Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #18

[Trooper]

It's my theory and I think it's a damn good one.

what could be more likely to bring to them their required desire for notoriety than murdering young people, tourists, no less, the lifeblood of the province, for no reason whatsoever? .. To start a chase across country , for days? . Notoriety was their lifeblood, and in their end, their death song, too.

Hard to think up any other more definite process than that, to bring on a whole heap of notoriety, and as for malicious intent, what more could one do to portray malicious intent than the insouciance leaving of the bodies they mangled with gunshot by the side of the road, for some other poor wretched innocent by stander to stumble across? They wanted it known what they did. No hiding the bodies from the gaze of the public, oh no. Leave them out there , right there on the road shoulder, maybe even do a bit of artistic re arranging of the bled out bodies, as the road worker who found them hinted at.

 

[sandbar]

[AS] was in denial that they did it even after they were found dead, saying he'll believe it when he sees the evidence.

sbm
This proves nothing other than he believes his son is innocent until proven guilty. I don't think it shows he's shocked or irrational.

 

[Schmoosh]

I don’t see how it’s helpful to imagine AS could’ve rescued B somehow. Three homicide victims lost their lives, the two accused chose to not voluntarily surrender and instead died by suicide and sadly we don’t get to rewrite the script.

I’m certain every single family member is tormented by thoughts of “what if” this or that and have woken up many a morning wishing they had the power to turn back the clock.

To be clear, I'm not imagining AS rescuing anyone. It was his words that he wished he had been able to.

 

[Trooper]

They were never charged with shooting a woman. The RCMP may conclude in their report that it was likely they did, based on evidence, but it hasn't happened yet. And they may not.

I have yet to ascertain if the RCMP is in the strange habit of charging dead men for the crimes they commit. Most jurisprudence organisations do not, as a rule, and I assume the RCMP is not one that does that, on the perfectly reasonable grounds that dead men cant testify.

So the claim that it hasn't happened yet is a bit obscure, …

Some tribes in Papua New Guinea , up in the northern hill sections, they actually prop up the body , should it be available , of the villain they wish to try for a crime, dead or not, and proceed with the trial.. …

But I don't think Canada has come to this yet.

 

[Schmoosh]

I have yet to ascertain if the RCMP is in the strange habit of charging dead men for the crimes they commit. Most jurisprudence organisations do not, as a rule, and I assume the RCMP is not one that does that, on the perfectly reasonable grounds that dead men cant testify.

So the claim that it hasn't happened yet is a bit obscure, …

Some tribes in Papua New Guinea , up in the northern hill sections, they actually prop up the body , should it be available , of the villain they wish to try for a crime, dead or not, and proceed with the trial.. …

But I don't think Canada has come to this yet.

Canada doesn't charge dead people with crimes, so you don't have to spend time ascertaining that.

 

[scrappinkat]

They were never charged with shooting a woman. The RCMP may conclude in their report that it was likely they did, based on evidence, but it hasn't happened yet. And they may not.

Exactly. They were charged with second degree murder of Leonard Dyck.

There were no charges laid against them for Lucas and Chynna, although the rcmp did say that it was coming very soon. I think it was around the 24th or 25th perhaps that they said that, but they were just waiting for paperwork to completed. And yet they hadn’t been charged by Aug 7th, when they were found deceased.

The facts and evidence about Kam and Bryer being responsible for the murder of Lucas and Chynna have simply not been publicly presented. The official rcmp report is sure to be publicly scrutinized, so hopefully it’s thorough and offers definitive answers.

 

[Trooper]

Exactly. They were charged with second degree murder of Leonard Dyck.

There were no charges laid against them for Lucas and Chynna, although the rcmp did say that it was coming very soon. I think it was around the 24th or 25th perhaps that they said that, but they were just waiting for paperwork to completed. And yet they hadn’t been charged by Aug 7th, when they were found deceased.

The facts and evidence about Kam and Bryer being responsible for the murder of Lucas and Chynna have simply not been publicly presented. The official rcmp report is sure to be publicly scrutinized, so hopefully it’s thorough and offers definitive answers.

The fact that no charges so far have been laid, in the matter of the death of Chynna Deese , surely is not a matter of the RCMP still looking for some other shooter?

It seemed to me that the RCMP had made it plainer than plain that there was no other suspects in regard to this triple murder?

It was made pretty plain that the reason for that was, it wasn't necessary to lay charges at that point, since the mechanism for the processing of the search for them didn't need more than one charge to be laid. The second degree charge in the matter of Prof Dyck was on the grounds that it could be upgraded, with no delay, but it would take a delay to down grade , say, in the possibility that the killers had a rational (?) explanation, and the charges could wait until some communication had been established between the suspects and Law Enforcement..

 

[Trooper]

so I don't think the fact that 'no charges have been laid for the murder of Mr Fowler, and Ms Deese' can be construed as it being therefore rude and undignified to hint that Kam and Bry shot and killed both these people , unprovoked and without mercy on the side of the road, and left their bodies there , in the open , to be found by the next unfortunate traveler. Murdered one, then the other, one a close up shot in the face to a woman.


These are horrible facts, that are in the public domain.

 

[sandbar]

The fact that no charges so far have been laid, in the matter of the death of Chynna Deese , surely is not a matter of the RCMP still looking for some other shooter?

It seemed to me that the RCMP had made it plainer than plain that there was no other suspects in regard to this triple murder?

It was made pretty plain that the reason for that was, it wasn't necessary to lay charges at that point, since the mechanism for the processing of the search for them didn't need more than one charge to be laid. The second degree charge in the matter of Prof Dyck was on the grounds that it could be upgraded, with no delay, but it would take a delay to down grade , say, in the possibility that the killers had a rational (?) explanation, and the charges could wait until some communication had been established between the suspects and Law Enforcement..

They have to make sure no one aided and abetted, or even knew or had heard K&B talk about it.

 

[Trooper]

They have to make sure no one aided and abetted, or even knew or had heard K&B talk about it.

of course, a perfectly reasonable position, but not one that would infer that because there were no charges laid, up until the verified death of Kam and Bryer, ( and certainly not after as charging dead men is not in the handbook of the RCMP ) that one should assume that therefore, because no charges were laid, that Kam and Bry were not the killers, ….

That no charges were laid is immaterial in this context. ..

 

[LoisLane]

I have never thought of it this way and it is a good take. AS would most likely sniff out a bogus story. Now the “are you ‘there’ yet?” message makes more sense to me. AS probably knew they were up to something - NOT insinuating AS knew about anything illegal that they may have done - just that he knew that the Whitehorse Alberta Grammar Rodeo story was a farce.

He may even have had good parental instincts if given the chance.

 

[Trooper]

What I am hoping for, with not a high degree of expectation, merely low level , that perhaps Kam and Bry , in their video 'will' , to use the term loosely, will explain why they chose Prof Dyck, Miss Deese and Mr Fowler as their victims.

Since they were strangers, and hardly responsible for the any trauma and hurt feelings Kam and Bry had suffered previously, in their former life as inhabitants of Port Alberni, doing the usual things, school, camping, Walmart, and now in their new life as on the road travelers, what made those three people as the one's to pay for all that irritation and undeserved approbation they appeared to have suffered at the hands of others, and not the one's they coolly and callously murdered ?

Why these three? why anyone, existentially, but .. why these three?

 

[LoisLane]

You know, this type of scenario never occurred to me and yet it makes so much sense and entirely possible. The one thing is I don’t think is that AS could have talked Bryer out of the trip... I’m still considering whether Bryer was just using him for the expensive gifts and all. But I also agree with your other post where you mentioned that AS may have more street smarts and harder to get this ruse past him.

Just want to point out that in one of the video interviews with AS he says that when BS worked with him he wasn’t paid with cash but with the computer. So if that’s the case it sounds like that was a fair exchange. Also, the airsoft was mentioned to be a gift iirc for Xmas which could also be considered a reasonable gift. If the cologne was not a code word it could have been a simple graduation/end of school year gift or possibly even a birthday gift as his bday was in early August.

 

[NJSleuth91]

Yes but he also initially talked about Bryer’s pain and how he was going out in a “blaze of glory” ... to me he just didn’t sound shocked... not at first. And that’s MOO.

Yeah as I said, I think he knew Bryer was troubled and in pain, and was worried about him, probably for a while. However I don't think he had any idea Bryer was going to go out and kill people. I think he was probably more worried about him killing himself, prior to the killings. However, once the idea of his son being a murderer was on the table, I think he said what his honest assessment of the situation was, given his previous concern about his son's issues, and knowledge of how these types of cases usually go. And I think a lot of things also coalesced for him, like "wait a second, maybe the obsession with playing survivalist games in the woods with Airsoft guns, wasn't just a hobby." That doesn't mean he saw it coming though...lots of teenagers have similar interests, and lots of them are troubled, and the vast majority of them don't kill people.

sbm
This proves nothing other than he believes his son is innocent until proven guilty. I don't think it shows he's shocked or irrational.

That's true. I don't think there's anything unusual about that, either -- it's pretty much what I would expect from a grieving parent.

Just want to point out that in one of the video interviews with AS he says that when BS worked with him he wasn’t paid with cash but with the computer. So if that’s the case it sounds like that was a fair exchange. Also, the airsoft was mentioned to be a gift iirc for Xmas which could also be considered a reasonable gift. If the cologne was not a code word it could have been a simple graduation/end of school year gift or possibly even a birthday gift as his bday was in early August.

Also, people think it's weird that he got Bryer a $600 Airsoft rifle as a gift. But keep in mind that he didn't see Bryer for eight years. Maybe he was trying to make up for all the birthdays and Christmases he missed. $100 is reasonable for a milestone birthday present (the 19th birthday is important in Canada) and also combined graduation present.

 

[MistyWaters]

He was certainly correct in his assessment that Bryer needed a rescue, though, wasn't he?

It's really ugly the way people keep twisting things against this victim. Against the ToS, as well.

Not a fair comment at all.

The video (Post #149) where AS mentions “I’m so sorry I couldn’t rescue you” immediately follows his statement that the police are going to shoot first and ask questions later and Bs going to be dead in a day or two. It would appear this is the reason why AS feels he’s unable to rescue him.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Canada doesn't charge dead people with crimes, so you don't have to spend time ascertaining that.

They mightn't charge them but still hold them responsible for the deaths with evidence accumulated. We'll find out soon enough when RCMP reveal what they have. Not charging them is understood in any language.

 

[Trooper]

They mightn't charge them but still hold them responsible for the deaths with evidence accumulated. We'll find out soon enough when RCMP reveal what they have. Not charging them is understood in any language.

It would have been very surprising if the RCMP had charged them, considering the difficulty for a coroner to establish who shot whom. So many variables, the RCMP would have been waiting to talk to the killers first.

Perhaps Kam and Bry shot Lucas and Chynna together, that is, they both , each , shot each victim. As a bonding dynamic. Not an unknown event. Perhaps Bry did the shooting and Kam did the watching. And admiring. Perhaps they drew short straws to decide who would murder whom. Perhaps Kam shot them both and Bry watched , ( and admired ) ..

Whatever the sequence was, it didn't disturb the partnership, as they both went on , some days, and some klms later to murder Prof . Dyck. It is reasonable to assume therefore that they were pleased with themselves, as otherwise, they might have split up , as a protest.
No such of a thing. They went on together, hunting down another person to kill.

The lack of a charge certainly wouldn't , in any sane gathering, be construed as a basis for claiming the innocence of Kam and Bry, under the circumstances.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

I’m pretty sure he was referring to cases/notes he’s looked into in the past, not Kams and Bryers case.

Ok thanks! I went back and forth because it could sound like either.

 

[scrappinkat]

He was certainly correct in his assessment that Bryer needed a rescue, though, wasn't he?

It's really ugly the way people keep twisting things against this victim. Against the ToS, as well.

Not a fair comment at all.

Yes, despite all his years of not being able to be the father and parent as he had hoped, he did seem to connect quite well with his son in the past couple years.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Shooting a woman, unknown to them, with no background of being hard done by her, at any point in their so far untalented life, and shooting her up close, too, on the side of a highway in front of her probably dying lover , dying horribly, alone, and without help, a long , long way from home, is something one can draw your rational conclusion from with complete agreement, without any dispute whatsoever.

Your post sure captures the cold-bloodedness and disturbing nature of this crime. That is what I think happened too. I imagine it was utterly quiet out there in that wilderness when it happened which just amplifies the horror, just sad.