CANADA Canada - Billionaire Couple Barry & Honey Sherman Murdered at Home, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #24

[planet]

I think it was someone Barry had helped out financially, who panicked. I think the amount was relatively small compared to Barry’s overall wealth. I think the person is not one of the people WSers tend to suspect.

I feel like a broken record here: the police have redacted everything that relates to persons of interest and current investigative theories. The unredacted sections of the ITOs are not a viable basis for guessing the direction of the investigation. They are unredacted precisely because they do *not* indicate what the police are investigating.

Asking with genuine curiosity: Do you have a narrative that would account for the scene and both murders?

What has bothered me about this case from the start (other than the fact that it's unsolved) is that the murders took place in the family home. A confrontation that escalated or was miscalulated (e.g. the person intended to confront Barry but instead, Honey was home; they struggled; she was killed; then Barry arrived and he was killed) seems more plausible than planned homicide. It seems incredibly high risk to intentionally kill two people (directly, or by proxy) in their family home. It's physically demanding, the opportunities to leave evidence are many, and the timing had to be perfect. I'm sceptical this was planned.

My sole conviction about this case is that there was one killer. Ultimately, evidence is the only thing that matters.

 

[fadedglitter]

Asking with genuine curiosity: Do you have a narrative that would account for the scene and both murders?

What has bothered me about this case from the start (other than the fact that it's unsolved) is that the murders took place in the family home. A confrontation that escalated or was miscalulated (e.g. the person intended to confront Barry but instead, Honey was home; they struggled; she was killed; then Barry arrived and he was killed) seems more plausible than planned homicide. It seems incredibly high risk to intentionally kill two people (directly, or by proxy) in their family home. It's physically demanding, the opportunities to leave evidence are many, and the timing had to be perfect. I'm sceptical this was planned.

My sole conviction about this case is that there was one killer. Ultimately, evidence is the only thing that matters.

The theory I have rolling around in my head is similar to yours, but opposite in some ways. I think the person went to the home to talk to Honey. After all, she was known to be the driving force behind the new spending that was going on. Barry told everyone who would listen that he did not want to move; Honey was insisting. The mansion was going to cost many millions, and meanwhile Barry was calling loans of far smaller amounts. To a desperate person, this might have seemed petty, a problem that could be resolved.

He may have hoped to convince her to get Barry to stop pursuing repayment. He may have intended to threaten or harm her. He may even have imagined that if she died, Barry would return to his usual generosity. Regardless of his intentions, the situation escalated.

I think the person did not have detailed knowledge of the Shermans’ changing schedules and had expected Honey to be home alone for hours that Wednesday evening. But that was an unusual day. She had a late-afternoon meeting and then went shopping. She arrived home much later than usual, and by then the perpetrator may have been waiting for hours and not have realized how little time was available. After all, the conventional wisdom was that Barry “worked late” every night. The perpetrator may not have realized this meant he left the office around 8pm and continued to send emails from his home. Barry got home about an hour after Honey did.

I think the perpetrator found himself in a situation where he felt there was no return. This is further into the realm of speculation: he may have had Honey’s body in position, ineptly staged as a suicide, and been interrupted when Barry came home. The underground garage is just on the other side of the pool; his headlights would have been visible through the glass wall. At that point the killer might have improvised. He was already a murderer and his options were to get caught red-handed or kill the person who happened onto the scene.

This would explain why Honey has injuries from a scuffle, and why Barry has blood on his pants, possibly from being lifted over her. Her body was already in place and the killer had expected to get away unnoticed rather than committing a second murder.

One problem with this theory is that it requires the killer to be very familiar with or at least confident around the Shermans, moving about the house and showing up for a conversation. Yet the Sherman family and friends do not recognize the walking man. Barry had a wide and oddball circle of friends. Maybe the perpetrator wasn’t an “inner circle” type. Or maybe he’s in disguise; if that’s the case, it strongly suggests he intended to murder Honey, not just speak to her.

There is no evidence of a second person so I believe the walking man acted alone.

 

[Aquabot13]

I've always been confused by the theory that the killer staged the scene to look like a murder-suicide.

IMO, the scene doesn't scream "murder-suicide" - surely there would be a plethora of easier, quicker ways to carry out a murder-suicide, ones that would be both more immediately suggestive of a murder-suicide and easier to stage than a pool hanging.

Pills, guns, even a physical fight would have been easier IMO and could be staged in such a way (gun in a victims hand, for example) so as to point to M/S. I wouldn't trust that the cops would arrive on scene and think Barry had scraped up Honey, dragged her down to the pool, hung her, and then elected to hang himself. Especially without much evidence of a fight.

Because of this, I believe the staging had some purpose outside of practicality or throwing cops off the scent. I also believe it could have been unplanned (either the whole thing or something went wrong while executing the plan) and the nature of the encounter led to a crime scene that doesn't make a lot of logical sense.

MOO

 

[planet]

The theory I have rolling around in my head is similar to yours, but opposite in some ways. I think the person went to the home to talk to Honey. After all, she was known to be the driving force behind the new spending that was going on. Barry told everyone who would listen that he did not want to move; Honey was insisting. The mansion was going to cost many millions, and meanwhile Barry was calling loans of far smaller amounts. To a desperate person, this might have seemed petty, a problem that could be resolved.

He may have hoped to convince her to get Barry to stop pursuing repayment. He may have intended to threaten or harm her. He may even have imagined that if she died, Barry would return to his usual generosity. Regardless of his intentions, the situation escalated.

I think the person did not have detailed knowledge of the Shermans’ changing schedules and had expected Honey to be home alone for hours that Wednesday evening. But that was an unusual day. She had a late-afternoon meeting and then went shopping. She arrived home much later than usual, and by then the perpetrator may have been waiting for hours and not have realized how little time was available. After all, the conventional wisdom was that Barry “worked late” every night. The perpetrator may not have realized this meant he left the office around 8pm and continued to send emails from his home. Barry got home about an hour after Honey did.

I think the perpetrator found himself in a situation where he felt there was no return. This is further into the realm of speculation: he may have had Honey’s body in position, ineptly staged as a suicide, and been interrupted when Barry came home. The underground garage is just on the other side of the pool; his headlights would have been visible through the glass wall. At that point the killer might have improvised. He was already a murderer and his options were to get caught red-handed or kill the person who happened onto the scene.

This would explain why Honey has injuries from a scuffle, and why Barry has blood on his pants, possibly from being lifted over her. Her body was already in place and the killer had expected to get away unnoticed rather than committing a second murder.

One problem with this theory is that it requires the killer to be very familiar with or at least confident around the Shermans, moving about the house and showing up for a conversation. Yet the Sherman family and friends do not recognize the walking man. Barry had a wide and oddball circle of friends. Maybe the perpetrator wasn’t an “inner circle” type. Or maybe he’s in disguise; if that’s the case, it strongly suggests he intended to murder Honey, not just speak to her.

There is no evidence of a second person so I believe the walking man acted alone.

This is the most satisfying ("high plausibility") scenario I've heard to date. All others seem farfetched.

I agree: it's difficult to be convinced that the WM was known to Barry. Someone in his circles would have recognized him by now.

Of course, maybe someone *has* recognized him by now, but TPS isn't sharing this. Or perhaps, he really was just a walking man (sans chien) and the perp was not caught on camera.

I don't believe he was just a walking man without a dog. That's for another post.

 

[ldlager]

Yes. And because I suspect that the murderer was triggered somehow by the requests for repayment, I think this is highly significant. Barry was cutting people off and calling loans in late 2017, some of them in amounts that would be large to the recipients but relatively small to a billionaire. We don’t know the full list of people who were being asked for repayments or told not to cash their regular “gift” cheques. One of those people may have overreacted.

I don’t believe any of the heirs is responsible for

It is my understanding that if Honey lived, the money goes into a trust for her benefit. The estate would not go to the four children.

You can imagine Barry being murdered and Honey still alive, she would go to the ends of the earth to find the perpetrator. Plus there would not be any money going to the kids to build a new arena.

If it was not about the money, Honey could live, but if it was about the money Honey had to die.

MOO

Conversely, It is possible that in fact HS was the primary target. And BS arrived home with the killers still at the house. Where he was murdered

 

[ldlager]

After 8 years of following this case, I have come to the point of saying that I do not believe that JS personally committed these murders.
I must assume that JS provided LE with an alibi for the night of the murders that LE would surely have examined and attempted to verify. Not just at 7pm, but for the whole night. I have to assume LE reviewed his cell records, and extracted and analyzed the locational data from all of his vehicles. (If they didn’t do at least that, there is no hope they will ever solve this case.). I believe JS has claimed he was at home on the night of the murders. Surely LE has interviewed JS’s husband FM to verify this, and while I don’t know FM, it is almost impossible for me to believe he would lie to police about JS being home when he knows he wasn’t on the night that the Sherman’s were murdered. How would one live with oneself keeping this lie?

Like several others here, I too believe someone known to at least one the Sherman’s showed up at the house that night to discuss something with one or both of them. And things went off the rails and escalated from there. I have my own theory who that person is.

Now all this is not to say that JS wasn’t involved in the murders. He just wasn’t there at the house when the murders were committed. IMO.

 

[Clue Keeper]

This is just flat out not true. Honey had no will and controlled no trust. The inheritance did not flow immediately to the heirs: it was overwhelmingly in illiquid assets like Apotex, Honey had no will that would have simplified distribution of her real estate, and Barry’s will required the heirs to reach specific ages before receiving their shares. Only Lauren was over age 35 at the time of the murders. Wrapping up the estate would have been extremely complex. It is likely still underway eight years later.

The fastest way to get money from Barry Sherman was to ask for the cash.

While your assessment of probate friction and illiquidity maybe accurate regarding administrative delays, it overlooks the immediate shift in fiduciary power and the acceleration of beneficial interest. The perpetrator may not have been seeking immediate cash flow but rather the total capture of the balance sheet through a succession of control. Honey functioned as a legal encumbrance on the estate corpus because as long as she was alive, the trustees were legally mandated to prioritize her maintenance, effectively locking the principal. Her death triggered an immediate termination of this life-interest, moving the equitable interest to the residual trusts where successor trustees often utilize encroachment clauses to distribute funds for lifestyle maintenance regardless of the stated vesting age. Furthermore, one cannot ask a living founder to liquidate his life’s work, and Barry’s death was the non-negotiable condition required to transform the concentrated, illiquid asset of Apotex into a liquid capital event. A dual-death event also allows for a book-entry offset where outstanding loans are zeroed out against future inheritance, providing an immediate financial benefit by extinguishing enforceable liabilities that Barry was actively pressured to collect. Such a maneuver suggests the objective was not a mere withdrawal but the permanent removal of the family’s internal audit committee. This logic does not necessarily implicate the heirs; it applies equally to debtors, business rivals, or any entity whose financial or personal survival depended on the absolute decapitation of Barry Sherman’s oversight.
JMO

 

[fadedglitter]

After 8 years of following this case, I have come to the point of saying that I do not believe that JS personally committed these murders.
(…)

Now all this is not to say that JS wasn’t involved in the murders. He just wasn’t there at the house when the murders were committed. IMO.

I obviously don’t think it was JS (I don’t think inheritance was the motive and if I did I’d suspect his sister) but the detail that convinces me that he wasn’t involved is that he had a solid alibi for the weeks before the murders and the day afterwards. But the day of the murders he was quietly at home, like all of the inner circle other than Jack and Lauren.

Nobody arranges a hit for a time when their spouse is their only alibi. People want to be far away, with many people who can assure the cops they weren’t involved.

Had the murders happened while he was in Japan, I’d be far more open to suggestions that he knew about it.

 

[Charlot123]

A tale of two sets of murders.
Here is a scenario: A married couple is brutally murdered in their house at night.. Their bodies discovered by visitors to the house. The husband was financially successful, with no known criminal record. Both victims had seemingly no known enemies, certainly no one who hated them enough to murder them. Police undertake a forensic examination of the murder scene. Police obtain video of an unknown man walking near the victims home around the time of the murders. The unknown man in the video seems to make an effort to avoid looking towards security cameras. He is dressed in a dark coat and a hoodie or hat, presumably to avoid recognition.

Sound familiar? No, I am not referring to the Shermans. I am referring to Spencer Tempe the murdered dentist and his wife who lived in Ohio and were murdered in their home less than 2 weeks ago. Within a couple of days after the murder, Ohio police announced that the case was a double homicide and not a murder suicide. Police almost immediately released the video of the man walking near the murder scene to the public and asked for the public’s help in identifying the individual. Within a few days the police, with the anssistance of the public, identified and arrested a suspect and he has been charged with murder.

The TPS waited four years to release their Sherman “walking man” video to the public. It’s been 8 years since the Sherman’s were murdered. No suspects, no arrests, no convictions, no justice.

Amazing how two similar sets of circumstances can result in completely different outcomes….

I was thinking about it

First, the Tepes were young professionals, with involved families and friends. All these people were very much invested in solving the case. Also, ironically, them living in not-the-best-but-rapidly-gentrifying-area helped. Lots of cameras around, everyone interested in proving that it was not a “city crime”. Plus, there was high index of suspicion about the killer. The killer could have stalked them a tad, but there was high impulsivity in the murders, too, and it was not a murder-for-hire. He left clues and he was not a professional.

Main thing: the Tepes were not the political figures, the donors or the capitalists. Very few people depended on them.

With the Shermans: they were very important figures but not everyone’s friends. Too many people depended on them, but their money made them less personal. They were the donors: so question one is, how is the charitable work going? It continues. Sherman the capitalist: how will the Apotex do know and will I keep my job? If I understand right, the Apotex was doing better under Barry, but it still exists and employs people. The family: well, they inherited and I assume there were no surprises.

Of course, not to forget that the Shermans were the major donors of a huge party. Here is where a call from a politician to the TPS could have pushed the things. A mega-donor is a politician’s personal friend, in a way.

(I used to like that politician. And maybe they did something). But realistically, what do you think?

If they didn’t do anything for such good friends and donors, didn’t make a call to TPS, to expedite things, then all this “ultra-nice behavior on public” isn’t worth much, IMHO.

 

[WINDSOR]

Asking with genuine curiosity: Do you have a narrative that would account for the scene and both murders?

What has bothered me about this case from the start (other than the fact that it's unsolved) is that the murders took place in the family home. A confrontation that escalated or was miscalulated (e.g. the person intended to confront Barry but instead, Honey was home; they struggled; she was killed; then Barry arrived and he was killed) seems more plausible than planned homicide. It seems incredibly high risk to intentionally kill two people (directly, or by proxy) in their family home. It's physically demanding, the opportunities to leave evidence are many, and the timing had to be perfect. I'm sceptical this was planned.

My sole conviction about this case is that there was one killer. Ultimately, evidence is the only thing that matters.

If you play this scenario in your mind, it goes like this. An assailant whom Honey knows arrives at the door and she lets him in the house. They are waiting for Barry to come home. Honey and the assailant become agitated and argue. The assailant restrains Honey by the wrists.

I ask at this point, has the individual already decided to kill Barry instead just confronting him? Barry arrives home and is restrained as well. The the assailant strangles both and stages the bodies in the pool room.

If it were not a planned homicide before the assailant arrived, where did he get the wrist restraints and where are they now? What did he use as the ligatures to strangle the Sherman's, and where are they now.

If the assailant was somebody known to the Sherman's why have the Police not interrogated him, checked his whereabouts that night. Plus if the assailant had a physical altercation with Honey, his DNA would be on her.

In my opinion this was not an impulsive or emotional act.

 

[WINDSOR]

"Barry told everyone who would listen that he did not want to move; Honey was insisting"

Did Barry tell his daughters that he did not want to move? If he did not tell his daughters then he was likely okay with the move.

I think there were some aspects of moving that Barry did not like, and voiced these to some people. Overall though he was probably okay with the move.
MOO

 

[WINDSOR]

While your assessment of probate friction and illiquidity maybe accurate regarding administrative delays, it overlooks the immediate shift in fiduciary power and the acceleration of beneficial interest. The perpetrator may not have been seeking immediate cash flow but rather the total capture of the balance sheet through a succession of control. Honey functioned as a legal encumbrance on the estate corpus because as long as she was alive, the trustees were legally mandated to prioritize her maintenance, effectively locking the principal. Her death triggered an immediate termination of this life-interest, moving the equitable interest to the residual trusts where successor trustees often utilize encroachment clauses to distribute funds for lifestyle maintenance regardless of the stated vesting age. Furthermore, one cannot ask a living founder to liquidate his life’s work, and Barry’s death was the non-negotiable condition required to transform the concentrated, illiquid asset of Apotex into a liquid capital event. A dual-death event also allows for a book-entry offset where outstanding loans are zeroed out against future inheritance, providing an immediate financial benefit by extinguishing enforceable liabilities that Barry was actively pressured to collect. Such a maneuver suggests the objective was not a mere withdrawal but the permanent removal of the family’s internal audit committee. This logic does not necessarily implicate the heirs; it applies equally to debtors, business rivals, or any entity whose financial or personal survival depended on the absolute decapitation of Barry Sherman’s oversight.
JMO

I think you are saying that having Honey dead, simplifies everything for the heirs, is that correct?

 

[FromGermany1]

"Barry told everyone who would listen that he did not want to move; Honey was insisting"

Did Barry tell his daughters that he did not want to move? If he did not tell his daughters then he was likely okay with the move.

I think there were some aspects of moving that Barry did not like, and voiced these to some people. Overall though he was probably okay with the move.
MOO

I believe, he was not okay with that move, not at all, and he resented his wife for wanting to force him to do it at his advanced age of 75. I think, he hated her for it. MOO

 

[planet]

If you play this scenario in your mind, it goes like this. An assailant whom Honey knows arrives at the door and she lets him in the house. They are waiting for Barry to come home. Honey and the assailant become agitated and argue. The assailant restrains Honey by the wrists.

I ask at this point, has the individual already decided to kill Barry instead just confronting him? Barry arrives home and is restrained as well. The the assailant strangles both and stages the bodies in the pool room.

If it were not a planned homicide before the assailant arrived, where did he get the wrist restraints and where are they now? What did he use as the ligatures to strangle the Sherman's, and where are they now.

If the assailant was somebody known to the Sherman's why have the Police not interrogated him, checked his whereabouts that night. Plus if the assailant had a physical altercation with Honey, his DNA would be on her.

In my opinion this was not an impulsive or emotional act.

Agree. Recall that I mentioned in my post that the evidence is all that matters, not which scenarios are most satisfying to us.

The ties indicate that the suspect intended to restrain and likely kill both of them. TPS has stated that both were targetted for homicide. So the scenario that makes more sense to me isn't supported by evidence or TPS statements.

I also liked the murder suicide scenario because it aligned with no forced entry and did not require the risk of someone entering. But this scenario too is not supported by evidence--both had signs of ties and use of ligatures. With this scenario, we also can't account for the walking man who spent time near or inside the property at the time of the murders.

Like others, I am struggling with disjunctures between the evidence and my instincts about the most plausible scenarios. However, at the end of the day, my conjectures are irrelevant. I'm not charged with managing this case, nor do I have access to the evidence. I'm just trying to reason through a complex case.

 

[ldlager]

If you play this scenario in your mind, it goes like this. An assailant whom Honey knows arrives at the door and she lets him in the house. They are waiting for Barry to come home. Honey and the assailant become agitated and argue. The assailant restrains Honey by the wrists.

I ask at this point, has the individual already decided to kill Barry instead just confronting him? Barry arrives home and is restrained as well. The the assailant strangles both and stages the bodies in the pool room.

If it were not a planned homicide before the assailant arrived, where did he get the wrist restraints and where are they now? What did he use as the ligatures to strangle the Sherman's, and where are they now.

If the assailant was somebody known to the Sherman's why have the Police not interrogated him, checked his whereabouts that night. Plus if the assailant had a physical altercation with Honey, his DNA would be on her.

In my opinion this was not an impulsive or emotional act.

IMO someone known to the Sherman’s showed up that night, equipped and prepared to murder either HS, or both BS and HS. Whether murder was the only planned outcome, I have no idea.

There are in fact people who knew the Sherman’s well, and/or were close to the Sherman’s that LE has never interviewed. I know a couple of them personally. There is also the possibility that one or more people who knew one or both of the Sherman’s well may have refused to speak to LE. I believe one such person has been speculated about on this thread in the past.

 

[fadedglitter]

IMO someone known to the Sherman’s showed up that night, equipped and prepared to murder either HS, or both BS and HS. Whether murder was the only planned outcome, I have no idea.

There are in fact people who knew the Sherman’s well, and/or were close to the Sherman’s that LE has never interviewed. I know a couple of them personally. There is also the possibility that one or more people who knew one or both of the Sherman’s well may have refused to speak to LE. I believe one such person has been speculated about on this thread in the past.

It would be wise for the murderer to not speak to police. There is no requirement for him to do so, and no up side.

TPS has said there are people who have not agreed to be interviewed.

 

[Jazzy5980]

IMO someone known to the Sherman’s showed up that night, equipped and prepared to murder either HS, or both BS and HS. Whether murder was the only planned outcome, I have no idea.

There are in fact people who knew the Sherman’s well, and/or were close to the Sherman’s that LE has never interviewed. I know a couple of them personally. There is also the possibility that one or more people who knew one or both of the Sherman’s well may have refused to speak to LE. I believe one such person has been speculated about on this thread in the past.

 

[Jazzy5980]

Based on your comment it seems you may know more about the case than many of us. Who do you think is responsible for the murders if you’re comfortable addressing this?? Thanks!

 

[Clue Keeper]

I think you are saying that having Honey dead, simplifies everything for the heirs, is that correct?

No, not at all.
While nothing could be ruled out, I don't think it was the heirs: the style of the murder just doesn't quite fit that plot. I would look for a desperate debtor, even though some business rivals cannot be ruled out either. But in this murder, there is so much personal hatred that it could be explained if a debtor, and not necessarily one owing a massive sum, was behind it.
Barry wasn't just a billionaire; he was a high-pressure lender who used capital as a leash. In the months leading up to the hit, he started "calling the paper" - cracking down on loans and dragging people into litigation. If you’re a debtor redlining toward bankruptcy, a dual-death event is a total game-changer.
In simple terms, it effectively zeros the ledger. When the founders are gone, the estate shifts into a passive "settlement" phase run by the next generation. If the debtor is a relative or a close associate, the new gatekeepers are usually way more chill - they’ll likely stop the aggressive collection or just let the debt slide. Legally, the debt can also be "offset", meaning instead of having to pay back millions in cash that the person doesn't have, the estate simply subtracts that amount from whatever future gift or inheritance they might eventually receive. MOO

 

[Clue Keeper]

What was the "staging" for? What did it mean?

Why not put the bodies in the pool under the pool cover? They would not have been found for a longer time and any DNA traces would be less likely to remain?

In my view, the staging of a murder-suicide was a calculated attempt to exploit the legal system. By making the scene look like a domestic tragedy, the perp tricked the police into thinking it wasn't an outside job, which gave him a massive head start while evidence went cold. The real impact, and the reason it points toward a debtor imo, is the legal chaos it created. If the police had stuck with the theory that Barry killed Honey, inheritance laws would have locked the estate in court for years. For someone who owed Barry money or was being sued by him, this outcome served a specific purpose: it didn't just remove the person who was pressuring them, it paralyzed his entire legal team, making it much harder for the estate to keep coming after him for cash.