera strapped to it & they followed it along as it worked... I suspect they like to keep the info about them somewhat quiet, as witnessed by the no-fly order.

The dogs eye view would be really cool.


Here is another video from the warrant execution and it looks like one of the dogs is being taken to work. That's a total assumption on my part just based off the handler walking the dog towards the house and the excitement of the dog. http://video.today.msnbc.msn.com/today/45014011#45014011 it starts around 2:48

 

[Deleted member 39678]

From the story about the Detroit case that Martin Grimes testified in there is this information.

Also Friday, Rex A. Stockham, a special agent for the FBI who oversees its forensic canine program, said the agency has been studying the science for about a decade.

The FBI began testing contract and volunteer teams for the human scent detection program in 2008, Stockham said. The agency has three full-time dogs working in the country.

Does this mean that the FBI uses contract, volunteers and three of their own dogs for forensic canine work? It looks that way to me if this information is correct.

The dogs are tested annually to ensure they meet best practices standards. Morse has only been tested one time, Stockham said.

Does this mean that Morse the dog is new to working with the FBI, hence the only one annual test, or is it just a young dog beginning in it's career as a working dog?


From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20120824/METRO01/208240420#ixzz25MJg9NNg