Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #19

[Trooper]

Does anyone know where it was revealed of Leonard's cause of death? I've read that his cause of death wasn't revealed out of the respect of his family. But some are saying he has been shot.

The term used, before Prof. Dyck's family closed it down , was 'brutal violence'. As brief as that. 'Gun violence ' was another term used.

Bearing in mind, that when Kam and Bryer got to Prof. Dyck's vehicle, they were , by any measurement, experienced and committed murderers, determined and ruthless. They were not disgusted with themselves, nor concerned, nor seeking anyone to surrender to.

And since Chynna Deese's brother said, he believed the reason why it took so long to identify Chynna and Lucas, ( Kam and Bryer's experimental first venture into thrill murder ) was because of the indescribable violence done to Chynna and Lucas, it perhaps doesn't require a huge stretch of imagination to grasp that the method used in Prof.Dyck's murder was out of all proportion to the stealing of a vehicle.

 

[Esprite]

The term used, before Prof. Dyck's family closed it down , was 'brutal violence'. As brief as that. 'Gun violence ' was another term used.

Bearing in mind, that when Kam and Bryer got to Prof. Dyck's vehicle, they were , by any measurement, experienced and committed murderers, determined and ruthless. They were not disgusted with themselves, nor concerned, nor seeking anyone to surrender to.

And since Chynna Deese's brother said, he believed the reason why it took so long to identify Chynna and Lucas, ( Kam and Bryer's experimental first venture into thrill murder ) was because of the indescribable violence done to Chynna and Lucas, it perhaps doesn't require a huge stretch of imagination to grasp that the method used in Prof.Dyck's murder was out of all proportion to the stealing of a vehicle.

Perhaps we should have some respect for the Dyck family, as Dr Dyck's wife also works at U of BC. The new school year just began on Tuesday; it must be a very difficult time right now.

 

[Jan424]

I don't think they were in contact after the 19th. And I don't think the RCMP suspected them or anyone they may have hypothetically confessed to went to the police until after the 19th.

Then I’d love to know how they sounded to family as I’m sure there was no confession there. For instance, if Kam checked in with his parents, then I guess he sounded pretty cool and calm for someone who just killed 2-3 innocent strangers (even if a text). And I wouldn’t have thought Bryer had any other close friends that he’d consider confessing to. But it’s possible, certainly. MOO

 

[Jan424]

Plus it could have been a vague confession as Moriarty said.

I just had another thought... what if it wasn’t really a confession, but some dramatic goodbye or a comment that they were never coming back, they’d never be seen again, etc.
One thing that would surprise me is if the friend(s) they potentially confided in never opened their mouth and told another soul. I’d have figured it would have spread like wildfire. MOO

 

[NJSleuth91]

I just had another thought... what if it wasn’t really a confession, but some dramatic goodbye or a comment that they were never coming back, they’d never be seen again, etc.
One thing that would surprise me is if the friend(s) they potentially confided in never opened their mouth and told another soul. I’d have figured it would have spread like wildfire. MOO

I could totally see this.

 

[10ofRods]

Hiding like cowards. If suicide by cop had ever been considered as a last resort, by the time they hid for days in the bush, possibly hoping the RCMP would just give up and go away, they were bug-bitten, hungry, damp, cold and ultimately defeated, cornered by the Nelson River with no means of escape ....perhaps any yearn for excitement and drama had passed.

I think a lot of young people (and others) think "suicide by cop" is more glamorous than plain old suicide.

 

[Trooper]

Perhaps we should have some respect for the Dyck family, as Dr Dyck's wife also works at U of BC. The new school year just began on Tuesday; it must be a very difficult time right now.

Perhaps 'feeling sorry ' for the killers is a bit disrespectful , really. These murders were brutal, and that is often forgotten in the rush to try and figure out what made two 'nice little boys' turn into ruthless and determined murderers, one of their victims an unarmed and unwary woman, and it could be that they were just born killers, waiting for their moment. It does happen, it doesn't need a 'trigger' , or a 'reason', or 'bad parenting' or any and all,.. it just is.

In this case, perhaps, it just was. They wanted to kill, they went out to kill and they killed.

 

[MistyWaters]

I just had another thought... what if it wasn’t really a confession, but some dramatic goodbye or a comment that they were never coming back, they’d never be seen again, etc.
One thing that would surprise me is if the friend(s) they potentially confided in never opened their mouth and told another soul. I’d have figured it would have spread like wildfire. MOO

I’m not sure “confession” is the right word here. Maybe “bragging” is more appropriate? Because if they “confessed” to any other person prior to fleeing, I can’t think of one good reason they wouldn’t have come forward and confessed to police as well.

Confession insinuates acknowledge of guilt yet that wasn’t a factor if they went on to murder LD and steal his car.

I don’t think they told anyone.

 

[Trooper]

What on earth are they going to 'confess ' to? . cold blooded murder , which I suspect didn't even have an element of focused rage to it? Hardly likely. It is difficult to believe that in some way, in such a short acquaintance that either Chynna, or/and Lucas offended Kam and Bry to that extent that their violent murder was the only satisfaction to be gained.

That surely cannot be it.

If anything, it will be the last word, along the lines of what perpetrators the world over say, and mean ..


"look what you made me do!".



For sure, if they say anything, it will be about whose fault it is, and it ain't gonna be theirs. Guaranteed.

 

[Shlock Homes]

Not meaning to be contrary here and I don't mean to offend, but I genuinely don't understand the sympathy that the suspects are garnering here at all. I feel sadness for their victims, not for BS or KM.I don't feel sad for BS looking at the pics of him in his suit because not too long after that pic was taken he took the lives of three people and destroyed their families. Even if they didn't kill LF and CD (I think they did) they killed LD, who had a wife, two sons around the same age as the killers, and extended family that needed and loved him.

They had no reason to go out an murder three innocent people, robbery gone wrong or not. I can't imagine what their angle was, I hope it'll come out in the police report, but these two were not "good kids" in any way and imo, they're both equally responsible for what happened. Imo, these two fed off each other and encouraged one another in whatever dark, disturbing fantasies they had, and them knowing/befriending one another, their final acts of violence against innocent people was the culmination of a perfect storm that brewed for years.

They hung with each other for years, they knew what the other was about. I still feel that KM was more of the leader than BS who we know had a very dark quality about him. Obviously it was way, way beyond trying to be edgy. Sure there's edgy, but BS was obviously a million light years past edgy when he and his buddy went out and killed three people.

Others have said that they distanced themselves from BS because they found his words and his behaviour disturbing - that would be the normal thing to do. KM had to have shared at least some of those qualities, otherwise he wouldn't have wanted to associate with BS, and he certainly wouldn't have gone and brought two firearms on an extended road trip with him.

The presence of two guns found with the bodies indicates to me that this was at least partially planned. Canadians generally don't go on road trips or camping armed, and it wasn't hunting season at the time of the murders. If they were concerned about wildlife, they could have purchased some bear spray brought along some noise makers but the fact that they had two weapons with them tells me concerns about wildlife attacks weren't on their minds whatsoever. It would even be a stretch if they brought one gun for protection, but the fact is that they had two - so imo, they had something loosely planned at the very least. If they were so sad, depressed, hard-done-by and whatever, and on a suicide mission as AS suggested, then why didn't they simply drive into the wilderness and off themselves instead of killing three others?

To me, they just seemed like they are the easiest target to pin the murders on. The reality is, they haven't been tried in a court of law, only in the media. None of the evidence that allegedly points to them (much of which hasn't been shared with the media) has been tested in a court of law, and yet people were calling for their heads. Let's say these guys were in fact set up, someone else committed the murders, that's not being disrespectful to the victims. I'd rather see the actual perps caught, instead of sweeping this thing under the rug. I think this case has just been raising way more questions than it's answered. Just trying to figure out a motive is almost impossible. Even figuring out the timeline of BS & KM movements prior to their burning truck being found has been perplexing. We are only assuming that video games or being estranged from his dad was maybe what set off BS, but without actually talking to him, we really don't know anything about him. And it doesn't account for KM's cooperation either, who seemed to have a reasonably normal family life. Also, for two guys who lived on Vancouver Island, which isn't exactly an urban jungle, you'd assume they'd have some wilderness experience, and it doesn't make sense why they would kill themselves after going through all the trouble of allegedly running from their crimes. So many odd aspects of this case, evidence trail just being left here and there, lucky breaks that lead to the bodies, all strange.

 

[Jan424]

I’m not sure “confession” is the right word here. Maybe “bragging” is more appropriate? Because if they “confessed” to any other person prior to fleeing, I can’t think of one good reason they wouldn’t have come forward and confessed to police as well.

Confession insinuates acknowledge of guilt yet that wasn’t a factor if they went on to murder LD and steal his car.

I don’t think they told anyone.

Yea, I actually don’t think they did either. I mean it’s possible, but not likely. JMO

 

[CanadianSleuther]

To me, they just seemed like they are the easiest target to pin the murders on.

I think since they had one of the victim's vehicle they became the prime and only suspect. I just hope in the next day or two we get an update of some kind.

 

[Shlock Homes]

I think since they had one of the victim's vehicle they became the prime and only suspect. I just hope in the next day or two we get an update of some kind.

I could see them being tied to LD's murder with that vehicle, but the LF & CD murders are the real head scratcher. I also don't understand how they could have stolen the SUV and moved the pickup truck, if only one of them was a driver.

 

[Esprite]

Perhaps 'feeling sorry ' for the killers is a bit disrespectful , really. These murders were brutal, and that is often forgotten in the rush to try and figure out what made two 'nice little boys' turn into ruthless and determined murderers, one of their victims an unarmed and unwary woman, and it could be that they were just born killers, waiting for their moment. It does happen, it doesn't need a 'trigger' , or a 'reason', or 'bad parenting' or any and all,.. it just is.

In this case, perhaps, it just was. They wanted to kill, they went out to kill and they killed.

With all due respect, I was referring to Dr Dyck's family, who are considered to be victims, and not suspects.

 

[MistyWaters]

What on earth are they going to 'confess ' to? . cold blooded murder , which I suspect didn't even have an element of focused rage to it? Hardly likely. It is difficult to believe that in some way, in such a short acquaintance that either Chynna, or/and Lucas offended Kam and Bry to that extent that their violent murder was the only satisfaction to be gained.

That surely cannot be it.

If anything, it will be the last word, along the lines of what perpetrators the world over say, and mean ..


"look what you made me do!".



For sure, if they say anything, it will be about whose fault it is, and it ain't gonna be theirs. Guaranteed.

Right, and their unsuccessful cross-country escape to Northern Manitoba proves it. Attempting to evade police is the opposite of taking responsibility for murdering innocent people. Probably the same reason for their suicides IMO.

 

[MistyWaters]

I could see them being tied to LD's murder with that vehicle, but the LF & CD murders are the real head scratcher. I also don't understand how they could have stolen the SUV and moved the pickup truck, if only one of them was a driver.

Why any stranger was responsible for murdering L&C and LD is way beyond the realm of rational thinking IMO.

But the rest stop and the location of the burning truck was only about a mile apart. That’d be an appx a 15 minute walk to the rest stop. For all we know they were lurking there, waiting for a potential victim.

 

[Trooper]

Right, and their unsuccessful cross-country escape to Northern Manitoba proves it. Attempting to evade police is the opposite of taking responsibility for murdering innocent people. Probably the same reason for their suicides IMO.

I'm not convinced it was a double suicide. My operative theory is one was too chicken to kill himself, having been 'brave' and 'true' enough to murder strangers, ( which, it is more than likely , were perhaps , as their last community act, kind to Kam and Bry for no reason other than that they were strangers, pretending to be in need ) and the other hadn't finished with the requirement to murder. I don't see any reason to assume otherwise, so far.

 

[MsBetsy]

What on earth are they going to 'confess ' to? . cold blooded murder , which I suspect didn't even have an element of focused rage to it? Hardly likely. It is difficult to believe that in some way, in such a short acquaintance that either Chynna, or/and Lucas offended Kam and Bry to that extent that their violent murder was the only satisfaction to be gained.

That surely cannot be it.

If anything, it will be the last word, along the lines of what perpetrators the world over say, and mean ..


"look what you made me do!".



For sure, if they say anything, it will be about whose fault it is, and it ain't gonna be theirs. Guaranteed.

Yes, I imagine it might be a long list of grievances and all the wrongs done to them by society.
It probably will not be made public to avoid giving them any notoriety. Imo

 

[10ofRods]

Not meaning to be contrary here and I don't mean to offend, but I genuinely don't understand the sympathy that the suspects are garnering here at all. I feel sadness for their victims, not for BS or KM.I don't feel sad for BS looking at the pics of him in his suit because not too long after that pic was taken he took the lives of three people and destroyed their families. Even if they didn't kill LF and CD (I think they did) they killed LD, who had a wife, two sons around the same age as the killers, and extended family that needed and loved him.

They had no reason to go out an murder three innocent people, robbery gone wrong or not. I can't imagine what their angle was, I hope it'll come out in the police report, but these two were not "good kids" in any way and imo, they're both equally responsible for what happened. Imo, these two fed off each other and encouraged one another in whatever dark, disturbing fantasies they had, and them knowing/befriending one another, their final acts of violence against innocent people was the culmination of a perfect storm that brewed for years.

They hung with each other for years, they knew what the other was about. I still feel that KM was more of the leader than BS who we know had a very dark quality about him. Obviously it was way, way beyond trying to be edgy. Sure there's edgy, but BS was obviously a million light years past edgy when he and his buddy went out and killed three people.

Others have said that they distanced themselves from BS because they found his words and his behaviour disturbing - that would be the normal thing to do. KM had to have shared at least some of those qualities, otherwise he wouldn't have wanted to associate with BS, and he certainly wouldn't have gone and brought two firearms on an extended road trip with him.

The presence of two guns found with the bodies indicates to me that this was at least partially planned. Canadians generally don't go on road trips or camping armed, and it wasn't hunting season at the time of the murders. If they were concerned about wildlife, they could have purchased some bear spray brought along some noise makers but the fact that they had two weapons with them tells me concerns about wildlife attacks weren't on their minds whatsoever. It would even be a stretch if they brought one gun for protection, but the fact is that they had two - so imo, they had something loosely planned at the very least. If they were so sad, depressed, hard-done-by and whatever, and on a suicide mission as AS suggested, then why didn't they simply drive into the wilderness and off themselves instead of killing three others?

Some people want to help others, who have flaws. They don't distance themselves (thank goodness, or we wouldn't have nurses, doctors or teachers). Not all of us automatically distance ourselves from people who others find distasteful. It's not "normal" to do so, not for all humans. Some people do distance themselves, some of us do not.

 

[Trooper]

Some people want to help others, who have flaws. They don't distance themselves (thank goodness, or we wouldn't have nurses, doctors or teachers). Not all of us automatically distance ourselves from people who others find distasteful. It's not "normal" to do so, not for all humans. Some people do distance themselves, some of us do not.

I genuinely believe that the desire to murder three people, in cold blood, without any known motive whatsoever, can hardly be categorized as a 'flaw'.... That is a hell of a stretch and one that , in one fell swoop, negates law, justice, social cohesion and protection of the human species..

If, say, murder is merely a 'flaw'... what is the point of the panoply of jurisprudence, the organization of law enforcement, law itself? .

I don't see a lot of merit in helping those with that particular 'murder' flaw.. what would be the point? It is perfectly normal to distance oneself from these kind of people who, as a choice, as a sentient, reasoning choice, chose to murder.

And one can say, oh, the 'snap' theory, the 'couldn't help myself' theory, the 'she made me do it' theory, and so on ad nauseum, all diminish each of the humanity of the whole. It should not be tolerated.