Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #14

[otto]

Agreed Lori, I should have worded it to say the family were waiting to enter the home with LE who were obvious on scene already. I was wondering what the blue and red item was on the ground. Cant imagine little N toy on the ground or a piece of clothing but I believe that is what that is. Because this was the following day IIRC that the family was reported missing, I think because there were possibly no items of NO in the home the LE wanted something for scent and tracking purposes if they were to go door to door et al.

I think that items used for tracking are put in a sealed bag in their original location, and then offered to the tracking dog at the location where they start tracking. I don't think that scent items for tracking dogs are left lying on the driveway at the crime scene.

 

[otto]

Thank you for the clarification. Bills and initiatives can be difficult to decipher, especially when there is competing legislation.

In layman's terms, currently all minors involved with the WPP, remain in their custodial parents care.

I believe so. The referenced link upthread is a proposal that was not put into law. The law that was passed addresses financial obligations of non-custodial parents regarding children that they no longer see.

 

[news.talk]

I believe so. The referenced link upthread is a proposal that was not put into law. The law that was passed addresses financial obligations of non-custodial parents regarding children that they no longer see.

Exactly. It makes sense too - the best interest of the child should ALWAYS supersede any investigation. Once in a while our government gets it right. [emoji12]

 

[Krystine]

This one is a different country but still gives ideas for WP and faking deaths

I am a bit shocked that your example of the other country where this type of trickery is used was Russia. Maybe more than a bit shocked.
I was born here, but my parents were not. They had a lot of misconceptions about law and politics and could never quite understand democracy and the umbrella of safety we have as Canadians and Americans. It never occurred to me that some people still don't understand the integrity of the justice system.

It is an interesting side bar to consider WPP but I still don't understand what could be accomplished by 'tricking' the accused in such a way. If convicted, he is already going to spend the rest of his days in prison. One more second degree murder charge isn't going to make a difference to the amount of years he will serve. He is 54.
I don't mean to be combative, I really don't understand the reasoning.

 

[Deleted member 117120]

I think that items used for tracking are put in a sealed bag in their original location, and then offered to the tracking dog at the location where they start tracking. I don't think that scent items for tracking dogs are left lying on the driveway at the crime scene.

Excellent point otto.

 

[news.talk]

I think that items used for tracking are put in a sealed bag in their original location, and then offered to the tracking dog at the location where they start tracking. I don't think that scent items for tracking dogs are left lying on the driveway at the crime scene.

My son is studying forensic science and I am always amazed at the professionalism and baffled by the degree of scientific expertise required for the job. He hopes to work for the CPS as he feels they have one of the best departments in Canada. It gives me hope and confidence that this case was built on proper evidence collection and will be won, given the challenges they face.

 

[LawyerMum]

Interestingly, JL does not appear to be wearing the sterile gloves as he opens the screen door on his way out. Wonder why this is? Front door already processed for forensics? Or this entrance had already been eliminated as being part of the crime scene, i.e. there was another point of entry?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-calgary-missing-person-case/article19554739/

 

[stan laurel]

I wonder if it's possible to find specific time slots from this website? These are live camera shots of highways in Alberta, I wonder if they cache historical to view?

http://www.alberta511.ca/map.html#l=36&x=-12679588&y=6662231&z=5

 

[Cherchri]

My son is studying forensic science and I am always amazed at the professionalism and baffled by the degree of scientific expertise required for the job. He hopes to work for the CPS as he feels they have one of the best departments in Canada. It gives me hope and confidence that this case was built on proper evidence collection and will be won, given the challenges they face.

I shared a link a couple of days ago - an interview with our chief ME and she stated, categorically, that Alberta has THE best department in Canada which is why she chose to relocate from Quebec for the opportunity. I am sure your son will enjoy a wonderful career here.

 

[stan laurel]

How each of us discuss in our own way,, many a variation of a simple theme.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA_Q

 

[LoisLane]

How each of us discuss in our own way, or rather a variation - or many - of a simple theme.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA_Q

Ha! That was perfect! Love Vivaldi

 

[LoisLane]

Here is the airdrie Echo article from 4 days ago. It is the same info we all know except that the reporter got the Garland relationship with PG and AL wrong or DG was in a realtionship with one of the couple's daughters. If it is an error I am annoyed that after this has been stated over and over again that this mistake shows up. Or is it a mistake?

http://eedition.airdrieecho.com/doc/Airdrie-Echo/airdrieecho_08202014/2014081901/6.html

 

[Deleted member 117120]

Interestingly, JL does not appear to be wearing the sterile gloves as he opens the screen door on his way out. Wonder why this is? Front door already processed for forensics? Or this entrance had already been eliminated as being part of the crime scene, i.e. there was another point of entry?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-calgary-missing-person-case/article19554739/

I noticed that as well. IMO the forensic team had already been through. You can see some of the dusting marks on the white screen door exterior. I am thinking the walk through was a verbal discussion walk through with LE rather then hands on scenario for JL and JO.

 

[Deleted member 117120]

Here is the airdrie Echo article from 4 days ago. It is the same info we all know except that the reporter got the Garland relationship with PG and AL wrong or DG was in a realtionship with one of the couple's daughters. If it is an error I am annoyed that after this has been stated over and over again that this mistake shows up. Or is it a mistake?

http://eedition.airdrieecho.com/doc/Airdrie-Echo/airdrieecho_08202014/2014081901/6.html

Agreed Lois, about Garland being in a relationship with one of the couple's daughters should be AL. It once again is past tense. We have seen this before on WS when msm says past tense for AL and PG relationship. However, I was under the impression AL and PG were common law as reported in several msm reports so that part seems accurate.

 

[LoisLane]

http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/992801/summary.html
APPARATUS FOR INCINERATING COMBUSTIBLE WASTES

This patent was issued in 1976. Not sure if this was already listed here.

 

[deugirtni]

Yes, I see your point, and I agree that this was stated off the cuff, rather than carefully crafted wording, and so that statement, although we can pick it apart, could mean different things. For example, that announcement was, I believe, made after the family had been missing for some 17 days (June 30-July 16?) and by that time, the bodies would have reached the 'black putrefaction' phase of decomposition, and if you look up the stages of decomposition, it isn't pretty. When I read that statement from the officer, I personally read it as, 'they don't know what they've signed up for', ie, here are these lovely searchers who only want to help, however they have no clue about what they may find, because they have no idea what a dead body looks and smells like after that many days.. I agree when you say, 'how could they not know what they are looking for... unless... they are no longer recognizable'.. but I think that nature had made the bodies unrecognizable by then anyway, nevermind other reasons perhaps also making them unrecognizable. You could of course, be correct in thinking that he meant unrecognizable for other reasons, but imho, he could have meant the most basic reason in that most people have never seen a body after 17 days of decomposition, and imho, most would likely be traumatized by such a finding, and it would probably burn an image into their memories which could never be un-seen. All MOO.

Good points... but I have to come back to the one piece of info that is detailed enough, and out of left field enough, to be considered a quote that LE might wish they could take back. If it were a concern over contamination, I don't think anyone would begrudge LE for telling searchers that they may contaminate the scene, please don't search. The quote we got was:

"Kevin Brookwell with Calgary police says he understands that people want to help, but questioned the usefulness of the search.

"These folks — God bless them — they've got hearts of gold, and they're giving of their time to come out and search but it's a bit of a blind search. They don't know what they're looking for," he said."

People are searching for bodies. How could they not know what they are looking for... unless... they are no longer recognizable. It's an odd quote, and the runup to the quip was a heartfelt, human being, not a carefully crafted LE release... to me it reads like an ooops moment after the emotional reaching out to connect with people on the runup.

They don't know what they are looking for, and LE can't release what they should be looking for... all we get is "anything unusual".

As to the contamination, I don't think it would matter if it was planted... they are prepared to follow through with the charges without any further evidence. If a body or part turned up, no matter how, it would be concrete proof of death. Compelling no matter how it is found.

http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/canada/calgary/story/1.2708571

 

[deugirtni]

Isn't that awful? Such incompetence! I went back to the paper to see if there was a subsequent correction printed, and I do not see one. Just shows that we can't rely on newspaper reports for accuracy, IMHO.

Here is the airdrie Echo article from 4 days ago. It is the same info we all know except that the reporter got the Garland relationship with PG and AL wrong or DG was in a realtionship with one of the couple's daughters. If it is an error I am annoyed that after this has been stated over and over again that this mistake shows up. Or is it a mistake?

http://eedition.airdrieecho.com/doc/Airdrie-Echo/airdrieecho_08202014/2014081901/6.html

 

[Cherchri]

Here is the airdrie Echo article from 4 days ago. It is the same info we all know except that the reporter got the Garland relationship with PG and AL wrong or DG was in a realtionship with one of the couple's daughters. If it is an error I am annoyed that after this has been stated over and over again that this mistake shows up. Or is it a mistake?

http://eedition.airdrieecho.com/doc/Airdrie-Echo/airdrieecho_08202014/2014081901/6.html

Please note that the article was written by Kevin Martin (Calgary Sun)I sat next to him in court and he is the guy who has a mistake in his own bio . I suspect the Echo used his report and paraphrased a bit. Someone ought to call them on it. Shocking!

 

[otto]

Isn't that awful? Such incompetence! I went back to the paper to see if there was a subsequent correction printed, and I do not see one. Just shows that we can't rely on newspaper reports for accuracy, IMHO.

I wouldn't go that far. It's clear from the article that the author interviewed the best friend of Kathryn Liknes - that's stated in the article. Did Kathryn's best friend give incorrect information about Kathryn's step children, or did the author use a second, unreferenced source for the mistaken info?

The article is published in a small town weekly publication, and the provided link is to the online print version of the newspaper. Vol 21, Issue 29 was published on July 16. Vol 21 Issue 34 was published on August 20. If there's is going to be a correction, it will be in next week's issue: Vol 21 Issue 35, published on Wednesday, August 27. If no one contacts the newspaper to tell them about the mistake, the newspaper will not print a correction.

Newspaper articles are, in general, accurate, but occasionally someone relies on an unreliable source and fails to verify facts, and there is a mistake in the content.

 

[otto]

If anyone wants to contact the Airdie Echo so they can make a correction in their next weekly publication, here is the article with the error highlighted. Perhaps it's a good idea to contact Cheryl Hodgins and double check the information. If it came from Kathryn's best friend, perhaps it's true ... although it is inconsistent with all other information about the case.



http://eedition.airdrieecho.com/doc/Airdrie-Echo/airdrieecho_08202014/2014081901/6.html#6