Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #18

[Shlock Homes]

I frankly cannot imagine that anything useful in the way of evidence was gotten out of that RAV4. They may have bumbled almost every other aspect of their murderous "long joyride", but they darn sure knew how, or learned how to torch a vehicle. JMO

The police certainly aren't talking about how they torched both vehicles. Did they fill the interiors with gasoline? It doesn't seem like they even care. Was the camper or pickup torched, or did they fill both with fluids and torch them? Did they attempt to torch LF and CD van if they weren't able to drive it off as their replacement vehicle?
Also in what order did they acquire the RAV4 and torch the pickup truck? Because as far as we knew, only Kam could drive. The pickup truck was also in the opposite direction of where they would have traveled to head into Alberta, etc... Seems like there would have been the need for at least a third person.

 

[acutename]

I frankly cannot imagine that anything useful in the way of evidence was gotten out of that RAV4. They may have bumbled almost every other aspect of their murderous "long joyride", but they darn sure knew how, or learned how to torch a vehicle. JMO

I am wondering if there is anything unique about the gas residue that would leave a clue as to where it came from. Obvs. not an arson expert.

 

[Schmoosh]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed> I'd just like to hear what it is people think they may have shoplifted that might go towards proving either that they committed one or three of these murders, or it was for escaping or committing future crimes (since the shoplifting seems to be specifically concerned with their Meadow Lake shopping trip).

You know, like sleuthing

 

[Shlock Homes]

Agreed. I'd just like to hear what it is people think they may have shoplifted that might go towards proving they committed one or three of these murders. Like, sleuthing

If they were going to shoplift, that certainly would have drawn attention to themselves, especially when it's a couple of teens entering a store. Usually people who shoplift have a certain body language that gives them away. Unless they're pros, which I don't believe these guys would have been. And there are cameras in the store watching, so it would have been very difficult for them to pull it off without someone suspecting something.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Agreed. I'd just like to hear what it is people think they may have shoplifted that might go towards proving either that they committed one or three of these murders, or it was for escaping or committing future crimes (since the shoplifting seems to be specifically concerned with their Meadow Lake shopping trip).

You know, like sleuthing

Exactly! I'm with you, I'm so curious if they shoplifted as well and if so - what? Ok, I'm going to go sleuth something about this, hopefully I'm not wasting my time if someone did it already lol

 

[NJSleuth91]

If they were going to shoplift, that certainly would have drawn attention to themselves, especially when it's a couple of teens entering a store. Usually people who shoplift have a certain body language that gives them away. Unless they're pros, which I don't believe these guys would have been. And there are cameras in the store watching, so it would have been very difficult for them to pull it off without someone suspecting something.

They couldn't even go through an alcohol checkpoint without acting totally suspicious and doing the exact opposite of what someone in that situation should be doing. Would they really have shoplifted and gotten away with it, in an empty-looking store with the staff talking to them?

 

[Shlock Homes]

Could be they were close to their destiny and about to hand over the rav4 after being paid to drive it to Manitoba, and get their promised ride back to BC and their truck. Not much point filling it.

At the time of the surveillance video, they would have no concept of the furor to come; genuinely, I see nothing in their demeanour to suggest they're the least bit worried about anything.

Things only begin to unravel when they finally realize nobody's meeting them and they're trapped in a hell. Or, perhaps they were met and led through the swamps to a place where their ride and pay was 'waiting'. Then executed, laid out to appear a joint suicide by their own gun, in a fashion that resembles LF & CD corpses, and therefor linking them to the murders. Might even have been forced into making that final phone video at gunpoint. Would explain why only part of the video was safe to allow grieving families view it.

Fanciful perhaps, but no more so than the official boat/rapids story - to me at least, and I really am trying to believe the dominant line here followed by fellow websleuthers.

Meantime with their own truck in the hands of some real evil villains, evidence would be easy to leave at the scene of their campertruck burn-out, and on poor LD. But too late for incrimination at the vansite of the original killing because LE are already investigating it. Could explain why the two gamers could not be charged by rcmp with that crime.

Quite a few timeline twisting to be done yet, if the report is not looking only to close the case.

That's another thing, they only buy $20 worth of gas, but they were able to torch their vehicle? I imagine it would have taken quite a bit of gasoline to get that Rav4 burning so it wouldn't get snuffed out. I highly doubt Toyota builds interiors that are easily ignited.
Your theory is along the lines of what I was also thinking. Isn't it strange that they would commit a murder then hang around the area for 3 or 4 days? Then commit another one and then take off, switching vehicles for no reason either. These were two easily manipulated teens who I feel are patsies. Maybe LD or LF & CD weren't just random targets. This would have required quite a bit of planning, more than one person as well. That's why this case has been very unsettling for me. Too many clues left lying around like a trail bread crumbs for the RCMP to follow, who can't even find the killer(s) on the Highway of Tears. Plus the mysterious 'tip' that led RCMP to believe KM & BS were the van murderers. Also, they conducted a massive search of the area, no trace of them was found (I guess no footprints either). But magically, or sheer luck, a damaged boat was found just down stream from where their bodies would be located, and after that, the blue sleeping bag which may or may not have belonged to them, was out there like a beacon to direct searchers right to the bodies when the boat didn't work. They haven't said how long the bodies were out there. Wrapped up nice and tidy, nobody asks questions.

 

[Gina20]

I frankly cannot imagine that anything useful in the way of evidence was gotten out of that RAV4. They may have bumbled almost every other aspect of their murderous "long joyride", but they darn sure knew how, or learned how to torch a vehicle. JMO

Five gallons, or 20 litres of gas ought to do it.

 

[Schmoosh]

They couldn't even go through an alcohol checkpoint without acting totally suspicious and doing the exact opposite of what someone in that situation should be doing. Would they really have shoplifted and gotten away with it, in an empty-looking store with the staff talking to them?

NJ, you have to understand that the checkpoint at Split Lake isn't your usual "police cars with rooftop lights flashing and officers outside of their cars motioning people to pull over like a R.I.D.E. check".

In Canada, if there is a "police" vehicle on the side of the road (with or without lights flashing), we're taught to pull to the left and pass slowly (for officer safety) and carry on (which they did). The "officers" weren't waving them over. Their vehicle may have barely been recognizable as "law enforcement". If you've seen pictures of the "checkpoint" and the vehicle, you'd understand.

When they did catch up to them, KM and BS pulled over and were apologetic and polite.

That whole incident didn't phase me in the least as anything any other Canadian wouldn't do entering that reservation the first time.

 

[Zella]

Hey y'all, for everyone asking about abbreviations, this page was a lifesaver for me last year when I first joined and was confronted with cryptic posts that had BBM, SBM, and MOO (among other acronyms):

Websleuths Lingo

Hope it helps everyone else as much as it helped me!

 

[Gina20]

That's another thing, they only buy $20 worth of gas, but they were able to torch their vehicle? I imagine it would have taken quite a bit of gasoline to get that Rav4 burning so it wouldn't get snuffed out. I highly doubt Toyota builds interiors that are easily ignited.
Your theory is along the lines of what I was also thinking. Isn't it strange that they would commit a murder then hang around the area for 3 or 4 days? Then commit another one and then take off, switching vehicles for no reason either. These were two easily manipulated teens who I feel are patsies. Maybe LD or LF & CD weren't just random targets. This would have required quite a bit of planning, more than one person as well. That's why this case has been very unsettling for me. Too many clues left lying around like a trail bread crumbs for the RCMP to follow, who can't even find the killer(s) on the Highway of Tears. Plus the mysterious 'tip' that led RCMP to believe KM & BS were the van murderers. Also, they conducted a massive search of the area, no trace of them was found (I guess no footprints either). But magically, or sheer luck, a damaged boat was found just down stream from where their bodies would be located, and after that, the blue sleeping bag which may or may not have belonged to them, was out there like a beacon to direct searchers right to the bodies when the boat didn't work. They haven't said how long the bodies were out there. Wrapped up nice and tidy, nobody asks questions.

"Fluff" at a wrecking yard ignites easily. Maybe they "bought" some BBQ starter fluid at a hardware store along the way, and threw it all over the upholstery. Use the old multi-tool to shred the seats a bit, then the old rag in the tank trick.

 

[Jan424]

But also, happiness is an ephemeral thing. Just because he was happy at the time when various pictures were taken, doesn't mean he was in general, or recently. I think every single one of us probably has pictures from horrible time periods of our lives, where we were smiling and looked happy.

SBM
More or less what I was saying.

 

[Shlock Homes]

"Fluff" at a wrecking yard ignites easily. Maybe they "bought" some BBQ starter fluid at a hardware store along the way, and threw it all over the upholstery. Use the old multi-tool to shred the seats a bit, then the old rag in the tank trick.

The other question would be, why even bother? A burning car is going to draw more attention.

 

[NJSleuth91]

NJ, you have to understand that the checkpoint at Split Lake isn't your usual "police cars with rooftop lights flashing and officers outside of their cars motioning people to pull over like a R.I.D.E. check".

In Canada, if there is a "police" vehicle on the side of the road (with or without lights flashing), we're taught to pull to the left and pass slowly (for officer safety) and carry on (which they did). The "officers" weren't waving them over. Their vehicle may have barely been recognizable as "law enforcement". If you've seen pictures of the "checkpoint" and the vehicle, you'd understand.

When they did catch up to them, KM and BS pulled over and were apologetic and polite.

That whole incident didn't phase me in the least as anything any other Canadian wouldn't do entering that reservation the first time.

That was never explained in any articles about that incident.

<modsnip>

 

[Shlock Homes]

Have the police officially confirmed if Leonard Dyck was shot, or even what weapons were used in those three deaths, and if they matched the weapons at the scene of KM & BS bodies? Seems like something they wouldn't need several weeks to determine.

 

[Gina20]

The other question would be, why even bother? A burning car is going to draw more attention.

They had to have that BOG. I would have mentioned the Macdonald triad, but it's fallen out of favor lately, although some say it's all in the interpretation.

 

[musicaljoke]

NJ, you have to understand that the checkpoint at Split Lake isn't your usual "police cars with rooftop lights flashing and officers outside of their cars motioning people to pull over like a R.I.D.E. check".

In Canada, if there is a "police" vehicle on the side of the road (with or without lights flashing), we're taught to pull to the left and pass slowly (for officer safety) and carry on (which they did). The "officers" weren't waving them over. Their vehicle may have barely been recognizable as "law enforcement". If you've seen pictures of the "checkpoint" and the vehicle, you'd understand.

When they did catch up to them, KM and BS pulled over and were apologetic and polite.

That whole incident didn't phase me in the least as anything any other Canadian wouldn't do entering that reservation the first time.

I'm not convinced that's exactly true. In these parts, First Nations Police conduct R.I.D.E. checks. They are fully qualified police officers and drive vehicles with regular police lights on them.

This news article suggests that the lights were on when the two suspects drove by it.

"Saunders said the teens drove past him and RCMP partner Morgan Spence at a traffic checkpoint in the RAV4, which had not yet been reported stolen from murder victim Leonard Dyck.

Saunders said,'They slowed down and then they drove by. I had the lights on and I was standing outside the truck. Me and my partner jumped in the truck and we went to stop them.'

Saunders said the boys saw the police in pursuit and pulled over.

He said, 'They turned off their engine, and I asked them why didn't they stop, they were supposed to stop when the lights are on."

'I should have done something': RCMP officer says he let fugitives slip through his fingers after they blew through a police checkpoint

 

[Schmoosh]

I'm not convinced that's exactly true. In these parts, First Nations Police conduct R.I.D.E. checks. They are fully qualified police officers and drive vehicles with regular police lights on them.

This news article suggests that the lights were on when the two suspects drove by it.

"Saunders said the teens drove past him and RCMP partner Morgan Spence at a traffic checkpoint in the RAV4, which had not yet been reported stolen from murder victim Leonard Dyck.

Saunders said,'They slowed down and then they drove by. I had the lights on and I was standing outside the truck. Me and my partner jumped in the truck and we went to stop them.'

Saunders said the boys saw the police in pursuit and pulled over.

He said, 'They turned off their engine, and I asked them why didn't they stop, they were supposed to stop when the lights are on."

'I should have done something': RCMP officer says he let fugitives slip through his fingers after they blew through a police checkpoint

You just proved exactly my post, thank you.

Canadians don't stop simply because there's a vehicle with its lights flashing and the officers are standing outside their vehicles.

We slow down and give them berth by pulling over to the left as safely as possible and pass by, unless they're flagging us down to pull over. If not, we can assume they're tending to/finishing other police business.

 

[NJSleuth91]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

I don't live there, I don't drive, and they don't have alcohol checkpoints where I live. How am I supposed to know what Canadian law is for what constitutes an alcohol checkpoint? Clearly in the article it says the officers themselves thought that Kam and Bryer should have known to stop.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Well, take it for what it is. Someone probably did this already? Will post regardless.

Them in the Co-Op store Seasonal section (photos should post in order they walked in): they bypass isle 17, bypass and look down isle 18 and went up/down isle 19. Bryer was buttoning/zipping/fidgeting with jacket almost the whole time and had head down until he looked down isle 18 and then something caught his attention to his left.

Last big photo is courtesy of the link Lois Lane shared (thanks Lois!) which looks to be same Seasonal isle 19 with bikes at the end. I was trying to check the inventory in isle 19 but my eyes fail me even when enlarged. The store seems quite small actually.