CANADA Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #17

[Lexiintoronto]

Exactly what I was talking about. Where is the business acumen evident that JS cherishes so much in AP if they bought a business then complained about a county change that would negatively affect said business when the road rerouting was already in the works?

AP seemed to be using the road closure to his advantage, imo.

“The business (Orillia/Green Storage), in discussions with city officials, suggested the municipality consider reducing its property taxes in recognition of the hardship it will endure.

“They said, that’s not going to happen because it’s out of their hands right now,” Sone (AP’s employee) said…
…Sone also suggested the municipality either prohibit the use of development lands on nearby University Avenue by commercial storage facilities, “or give us the right of first refusal to buy that land.”
Orillia business fears road closure will drive away customers

Then later:

"We understand why it had to be closed," said Kim Wallace, sales manager of Green Storage (formerly Orillia Storage). "It will impact us a little until people get used to the route."
The Harvie Settlement access point from Old Barrie Road to close next week

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

Is anyone familiar with the Oriole Go Station? I'm a little confused about where it is. Is it actually underneath the 401? Could the NW have walked to it from within the neighborhood?

Edit - never mind, I see the maps that were posted earlier. So there is literally a walkway out of that subdivision to public transit.

43.765065,-79.36586 @ Instant Street View

Note: Go Stations are for trains and busses and are not the same as TTC subways, LRT, or public transit, Go have their own tracks and buildings, some links to TTC subways, etc but they are not the same modes of transportation or schedules.

Go busses and trains do not run on the same schedules as subway and busses that will run past midnight. I do not see someone going to a Go station at midnight, the next train or bus would not be until the early morning say 4 am the earliest.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

cannot stop the double post! argh sorry

 

[juli99]

Note: Go Stations are for trains and busses and are not the same as TTC subways, LRT, or public transit, Go have their own tracks and buildings, some links to TTC subways, etc but they are not the same modes of transportation or schedules.

Go busses and trains do not run on the same schedules as subway and busses that will run past midnight. I do not see someone going to a Go station at midnight, the next train or bus would not be until the early morning say 4 am the earliest.

So if he was taking public transit, he was probably walking a little further to the Leslie Subway.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Note: Go Stations are for trains and busses and are not the same as TTC subways, LRT, or public transit, Go have their own tracks and buildings, some links to TTC subways, etc but they are not the same modes of transportation or schedules.

Go busses and trains do not run on the same schedules as subway and busses that will run past midnight. I do not see someone going to a Go station at midnight, the next train or bus would not be until the early morning say 4 am the earliest.

You’re right, the Oriole train passes southbound during morning rush hour, then northbound at evening rush hour, it doesn’t stop otherwise. No trains after 7:11 pm going northbound. The next train goes southbound at 6:36 am.

It’s a tiny station with one track. (No Go busses there.)

https://www.gotransit.com/static_fi...Planning/FullSchedules/FS29012022/Table61.pdf

The TTC would be likely if he took transit, imo.

 

[juli99]

AP seemed to be using the road closure to his advantage, imo.

“The business (Orillia/Green Storage), in discussions with city officials, suggested the municipality consider reducing its property taxes in recognition of the hardship it will endure.

“They said, that’s not going to happen because it’s out of their hands right now,” Sone (AP’s employee) said…
…Sone also suggested the municipality either prohibit the use of development lands on nearby University Avenue by commercial storage facilities, “or give us the right of first refusal to buy that land.”
Orillia business fears road closure will drive away customers

Then later:

"We understand why it had to be closed," said Kim Wallace, sales manager of Green Storage (formerly Orillia Storage). "It will impact us a little until people get used to the route."
The Harvie Settlement access point from Old Barrie Road to close next week

So potentially, they purchased knowing the issue but hoping to use it to their advantage. That seems a lot like something BS would do.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

So potentially, they purchased knowing the issue but hoping to use it to their advantage. That seems a lot like something BS would do.

JS most likely learned this strategy from BS. IMO I still see JS attempting to mimic BS - but be better than him, only to impress his father, not for any nefarious reason. Just a son trying to impress a father, a son looking for his father's praise and approval. Not too different from KW, with a Father (Father figure to KW) with little outward emotion and affection I think that is a tall mountain to climb, never mind reaching the crest.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Wondering if BS/ Apotex did comply or were about to comply, with the deal to record conversations and report on his competitors and rivals? speculation, imo.
Oct 2021 rbbm.
Barry Sherman’s Apotex has paid $100 million to answer U.S. price-fixing allegations and agreed to help investigate competitors | The Star
''In the U.S. government case, Apotex admitted to a conspiracy to “suppress and eliminate competition,” escaping a criminal conviction that would likely have barred it from the lucrative American market, according to the U.S. Justice Department. As its part of the deal, Apotex must co-operate with investigations of rivals, including recording telephone conversations, introducing law enforcement to sources, or testifying before a grand jury, documents filed in court say''

''Sources close to the Sherman family and Apotex say these agreements and potential liabilities are complicating the Sherman children’s plan to sell the Toronto-based firm.''

''In addition to the payout, Apotex agreed to help U.S. justice officials investigate other generic firms, including (if asked) recording phone calls with officials from other companies, testifying before federal grand juries related to the investigation, and setting up a corporate compliance system to “detect and prevent criminal antitrust violations” in the future.''

I think that was a huge development.

I can’t dig for it now—so I may have it wrong— but I thought Barry agreed to cooperate with the investigation prior to the murders. There was something in the works other than his autobiography. A tell-all about the generic pharmaceutical world.

It was part of the original theories about why he had been murdered, to stop his participation. Possibly steal the evidence he had(??)
(Or maybe this is a newer scandal.)

 

[ldlager]

Self-storage was considered an excellent business venture a few years before JS jumped in. I only know this because my brother who is a savvy investor researched it years ago and tried to get into the market, but found buying an existing storage company had become extremely expensive . It is needed, it is low maintenance and it doesn't require much time or effort to turn a profit. But, you needed big bucks to buy into it, and my brother was too late to capitalize on the growing demand before prices soared.

JS got involved after my brother looked into it, and BS apparently was happy to fund the business venture. It may be a very profitable business despite what JS had to pay for any existing companies, or the cost of any rent or buying land and building new storage sites. It is difficult to determine if Green Storage (now 8 locations, and one in Toronto) was a good business venture compared to the apparent high dollar investment. I recall Lexiintoronto said that JS had asked BS for $50 million to buy a new storage location, per KD's book. My sister borrowed my book and left town, so I can't look this up, but I think the storage/warehousing business is/was a hot market and the cost to get into, and expand the business was astronomical. I wonder how the pandemic has affected it.

FWIW I can tell you that I rent a storage unit from a big storage company in the GTA (not Green Storage0 and there are a number of small businesses there that have given up their former (pre pandemic )space due to higher rent and they are running their businesses directly from their rental units in the the storage facility. Distributors, light manufacturers, etc are able to use their unit as a base of operations, for a relatively cheap rent vs what they had been paying.

 

[ldlager]

I think BS was a product of his generation, especially as someone who worked in the sciences. I also think his gender bias came from years of learning and working in a male dominated profession that was very far removed from the realities of dealing with sick people, family strife or young children. No emotion needed or wanted in the discovery of medical breakthroughs in a lab.




The cash flow is peanuts in comparison to the initial outlay. As a real estate play it sucks, imo. JS owns a storage unit in Orillia and several years the county decided to turn the road his storage unit was on into a dead end where before it was a not-so -easy off from highway 11. When you're buying up property like that it pays to know why the seller wanted to sell and to check the county plans for future development that may negatively affect your purchase. Check out the map of Harvie Settlement Road on Google maps. You can see the ghostly outline of where it used to be. I doubt the business partners did that. I moved to this area in 1993 from Toronto when the population in Orillia was 24000 people. Today it's 34000 people. Not a good standard of growth for future business potential, imo.

Google Maps

Here's an article in a local paper dated December 2016 regarding the closure.

Orillia business fears road closure will drive away customers

I am familiar with the location, and while there is one off issues like the one you have cited, there is no shortage of storage facilities popping up everywhere in S Ontario. So I can't believe its a terrible business. Or maybe its just useful for people to park long term $. BTW I expect, even with the road change, that JS has more than doubled his investment in his Orillia property.

 

[ollie2]

I am familiar with the location, and while there is one off issues like the one you have cited, there is no shortage of storage facilities popping up everywhere in S Ontario. So I can't believe its a terrible business. Or maybe its just useful for people to park long term $. BTW I expect, even with the road change, that JS has more than doubled his investment in his Orillia property.

I have had a storage locker for 15 years. I am storing old office furniture I am not using, don't want to sell or get rid of during the years as they are generational (well packed and preserved) as well as chattels that I am not currently using or desire from past generations that mean something and hopefully my Nieces will appreciate at a later date. I pay the bill every month and forget about it because I know it's all safe and I don't want to store it myself.

 

[Bobbi Pearl]

I think that was a huge development.

I can’t dig for it now—so I may have it wrong— but I thought Barry agreed to cooperate with the investigation prior to the murders. There was something in the works other than his autobiography. A tell-all about the generic pharmaceutical world.

It was part of the original theories about why he had been murdered, to stop his participation. Possibly steal the evidence he had(??)
(Or maybe this is a newer scandal.)

Very intriguing and believable reasons for murder, but the first questions that came to my mind are, Why Honey? Why at home and Why stage the scene as it was? They could have easily killed him alone and made it look like an accident or something.

 

[branmuffin]

FWIW I can tell you that I rent a storage unit from a big storage company in the GTA (not Green Storage0 and there are a number of small businesses there that have given up their former (pre pandemic )space due to higher rent and they are running their businesses directly from their rental units in the the storage facility. Distributors, light manufacturers, etc are able to use their unit as a base of operations, for a relatively cheap rent vs what they had been paying.

When we downsized 3 years ago we used two different storage facilities because our house closed before our new house was ready. We stored all our stuff over and above furniture which remained in a container until we moved. I have to say storage buildings were a bit creepy later in the day when you felt you were the only one there. I used to fake talking on a phone when I heard footsteps coming up the hall.

And here's an interesting article regarding the burgeoning storage unit business and how huge companies are going above and beyond just storing your stuff. I wonder if AP read about this and thought, hey with BS's free millions, we can do this, too.

Self storage: Inside the new real estate war to stash your stuff - Macleans.ca

 

[WINDSOR]

Further to my comments regarding the theory of a safe house in the Stubbs Drive area, here is a list of used furniture stores, and car rental agencies nearby. The hit team easily could been up and operating in a matter of days, several months before December 2017.
One individual who was not involved in either the surveillance nor the the actual murder, could have set up the safe house before the team arrived. This person would then have returned to his home, and would appear to have no connection with the action team.

<modsnip>
I know some do not put too much credence in the 'safe house' theory and I may be way off in the Stubbs Drive location.
However I think if these individuals are who I believe they are, this would be how they operate.

 

[juli99]

Further to my comments regarding the theory of a safe house in the Stubbs Drive area, here is a list of used furniture stores, and car rental agencies nearby. The hit team easily could been up and operating in a matter of days, several months before December 2017.
One individual who was not involved in either the surveillance nor the the actual murder, could have set up the safe house before the team arrived. This person would then have returned to his home, and would appear to have no connection with the action team.


<modsnip>

I know some do not put too much credence in the 'safe house' theory and I may be way off in the Stubbs Drive location.
However I think if these individuals are who I believe they are, this would be how they operate.

I just can't imagine. It's a huge ordeal to furnish an apartment, and leaves so much that can be tracked. Even just neighbors noticing someone moving stuff in.

Just as an aside, once when we lived abroad we returned home and had to rent a place for a month in London, Ontario. I found a condo downtown that was being rented as a short-term rental. We basically just stayed there the same as a hotel, except I paid for the month and never saw the people that owned the place. It was fully furnished. This is the type of place I was thinking of when I first imagined a short-term rental.

 

[Window21]

I know some do not put too much credence in the 'safe house' theory and I may be way off in the Stubbs Drive location.
However I think if these individuals are who I believe they are, this would be how they operate.

I can totally see this happening, I can also see fly in, do the job and fly out all in 24hr.
Surveillance could easily be done by someone local to Toronto. All JMO

 

[dotr]

''Safe'' mansions?
You Can Rent This Insane Bridle Path Mansion For A Night On Airbnb - Narcity
May 29, 2017,

The Bridle Path: Airbnb suspends listing for multi-million dollar home after shooting | CTV News
2019
Airbnb has suspended further bookings at a luxury home on Toronto’s Bridle Path after a man was shot in the upper body on the property overnight.
Police were called to the multi-million dollar home, near Timberglade Court, at around 6 a.m

7 min (3.5 km) via Bayview Ave
timberglade court toronto on to 50 old colony road - Google Search

 

[Lexiintoronto]

This is from a recent article, just reposting. (Emphasis is mine.)

“And the new documents show that the image the public saw (police broadcast a short video clip of the unknown man with an odd gait in hopes the public could make an identification) is the last image they have, caught 1.3 kilometres east of the Sherman home in North York.

“After this image the unknown male was not seen on video anywhere else as there was no other known video available and other locations with video had already been overwritten,” the police documents show. Police say they have other video that shows the individual approaching the Sherman home, disappearing from any cameras in the area, then reappearing and walking away from the home. Police say the person spent a “suspicious” amount of time near the Sherman home on Old Colony Road.”
Detectives sought ‘tower dump’ of all cellular communication around Barry and Honey Sherman’s home, Barry’s office, documents reveal




@Momtoapug mentioned that the NW may have gone through a greenbelt area and changed direction. I think the Vyner Greenbelt might be possible.

 

[juli99]

This is from a recent article, just reposting. (Emphasis is mine.)

“And the new documents show that the image the public saw (police broadcast a short video clip of the unknown man with an odd gait in hopes the public could make an identification) is the last image they have, caught 1.3 kilometres east of the Sherman home in North York.

“After this image the unknown male was not seen on video anywhere else as there was no other known video available and other locations with video had already been overwritten,” the police documents show. Police say they have other video that shows the individual approaching the Sherman home, disappearing from any cameras in the area, then reappearing and walking away from the home. Police say the person spent a “suspicious” amount of time near the Sherman home on Old Colony Road.”
Detectives sought ‘tower dump’ of all cellular communication around Barry and Honey Sherman’s home, Barry’s office, documents reveal


View attachment 332472

@Momtoapug mentioned that the NW may have gone through a greenbelt area and changed direction. I think the Vyner Greenbelt might be possible.

Thank you! So in essence, TPS does not know any more than we do where he went after 59 Bannatyne. If they have a theory of the case, it likely doesn't include whether he walked to a house, got on the TTC, or got in a car.

 

[WINDSOR]

I just can't imagine. It's a huge ordeal to furnish an apartment, and leaves so much that can be tracked. Even just neighbors noticing someone moving stuff in.

Just as an aside, once when we lived abroad we returned home and had to rent a place for a month in London, Ontario. I found a condo downtown that was being rented as a short-term rental. We basically just stayed there the same as a hotel, except I paid for the month and never saw the people that owned the place. It was fully furnished. This is the type of place I was thinking of when I first imagined a short-term rental.

In my post, I listed (modsnipped) furniture rental and auto rental places nearby.
It is rather easy to furnish an apartment. If you want you can do it it in one trip to Ikea.
If you are in a large complexes like I mentioned, you are relatively invisible to your neighbours.
Remember budget and time is not a majour considerations to these people.