CANADA Canada - Ben Tyner, 32, cowboy, horse returned w/o him, Merritt, British Columbia, 26 Jan 2019 - #2

[Trudie]

If you’re referring to cellphone tower data, unfortunately that doesn’t identify a precise location, only a range within a few miles of the tower’s coverage.

It’s a cellphone option referred to as Location Services (ie Google mapping) that provides exact location data. However as it uses a great deal of battery power, it’s very common that people turn it off when they’re not requiring the service (ie find my phone or GPS).

Hopeful however LE would be extremely fortunate if the precise location of everyone involved could be confirmed by their cellphone.

Is there a reason for you to believe someone already questioned has lied to authorities?

It is moo the person reporting Ben was seen riding out lied to LE.
I have no idea if Ben turned his location apps off.

 

[MistyWaters]

It is moo the person reporting Ben was seen riding out lied to LE.
I have no idea if Ben turned his location apps off.

Another possibility was the horse was moved during the darkness of the night, either Saturday or Sunday, many hours after Ben was last seen. We don’t know where the horse was corralled or pastured and while there’s been mention of Ben last being seen, there’s no word on when his horse was last seen at NR.

I’m still on the fence about only one person involved and a murder occurring at NR during daylight hours. If it was a targeted attack that would seem quite a risky plan IMO. Darkness is always the preferred cover of the unscrupulous.

My second theory is Ben did go riding and was ambushed. I can appreciate the office manager said he’d have notified somebody if he went riding but if the watch on each other was so active, my question is why didn’t anybody become greatly concerned when neither he nor his horse was anywhere around by Monday, assuming that was a workday after his weekend off? Wouldn’t it also be out of character for Ben to be nowhere around?

 

[Trudie]

We’ve discussed the horse potentially being moved as late as Monday morning. Only Ben’s murderer knows, imo.
However, LE is still requesting dash cam footage from Saturday.
I’ve followed many cases with murders occurring in broad daylight. In a rural setting, it makes no dif’, moo.
We all have our own theory as to what we believe took place, based on our findings.
I always make a list of potential suspects, keeping notes as the case unfolds.
I, personally, have had one person on my list.
Someone else might have a list of 40 possible suspects based on their findings.
All moo

 

[MistyWaters]

We’ve discussed the horse potentially being moved as late as Monday morning. Only Ben’s murderer knows, imo.
However, LE is still requesting dash cam footage from Saturday.
I’ve followed many cases with murders occurring in broad daylight. In a rural setting, it makes no dif’, moo.
We all have our own theory as to what we believe took place, based on our findings.
I always make a list of potential suspects, keeping notes as the case unfolds.
I, personally, have had one person on my list.
Someone else might have a list of 40 possible suspects based on their findings.
All moo

“We know of his whereabouts on Saturday night, so that gives us an extra day," Dunsmore explains...”
Searchers narrow time frame of Merritt cowboy's disappearance

It may just be the officer was not careful with her words but generally speaking LE do not declare “they know” the past whereabouts of a missing person unless they have concrete proof, such as CCTV. This statement is perplexing to me if indeed it’s been changed to 2pm, although by their last press release they no longer indicate any time, only referring to his “sudden disappearance in late January”. I have no idea if his perceived whereabouts Sat night somehow relates to dash cam requests for the Saturday as well but it’s possible. Early on iirc there were reports he’d been at a bar and maybe I only read of a rumour here on WS because I’m unable to find a source.

This is one reason, if I had a list of suspects (which I don’t), the possibilities appear wide open. Ben must’ve formed a circle of friends, it was his days off, a young, single sociable guy, Saturday night out on the town is always the #1 high social time.

But maybe LE no longer know what they thought they knew, we don’t know...

 

[Trudie]

Ben Tyner Missing FB is a great source of info.
Remember, a lot of what police/media know & report comes from family/friends. There has to be an initial source to collect info.
Moo

 

[Trudie]

This is one reason, if I had a list of suspects (which I don’t), the possibilities appear wide open. Ben must’ve formed a circle of friends, it was his days off, a young, single sociable guy, Saturday night out on the town is always the #1 high social time.

We all sleuth cases we follow differently. I prefer to begin with obvious suspects & go from there.
I immediately ruled out a stranger as the perp. Even if there had been a home invasion, that person would have no knowledge of Gunny, her tack, was she acquiescent, difficult to handle, etc.
As far as the sighting @ 2, it is moo it never happened. Because it is reported doesn’t mean it’s true. The absence of tracks or manure is a huge red flag for me. All of us that ride know how frequently horses poop. Why did no one else see Ben riding at 2:15, 2:30, 3:00, even someone passing by in a vehicle?
Lying to LE is more the norm than not, in my experience.
Even drunk drivers lie when asked “have you been drinking”, claiming they have not or they’ve had one or two. It is moo the person claiming the 2pm ride happened is covering his butt. Again, not unusual. Most suspects lie, assuming they have pulled off the perfect crime. But, they forget the little details that ultimately prove otherwise.

 

[otto]

Regarding the timeline, any reports that Tyner was seen riding out at 2PM Saturday are unrelated to his disappearance. He was seen on Saturday night, and RCMP believe he disappeared on Sunday - which could mean at 1AM on Sunday:

"At this point, RCMP say they have determined Tyner would've likely left on Sunday, however it's still not known how he got into the backcountry.

"We know of his whereabouts on Saturday night, so that gives us an extra day," Merritt RCMP Const. Tracy Dunsmore explains. "We are still looking at how he may have gone up here, because we're still thinking that maybe he was driven up. So we don't know who would have driven him up, or if there's anybody out there that maybe brought him up with a truck and trailer, and we're looking for that person if that did happen."​

January 30, 2019
Searchers narrow time frame of Merritt cowboy's disappearance

 

[MistyWaters]

Ben Tyner Missing FB is a great source of info.
Remember, a lot of what police/media know & report comes from family/friends. There has to be an initial source to collect info.
Moo

I’ve looked at the public page several times and clearly the family and friends want Ben found. Aside from that, what other info are you referring to and where can it be found?

 

[MistyWaters]

Regarding the timeline, any reports that Tyner was seen riding out at 2PM Saturday are unrelated to his disappearance. He was seen on Saturday night, and RCMP believe he disappeared on Sunday - which could mean at 1AM on Sunday:

"At this point, RCMP say they have determined Tyner would've likely left on Sunday, however it's still not known how he got into the backcountry.

"We know of his whereabouts on Saturday night, so that gives us an extra day," Merritt RCMP Const. Tracy Dunsmore explains. "We are still looking at how he may have gone up here, because we're still thinking that maybe he was driven up. So we don't know who would have driven him up, or if there's anybody out there that maybe brought him up with a truck and trailer, and we're looking for that person if that did happen."​

January 30, 2019
Searchers narrow time frame of Merritt cowboy's disappearance

Yes, good observation. If indeed LE know the whereabouts of Ben on the Saturday night, any sightings of him earlier in the afternoon are irrelevant to his disappearance. It’s entirely possible the media reported the 2pm information sourced from one or more individuals who “last seen” him then but LE learned he was somewhere else that same night.

JMO the RCMP certainly should’ve retracted the “we know his whereabouts on Saturday night” statement if something had changed because it discourages others who might’ve saw him at say, 4pm or 6pm from coming forward.

 

[Trudie]

Regarding the timeline, any reports that Tyner was seen riding out at 2PM Saturday are unrelated to his disappearance. He was seen on Saturday night, and RCMP believe he disappeared on Sunday - which could mean at 1AM on Sunday:

"At this point, RCMP say they have determined Tyner would've likely left on Sunday, however it's still not known how he got into the backcountry.

"We know of his whereabouts on Saturday night, so that gives us an extra day," Merritt RCMP Const. Tracy Dunsmore explains. "We are still looking at how he may have gone up here, because we're still thinking that maybe he was driven up. So we don't know who would have driven him up, or if there's anybody out there that maybe brought him up with a truck and trailer, and we're looking for that person if that did happen."​

January 30, 2019
Searchers narrow time frame of Merritt cowboy's disappearance

@otto I’ll look around, iirc, later reports went back to the Saturday @2 sighting.
As is always the case, reporting is all over the place.
I know on the Berreth thread we had issues with msm reporting different timelines.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/brit...-cowboy-months-after-he-disappeared-1.5093604

Even this article uses 01/26 (also says he’s been missing nearly 4 months)

 

[Trudie]

Case of Merritt cowboy missing since January deemed suspicious by RCMP

This only mentions the date he was reported missing.

Iirc, the Constable & a Sgt with RCMP have been quoted using different times. I’ll go back thru my bookmarks & notes as soon as I have a chance.
My own conclusion is no one has any idea the date Ben actually went missing.

Moo

 

[otto]

Yes, good observation. If indeed LE know the whereabouts of Ben on the Saturday night, any sightings of him earlier in the afternoon are irrelevant to his disappearance. It’s entirely possible the media reported the 2pm information sourced from one or more individuals who “last seen” him then but LE learned he was somewhere else that same night.

JMO the RCMP certainly should’ve retracted the “we know his whereabouts on Saturday night” statement if something had changed because it discourages others who might’ve saw him at say, 4pm or 6pm from coming forward.

I think so. It sounds like someone last saw Ben riding out on Saturday at 2PM and did not see him return. Someone else last saw him on Saturday night.

Evidence related to the horse suggests that it was driven to the location, which means that riding at 2PM is unrelated - unless that 2PM statement was intended to mislead RCMP in the same way that transporting the horse was meant to mislead.

RCMP seem to believe that he disappeared on Sunday, yet isn't the dash cam footage request for Saturday? Is it possible that RCMP now doubt the Saturday night sighting, or are they interested in the movements of a specific vehicle prior to his disappearance? Even if police now doubt the Saturday night sighting, I doubt they would announce that simply because doubt does not equate to proof.

It seems evidence that someone is going to a lot of trouble to prevent RCMP from knowing how and when the horse and Ben left the ranch.

 

[Trudie]

@otto

RCMP seem to believe that he disappeared on Sunday, yet isn't the dash cam footage request for Saturday? Is it possible that RCMP now doubt the Saturday night sighting, or are they interested in the movements of a specific vehicle prior to his disappearance? Even if police now doubt the Saturday night sighting, I doubt they would announce that simply because doubt does not equate to proof.

I think so. It sounds like someone last saw Ben riding out on Saturday at 2PM and did not see him return. Someone else last saw him on Saturday night.

Evidence related to the horse suggests that it was driven to the location, which means that riding at 2PM is unrelated - unless that 2PM statement was intended to mislead RCMP in the same way that transporting the horse was meant to mislead.

RCMP seem to believe that he disappeared on Sunday, yet isn't the dash cam footage request for Saturday? Is it possible that RCMP now doubt the Saturday night sighting, or are they interested in the movements of a specific vehicle prior to his disappearance? Even if police now doubt the Saturday night sighting, I doubt they would announce that simply because doubt does not equate to proof.

It seems evidence that someone is going to a lot of trouble to prevent RCMP from knowing how and when the horse and Ben left the ranch.

I’m not so sure they believe he disappeared Sunday because it seems that backtracked on that comment.
The last request for dash cam is for Saturday. Prior requests included Friday-Sunday.

 

[Trudie]

https://www.radionl.com/2019/04/11/...he-disappearance-of-merritt-cowboy-ben-tyner/

This is the latest request for footage that I have bookmarked.

ETA: Ben’s brother, Jack
Tyner, has never changed the official BT FB page, it still shows 01-26 2pm sighting as the last.

 

[MistyWaters]

https://www.radionl.com/2019/04/11/...he-disappearance-of-merritt-cowboy-ben-tyner/

This is the latest request for footage that I have bookmarked.

ETA: Ben’s brother, Jack
Tyner, has never changed the official BT FB page, it still shows 01-26 2pm sighting as the last.

And in that link they’re asking for dash cam footage from “the Merritt RCMP area” on January 26 because “police are still looking for some specific dash cam footage”.

What’s the Merritt RCMP area?

“This detachment serves: Merritt, Lower Nicola, Shulus Indian Reserve, Upper Nicola Indian Reserve, Douglas Lake Indian Reserve, Douglas Lake, Shackan Indian Reserve, Lower Nicola Indian Reserve”
Merritt detachment - British Columbia

 

[otto]

@otto
I’m not so sure they believe he disappeared Sunday because it seems that backtracked on that comment.

The last request for dash cam is for Saturday. Prior requests included Friday-Sunday.

RCMP stated on January 30 that Ben was last seen on Saturday night, and that the disappearance was on Sunday. If something happened to Ben early Sunday morning, and the horse was transported in the early hours of Sunday, that makes sense. It also fits with RCMP requesting information about Ben and dash cam video from Friday or Saturday through to Sunday or Monday. The dash cam footage request suggests to me that RCMP are looking for information about a specific vehicle.

Perhaps you recall the Mollie Tibbetts discussion, where police requested CCTV footage and then they asked for information about specific locations in the town. They were looking for a specific vehicle at specific times because they were trying to determine where the vehicle went after the abduction. They did not release the description of the vehicle until after the arrest. Mollie was presumed to be alive until her body was found.

 

[Trudie]

Disappearance of B.C. rancher Ben Tyner ‘may involve criminality,’ RCMP say

Mrs. Tyner’s comments reveal to me the family knew what was going on & her knowledge (as well as Jack’s) is what ultimately got the ball rolling. It is moo they were able to advise rcmp what Ben was dealing with.
Hopefully Ben sent a lot of texts & emails to his family, friends & boss.
Again, moo

 

[Trudie]

RCMP stated on January 30 that Ben was last seen on Saturday night, and that the disappearance was on Sunday. If something happened to Ben early Sunday morning, and the horse was transported in the early hours of Sunday, that makes sense. It also fits with RCMP requesting information about Ben and dash cam video from Friday or Saturday through to Sunday or Monday. The dash cam footage request suggests to me that RCMP are looking for information about a specific vehicle.

Perhaps you recall the Mollie Tibbetts discussion, where police requested CCTV footage and then they asked for information about specific locations in the town. They were looking for a specific vehicle at specific times because they were trying to determine where the vehicle went after the abduction. They did not release the description of the vehicle until after the arrest. Mollie was presumed to be alive until her body was found.

Yes, I do recall. I also have vivid recollection of the msm articles being all over the place. That’s the norm, imo.
Yes, I believe they have questioned a person that denies hauling Gunny, and they need the footage to prove he did in fact haul the horse. I absolutely agree & have posted many times, I believe they have a specific truck/trailer unit in mind. Someone saw something, ya know? Where do we go without being seen? Not all of us have dash cams, though. A local might be able to say I saw ________ on _____ road at _______, driving a truck pulling a stock/horse trailer. Now, all that is needed is documentation.

 

[Trudie]

Everyone, I emailed several msm requesting an accurate reporting of the date Ben was last seen. I’ll report back once I get response/s.
Going thru my notes, bookmarks & screenshots, 01-26 @2pm is the most popular sighting.
If Ben was seen Saturday night at John Doe’s Saloon, I think rcmp would release info as it might lead to tips.
So, I’m going with the 2pm riding out sighting as the last known. Moo

ETA: also sent message to RCMP

 

[otto]

This is the RCMP statement regarding Ben. He was at the ranch on Saturday afternoon, and RCMP are interested in information about him after Saturday. That is consistent with other statements from RCMP that he was seen on Saturday night, but not at the ranch.

"Ben TYNER was last seen Saturday afternoon at Nicola ranch where he has worked as the ranch manager since November of 2018. His whereabouts after Saturday are still being investigated and RCMP are asking if anyone has any information or saw Ben TYNER anytime over the weekend of January 27th to contact the Merritt RCMP or crime stoppers."​

RCMP in British Columbia - Search Suspended for Missing Merritt Rancher
2019-02-03